#indiewebcamp 2015-07-31

2015-07-31 UTC
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aaronparecki.com uploaded /Special:Log/upload "uploaded "[[File:private-webmention-sequence-diagram.svg]]""
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aaronpk bah
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aaronpk what good is an SVG if it references a non-standard font
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aaronparecki.com deleted /File:private-webmention-sequence-diagram.svg "replacing with png"
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KevinMarks__ you can annotate the text lines os they are the same length
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aaronpk i don't know what tat means
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KevinMarks__ http://tutorials.jenkov.com/svg/text-element.html#text-length
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aaronpk i'm not making this svg, a tool is
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tantek has anyone tried creating a tumblr account with a domain name as the name / "subdomain" ?
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KevinMarks__ well, slap the tool vendor to mark up the text runs
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tantek tries
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aaronparecki.com uploaded /Special:Log/upload "uploaded "[[File:private-webmention-sequence-diagram.png]]""
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tantek creating an account just for POSSEing
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aaronparecki.com edited /File:private-webmention-sequence-diagram.png (+763) "add source" (view diff)
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KevinMarks__ oh, the SVG's gone
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aaronparecki.com edited /private-webmention (+56) "add sequence diagram" (view diff)
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KevinMarks__ I was going to look
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aaronpk you can make it again by pasting the data from here http://indiewebcamp.com/File:private-webmention-sequence-diagram.png
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tantek answer is no from Tumblr.com/register when you click the "Sign up" button: "Letters, numbers, and dashes only please. This is serious business."
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aaronpk supporting "tantek.com" as a subdomain of "tumblr.com" means they have to do more crazy things with DNS
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tantek now trying tantek-com
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myfreeweb demo page is done! https://unrelenting.technology/mf2/
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tantek that seems to ahve been accepted
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aaronpk whoa I don't understand what's going on there
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aaronpk why are there so many properties in the parsed result that aren't on the page?
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aaronpk is the CamelCase thing a haskell thing?
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myfreeweb yeah
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aaronparecki.com edited /private-webmention (+0) (view diff)
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myfreeweb i could've customized it
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myfreeweb but i didn't
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tantek that's not really compatible since JSON is case-sensitive
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tantek as are class names
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myfreeweb it's not intended to be compatible
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tantek caseness from the class names is supposed to be preserved
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aaronpk it looks like the parser has knowledge of vocabulary, given that things like "Anniversary" are appearing on the h-card even though it's not in the HTML
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myfreeweb the parser parses into Haskell types
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myfreeweb then Aeson, a JSON library, serializes into JSON
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tantek there's no special types involved, just strings
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myfreeweb these types https://github.com/myfreeweb/microformats2-types/blob/master/library/Data/Microformats2.hs
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aaronpk !tell elf-pavlik I finished the sequence diagram! Let me know if that looks right to you, I was kind of rushed http://indiewebcamp.com/private-webmention
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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KevinMarks__ hm, thats more of an mf1 approach
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myfreeweb mf1 approach?
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KevinMarks__ you've hardcoded known properties of certain types
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myfreeweb that's a haskell approach :)
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myfreeweb key-value maps are not idiomatic haskell
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KevinMarks__ not going to pass many test then
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KevinMarks__ or work with eg http://www.kevinmarks.com/microformatschema.html
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KevinMarks__ so not http://hackage.haskell.org/package/json-0.9.1/docs/Text-JSON-Types.html ?
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myfreeweb the parser doesn't know about JSON at all
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tantek ok so I set this up, now I just have to figure out how to POSSE likes/reposts/replies to Tumblr posts through it into Tumblr: http://tantek-com.tumblr.com/
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myfreeweb i might add custom properties, but that's not what i need right now
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KevinMarks__ silo.pub
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KevinMarks__ it'll walk you through, then you can micropub to it
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KevinMarks__ or maybe kyle got magic proxying working
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tantek I'd prefer to do it simpler via webmention
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tantek the way Bridgy Publish works
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tantek.com edited /Falcon (+834) "/* Working On */ POSSE responses to Tumblr posts" (view diff)
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KevinMarks__ aaronpk: this looks like it supports the same syntax but renders better: https://github.com/knsv/mermaid
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KevinMarks__ http://svgur.com/i/d.svg
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kylewm you can't actually publish native likes/reposts/etc. through silo.pub right now... even if you u-like-of a tumblr post, it still publishes a note with mf2 markup in it
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tantek good to know
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ben_thatmustbeme Can bridgy publish do likes?
