#indiewebcamp 2015-07-27

2015-07-27 UTC
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@veganstraightedge Thanks to @t for publishing this #indieweb 2014 recap. It's important to look back on our accomplishments sometimes. http://tantek.com/2015/201/b1/indiewebcamp-2014-year-review (twitter.com/_/status/625465793912815617)
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GWG !tell acegiak Some of what I'm doing is up in the GIthub repo, if you want to look
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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@MicropubInfo July 26, 2015 5:32am: July 26, 2015 7:25am GMT-0700 · ← → Notes · Articles · Notes · Replies · Metrics · Pages... https://www.google.com/url?rct=j&sa=t&url=https://aaronparecki.com/notes/2015/07/26/1/micropub-indieweb&ct=ga&cd=CAIyHDNlNjg4ODQzODIxNzA0ZmU6Y28udWs6ZW46R0I&usg=AFQjCNHD0b1gOfFxD_bSXcVTyT-nQNqjwg&utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter (twitter.com/_/status/625465624248975360)
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kylewm complains about documentation that uses "authentication" and "authorization" interchangably
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kylewm #justindiewebthings
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kylewm specifically wordpress.com
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kylewm (that said, their API is great and such a big difference from the walled gardeny silos)
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GWG kylewm: As I said, you should try for the new REST API
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GWG http://v2.wp-api.org/
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GWG I think it is similar, but they are trying to refine it before integration
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kylewm GWG: I don't really want to encourage self-hosted Wordpress users to use silo.pub
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kylewm they should use the Micropub plugin right?
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GWG kylewm: If the standard is clarified on the subject of editing, yes
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kylewm what are you working on this evening, GWG?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "you working on this evening, GWG" yet. Would you like to create it? http://indiewebcamp.com/s/100T
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kylewm !give Loqi a sock
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Loqi gives a sock to Loqi
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kylewm gives Loqi a sock
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Loqi eyes the sock
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ben_thatmustbeme !give kylewm a hard time
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Loqi gives a hard time to kylewm
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kylewm amen
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kylewm oh man this is very confusing. I want to get authorization credentials from Wordpress.com, but later also want to use it as an identity provider ... should I create two different "Applications" for those two purposes?
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kylewm because the SiloPub Wp.com application only allows one redirect_uri to be used, and I don't know how to use the same one for those two very different purposes...
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aaronpk you're kidding me
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Loqi aaronpk: anomalily left you a message 2 hours, 48 minutes ago: to work on his book http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-07-26/line/1437952163915
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aaronpk tehe I am don't worry
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aaronpk kylewm: that's is bad form on wordpress.com's part. but the way to get around it is to use the "state" parameter
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aaronpk you can do state=123123124123-authz and state=123124123124-id and then your app can know what to do
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aaronpk see this is why i am writing a book on OAuth :)
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kylewm ok, that makes sense...
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kylewm haha, yes! back to work!
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GWG aaronpk: I'm sorry to say I'm not planning to read it
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aaronpk haha
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GWG But if for some reason I decide to implement oauth, your book will be my first stop
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kylewm will read it
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kylewm I have to say http://grant.codes/ is the coolest domain thus far, sorry yourmom.io
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GWG aaronpk: Have you written any other books?
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GWG And why is anomalily coming in here to tell us not to distract you?
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GWG By the way, hope we aren't?
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GWG Did you offer her a free copy?
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@AdGoggleKo RT @conflictmedia: Cool and important work is done on #federation & #decentralization http://www.w3.org/2013/socialweb/social-wg-charter.html http://indiewebcamp.com/ @w3c #i… (twitter.com/_/status/625502547168526336)
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tantek aaronpk++ for peacekeeping
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Loqi tantek: KevinMarks left you a message 6 hours, 2 minutes ago: I am sometimes getting 400 errors when fetching http://tantek.com (note no /) http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-07-26/line/1437950846670
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Loqi aaronpk has 910 karma
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tantek aaronpk - would it be bad to edit that typo tanttk to fix a mistaken link?
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tantek (in the logs)
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tantek rhiaro++ for a successful #IndieWebCamp Edi!
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Loqi rhiaro has 134 karma
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tantek jarofgreen++ for a successful #IndieWebCamp Edi!
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Loqi jarofgreen has 3 karma
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KevinMarks_ So please fix my typo
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tantek aaronpk ^^^
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@energyovertime Geeking out. Set up personal domain hosting via github pages, web sign-in via indieauth, validated my profiles via http://indiewebify.me/validate-rel-me/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fbradleyallen.info (twitter.com/_/status/625537595422801925)
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@voxpelli @energyovertime Nice! Happy to see more static site IndieWebbers :) If you want to set up WebMentions next, check https://webmention.herokuapp.com/ (twitter.com/_/status/625579659514769408)
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@CelesteSalas6 RT @meedabyte: Why We All Need to Make the Internet Fun Again http://recode.net/2015/07/17/why-we-all-need-to-make-the-internet-fun-again/?utm_content=buffer230ff&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer #amazing @caseorganic on #decentralization #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/625581008239390720)
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petermolnar good morning
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petermolnar how was Edinburgh?
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tbrb petermolnar: I think it went pretty well actually, most people seemed to take something from the weekend and there was a lot of good hacking done on the sunday
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moredhel yeah, I definitely enjoyed it.
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moredhel I spent more time being social and chatting than actually hacking though
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@Sahnelinchen Es funzt plötzlich alles viel schneller als ich dachte. Neues Theme und #indieweb laufen. Fehlen nur noch ein paar Beitragsfotos! #blogumzug (twitter.com/_/status/625606407409246208)
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@LukasRosenstock @mxstbr The idea of putting keys on your site fits the #IndieWeb spirit very well, I invite you to present it on @indiewebcamp IRC and wiki. (twitter.com/_/status/625645331821273088)
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Loqi Welcome, indie-visitor! Set your nickname by typing /nick yourname
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mxstbr As Lukas Rosenstock suggested on twitter, (https://twitter.com/LukasRosenstock/status/625645331821273088) I'll share a project of mine here, pgp.asc. (http://pgpasc.org) The idea is to decentralise public PGP keys by storing them on your own server, in the root folder, in a file called pgp.asc. That way, to get a public PGP key you just have to go to recipientdomain.tld/pgp.asc and you'll get his key. E.g. if you go to http://m
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@LukasRosenstock @mxstbr The idea of putting keys on your site fits the #IndieWeb spirit very well, I invite you to present it on @indiewebcamp IRC and wiki. (twitter.com/_/status/625645331821273088)
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voxpelli mxstbr: It's a neat idea! I think it ties into http://indiewebcamp.com/pgp and perhaps especially https://indieauth.com/gpg
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cweiske that works for 1 person per domain
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mxstbr voxpelli cheers for the links, will read through them! cweiske, yes, exactly it is currently intended for personal domains.
