#indiewebcamp 2015-07-02

2015-07-02 UTC
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Loqi [bridgy] Dan Fowler replied '@t NetNewsWire' to a tweet that linked to https://indiewebcamp.com/next-hwc (https://twitter.com/danfowler/status/616395816043843585)
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Loqi [bridgy] Philip Durbin favorited a tweet that linked to https://indiewebcamp.com/next-hwc (https://twitter.com/t/status/616386559877713920)
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KevinMarks Odd that csarven is surprised that I express opinions in posts on my own site
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@kevinmarks @yonatanzunger you're very welcome to join us discussing it at http://indiewebcamp.com/reply (twitter.com/_/status/616405794330808320)
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GWG KevinMarks: Maybe you need a disclaimer.
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GWG "These views represent the views of Kevin Marks himself, and not one of his subsidiaries, parent companies, or affiliates."
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Loqi [bridgy] Brad Fitzpatrick favorited a tweet http://indiewebcamp.com/reply (https://twitter.com/kevinmarks/status/616405794330808320)
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GWG I have a content question to run by you guys.
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GWG I found an old paper journal. I'm wondering if I should retroblog it
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GWG I know people are importing their old livejournals and such.
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GWG Is there a point in importing a record of what I did from April 10-April 26, 1999?
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KevinMarks_ yes, that is a good impulse, GWG
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KevinMarks_ tantek: https://twitter.com/stvnrlly/status/615914300255809536
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@stvnrlly I have closed the tabs that were in the browser and which you were probably saving to read Forgive me they hogged memory and were so old (twitter.com/_/status/615914300255809536)
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Jeena GWG, yes! It is part of history and you want to be able to look back on it some day :)
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GWG Jeena: I was rather shocked.
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GWG I have been in the midst of a travelogue as an experience in content creation.
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GWG And I pulled this document out of a box last night, when I remembered it existed.
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Jeena hehe
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GWG Makes me wish I'd written more during certain events.
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GWG April 21, 1999 - "I think there might be a future for me as a donkey guide."
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bret Jeena: heading over
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bret Jeena: cool, here... sitting at the bar
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bret you here?
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: I added a few things to the wiki - Indiewebcamp 2015 is only 10 day away in Portland Oregon and Brighton England (twitter.com/_/status/616421381090213888)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: barcamp was put together in fewer than 10 days so we could still add more cities (twitter.com/_/status/616421471490056192)
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tantek.com edited /events/2015-07-01-homebrew-website-club (+0) "/* Topics */ post not site" (view diff)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: Karthik Prabhu has put together custom style and script per post for his site. This sin something silos don't let you do (twitter.com/_/status/616421650133876736)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: what would it mean to put that kind of custom style/script in a post that a Reader could pull out and present to the user? (twitter.com/_/status/616421807193780224)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: There's lots of things indieweb users can do on their own sites that silos don't support (twitter.com/_/status/616421912290439168)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @kevinmarks: I found with the http://www.kevinmarks.com/microformatschema.html post that being able to paste in tabs was useful (twitter.com/_/status/616422215437914112)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: there are posts that are like mini web apps, and it would be nice to use them in readers (twitter.com/_/status/616422320471584768)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @kylewmahan: there is http://reader.kylewm.com if you want an indieweb reader (twitter.com/_/status/616422560729841664)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: for styles there is a way to express scoped-style that only applies to a parent and its subtree (twitter.com/_/status/616422701687816192)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: we can also say in microformats 'save this whole subtree' with an e- prefix which would keep the style and script (twitter.com/_/status/616422970597199872)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: as my post storage format is html I can experiment with scoped style sin it (twitter.com/_/status/616423374554857476)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: Karthik pointed out that @kylewmahan does deduplication of posts with their POSSE'd comments and shows the syndicated ones (twitter.com/_/status/616423611063238656)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: here's @kylewmahan's deduplicated post https://kylewm.com/2015/06/i-wonder-how-much-this-conversation-is-annoying-kartikprabhu (twitter.com/_/status/616424108545449984)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: it is the 2 year anniversary of Google Reader's site-death today (twitter.com/_/status/616424208919326720)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @schnarfed: what kind of reader do you use now? (twitter.com/_/status/616424355220844544)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: I read the irc channels fro indiewebcamp and social; I read facebook's events feed; I will occasionally check twitter (twitter.com/_/status/616424693520822274)