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tantek that's how I POSSE my likes of tweets
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ben_thatmustbeme As in like tweets?
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ben_thatmustbeme Oh nice
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ben_thatmustbeme I need to do that in mptweet
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tantek.com edited /Falcon (+246) "/* POSSE responses to Tumblr posts */ note silo.pub caveat" (view diff)
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ben_thatmustbeme And images etc
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tantek ben_thatmustbeme: https://indiewebcamp.com/Falcon#Likes
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kylewm I didn't really see the point of micropubbing tumblr-specific responses *to tumblr*, not sure why anyone would use it like that
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kylewm but if someone does want to , I'm more than happy to add it
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kylewm tantek: what was the link http://pronoun.is/they in reference to?
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tantek URL on @myfreeweb's Twitter profile
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tantek a whole site for linking to preferred pronouns, where the page at that URL shows you how to use that preferred pronoun!
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KevinMarks__ so you could do rel-pronoun ?
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tantek or even h-* since it has a name and URL
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KevinMarks__ they have 5 variants
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tantek I think it's on github and they accept pull requests
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KevinMarks That pronoun site is by @morganastra, source of the object oriented quote
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tantek kylewm better to add it to Bridgy Publish https://github.com/snarfed/bridgy/issues/272 instead of silo.pub
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tantek tumblr-specific responses *to tumblr*, that is
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kylewm would have to add publish to tumblr first
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kylewm which is a pretty big job
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kylewm but yeah, i agree that would make more sense
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tantek kylewm: I think even just supporting responses to Tumblr would be a good incremental and useful step
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tantek before the massive effort it would take to support POSSEing the 7 native top level post types of Tumblr
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tantek.com edited /Falcon (+835) "/* POSSE Details */ note details of POSSEing likes to Twitter, separate section for FB, more details" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /Falcon (-3) "/* POSSE Details */ -of" (view diff)
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tantek kylewm: added a few incremental steps in case you get interested: https://github.com/snarfed/bridgy/issues/272#issuecomment-126536742
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tantek I'll start documenting examples of my manual POSSEing of response to Tumblr to show some real-world-ness at least.
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tantek s/response/responses
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Loqi tantek meant to say: I'll start documenting examples of my manual POSSEing of responses to Tumblr to show some real-world-ness at least.
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KevinMarks Looks like app.net has hfeed but no timestamps https://alpha.app.net/riverfold
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KevinMarks Hm, I should use lang on this post http://known.kevinmarks.com/2015/slack-values-in-full-einfhlung-theoxenia-techne-sprezzatura-eudaimonia-sitesgeorgeanders20150729your-hr-team-needs-to-see-slacks-defiant-take-on-values
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aaronpk not sure how much app.net is still in development, but they would probably accept a PR to fix their microformats
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[aaronpk] hah gregorlove it got translated back in slack #indiewebcamp tantek #indiewebcamp
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aaronpk oops hahaha
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aaronpk sorry
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tantek agreed - it's likely worth sending pull requests to app.net
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tantek.com edited /Tumblr (+387) "/* POSSE Favorites of Tumblr posts */ add IndieWeb example of like of a Tumblr post, and POSSE liking of it natively on Tumblr" (view diff)
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@papapelz FB-Import zum Blog tut wieder. Jedenfalls fast vollständig. Jetzt noch indieweb-Imports von Insta als Bild, nicht Gallery, dann bin ich :)) (twitter.com/_/status/626971632138125313)
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tantek BTW Tumblr's "Dashboard" also has an item called "inbox" which has nothing to do with reading your social stream of who you follow etc.
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tantek does anyone know how Tumblr makes slugs?
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tantek BTW Tumblr post types (UI that they present for users to choose from) Text, Photo, Quote, Link, Chat, Audio, Video
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tantek hmm - looks like you can reverse engineer the name/title of a post (or at least partially thereof) from the slug on a Tumblr post - it doesn't seem to be editable
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tantek I mean editable separately from the source content like name/title
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tantek text copy review? how understandable is the description here? http://tantek-com.tumblr.com/
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tantek tried to provide explanation for what that Tumblr is for, and a hook for learning more about IndieWeb
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tantek who here has experience with Tumblr? anyone?