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petermolnar mxstbr you can store that in dns and there's already a few solutions for that...
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petermolnar check dkim and the *._domainkey entries
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voxpelli there's many ways for discovery – all with their upsides and downsides :)
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petermolnar although to be honest the more I understand the DNS system I trust it less and less
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petermolnar so alternatives may not be bad ideas
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mxstbr petermolnar, true, but you have to be able to add DNS records, which might not be given. Also, you know the DNS system... ;-)
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petermolnar mxstbr so which PGP key is meant to be uploaded?
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petermolnar the primary mail I believe
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mxstbr petermolnar Whichever one you want to share
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petermolnar but how will the mail address be discovered?
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mxstbr petermolnar: it's assumed the sender already has it/has an easy to find it (e.g. a mention on your webpage)
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voxpelli if the e-mailer claims to be the same user as site X and you on site X finds a public key that can verify a signature included in the e-mail then that verifies that claim
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petermolnar ( by the way I had /pgp for this already, but not as plain text; the pgp.avc does make is more reasonable )
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petermolnar s/pgp/gpg/
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Loqi petermolnar meant to say: ( by the way I had /gpg for this already, but not as plain text; the gpg.avc does make is more reasonable )
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petermolnar mxstbr please move pgpasc.org to https :); http://indiewebcamp.com/https has guide
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mxstbr petermolnar that's what I'm currently doing, just waiting for the certificates. Should be done soon!
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@aaronpk @LukasRosenstock @mxstbr If you link to your PGP key you can sign in to the wiki with your domain! https://indieauth.com/gpg (twitter.com/_/status/625666628819267584)
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@maxbarners An epic review of 2014 for the #IndieWeb movement from @t. Own your data! http://tantek.com/2015/201/b1/indiewebcamp-2014-year-review (twitter.com/_/status/625667168575864833)
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aaronpk just caught up on (short) logs from overnight :)
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aaronparecki.com edited /antipatterns (+106) "add well-known" (view diff)
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voxpelli aaronpk: funny that the well-known wiki page doesn't have /.well-known as an example ;)
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aaronpk haha yeah
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Loqi rofl
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snarfed /.well-known++
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snarfed lesser evil at least
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aaronparecki.com edited /well-known (+14) "/* Examples */ add .well-known" (view diff)
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voxpelli +1
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aaronpk mxstbr: for the GPG support for indieauth.com, I let people put their GPG key wherever they want, including on a different hostname, and just link to it with a rel=me attribute from their home page
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voxpelli it and webfinger – I still find them a bit interesting, but lack of momentum around them makes me not give them a lot of attention
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aaronpk the benefit is you can put the GPG key wherever you want, regardless of what backend storage mechanism you're using. and if you want, you can even put it on a different server
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aaronpk some people link directly to their key on keybase.io that way
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voxpelli aaronpk: https://indieauth.com/gpg says you should link to it with a rel-pgpkey?
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aaronpk oh yes sorry
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voxpelli too bad there doesn't seem to be a mime-type for such keys – otherwise a <a rel="me" type="a-relevant-mime-type"> would have been kind of neat
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cweiske voxpelli, there is "asc"
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cweiske ascii-armored data
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@LukasRosenstock Interested in the #IndieWeb? Read the great 2014 review of the @indiewebcamp movement by @t: http://tantek.com/2015/201/b1/indiewebcamp-2014-year-review?utm_content=buffera01d4&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer (via @pfefferle) (twitter.com/_/status/625670750033330176)
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aaronpk the idea of ascii as "armor" is amusing
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mxstbr aaronpk yeah, but then you need a webpage to parse. Having the pgp key at /pgp.asc, no matter if you have a website or not has the benefit of not needing a webpage.
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aaronpk that feels like an edge case not worth optimizing for
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aaronpk especially since it still requires web hosting
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aaronpk when I have seen people who have a domain but don't have a website there, it's because they don't have hosting for the domain and there is no A record for their domain
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mxstbr Don't feel like that's necessarily true, one of my domains (mxs.is) is hosted on a virtual host that is solely a link shortener — no homepage there.
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mxstbr Maybe it's just me though, that's possible. :-)
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aaronpk why would you want your pgp key on your short domain tho?
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mxstbr Because I have an email address @mxs.is
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aaronpk aha that is a great reason :)
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aaronpk it would still work though, because mxs.is redirects to mxstbr.com which does have a home page!
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mxstbr And the basic premise is that a mail client could automatically check for a pgp key based on the recipients domain
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petermolnar aaronpk is there a way to use that link rel="pgpkey" as rel="me" in a hcard?
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mxstbr Yeah I just checked that and mxs.is/pgp.asc works as well, because it redirects to mxstbr.com aswell
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voxpelli one could have the well-known as a fallback to a rel-pgpkey
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aaronpk it looks like http://microformats.org/wiki/h-card lists a "key" property, not sure where that came from
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voxpelli aaronpk: a lot of those keys are taken from vCard, aren't they? So from there?
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aaronpk likely
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aaronpk mxstbr: nice job on the pgpasc.org site though, es sieht gut aus! :)
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mxstbr aaronpk Danke sehr! Thankfully, a proper designer stepped forward, big props to Jurgis! (see here: https://github.com/mxstbr/pgp.asc/issues/1)
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mxstbr While I'm okay at design, I get really perfectionistic and it's never good enough, so it takes me ages to finish anything.
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mxstbr So it's good to have somebody else take that responsibility ;-)
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aaronpk that's great!
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aaronpk I'd love someone to help with design for some of my projects like indieauth.com and webmention.io :) I mostly use bootstrap and do as little as possible haha
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ben_thatmustbeme i think i might have mptweet working
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aaronpk is that the micropub endpoint that actually posts to twitter?
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ben_thatmustbeme aaronpk: yes
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ben_thatmustbeme i'm trying to get it correctly returning data so i can store the syndication url
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ben_thatmustbeme but i have had it syndicating already. i somehow just broke it actually
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@kylewmahan https://silo.pub/ supports “native” authentication now! #indieweb #micropub https://www.youtube.com/ (twitter.com/_/status/625690522120622080)
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aaronpk ooo
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aaronpk that's amazing
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aaronpk kylewm++
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Loqi kylewm has 198 karma
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kylewm thank you!
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kylewm I should have recorded the video on a smaller window
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Loqi definitely
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aaronpk hehe yeah a full screen shrunk down is hard to see
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snarfed kylewm++ !
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Loqi kylewm has 199 karma
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snarfed kylewm: youtube's "up next" videos for your screencast are soooo random
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aaronpk i wish there was a way to disable those as a publisher
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snarfed MUST SEE! Magicians Young & Strange Hijack Sky News!
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snarfed MUST SEE! Magicians Young & Strange Hijack Sky News!
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snarfed 6ft Man in 6ft Giant Water Balloon - 4K
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snarfed MUST SEE! Magicians Young & Strange Hijack Sky News!