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tyson_nw bret http://www.vanoverhill.com/
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @t: I don't use push notifications for any of these; i deliberately browse instagram (twitter.com/_/status/616424863427895296)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @danlyke: I use rssyl which is a plugin for mail to do feed reading in email all my feeds show there - emailis my primary thing (twitter.com/_/status/616425805300764672)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @kylewmahan: I use http://reader.kylewm.com mostly, and brings in twitter and instagram via granary https://github.com/snarfed/granary (twitter.com/_/status/616426028806893568)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @kylewmahan: I subscribe to the full twitter feed on there it floods it so I use a list and still chekc twitter (twitter.com/_/status/616426217940615168)
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Loqi [bridgy] Mark favorited a tweet that linked to https://indiewebcamp.com/next-hwc (https://twitter.com/t/status/616386559877713920)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @schnarfed: I use an rss reader called newsblur; my twitter, fb, github notifications go there but I want an offline mobile app (twitter.com/_/status/616426371393417217)
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bret Jeena: https://github.com/aaronpk/IndieAuth.com/issues
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tyson_nw jeena https://paste.ee/p/ERxle
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @kevinmarks: I have been hacking on indiecards and hovercards on http://www.unmung.com/ but nerd-sniped myself into doing layout (twitter.com/_/status/616428859811045376)
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bret Jeena: https://gist.github.com/bcomnes/eef4696b1366625d074e
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bret http://imgur.com/pfzFV1U
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @kevinmarks: is pinch-out the mobile equivalent of hover for desktop? (twitter.com/_/status/616429333943570433)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @webrecorder_io: I have a new project that works with webrecorder at http://archivethis.website that you cna add a URL (twitter.com/_/status/616429600705482752)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @webrecorder_io: it runs Selenium so it is archiving with Chrome or Safari browser to crawl a website as ti is rendered (twitter.com/_/status/616429744402382848)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @webrecorder_io: this catches things that javascript instantiates on the page as well as the static elements (twitter.com/_/status/616429921813053440)
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@pcosdeaf RT @kevinmarks: #indieweb @webrecorder_io: it runs Selenium so it is archiving with Chrome or Safari browser to crawl a website as ti is re… (twitter.com/_/status/616430009515814912)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @webrecorder_io: the code is all on github linked from http://archivethis.website (twitter.com/_/status/616430191670337536)
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bret Jeena: http://imgur.com/pfzFV1U
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @danlyke: the reason Kyle had to send a manual webmention is that I was looking for a vouch parameter and only accepting those (twitter.com/_/status/616430575503675392)
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bret tyson_nw: http://calagator.org
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acegiak morning, all!
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GWG Good morning, acegiak
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aaronpk how is pdx hwc going?
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@kevinmarks Notes from tonight's Homebrew Website Club on my website http://www.kevinmarks.com/hwc2015-07-01.html #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/616453810605572096)
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KartikPrabhu KevinMarks++ for good note taking at HWC
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Loqi KevinMarks has 123 karma
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@nypananders RT @kevinmarks: Notes from tonight's Homebrew Website Club on my website http://www.kevinmarks.com/hwc2015-07-01.html #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/616473910872248320)
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bjorn- tantek__: What did you mean with "what are metrics?" regarding my question with QS data?
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Loqi bjorn-: tantek left you a message 8 hours, 1 minute ago: see https://indiewebcamp.com/exercise re: " movement around Quantified Self-data to help users own their own data" http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-07-01/line/1435787156568
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Loqi exercise is a (typically) passive post type that represents some form of physical activity https://indiewebcamp.com/metrics
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gRegorLove Hi, bjorn- . tantek was just using our IRC bot to get a summary + link from the wiki. Loqi responds to 'what is...' questions.
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gRegorLove What is Loqi?