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tantek (I mean both reading and posting a lot to)
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tantek (just as a user)
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tantek here's a very weird Tumblr permalink example: http://50thousand.tumblr.com/post/124122093511/cloud-kitten-holyshmidt-time-lapse-photo-of
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tantek it's a repost of a repost (both with comments)
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tantek and the slug includes the repost source!
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tantek however if you click through to the previous repost chain, only the previous repost http://cloud-kitten.tumblr.com/post/103017083270/holyshmidt-time-lapse-photo-of-hundreds-of is still there
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tantek the next one (which appears to be the original) looks like it was actually deleted, and does not show the source
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tantek thus when you repost something on Tumblr, it gets copied completely
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tantek in contrast to Twitter, where retweets of a deleted tweet themselves disappear!
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KevinMarks__ well retweets get their own url
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KevinMarks__ it just redirects
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KartikPrabhu tantek: copy look good. seems I have to login to view "Tumblr posts liked by tantek.com."
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@papapelz Wenn die Techie-Fummelei im Blog n neuen Daddy (@schnarfed) in der TL auftut...: https://snarfed.org/2015-06-04_what-doesnt-kill-my-baby #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/626985774551011328)
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endi wow just watched SWAT0 video on TWIG via @KevinMarks :) well done all!
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KevinMarks__ thanks endi
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KevinMarks__ now we need to get more of us abel to play the different roles in it
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Jeena KevinMarks__ the thing I still lack is the whole reader thing which is huge and I want to tackle it with a native android app but it will take a lot of time before it works
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KevinMarks__ you can use reader.kylewm.com if you support micropub...
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Jeena yeah I can but if we only have one implementation of a reader what is the point ;)
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KevinMarks__ It's a scaffolding thing; get into the reading habit before you build your own.
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Jeena but it is really good to test my other stuff, I just yesterday implemented likes, perhaps I should test it with this reader
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KevinMarks__ yes, exactly
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KevinMarks__ it's a micropub client as well...
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Jeena yeah, that is the cool thing about it
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Jeena oh hehe I should add the like stuff to my micropub backend before testing it ^^
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Jeena Jesus Christ, it is an amazing feeling to see something KevinMarks__ answers to werd.io in this reader and then to answer myself on this withing this reader and it gets posted automatically on my site and it shows up on Kevins website, and nothing crashes https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4119/4876696414_d3f62d18be_z.jpg
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KevinMarks__ I said ti is liek Penn and teller
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Jeena yeah :D
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KevinMarks__ you see it done, then you have to look again to see how much crawling through tubes is going on underneath
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Jeena haha yeah, it is unbelievable that this can work at all
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KevinMarks__ if we can get the reply contexts, cites and salmentions wired up, we really do have distributed twitter
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KevinMarks__ http://known.kevinmarks.com is mostly posts from woodwind now
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Jeena is Woodwind your own baby?
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KevinMarks__ woodwind is reader.kylewm.com
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Jeena yeah I mean the software behind it, is it you who is writing it?
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Jeena oh I think I found it on github
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KevinMarks__ no it's kylewm
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Jeena ah haha I'm sorry obviously, I should have looked at the domain
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endi watching the reader bit, looks awesome :)
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Jeena it's such a pitty it didn't work on live TV, hehe you should retry it next time ;)
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Jeena but as a scripted demo :-p
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tantek Jeena you can also use monocle.p3k.io as a micropub enabled reader!
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tantek the design/styling in monocle is really slick
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tantek looks great on mobile etc.
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@kevinmarks @BenedictEvans share on twitter as they are relevant to ongoing conversations. Repost on medium for their discussion http://indiewebcamp.com/POSSE (twitter.com/_/status/626999937394348032)
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tantek !tell KartikPrabhu thanks for the "requires login" reminder - just added a parenthetical accordingly to the copy text to give a heads-up to viewers.