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snarfed 6ft Man in 6ft Giant Water Balloon - 4K
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snarfed How to Destroy Your Cell Phone With Sen. Lindsey Graham
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snarfed huh that was weird paste behavior
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KartikPrabhu !spammer snarfed ;) jk jk
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Loqi Only aaronpk and tantek can do that
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snarfed heh
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kylewm ha, yeah that is weird. It would've been nice if it was other indieweb related stuff....
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aaronpk i think it uses tags to match? so if you add a bunch of indieweb tags it might help
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snarfed kylewm: minor typo on https://silo.pub/tumblr/site/snarfed.tumblr.com/micropub/ : purposse
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snarfed fun pun though
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aaronpk oh and that description isn't accurate anymore right?
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kylewm oh, yeah I need to change that copy
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kylewm good catch both
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snarfed i tried teacup against my test tumblr just now, and i think teacup worked, but http://snarfed.tumblr.com/ doesn't show it. maybe because teacup doesn't pass content?
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aaronpk teacup passes summary, no content
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snarfed teacup post: https://teacup.p3k.io/snarfed.tumblr.com/3470
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snarfed right. maybe silo.pub should either allow that or error?
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aaronpk accepting summary as a fallback would be a good plan i think
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kylewm yeah
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kylewm did you say that 'summary' will maybe be the thing that is always guaranteed?
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snarfed wow, jonnybarnes your autosave animation on https://jonnybarnes.uk/notes/new is very…animated :P
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aaronpk if no content
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KartikPrabhu aaronpk: hfeed2atom now has a service for Atom: https://kartikprabhu.com/hfeed2atom?url=https://aaronparecki.com let me know if you use it or have suggestions
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aaronpk KartikPrabhu: nice!
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snarfed also jonnybarnes minor feature suggestion, i first tried logging in with snarfed.tumblr.com and it errored. maybe consider adding http:// automatically in that case.
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snarfed KartikPrabhu++ woo!
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Loqi KartikPrabhu has 110 karma
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kylewm ok cool, added summary http://kylemahan.tumblr.com/post/125176721187/just-drank-coffee
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KartikPrabhu might attempt an appspot move if my bandwidth takes a big hit but for now easier to host myself
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aaronpk that's amazing
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aaronpk http://miniblog.aaron.pk/post/125176752446/nice-work-with-silopub-kylewm
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aaronpk worked with my custom domain tumblr too :)
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kylewm oh yay! that needs more testing
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Loqi yay!
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snarfed KartikPrabhu: https://kartikprabhu.com/hfeed2atom?url=https://snarfed.org is hanging on me :( maybe ssl is unhappy?
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KartikPrabhu snarfed: yeah weird. because it is the same code as on my website which seems to get your webmentions fine afaik. will track the problem
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snarfed jonnybarnes: another bug report, when i clicked on Refresh Syndication Targets, it errored and then kept erroring on every page until i cleared cookies. just fyi
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aaronparecki.com edited /Micropub-brainstorming (+68) "/* Explicit CRUD */" (view diff)
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kylewm I'm having trouble loading kartikprabhu.com at all
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KartikPrabhu kylewm: yeah seems snarfed's feed triggered some bad process on server. will have to restart apache
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snarfed aww sorry
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snarfed kylewm: using silopub…i wonder if there's a way to skip the tumblr approval prompt every time
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KartikPrabhu i ran into this with some feeds earlier but I thought I fixed it
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aaronpk sometimes oauth providers have a parameter that can skip the prompt if the user has already authorized the app
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kylewm i tried to use /authenticate instead of /authorize there, but tumblr only has the latter
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KartikPrabhu kylewm: site should be back up
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KartikPrabhu https://kartikprabhu.com/hfeed2atom?url=https://snarfed.org seems to work now but only picks up 2 posts. weird indeed
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snarfed huh
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KartikPrabhu alright. good stuff to hack on tonight :P
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aaronpk yeah no mention of a way to skip it on tumblr
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aaronpk sometimes i'ts a parameter on the /authorize url
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kylewm snarfed: I think your h-feed has a deleted post cached at the top of it
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snarfed kylewm: huh, what do you mean cached?
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kylewm I see an entry for https://snarfed.org/2015-07-26_kyle-mahan-stackoverflow-needs-a-way-to-mark-good-responses
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snarfed also, funny…i'm trying different micropub clients from https://indiewebcamp.com/micropub#Clients , i hit elf-pavlik's at https://elf-pavlik.github.io/unmpc/ , and i have no clue how to use it
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kylewm but the post itself is missing
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snarfed makes me feel dumb
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kylewm oh ha, elf's needs CORS at minimum
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snarfed ah, true, that post is indeed deleted. odd that it's there. meh.
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kylewm and even then I think it will only post to one domain
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snarfed kylewm: oh you've been sampling clients too?
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aaronpk yeah i don't know how to use elf's either
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snarfed i totally didn't for wp-micropub
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snarfed heh ok good then
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aaronpk i don't know what "space" means, or why it has "aaronparecki.com" pre-filled in the "persona" label which is disabled
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snarfed yup
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snarfed i barely even know what persona is
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kylewm heh, I still have access-control-allow-origin:"https://elf-pavlik.github.io" in my headers
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fkooman aaronpk, snarfed it is not super intuitive, but it works with phubble.tuxed.net as far as I know (https://phubble.tuxed.net)
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snarfed taproot got a 403 on silopub to blogger
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fkooman but you need to use indiecert to be able to actually use the micropub endpoint for now :(
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snarfed fkooman: ah ok. even UI wise, i was immediately stumped. but meh no matter.
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snarfed (taproot: https://waterpigs.co.uk/notes/new/ )
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fkooman snarfed, haha yeah, the prefiil is a bit confusing :)
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snarfed aaronpk: teacup crashed on me just now, trying to post a custom food + location to http://freedom-io-2.blogspot.com/
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snarfed let me know if you want the stacktrace
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aaronpk eep
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aaronpk sure
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fkooman snarfed, it has the ability to view and post to private 'spaces', so you have to specify the URL of the 'space' you want to post to. Only if you are a member of the group associated with the space you can post...
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snarfed i should start charging for qa :P
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Loqi +1
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snarfed fkooman: i see. soo it's feature rich but only partly micropub
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snarfed all of those explanations would be great to have on the site itself!
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fkooman snarfed, well...
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fkooman it is an experiment with private micropub/webmention etc.
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snarfed definitely worth saying on the site :P
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fkooman agreed :)
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snarfed aaronpk: https://snarfed.org/teacup
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aaronpk thx
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snarfed ok i'm 2/5 on micropub clients so far
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aaronpk snarfed: how'd you manage to pull that off? were you using the teacup site as normal?
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snarfed postly (ben_thatmustbeme) and jonnybarnes yes, teacup taproot unmpc no
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snarfed aaronpk: i guess?