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bjorn- Hmm alright. :)
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Loqi Loqi is a friendly and useful bot present in the #indiewebcamp IRC channel and other channels https://indiewebcamp.com/Loqi
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KartikPrabhu Who is Loqi?
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Loqi Loqi is a friendly and useful bot present in the #indiewebcamp IRC channel and other channels https://indiewebcamp.com/User:Loqi.me
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@scott_gruber TwitterOAuth PHP Library for the Twitter REST API. @t @adactio is this API a good one to use for indieweb work? https://twitteroauth.com/ (twitter.com/_/status/616487768714186752)
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Loqi [mention] gRegor Morrill posted 'IndieWebCamp is coming up next weekend in Portland. I am realizing now that last year’s IndieWebCamp is still on my to-blog list. At this po...' linking to http://indiewebcamp.com/2015 (http://gregorlove.com/2015/07/1206/)
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petermolnar good morning
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GWG Good morning, petermolnar
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GWG I have been thinking
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acegiak dangerous territory
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acegiak :P
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GWG acegiak: I'm blaming you for some of them.
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GWG I'm thinking of adding a meta box to comments to fix/edit Semantic Linkbacks fields.
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acegiak oh that's a useful idea
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GWG I have my moments
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GWG acegiak: I sm still waiting for pfefferle to return and accept my notifications fix pull request.
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acegiak GWG: he's a mysterious fellow
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GWG acegiak: I know, but he usually catches things that I miss.
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acegiak oh yeah he got skillz
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ouvre-boite.com edited /PubSubHubbub (+402) "Added details about the change of hub." (view diff)
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cweiske is dym.cx here?
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pfefferle good morning indieweb
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@MrStephenJones #wisewords from @PeterGChun "Automation is good but you still have to #ownyourdata." Behavior change by tracking change. (twitter.com/_/status/616628108842500096)
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@RyanStipUTES RT @MrStephenJones: #wisewords from @PeterGChun "Automation is good but you still have to #ownyourdata." Behavior change by tracking change. (twitter.com/_/status/616629452865273856)
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@Joel_HoveyHV RT @MrStephenJones: #wisewords from @PeterGChun "Automation is good but you still have to #ownyourdata." Behavior change by tracking change. (twitter.com/_/status/616638832897884160)
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gregorlove.com edited /2015 (+89) "/* Blog */" (view diff)
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dym.cx edited /User:Dym.cx (-158) "decided not to waste time on something barely viable even for me and instead pursue my career as in comics and pixel-graphics" (view diff)
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@bjfr Next HW, Read @dweinberger piece iThe Internet that Was http://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2015/06/medium-is-the-message-paradise-paved-internet-architecture/396227/ Now you know the IndieWeb critique of the 2015 Internet. 3/x (twitter.com/_/status/616651469979258880)
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@webrocker was haltet ihr von slack? bin einerseits sehr begeistert, andererseits zögerlich, komplettes projekt knowhow da reinzukippen #ownyourdata (twitter.com/_/status/616652060566683652)
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@kevinmarks @whataboutbob http://indiewebcamp.com/indiecard http://indiewebcamp.com/hovercard - http://www.unmung.com/indiecard?url=http%3A%2F%2Fkevinmarks.com is my hacky implementation of indiecard (twitter.com/_/status/616675048116629504)
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@joseph_fraley I just registered for IndieWebCamp 2015! https://ti.to/indiewebcamp/2015-portland (twitter.com/_/status/616675226911420416)
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GWG I missed pfefferle, darn
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KevinMarks on good ui: https://www.useronboard.com/how-applemusic-onboards-new-users/
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@benmartinezJ RT @MrStephenJones: #wisewords from @PeterGChun "Automation is good but you still have to #ownyourdata." Behavior change by tracking change. (twitter.com/_/status/616690308546433024)
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@kylewmahan @zaskoda @joindiaspora I choose option 3: #indieweb! host your own site and syndicate to wherever your friends are https://indiewebcamp.com/Getting_Started (twitter.com/_/status/616690886370570240)