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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Jeena yeah, Twitter did really a good job with Botstrap, it made all the engineer stuff which was always dreadfull to please the eye so people wouldn't just run away but would at least play with it :D
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Jeena hm there is one not so cool thing we will need to adress some time in the future, just so we're better than the RSS community. We need a way to share the subscription lists between readers
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Jeena and a way for them to update the list
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tantek was just looking at that on Tumblr
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Jeena it is neat that monocle gets the big picture from the full post, but it is weird that it shows all the text from the page as the title https://jeena.net/s/latest.png
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tantek heh - that's a p-name issue I think aaronpk would say
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KevinMarks__ except bootstrap was crap at mobile and still feels kludgy
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KevinMarks__ we need a shiny new layout framework built on flexbox and SVG to replace it
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KevinMarks__ flexstrap
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Jeena so tantek because this photo doesn't have an explicit p-name this is what comes out of the algorytm for that page?
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Jeena hm, I guess I need to do something about it
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tantek Jeena - it's because the h-entry has no explicit p-name, it is implied by the full text contents of the h-entry
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Jeena so basically have to always have some kind of title because otherwise all the readers will show all the text from the whole entry as the title which looks hidious
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Jeena I will fix that!
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cweiske except readers get more intelligent
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cweiske and know that they should not use a text as title
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tantek it is an open issue also, there have been various brainstorming proposals for how to improve
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Jeena cweiske yeah but the readers can only take the information from the mf2 parser
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Jeena and p-name is the designated thing for a title as far as I can see
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tantek it's the name of the h-entry, which can be displayed as a title
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KevinMarks__ hm, buzzfeed lets you post
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KevinMarks__ wonder if we can POSSE
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Jeena I see I do that for notes already where I just set it to "Note #37" or something
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Jeena I will do that for photos too
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cweiske why don't you set an empty title?
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Jeena I think Note #3 has more value for the users because it at least has some information
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tantek both reasonable approaches
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tantek KartikPrabhu: I'm thinking of adding the following: "A POSSE portal, or IndieWeb-Silo Bridge, is a syndication feature that takes a fundamental shortcut through hypermedia. Observers inside the silo see a local representation of hyperlinked responses from the IndieWeb."
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KartikPrabhu tantek: lot of jargon
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Loqi KartikPrabhu: tantek left you a message 33 minutes ago: thanks for the "requires login" reminder - just added a parenthetical accordingly to the copy text to give a heads-up to viewers. http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-07-30/line/1438323542989
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KartikPrabhu also I don't trust any summary that says "fundamental", its my science brain
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KartikPrabhu ;)
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tantek KartikPrabhu: I copied from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wormhole :D
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tantek "that would fundamentally be a shortcut through spacetime" ;)
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KartikPrabhu lol!
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KartikPrabhu yeah because wormholes don't exist
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KartikPrabhu :P
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tantek see I thought you would get a kick out of it
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KartikPrabhu :) anyway, your new description idea might have too much Indieweb jargon
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tantek it was supposed to sounds all pseudo-scientificy as a point of humor
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tantek maybe I'll just post it as a note
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KartikPrabhu haha! if the humor is the point then sure go for it!
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KartikPrabhu "hypermedia" does sound like the Web version of "fundamental theory" ;)
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tantek brb adding more jargon
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KartikPrabhu haha
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@t A POSSE portal, or IndieWeb-Silo Bridge, is a syndication feature that takes a fundamental shortcut through ... http://tantek.com/2015/212/t1/posse-portal-indieweb-silo-bridge (twitter.com/_/status/627011121074073600)
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tantek how's that KartikPrabhu ? http://tantek.com/2015/212/t1/posse-portal-indieweb-silo-bridge
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KartikPrabhu tantek: https://kartikprabhu.com/notes/like-tantek-web-jargon ;)
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Jeena ah much better now with the p-name https://jeena.net/s/latest.png
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KartikPrabhu my likes presentation needs more context
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tantek KartikPrabhu: if I ever write an academic paper about POSSE I will use that as the summary before the abstract ;)
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KartikPrabhu summary before the abstract? is that a thing?
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tantek yeah, because abstracts are so long these days ;)
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KartikPrabhu lol! true
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KartikPrabhu p-summary-summary
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tantek p-sum-up
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Jeena KartikPrabhu mine looks about the same :D https://jeena.net/likes/1
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KartikPrabhu Jeena: yup. that is a good first implementation. but I'd like to have some sort of reply-context, as in pull in tantek's post and display it
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Jeena yeah
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KartikPrabhu Jeena: also i think the typography on your site is pretty good ;)
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KartikPrabhu might need some vertical space tweaks though
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Jeena could you elaborate?