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snarfed manually through a browser yes
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aaronpk weird, i don't understand how that case was hit, but i can fix it anyway
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fkooman snarfed, https://github.com/elf-pavlik/unmpc/issues/1
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snarfed fkooman: thanks!
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snarfed oh actually 2/6. https://micropublish.herokuapp.com/ also failed. couldn't even log in
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kylewm I need to remember this -- do not test only on Quill
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kylewm adds logging
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fkooman still is unable to get Quill running locally :-)
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aaronpk fkooman: you might try again, Jeena just added sqlite support for it
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snarfed hey quill is still better than my wp-micropub testing, i think i only used curl :P
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snarfed kylewm: but afaict most/all of the failures were their fault, not yorus
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snarfed trying hard to find a seventh non-quill client
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kylewm that's what silopub wants you to think
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kylewm woodwind?
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snarfed i thought readers all required indie config etc?
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snarfed btw kylewm didn't you write a cmd line client? should it be on https://indiewebcamp.com/micropub#Clients ?
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kylewm indie config like /indie-config? nah, it's optional
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snarfed oh ok then
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kylewm I started a cmd line client but fell short
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snarfed ah
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aaronpk you could try monocle but it might not be sufficiently diffeerent from quill since i wrote it too :)
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snarfed heh
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kylewm Taproot is sending the wrong client_id
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kylewm to the token endpoint
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fkooman aaronpk, yeah I did, but was unable to debug white screen of death, nothing in logs, have to look more :)
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aaronpk ah weird. might be local php error logging settings?
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fkooman aaronpk, that was my first guess... I'll take a look now :)
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snarfed kylewm, silly question, how do i reply from woodwind?
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snarfed oh i have to configure it
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snarfed maybe consider auto-discovering and enabling mp/indie-config?
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snarfed also, when i enabled micropub, auth worked, but then it was unchecked when i was redirected back to woodwind
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snarfed (checking it showed the stored auth)
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Jeena fkooman what problems do you have with it? Most of the things I had was that I had to change something in the php.ini to get it running, perhaps I can help?
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fkooman Jeena, thanks, I'll fiddle some more first :)
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snarfed woo silopub success! three posts on three silos from three different clients: http://freedom-io-2.blogspot.com/ , http://snarfed.tumblr.com/ , https://ryandc.wordpress.com/
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snarfed kylewm++
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Loqi kylewm has 200 karma
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Jeena ok, are you trying to run it via apache or just plain php -S localhost:8000 or something like that?
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aaronpk snarfed++ that's great!
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Loqi snarfed has 122 karma
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snarfed btw kylewm silopub's silo setup instructions are great, nice work on those
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fkooman Jeena, via apache
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fkooman Jeena, i now reach the post screen! :-) but posting doesn't do anything
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Jeena I would start with the standalone thing first, and when that is working go over to apache if your really need it
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Jeena hehe nice, good luck with the rest then too ;)
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fkooman Request made to your Micropub endpoint
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fkooman this box remains empty
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kylewm snarfed: thanks for the testing!! yeah the micropub radio button thing is a problem i've had before too. i need to fix it so that it has to submit before you can click "authorize micropub" or something like that
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fkooman Jeena, ah, CSP issue
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kylewm man, micropub clients are all different :p
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kylewm adding "micropub test suite" to my itches...
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fkooman Jeena, aaronpk everything works now :)
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Jeena cool :D
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fkooman i had to empty the users table
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fkooman that fixed stuff
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Jeena it is a pitty that you have to be on port 80 to authenticate with https://indieauth.com/
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Jeena I needed to run Quill as root to do that for testing
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Jeena oh not quill, my website
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Jeena because you can use ip addresses as domains but without the port
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fkooman but cool now, i have an offline micropub client, yee :)
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kylewm.com edited /User:Kylewm.com (+283) "Micropub conformance test suite" (view diff)
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kylewm.com edited /User:Kylewm.com (-2) "/* Itches */ markup fix" (view diff)
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aaronpk Jeena: you shouldn't need to be on port 80
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aaronpk someone logged in with their domain on port 8081 this weekend
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Jeena weird, I couldn't do it, it would just hang or something
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kylewm snarfed: also thanks for the kind words about the instructions -- i borrowed a bunch from bridgy for blogs, especially the direct links to Customize HTML type pages
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aaronpk Jeena: well until sunday one of the servers was blocking outgoing traffic except 80 and 443
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aaronpk but that's fixed now
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Jeena ah I see
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Jeena than that is not a problem anymore
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Jeena then
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kylewm I think maybe when I redo the oauth flow for Blogger, it invalidates the old token
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mxstbr aaronpk: are webmentions.io and indieauth.com online somewhere? (GitHub or similar)
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mxstbr Can take a look when I have a few minutes
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aaronpk yes, on https://github.com/aaronpk/IndieAuth.com and https://github.com/aaronpk/webmention.io
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aaronparecki.com edited /Micropub-brainstorming (+2295) "html escaping" (view diff)
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aaronpk this is relevant to many people here, would appreciate review/thoughts: http://indiewebcamp.com/Micropub-brainstorming#HTML_Escaping
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aaronpk particularly if you've written either a micropub client or server
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Jeena jeez, Facebook has such a shitty UI, something a friend of mine commented showed up in my stream, I wanted to find it, but I can't on his timeline it doesn't show up and in my stream it's gone too
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voxpelli aaronpk: so far I have assumed "content" to always be HTML – good with a generic approach for that
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aaronpk voxpelli: if you assume it to be html, how would you expect to be able to type un-escaped things in a client? like if you're typing literally <blink> and you want the <> to show up in your note?
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aaronpk cause the other way this could go (which diverges from the microformats<->micropub mapping) is to say that clients should send escaped content
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voxpelli that would make all params e-* essentially
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voxpelli good to be able to differentiate between when one wants a e-* and when one wants a non e-* parameter – so +1 on your suggestion
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aaronpk cool, that's a +1 to what's in the wiki?
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voxpelli yep
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aaronpk would you mind adding that to the wiki then? probably worth collecting there
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voxpelli and then we can do content[lang]=sv to define the language as well if that direction for language gets traction ;)
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aaronpk ah yeah
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aaronpk i like that
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voxpelli aaronpk: how do one typically mark up a +1 on a brainstorm page? :P
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aaronpk * +1 ~~~~
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voxpelli at the very bottom or at the top of the suggestion?