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kylewm What is interpersonal connection management?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "interpersonal connection management" yet. Would you like to create it? https://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=interpersonal+connection+management&summary=prompted+by+kylewm+https%3A%2F%2Findiewebcamp.com%2Firc%2F2015-07-02%2Fline%2F1435865812383
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kylewm darn
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kylewm https://twitter.com/zaskoda/status/616691510252322816
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@zaskoda @kylewmahan @joindiaspora Do you syndicate beyond RSS? What's the indie solution for interpersonal connection management? (twitter.com/_/status/616691510252322816)
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KevinMarks i think the answer is woodwind
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KevinMarks or possibly irc
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Loqi [bridgy] Zaskoda replied '@kylewmahan @joindiaspora Do you syndicate beyond RSS? What's the indie solution for interpersonal connection management?' to a tweet that linked to https://indiewebcamp.com/Getting_Started (https://twitter.com/zaskoda/status/616691510252322816)
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kylewm ty KevinMarks
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@kylewmahan @zaskoda The community is definitely actively exploring friend/follower/followee relations. Right now I use IRC and https://indiewebcamp.com/Woodwind (twitter.com/_/status/616692801468653568)
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Loqi [mention] Kyle Mahan commented '@zaskoda The community is definitely actively exploring friend/follower/followee relations. Right now I use IRC and indiewebcamp.com/Woodwin...' on a post that linked to https://indiewebcamp.com/Woodwind (https://kylewm.com/2015/07/zaskoda-the-community-is-definitely-actively-exploring)
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kylewm KevinMarks++
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Loqi KevinMarks has 124 karma
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KevinMarks didn't we talk about this last night?
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KevinMarks http://www.kevinmarks.com/hwc2015-07-01.html#kind%20of%20reader
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kylewm heh yes, but interpersonal connection management didn't immediately mean "reader" to me
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KevinMarks hm, of course I dind't take notes on what i was saying...
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KevinMarks http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-07-01#t1435801993664
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ben_thatmustbeme indeed, i noticed there was very little irc chat last night during HWC
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KevinMarks tantek normally scribes to irc too, but he wasn't last night
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KevinMarks and aaron does for portland, but he was not there
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KevinMarks boo, huffduff-video doesn't work on the bbc http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b05zktnk
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KevinMarks missing some RTMP thing
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Loqi [bridgy] Kylo Riley replied '@zaskoda & yep, I selectively syndicate posts from my site to Twitter, FB, and pull them in from Instagram (bc they don’t have a write A...' to a tweet that linked to https://indiewebcamp.com/Getting_Started (https://twitter.com/kylewmahan/status/616693281187983361)
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Loqi [bridgy] Kylo Riley replied '@zaskoda The community is definitely actively exploring friend/follower/followee relations. Right now I use IRC and indiewebcamp.com/Woodwin...' to a tweet that linked to https://indiewebcamp.com/Getting_Started (https://twitter.com/kylewmahan/status/616692801468653568)
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@kevinmarks do also read http://indiewebcamp.com or look at some of the talks there: http://indiewebcamp.com/videos_about_the_indieweb @bjfr @dweinberger (twitter.com/_/status/616700389216272386)
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@bjfr RT @kevinmarks: do also read http://indiewebcamp.com or look at some of the talks there: http://indiewebcamp.com/videos_about_the_indieweb @bjfr @dweinberger (twitter.com/_/status/616708229620330496)
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tantek good afternoon #indiewebcamp! 9 days til Portland & Brighton!
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Loqi [bridgy] Justin Reich retweeted a tweet http://indiewebcamp.com/videos_about_the_indieweb (https://twitter.com/bjfr/status/616708229620330496)
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Loqi [bridgy] Justin Reich retweeted a tweet http://indiewebcamp.com/ (https://twitter.com/bjfr/status/616708229620330496)
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tantek KevinMarks that "useronboard" site you linked to puts up a really annoying email form prompt that covers the content. :P
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rhiaro oh man, I should book transport to Brighton or something
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tantek How *not* to onboard your users - present them first thing with a "Your email" form prompt that covers the content they were trying to read.