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tantek Jeena: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GZYhDMCOyww
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Jeena hehe tantek
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KartikPrabhu as in in that note the "about 8 hours ago" is so close and same in size to the actual post content that it looks like a part of content
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Jeena ah yeah that is true, on my notes it looks better https://jeena.net/notes/395
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KartikPrabhu aah yes! but why is the like display different from notes. You could do "Jeena liked, about 8 hours ago" then URL
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KartikPrabhu same as notes pattern
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KartikPrabhu no need to make new patterns for each post type unless really required
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Jeena hm yeah you might be right
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KartikPrabhu :)
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tantek KartikPrabhu: re: text display of likes: http://indiewebcamp.com/like#Brainstorming
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Jeena it was late yesterday so I din't think clear ^^
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cweiske don't drink and code
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KartikPrabhu cweiske: oh no! I have been doing everything wrong so far!
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KartikPrabhu tantek: yes. I like the notification-first idea. Hadn't thought of that while first designing likes. Will have to work that in
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tantek KartikPrabhu: I literally designed those first and then step by step expanded until I had hypertext, then markup, then coded it and kept iterating.
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tantek That's how I got to the presentation of likes on my site
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KartikPrabhu yes! that is how posts ought be designed, me thinks
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tantek I hope the intermediate steps I documented are of use to others
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KartikPrabhu will refer to that when redesigning
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Jeena cweiske also: don't drink and derive
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Jeena in mathematics that is
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tantek It's also a "proof" of sorts, allowing anyone to verify the thinking that went into the design
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KartikPrabhu Jeena: I had made a comic on that a long long time ago
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Jeena hehe
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KartikPrabhu wow! can't find where I stashed it. Should post :P
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Jeena post all the things!
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tantek Loqi ^^^
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KartikPrabhu well now that I have my own site, I am more inclined to do that
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tantek I suppose I should put in footnotes for all the jargon
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KartikPrabhu ha! nothing is more academic than footnotes for jargon ;)
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KartikPrabhu is using Latex again and it is so terrible
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Jeena really? We used http://www.lyx.org/ to write our thesis back then and I was quite pleased
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Jeena especially about how official the result looked like https://jeena.net/t/GGS.pdf
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KartikPrabhu Jeena: managing and outputitng references is annoying in latex and also other things
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KartikPrabhu I wrote most of this paper in HTML, but have to switch due to journals
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Jeena I never wrote pure latex, always just used lyx and that was quite nice to work with
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KartikPrabhu not writing pure latex gives me the same feeling as using Word! or a CMS HTML editor ;)
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KartikPrabhu don't like it
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elf-pavlik aaronpk++ thanks for http://indiewebcamp.com/File:private-webmention-sequence-diagram.png
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Loqi elf-pavlik: aaronpk left you a message 7 hours, 20 minutes ago: I finished the sequence diagram! Let me know if that looks right to you, I was kind of rushed http://indiewebcamp.com/private-webmention http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-07-30/line/1438301712387
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Loqi aaronpk has 918 karma
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KartikPrabhu man! what if aaronpk reaches 1000 karma, what happens?
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elf-pavlik from then he can move to cyberspace and leave the gross matter behind ;)
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elf-pavlik !tell aaronpk does wm.bob can always get auth token with me=https://bob.example.org/ ? it seems to me making delegation not useful if for example https://webmention.io/wwelves.org-perpetual-tripper/webmention can access all the resources which have me in ACL
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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tuxed.net edited /private-webmention (+0) "move toc" (view diff)
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cweiske.de edited /File:private-webmention-sequence-diagram.png (+22) (view diff)
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cweiske.de created /Category:Diagrams (+32) "Created page with "UML sequence and other diagrams."" (view diff)
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elf-pavlik aaronpk, also alice (or bob) 'home page' can send web mentions (so no satic site) but they use separate wm.alice (or wm.bob) to receive web mentions ... i don't understand why separating concerns this way helps in any way?