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aaronpk i guess at the bottom
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voxpelli not much feedback on the micropub brainstorming page :P
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aaronpk there's a bit of discussion under some of the things
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kodfabrik.se edited /Micropub-brainstorming (+83) "Add my +1" (view diff)
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aaronpk damn, i just realized a limitation of using the "edit-of" and "delete-of" properties that way
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cweiske aaronpk, I didn't get a webmention from your post
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cweiske I wonder why
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aaronpk checks his webmention sending logs
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cweiske nothing in my linkback database
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aaronpk doesn't have actual logs, just tmux scrollback ,and it's gone
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Loqi [mention] Aaron Parecki posted 'Today I extended @cweiske's sequence diagram to cover the whole IndieAuth for Micropub flow. Hope it's helpful! More info here: http://indie...' linking to http://indiewebcamp.com/obtaining-an-access-token (https://aaronparecki.com/notes/2015/07/26/3/)
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aaronpk oh you know what, i bet my webmention sending from micropub is broken somehow
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aaronpk just forced it to re-send for that post
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cweiske got it
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cweiske KartikPrabhu, I often do not get a response for https://kartikprabhu.com/hfeed2atom?url=https://aaronparecki.com (or a timeout)
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aaronparecki.com edited /Micropub-brainstorming (+274) "/* Multiple in-reply-to */" (view diff)
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cweiske 504 - Gateway Timeout
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cweiske aaronpk, when clicking on the "more notes" link on your home page, it'd be nice if it jumped to the correct anchor on the notes page
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aaronpk good idea
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cweiske so I can continue reading instead of having to scroll down manually
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@csarven http://csarven.ca/webmention is a #webmention endpoint w/ #RDF & #microformats support, optionally accepts a property parameter. Details provided (twitter.com/_/status/625720555308777472)
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tantek good morning #indiewebcamp!
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tantek !tell GWG any plans for HWC in NYC this week?
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tantek http://indiewebcamp.com/events/2015-07-29-homebrew-website-club
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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cweiske KartikPrabhu, you should send out last-modified headers with your hfeed2atom proxy and support if-modified-since request headers
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kylewm aaronpk: I think that IndieAuth.com's verify step does not check that the client_id matches... should it? https://github.com/aaronpk/IndieAuth.com/blob/master/controllers/verify.rb#L81
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kylewm cweiske: he would have to implement caching to support that too right?
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cweiske not really. he could still query the original source and use its last-modified headers
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cweiske but having a cache would of course be better
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aaronpk kylewm: yes you're right
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kylewm oh gotcha, and just forward "Unmodified" to the client?
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tantek hey aaronpk is HWC a hacknight again this week?
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tantek or is that just getting errantly copy/pasted forward from one event to another?
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kylewm s/Unmodified/HTTP 304 Not modified
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Loqi kylewm meant to say: oh gotcha, and just forward "HTTP 304 Not modified" to the client?
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aaronpk yeah i want to do hacknights for a while
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tantek hoping you'll make it more open than just a hack night so we can be more inclusive of a broader set of creatives
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tantek ok
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cweiske kylewm, yes
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aaronpk helps me set aside time to actually work on things
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tantek fair
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aaronpk i admit it's a somewhat selfish goal :)
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cuibonobo hey everyone
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aaronpk waves at cuibonobo
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cuibonobo i got a response from the Apache Any23 people
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cuibonobo apparently there's a google summer of code project that is tackling this
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cuibonobo and they'd like to interface with kylewm to merge code
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cuibonobo see here: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/ANY23-207
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tantek yay!
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Loqi yay!
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tantek.com edited /events/2015-07-29-homebrew-website-club (-449) "delete past cities, comment out NYC until/unless GWG sets it up - he can uncomment, add Göteborg to Notes" (view diff)
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aaronpk speaking of which, it might be time for me to add an events interface to Quill so that I can post indie events faster :)
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cuibonobo so kylewm, if that's cool with you, you can jump into that thread and see what needs to be done
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kylewm whoa, cool
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KevinMarks http://meme.loqi.me/4cPrktLb.jpg
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aaronparecki.com edited /Micropub-brainstorming (+184) "/* Explicit CRUD */" (view diff)
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aaronpk ben_thatmustbeme: thoughts on http://indiewebcamp.com/Micropub-brainstorming#Explicit_CRUD ?
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voxpelli aaronpk: +1
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voxpelli is generous with +1:s today
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voxpelli then there's "q" for GET requests and "mp-action" for POST requests that decides what kind of request it is and everything else regarding that request is relative to the kind of action, right?
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voxpelli such a setup is very flexible and future proof
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KevinMarks I'm trying to get 304 working with unmung hovercards, but hitting all kinds of oddnesss
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KevinMarks which wasn't showing up when I just dis a naive read
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aaronpk yes, as well as "access_token" for the post body
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kodfabrik.se edited /Micropub-brainstorming (+148) "/* Explicit CRUD */ Adding a +1" (view diff)
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KartikPrabhu cweiske: thanks will look into it. I don't know what is causing the time outs
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tantek FYI demoing (video of) SWAT0 at Mozilla in minutes as part of https://wiki.mozilla.org/WeeklyUpdates/2015-07-27 - public stream info there
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tantek aaronpk FYI - did you catch the errant typo link(s) to tanttk(.)com?
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aaronpk yep
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tantek thanks!
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kylewm cuibonobo++
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Loqi cuibonobo has 16 karma
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aaronpk tunes into the mozilla livestream
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cweiske KartikPrabhu, too bad that the feed isn't a full one with content
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KartikPrabhu cweiske: it is if the original h-feed is
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KartikPrabhu it doesn't do article fetching simply converts h-feed to Atom
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cweiske http://fotostore.cweiske.de/screenshots/2015-07-27%20thin%20feed.png
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cweiske not very reading friendly :/
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KartikPrabhu cweiske: h-feed page for that?
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cweiske /articles
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tantek and done!
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cweiske https://kartikprabhu.com/hfeed2atom?url=http://aaronparecki.com/articles
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kylewm I don't think you should expect hfeed2atom to produce higher fidelity than the h-feed itself...
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kylewm that seems like an unreasonable expectation
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KartikPrabhu yeah. it has the same readability as aaronpk's feed page :)
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tantek indeed!
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KartikPrabhu except aaronpk's page is nicely designed to be readbale
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voxpelli if one uses a client like Feedbin or Reeder.app then one can get the full article extracted in there
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kylewm I noticed Feedly does that too, are they parsing microformats??
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cweiske pubsubhubbub was meant to take load from the server, but by only providing thin h-feeds, the clients do have to fetch more data
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voxpelli kylewm: feedbin and reeder.app uses the Readability API – so it's basically an Instapaper-like solution
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KartikPrabhu Feedly does not get the full article I think
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voxpelli My guess is that Feedly fetches Open Graph data – I know Bloglovin does (as I'm the one who built it there)
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KartikPrabhu oh noes my site is down again! :|
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voxpelli but +1 on cweiske – having clients fetch data from the individual page removes much of the point with fat pings from the hubs
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cweiske aaronpk used to have fat atom/rss feeds which my reader only had to fetch once. now, even with push, my reader has to request each article by itself
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KartikPrabhu no idea what in hfeed2atom is causing my server to go nuts
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voxpelli one way to solve that is to put the resolving in the hub – I believe Superfeedr has played around with some such things
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tantek cweiske - that's an interesting observation re: # of HTTP requests
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aaronpk that seems like a good job for the hub
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cweiske tantek, I already made that a year ago: http://cweiske.de/tagebuch/atom-vs-hfeed-size.htm
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cweiske Number of HTTP requests
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cweiske atom: 1
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cweiske h-feed: 11
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voxpelli cweiske: that's not a fair comparison – often you would want to fetch the individual articles for Atom as well
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cweiske why?