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aaronpk haha someone should post a useronboard of useronboard
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tantek YES
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tantek Irony, the intro text ends with "Without further ado, here is…" [actually just one more "ado" - please give us your email address first]
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tantek yeah this is too dumb/ironic to not write-up
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tantek.com edited /2014-review (+132) "/* Technologies */ webactions indie-config, note invention and interop implementation *during* IWC Brighton 2014" (view diff)
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tantek.com created /founding (+43) "r" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /community (+15) "/* See Also */ founding" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /2014-review (+116) "/* Community Resources */ scope" (view diff)
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fkooman aaronpk, i was able to login using indiecert.net once on indieauth.com (after manually adding a state parameter), but not when trying to login to the wiki...
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cweiske fkooman, indieauth.com works now fine with my indieauth-openid proxy
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cweiske state should be there now
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fkooman now as in since 9 minutes ago? :)
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fkooman i have to all the time press the "rescan" button though, and then:
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fkooman There was an SSL error connecting to https://www.tuxed.net/fkooman/
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fkooman Re-Scan
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cweiske no, now since some weeks
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cweiske http://cweiske.de/tagebuch/federated-indieauth.htm
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fkooman it almost seems like there are two instances and one is up to date and the other is old :)
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cweiske three
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aaronpk now that there are 3 indieauth.com servers, you are going to have to click re-scan more often since they don't share state between them. you might end up on a server you haven't been on in a while
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aaronpk they all have the same code tho, you can verify with the version number in the footer
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KevinMarks do it, tantek
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tantek do what?
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fkooman aaronpk, but at least one of them gave the 400 error again, which i didn't see on the previous one... even after rescan
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tantek oh the screenshot and metawrite-up of useronboard? ok
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tantek somehow that page is also hanging my browser (or nearly) even without executing its JS
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fkooman cweiske, there is no state still though :)
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fkooman aaronpk, and there is the SSL connection problem again to https://tuxed.net/... what is up with that? :)
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fkooman aaronpk, There was an SSL error connecting to https://www.tuxed.net/fkooman/
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aaronpk i see that
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fkooman indiecert.net/auth
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fkooman Endpoint did not return HTTP 200 for the initial query. (Returned 400 instead)
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fkooman this worked at least once somewhere :)
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aaronpk i don't think i've fixed that problem yet, i would have commented on the github thread
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fkooman okay :)
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fkooman strange it did work once...
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aaronpk the ssl thing should be fixed if i remember what system packages to upgrade
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aaronpk tho I thought I just upgraded that server
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aaronpk oh darn, it's still ubuntu 12.04
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aaronpk well I can remove that one from the pool
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fkooman do you have some notes from your load balancing setup? it would be interesting to also look at that for indiecert and to get some experience with that as well
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aaronpk it's just DNS load balancing
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aaronpk so indieauth.com returns several addresses
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aaronpk i had to rewrite the whole thing to not actually store anything in a database and make it entirely stateless
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aaronpk none of the servers have a shared backend of any kind
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fkooman aaronpk, what about the authorization code for verification?
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aaronpk :)
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aaronpk what is my favorite database?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "my favorite database" yet. Would you like to create it? https://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=my+favorite+database&summary=prompted+by+aaronpk+https%3A%2F%2Findiewebcamp.com%2Firc%2F2015-07-02%2Fline%2F1435874243055
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aaronpk my favorite database is the network http://lucumr.pocoo.org/2013/11/17/my-favorite-database/
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loqi.me created /my_favorite_database (+119) "prompted by aaronpk https://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-07-02/line/1435874243055 and dfn added by aaronpk" (view diff)
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Loqi ok
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fkooman aaronpk, ah, i see :)
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fkooman indieauth.com always gives 71.214.80.188 to me
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kylewm aaronparecki.com is the 5th search result for "my favorite database is the network"
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kylewm (kylewm.com is 10th)
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fkooman if i ask 8.8.8.8 I get 45.79.83.22
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aaronpk your dns server may be caching more aggressively
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kylewm I'm amazed how easy it is to get on the front page of search results these days
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aaronpk i just removed that one so in a few minutes it'll probably stop returning it
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fkooman aaronpk, stupid home router crap
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aaronpk speaking of... bear, think the new one is ready to go?