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cweiske.de edited /File:2014-285-webmention-vouch-drawing.png (+22) (view diff)
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cweiske.de edited /File:2014-285-webmention-vouch-flowchart.jpg (+41) (view diff)
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cweiske.de edited /File:20140423-indieauth-micropub.jpg (+41) (view diff)
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cweiske.de edited /File:Webmention_Vouch.svg (+22) (view diff)
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cweiske.de edited /File:indieauth-login-flow.png (+22) (view diff)
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cweiske.de edited /File:iwc-2014-indie-reader-whiteboard.jpg (+20) (view diff)
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cweiske.de edited /File:micropub-auth-flow.png (+22) (view diff)
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cweiske.de edited /File:micropub-flow-diagram.png (+22) (view diff)
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cweiske.de edited /File:stapibas_linkback_info.png (+25) (view diff)
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Loqi [bridgy] Arlo Gilbert favorited a tweet http://indiewebcamp.com/POSSE (https://twitter.com/kevinmarks/status/626999937394348032)
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ben_thatmustbeme Hmm I realized with vouch we don't say what to do when the couch isn't a valid url
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ben_thatmustbeme 449 or 400??
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cweiske (c|v)ouch
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ben_thatmustbeme Heh
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ben_thatmustbeme On my phone. Auto correct
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Zegnat 400 Bad Request is the only error code defined by the webmention spec, IIRC
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Zegnat Sorry, two error codes: 400 for “sender error”, which would be a faulty vouch, 500 for “receiver error”, if your endpoint had problems somewhere
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Zegnat https://github.com/converspace/webmention/blob/master/README.md#error-responses
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ben_thatmustbeme 449 is introduced for vouch
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ben_thatmustbeme What is vouch?
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Loqi The Vouch protocol is an anti-spam extension to Webmention. Webmention with Vouch depends on understanding Webmention https://indiewebcamp.com/Vouch
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Zegnat I totally missed that, ben_thatmustbeme, thanks!
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Zegnat Seems that it is 449 for missing vouch, 400 for non-approved vouch
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ben_thatmustbeme Indeed. Both are non Approval but 449 points you to vouch
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ben_thatmustbeme If they don't send a url as vouch
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ben_thatmustbeme I feel like 449 is a good way to indicate "go read the spec"
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Zegnat The protocol summary says you should return 400 for any check that fails, including when receiver “syntax checks [vouch] is a valid URL” - https://indiewebcamp.com/Vouch#Protocol_Summary
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fkooman Blog: OAuth 2.0 AS discovery from RS https://www.tuxed.net/fkooman/blog/as_discovery.html
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elf-pavlik fkooman++ for http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-07-31/line/1438334626232
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Loqi fkooman has 7 karma
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wwelves.org perpetual-tripper edited /private-webmention (+35) "/* Security by Obscurity */ See also: capability-urls" (view diff)
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elf-pavlik ben_thatmustbeme, did you try implementing https://indiewebcamp.com/private-webmention ?
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ben_thatmustbeme elf-pavlik: not yet, its on my todo list
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elf-pavlik <link rel="webmention" href="https://ben.thatmustbe.me/webmention" />
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elf-pavlik so for you your 'home page' and webmention endpoint run on the same backend
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elf-pavlik but for auth you use <link rel="authorization_endpoint" href="https://indieid.com/">
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elf-pavlik and for token <link rel="token_endpoint" href="https://ben.thatmustbe.me/token">
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ben_thatmustbeme yep
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elf-pavlik keeping in mind fkooman's https://www.tuxed.net/fkooman/blog/proposed_changes_to_indieauth_protocol.html
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elf-pavlik <link rel="authentication_endpoint" href="https://indieid.com/">
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elf-pavlik would make sense for distributed indieauth
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elf-pavlik since i see mixing of authorization and authentication
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elf-pavlik i don't always write only to 'my homepage'
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elf-pavlik i also write for example to https://phubble.tuxed.net/w3c-social/
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elf-pavlik see https://github.com/linkeddata/SoLiD/issues/26
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ben_thatmustbeme whild i think he is correct, it really should be "authentication" not "authorization". i don't see the need for verification being seperate
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ben_thatmustbeme keeps reading
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elf-pavlik yeah also i would use <link rel="authentication_endpoint" href="https://indiecert.net/authenticate" />
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ben_thatmustbeme elf-pavlik: huh? "i don't always write only to 'my homepage'"
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elf-pavlik while <link rel="authorization_endpoint" href="https://as.wwelves.org/" />
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elf-pavlik yes, i can always keep copy first but than do 'fat ping' and authenticate to shared data space to post directly there
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elf-pavlik than it dosn't need to access resource but only have copy and other people who have ACL can access it
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elf-pavlik see https://github.com/converspace/webmention/issues/41
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elf-pavlik you write directly to http://indiewebcamp.com/indieauth
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elf-pavlik using mediawiki as client you authenticate to
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elf-pavlik using <link rel="authentication_endpoint" href="" /> hopefully at some point ...