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voxpelli because the metadata of most RSS/Atom feeds are really bad
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aaronpk in practice, many publishers ended up putting only a summary in their atom feeds
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cweiske because ads
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voxpelli and the image data is often much worse than the Open Graph data – because honestly – how many web devs test the sites they design in RSS-readers vs tests them at Facebook?
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aaronpk right, but then clients go fetch the canonical html anyway to get the full article
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voxpelli (suprisingly few even tests them at Facebook!)
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voxpelli cweiske: not just ads, statistics are at least as important
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cweiske and they get stats from facebook?
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voxpelli sites want to know how many readers they have – and that very question was up in this channel as well – that people here wanted to know how many readers they would lose if they dropped their RSS-feed
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aaronpk it just occurred to me that this is analogous to podcast distribution
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voxpelli cweiske: Facebook has amazing stats!
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cweiske (never used it)
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aaronpk podcast feeds contain a link to the audio file, which all the clients go and download
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aaronpk there's no such thing as "fat podcast distribution"
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cweiske so you're comparing binary data with plain text (html) data
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aaronpk audio files are significantly larger
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cweiske yep. that's why they are not included in the feeds
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cweiske but the show notes are often
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aaronpk they *could* be included in the feeds
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aaronpk and they could be pushed to subscribers via PuSH as well
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aaronpk but they aren't
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voxpelli one difference is that audio (and photos) are static – harder to put a strain on a server when it's raw bandwidth rather than dynamic generation
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cweiske most podcasts have multiple formats, it would make no sense to put them all in the same feed
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voxpelli and it can be cached efficiently compared to an article page
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cweiske if only one format is then used by the client anyway
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cweiske but the HTML in the feed *will* be used, because there is no other format that delivers the same data
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aaronpk interesting observation re: dynamically generated pages vs static assets
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voxpelli but it would probably be a problem if a podcast started doing PuSH and had thousands of clients all trying to download an episode at once
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kylewm "most podcasts have multiple formats" -- citation needed?
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cweiske http://logbuch-netzpolitik.de/
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cweiske see the dropdown
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M-Kegan Most of the podcasts I listen to just have the one format personally...
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cweiske http://raumzeit-podcast.de/ same
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aaronpk the itunes spec (which obviously heavily dominates podcast distribution) only lists one enclosure https://www.apple.com/itunes/podcasts/specs.html
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voxpelli if one subscribes to a podcast through eg. iTunes – do Apple perhaps "fat ping" the audio by mirroring at their own servers and pointing clients there?
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kylewm huh, I'm pretty sure I've only ever seen that kind of thing on archive.org before
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cweiske http://freakshow.fm/ same
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aaronpk no, apple doesn't host audio
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voxpelli cweiske: the German podcaster community and the american one are fascinatingly different even in technological regard though ;)
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GWG snarfed: I tested against multiple clients for Micropub
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Loqi GWG: tantek left you a message 58 minutes ago: any plans for HWC in NYC this week? http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-07-27/line/1438018517197
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snarfed GWG: great!
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GWG tantek: No news from zachdonovan
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aaronpk you can get approximate listener counts by just checking the number of http requests for your audio file linked in your podcast rss feed
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cweiske http://www.alternativlos.org/33/
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snarfed wonders how KartikPrabhu's hfeed2atom compares to https://waterpigs.co.uk/services/microformats-to-atom/
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cweiske also multiple format
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cweiske s
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GWG snarfed: That is why Teacup works in the development version of the plugin.
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aaronpk cweiske: those don't have rss URLs do they?
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cweiske they have
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kylewm cweiske: yoru three examples are all produced by the same company!
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cweiske I'm subscribed via rss/atom to them
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cweiske kylewm, the last one not :)
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aaronpk the atom feed only has one audio type
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cweiske http://logbuch-netzpolitik.de/feed
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voxpelli yay – they have rel-payment links in them! then again – I see it is Tim Pritlove so kind of expected it :)
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aaronpk that last one doesn't even have an enclosure tag
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cweiske they have per-format feeds: http://logbuch-netzpolitik.de/abonnieren
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kylewm ahh, bad voltage has two different feeds, http://www.badvoltage.org/feed/ogg/ http://www.badvoltage.org/feed/mp3/
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cweiske http://logbuch-netzpolitik.de/feed/mp3
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cweiske http://logbuch-netzpolitik.de/feed/oga
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cweiske etc
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M-Kegan Isn't this mainly a bandwidth problem though? In the ideal world every rss feed would spit out all the info you need, but that's not the point of pinging the client like this though imo
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cweiske http://www.alternativlos.org/alternativlos.rss
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cweiske there are mp3s in it
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M-Kegan I want to be notified that there's a new podcast, but I may want to download it later eg because I'm on mobile data
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M-Kegan I should be able to choose.
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Loqi I agree
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cweiske M-Kegan, we're talking about pubsubhubbub here
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voxpelli M-Kegan: yeah, that probably mitigates the "running herd"(?) problem
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cweiske which means you need to be reachable anyway
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cweiske thundering herd
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GWG I am wondering if anything in the IndieWeb community would make for a good podcast
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M-Kegan voxpelli, sure that would help with thundering herds
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voxpelli and the fact that it is static means that if one have a big audience one probably puts the audio on a CDN
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M-Kegan cweiske, I don't get why this is any different between rss feeds and pubsub. If the server is going to send me a crap ton of data, I'd rather it didn't.
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voxpelli so – the conclusion here can perhaps be that if everyone were to switch their sites to jekyll then we could skip fat pings altogether – right? :)
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cweiske M-Kegan, ok.
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cweiske binary data are optional in the feeds; not everyone needs them immediately.
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cweiske but the html data /are/ needed
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cweiske because there is no other format that delivers the same data
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GWG tantek, I think I may need to replace zachdonovan for a while
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M-Kegan The core data needs to be supplied, but that's it imo. Send too much stuff and you also start increasing latency as my client desperately tries to download older content whilst newer stuff builds up.
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aaronpk what about embedded images in the html?
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ben_thatmustbeme aaronpk: i think that makes sense, and is exactly what i do already
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voxpelli well, just like you download a podcast when you want to hear it you can download the content of an article when you want to read it – the only really necessary stuff is URL, date – and a title is kind of nice :)
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aaronpk should that be sent in the fat ping as data URI?