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bear @aaronpk - yes
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bear my firefox resolved it with zero ocsp issues
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aaronpk cool
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aaronpk it's in the pool now!
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tantek.com edited /scope (+32) "more see also" (view diff)
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aaronpk (i'm going to be on a bike for the next couple hours, so if things blow up can you log in and remove it?)
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KevinMarks what for, kylewm?
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kylewm KevinMarks: I just mean, aaronpk and I are both on the first page of search results just for posting links to this mitsuhiko article https://www.google.com/search?q=my+favorite+database+is+the+network
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fkooman There was an SSL error connecting to https://www.tuxed.net/fkooman/ :P
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aaronpk you're on the same server still
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fkooman ah, I'll change DNS servers
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aaronpk if you want to test one directly, you can try https://p3k.indieauth.com or https://primary.indieauth.com
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aaronpk https://aaronpk.indieauth.com/ is the one running off my home gigabit network which is the one you're having trouble with
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aaronpk (the other two are ubuntu 14.04, my home server is 12.04)
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KevinMarks that's a fairly obscure phrase
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kylewm but it was a popular post on a high traffic blog, I assume lots of people read it
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fkooman aaronpk, ah, but it still gives the 400 error with indiecert.net, so i can't get much further :)
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KevinMarks right, but most people tweet rather than blog, so google will only show 1 from twitter.com
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tantek KevinMarks: huh that's interesting. observation? or documented?
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tantek perhaps good to add to /Why
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tantek also - /FreeMyOAuth icons need updating if anyone wants to help get new ones
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kylewm KevinMarks: yep that was exactly my point. everybody uses silos, so its easy to get a high page rank just by existing outside of one
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tantek can we make the same js;dr argument about silo;dr ? that is, that people's silo posts are ignorable because they won't get indexed/archived?
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kylewm is feeling intense deja vu
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tantek.com uploaded /Special:Log/upload "uploaded "[[File:2015-183-useronboard-form-block.png]]""
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tantek per discussions about DNS, WHOIS previously in this channel: http://ma.tt/2015/07/domain-anonymity-and-the-brilliance-of-entertainment-lobbyists/
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tantek oh dear, the "Related" box at the bottom of that page is an article about OpenID, Spam, and the (defunct) service Magnolia
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tantek (from 2008)
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tantek I wonder what WP plugin does the "Related" box of articles at the bottom, and how it picks out a 7+ year old article!
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GWG Those Related plugins usually stink
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tantek.com edited /2014-review (+642) "/* Community Resources */ generations, communication" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /Trovebox (+0) "fix date per citation" (view diff)
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tantek I keep LOLing here btw, reviewing /2014-created pages - so much humor.
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tantek E.g. just came across
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tantek what are timezones?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "timezones" yet. Would you like to create it? https://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=timezones&summary=prompted+by+tantek+https%3A%2F%2Findiewebcamp.com%2Firc%2F2015-07-02%2Fline%2F1435880138816
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tantek I mean, what is a timezone?
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Loqi timezones are a way to create dependencies in your code on legislative bodies in countries you have never heard of[1] https://indiewebcamp.com/timezone
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tantek see also leapseconds?
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tantek oh dear, /lulz and /chicken were created in 2014
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tantek.com edited /2014-review (+104) "/* Technologies */ fragmention!" (view diff)
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kevinmarks.com edited /fragmention (+20) "better definition" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /2014-review (+139) "/* Community Resources */ disclosure" (view diff)
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KevinMarks CSS driving me mad today
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tantek apologizes in general
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tantek.com edited /2014-review (+158) "/* Community Resources */ facepile" (view diff)
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KevinMarks flex-box is actually nicer
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KevinMarks than previous CSS tricks
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KevinMarks but using it with SVG is bothersome
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KevinMarks or maybe I'm just breaking dabblet
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tantek.com edited /2014-review (+692) "/* Community Resources */ archive, this-week-in-the-indieweb, follow, collection, exercise, quotation" (view diff)
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tantek nearly getting to an a-z of new community resources created in 2014
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tantek and that's after a review of the first half of /2014-created !
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KartikPrabhu Loqi messages?