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elf-pavlik but you could have you wikiclient similar to http://indiewebcamp.com/unmpc
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elf-pavlik which would use authorization_endpoint specified by http://indiewebcamp.com/ which in turn would use my authentication_endpoint to login and write directly to indiewebcamp.org wiki
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elf-pavlik s/.org/.com/
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Loqi elf-pavlik meant to say: which would use authorization_endpoint specified by http://indiewebcamp.com/ which in turn would use my authentication_endpoint to login and write directly to indiewebcamp.com wiki
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ben_thatmustbeme looks bewildered at all this... its taken to a bit of an extreme rediculousness
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elf-pavlik so we need distinct rel=authentication_endpoint which acts as IdP to authenticate
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elf-pavlik and rel=authorization_endpoint which specifies authorization server for this resource server
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ben_thatmustbeme tunes out to go feed babies
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elf-pavlik enjoy ben_thatmustbeme
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elf-pavlik ben_thatmustbeme, "Currently set to automatically accept, but moderation is planned." http://indiewebcamp.com/webmention#IndieWeb_Examples
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elf-pavlik sending web mention looks like a write to 'not my homepage' resource server
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fkooman is blogging away about private webmentions...
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elf-pavlik i see use in sending the payload if i can authenticate when posting a webmention
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elf-pavlik so the 'webmention endpoint' dosn't need to go throught source ACL
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ben_thatmustbeme i need to update that, I use vouch now + moderation
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ben_thatmustbeme any non vouched, non whitelisted mentions go to moderation
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elf-pavlik if we don't talk about private messaging but groups with ACL like https://phubble.tuxed.net/w3c-social/
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elf-pavlik having web mention 'endpoint' of https://phubble.tuxed.net/w3c-social/ authenticating to fetch messages seems to make ACL much more complicated
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ben_thatmustbeme isn't completely following elf-pavlik, you seem to be all over the place
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elf-pavlik https://raw.githubusercontent.com/w3c-social/social-web/master/phubble-acl.json
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elf-pavlik for secret phubble wall (smilar to irc channel or xmpp muc) one can also set read access just for those people
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elf-pavlik we could try sketching https://phubble.tuxed.net/w3c-social/ using http://indiewebcamp.com/private-webmention
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elf-pavlik with public read and ACL write it could serve as https://twitter.com/SocialWebWG or https://twitter.com/indiewebcamp
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elf-pavlik but seeing who made the actual post and not posting as organization itself
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elf-pavlik ben_thatmustbeme, https://www.w3.org/wiki/Socialwg/Social_API/User_stories#Reply_in_a_discussion
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ben_thatmustbeme elf-pavlik: i think for the indie-web ideal of keeping all your own data, private webmention would be the way about this
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ben_thatmustbeme if you are talking about the idea of public posts but non-advertised posts
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ben_thatmustbeme you just don't put the reply on your homepage feed
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elf-pavlik https://github.com/w3c-social/social-ucr/issues/9
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elf-pavlik this way resource server which 'hosts' discussion also needs agency to act as resource owner
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ben_thatmustbeme why?
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elf-pavlik which doesn't support cases like http://indiewebcamp.com/ https://tag.w3.org/ etc.