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kylewm snarfed: does Bridgy use/handle refresh tokens for blogger?
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ben_thatmustbeme regarding explicit crud
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aaronpk ben_thatmustbeme: thanks
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cweiske M-Kegan, the push server should actually know when you got your last ping
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voxpelli aaronpk: oh please no :P
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aaronpk voxpelli: :D
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M-Kegan I feel quite strongly against data uris in general for similar reasons to why I think audio is a bad idea.
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cweiske and only send the diff to the current data
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M-Kegan But for teeny tiny icons I'm okay with that.
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voxpelli aaronpk: I've heard stories :P
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aaronpk (i'm illustrating a point here, not actually suggesting doing this)
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voxpelli it's amazing what people sometimes put in their metadata
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M-Kegan cweiske, yes but my point is that the diff may be large.
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M-Kegan Eg connectivity losses and the next time you ping you get lots of backlog.
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voxpelli (eg. found someone that put their entire blog posts within an og:details – one then hopes that one has put an upper limit on the size of that field within ones parser and data store :P)
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cweiske which "core meta data" are the ones you would expect in a feed?
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voxpelli date + url + title
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cweiske why is title and date required?
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cweiske you can get that from the url.
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M-Kegan There needs to be enough information for that client to make an informed decision on whether they want to "click" and get more info.
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voxpelli date because you need to know if it's new and relevant and title isn't really necessary but most presentations need it – kind of a notification first design approach as I believe tantek has been pushing for :)
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M-Kegan It may be a title, a short summary, it will depend on the content.
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voxpelli the rest can be lazy loaded
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voxpelli cweiske: what reader are you using btw?
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KevinMarks__ Tantek puts his whole post in the html <title>
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cweiske tiny tiny rss
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KevinMarks__ Atom has title/summary/content
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tantek KevinMarks__: yeah - that's from lack of design ;)
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KevinMarks__ Rss originally just had description
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GWG cweiske: I use ttrss
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tantek voxpelli: yes!
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tantek notificationfirstdesign++
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Loqi notificationfirstdesign has 1 karma
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tantek which is a special case of
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tantek textfirstdesign++
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Loqi textfirstdesign has 2 karma
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cweiske ttrss is tiny tiny rss
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GWG cweiske: I was advising of a shared use
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cweiske GWG, I made a subtome plugin for tt-rss some weeks ago: http://cweiske.de/tagebuch/tt-rss-subtome.htm
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GWG cweiske, I try to stay away from the developer
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snarfed kylewm: yes, google-api-python-client does it automatically
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snarfed which afaik the gdata lib uses
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tantek wow gdata - haven't heard a serious reference to that in a while
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snarfed heh
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snarfed for the morbidly curious: blogger's current v3 api is REST, but doesn't support creating comments. v2 is gdata and does
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tantek snarfed, wow they're trudging through history of API conventions
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KevinMarks__ Gdata is atom pub, so a decent fit for blogging api
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KevinMarks__ Less good fit for everything else it was shoehorned into
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KevinMarks__ And never made much sense for browser clients
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KevinMarks__ Interesting - filmstrip in dev tools https://developers.google.com/web/updates/2015/07/23/devtools-digest-film-strip-and-a-new-home-for-throttling
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KevinMarks__ Handy for the "how long did that webmention take" debates
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Jeena neat, I'm a positive example for a IndieWeb page on http://montrealsauce.com/2015/07/26/privacy-special-pt-2/
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@jeena @peakwinter that is the already developed software you can use to get all the IndieWeb stuff for free. (twitter.com/_/status/625763456646557698)
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kylewm ok I added refresh tokens for blogger, I guess that had only ever worked long enough for proof of concept but not actual use, oops
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kylewm snarfed++ for the info
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Loqi snarfed has 123 karma
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snarfed funny
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snarfed ooh you did it all yourself
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snarfed is impressed
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kylewm the docs say if you ask for 25 tokens for the same user, itwill silently revoke the oldest one
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kylewm so now i'm a little concerned that the long-lived token I use for posting will be revoked if they log in a bunch of times
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snarfed there goes my access token bingo game
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kylewm since it generates a new access token for each login :/
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snarfed yeah, you probably need to store the new one every time
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kylewm did i just use every access token buzz word?
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snarfed i think that's what g-a-p-c does
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aaronpk kylewm++
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Loqi kylewm has 202 karma
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kylewm store new token each time, ok that makes sense
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tantek.com edited /indieauth-for-login (+102) "grammar changes in dfn, move TOC to below diagram" (view diff)
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tantek aaronpk - made some minor edits to the dfn and TOC/styling of that page - please take a look to see if that looks better to you (or not).
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aaronpk is "personal web address" different from URL?
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tantek it's what the NYT ages ago used as a phrase that is user-friendlier (to their readers)
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tantek "web address" > URL
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aaronpk okay, so it's not an "OR" then?
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tantek yeah that's ambiguous
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aaronpk i'll just remove "URL"
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aaronpk or maybe "personal web address (URL)"?
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tantek is having flashbacks
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tantek oh yeah: http://microformats.org/wiki/web-sign-in
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tantek.com edited /indieauth-for-login (+76) "prefer personal web addres" (view diff)
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aaronparecki.com edited /indieauth-for-login (-6) "linking to an authorization service is not optional, prefer personal web address" (view diff)
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tantek cool
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rhiaro I didn't read backlog, but just wanted to mention that I had no idea indieauth for login was a thing until I saw tbrb implement it at the end of last week, and omg I want it
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djwesto 236596675647935
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wolftune what's "[CTCP] Received CTCP-PING request from djwesto to channel #indiewebcamp, sending answer." mean?
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aaronpk i was wondering the same thing
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myfreeweb isn't CTCP the peer to peer thing for IRC? that allows sending files
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aaronpk didn't know you could send a file to a whole channel
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myfreeweb apparently you can send a ping
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djwesto Yikes, hi there. I'm new to IRC and just going through a tutorial trying to learn it. I am so sorry for troubling you all.
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ben_thatmustbeme woohooo, it worked
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ben_thatmustbeme https://ben.thatmustbe.me/note/2015/7/27/40/
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ben_thatmustbeme micropub chaining
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tantek ooh
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aaronpk neat!
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ben_thatmustbeme i keep building stuff out of the relmeauth lib
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ben_thatmustbeme hehe
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myfreeweb what's chaining?
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ben_thatmustbeme you can tell i was debugging a lot today (post count 40)
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ben_thatmustbeme what is micropub chaining?
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Loqi micropub chaining is when you have one micropub endpoint itself use micropub to post to another micropub endpoint, like to POSSE a post to silos, or to a community site or other commons https://indiewebcamp.com/micropub_chaining
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ben_thatmustbeme interestingly i can set my micropub endpoint to syndicate different content now to twitter
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ben_thatmustbeme or customize it
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ben_thatmustbeme mpTweet just posts content + ' ' + url
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hpincket.com edited /friendly (+364) "/* Friendly Services */" (view diff)
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aaronpk hmm neat
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aaronpk that seems a little different from what we intended the "friendly" page for... maybe we need a new section or new page?
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tantek right no evidence of SaveMyMix supporting any indieweb protocols or formats as documented on that page
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tantek better to move that to Spotify
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tantek what is Spotify?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "Spotify" yet. Would you like to create it? http://indiewebcamp.com/s/100U
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tantek Spotify is a [[playlist]] hosting [[silo]] and streaming [[music]] service.
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loqi.me created /Spotify (+102) "prompted by tantek https://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-07-27/line/1438031874090 and dfn added by tantek" (view diff)
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Loqi ok
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tantek.com edited /Spotify (+435) "exporting - move content from /friendly , add see also" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /friendly (-364) "move savemymix for exporting to /Spotify page, since neither are actually indieweb friendly per this page dfn. Undo revision 21133 by [[Special:Contributions/Hpincket.com|Hpincket.com]] ([[User talk:Hpincket.com|talk]])" (view diff)
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ben_thatmustbeme well i feel accomplished for today
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ben_thatmustbeme managed to get mptweet working
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ben_thatmustbeme now what to write up for today's 100words
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aaronpk that?
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KevinMarks what is salmention
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Loqi Salmentions are a way to pass comments upstream by sending a webmention from a reply post to the original post when the reply recieves a comment https://indiewebcamp.com/salmention
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KevinMarks hm, how do I mark up inline native comments?
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aaronpk what are native comments?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "native comments" yet. Would you like to create it? http://indiewebcamp.com/s/100V
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aaronpk what is comments presentation?
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Loqi https://indiewebcamp.com/comments-presentation
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KevinMarks yeah, in there now
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KevinMarks does h-cite make sense for a native comment?
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KevinMarks when it doesn't have a permalink?
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aaronpk wasn't there some discussion abou this a couple weeks ago?
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aaronpk i think the answer was yes because it isn't your own content
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KevinMarks thats what i was looking for
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KevinMarks OK
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aaronpk but i can't remember where that was written down
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kylewm tentatively, I think we said they should still be u-comment h-cite, and the url should include the #id of the comment
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aaronpk that sounds right
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aaronpk if you give the comment its own permalink that'd be fine too
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kylewm I think Known does the latter
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KevinMarks if the comment doesn't have a permalink is p-comment h-cite ok?
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aaronpk not even a fragment ID? I guess so
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tantek kylewm: that sounds right, can you document what Known does?
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aaronpk at least the value of the h-cite will still (probably) be a unique string
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tantek hey that makes sense aaronpk
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gRegorLove KevinMarks: I use(d) p-comments h-entry for native commetns, which don't have permalinks of their own.
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gRegorLove I haven't added back comments-presentation since I migrated my site at IWC
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tantek has anybody documented their implementations of "local comments" ?
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gRegorLove It was quite a while ago I initially set that up, but I think it was because of this q that I asked: http://indiewebcamp.com/h-cite#FAQ
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tantek dislikes "native comments" as a term
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tantek bikeshed time?
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tantek native comments, local comments, in-page comments, in-post comments
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gRegorLove "local comments" sounds good to me
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aaronpk localcomments++
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Loqi localcomments has 1 karma
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tantek what are local comments?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "local comments" yet. Would you like to create it? http://indiewebcamp.com/s/100W
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KevinMarks local is better, yes
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KevinMarks hm, now I'm editint he template and nothign is happening
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tantek local comments are comments that are made directly (locally) on a post in the UI of the site serving the post, instead of posting a [[reply]] post on an indieweb site and sending a webmention.
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loqi.me created /local_comments (+219) "prompted by tantek https://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-07-27/line/1438033825982 and dfn added by tantek" (view diff)
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Loqi ok
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KevinMarks too many dev envs
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aaronpk KevinMarks: when that happens to me it's usually because i'm actually editing a file on my computer but i think it's on the server :P
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kylewm I have a Known permalink to add to the examples section
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KevinMarks this is running locally on node
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tantek kylewm: could you add the "IndieWeb Examples" section on /local_comments ?
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gRegorLove Looking over my code, looks like I used a fragment as the u-url for local comments.
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gRegorLove I will add my example once I get /comments-presentation set up again.
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gRegorLove what is native comments?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "native comments" yet. Would you like to create it? http://indiewebcamp.com/s/100X
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gRegorLove native comments is /local_comments
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loqi.me created /native_comments (+27) "prompted by gRegorLove https://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-07-27/line/1438033988911 and dfn added by gRegorLove" (view diff)
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Loqi ok
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kylewm what's the name for a permalink url that distinguishes it from a permalink by #fragment?
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kylewm "Known gives comments their own permalink" isn't quite right
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gRegorLove anchor link?
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aaronpk isn't that right?
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tantek permalink anchor?
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kylewm sorry I don't even know how to ask the question
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gRegorLove hehe
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kylewm this comment has its own separate url, it's not just an anchor on the target page
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kylewm i don't know how to make that clear
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aaronpk i think that means it has its own permalink
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aaronpk or you could say literally what you juhst said
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gRegorLove "own permalink on the same domain" perhaps
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tantek where it's the top level item on the page?
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kylewm.com edited /local_comments (+474) "add indieWeb Examples section with Known url" (view diff)
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kylewm ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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tantek gRegorLove: you're up next :)
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tantek.com edited /local_comments (+83) "linky linky, see also" (view diff)
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gRegorLove Once I have a public URL to demonstrate them on :)
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KevinMarks hm, so I apaprently had the same file on my machien twice as it was inside Google Drive's folder
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tantek the (copy in the) cloud is a lie?
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KevinMarks some kind of symlink nightmare I expect
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KevinMarks OK, beginnings of an h-feed for instagram tags
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KevinMarks http://www.unmung.com/mf2?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.pestagram.com%2Ftag%2Findieweb&html=&pretty=on
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snarfed ooh https://granary-demo.appspot.com/ can't do that afaik
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snarfed KevinMarks++
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Loqi KevinMarks has 136 karma
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tantek is wondering what trickery KevinMarks is using to extract that feed from IG
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snarfed none needed, the api exposes it: https://instagram.com/developer/endpoints/tags/
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snarfed (granary understands ig tags but doesn't know how to fetch by tag)
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@elimisteve RT @dkreuz: Level 1 of #Indieweb achieved. I encourage my students to follow. http://indiewebify.me (twitter.com/_/status/625804797396914176)
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KevinMarks they have an API, I made that thing a while ago
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KevinMarks just realised I shoudl mark it up properly
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KevinMarks then I can subscribe to the indieweb tag in woodwind
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KevinMarks tho' markup isn't right yet
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