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elf-pavlik i'll use social.w3.example with a chair only discussion on https://social.w3.example/chairs/sched
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elf-pavlik only people on list of group chair can read and write there (write - append)
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ben_thatmustbeme i'd recommend, A) take this to #social as this is getting outside of IWC, and B) start by proposing a new user story that is clear since that one was pretty well downvoted for being duplicate / unclear
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elf-pavlik https://www.w3.org/wiki/WebAccessControl#Modes_of_Access
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ben_thatmustbeme in which case you are just saying private groups
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elf-pavlik restricted shared feeds, groups can have independent definitiosn e.g. w3c-social chairs
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elf-pavlik in private-webmention scenario always a person (having agency) needs to host conversation and fetch webmentions using its webmention endpoint
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elf-pavlik me=https://bob.example
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elf-pavlik <link href="http://webmention.io/indiewebcamp/webmention" rel="webmention" /> in https://indiewebcamp.com/micropub
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elf-pavlik would require me=https://indiewebcamp.com to fetch webmentions hosted here
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elf-pavlik while IMO https://indiewebcamp.com doesn't need to have 'agency' but only host wikis, discussions, chatrooms etc.
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ben_thatmustbeme remember that chatrooms is sort of out of scope.
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elf-pavlik private-webmentions seems to require hosting resource server to have agency and authenticate as someone included in ACL
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ben_thatmustbeme for the WG anyway
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ben_thatmustbeme oh, i see
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ben_thatmustbeme you are concerned about hosting the posts on some external site
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elf-pavlik https://www.w3.org/wiki/Socialwg/Social_API/User_stories#Photo_sharing_with_event_attendees
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ben_thatmustbeme when we started to look at the whole groups thing it was suggested that events as they stand now are a pretty good place to start
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elf-pavlik freenode.net hosts this channel, indiewebcamp.com hosts wiki ...
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ben_thatmustbeme figure out groups from that
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elf-pavlik this would work if Ben creates an event
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elf-pavlik but not if https://www.w3.org/wiki/Socialwg/2015-05-04
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elf-pavlik hosted by w3.org not a person with 'agency'
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ben_thatmustbeme why not?
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ben_thatmustbeme w3.org is a wiki, so it really can't. but some JS alternative in the like of webmention.io could
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elf-pavlik shared responsibility, i don't think anyone would like a single person to control w3.org events or groups
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ben_thatmustbeme what are they controlling
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "they controlling" yet. Would you like to create it? http://indiewebcamp.com/s/100q
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elf-pavlik the event wall resource or group message board resource
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ben_thatmustbeme i think you are mixing two issues, one is just creating things as some group account, the other is just private groups / events
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ben_thatmustbeme how its controlled is independant of the spec to notify
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elf-pavlik i don't agree... in private-webmention case you need to get token for me=https://w3.org/ for example to fetch content behind ACL
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elf-pavlik and add https://w3.org/ to ACL
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elf-pavlik did you look at diagrams in https://github.com/linkeddata/SoLiD/issues/26
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elf-pavlik for group/event walls message boards 'notification' acts as a way to post
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elf-pavlik illustrated case would require me=https://web.academy while i would also like to support hosting by resource servers which don't have 'agency'
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elf-pavlik so can't authenticate as organization
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ben_thatmustbeme elf-pavlik: you need an authentication token, to prove its you (the reader)
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elf-pavlik i agree we better move this topic to #social :) IWC seems to focus on 'personal' and doesn't seek support for 'group' / 'organization' workflows
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ben_thatmustbeme in case of w3.org hosting an event. w3.org needs to prove to my site it is w3.org in order to fetch content
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elf-pavlik so the client needs to fetch all the content in this case? not webmention endpoint
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ben_thatmustbeme ?
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ben_thatmustbeme w3.org fetches copies
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ben_thatmustbeme and keeps that data restricted to some ACL
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ben_thatmustbeme who need to prove it is them to read
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elf-pavlik oh webmention endpoint for private-webmention always acts as client on behalf of resource owner (via me=https://alice.example)
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ben_thatmustbeme works exactly as pulling in comments or context on current public posts
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elf-pavlik for public posts one doesn't need to authenticate to pull them
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elf-pavlik http://indiewebcamp.com/private-webmention#Sharing_with_Groups
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elf-pavlik in this case in each reply i always need to mention everyone? i can't just subscribe to a thread like in github issues
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elf-pavlik BTW how does private content work with pubsubhubbub?
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elf-pavlik eg. i want to receive 'notification' for each reply to an event, not only those which mention me in explicit way
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elf-pavlik but the event stay secret like https://phubble.tuxed.net/alice-b-day/
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ben_thatmustbeme you wouldn't need to share with everyone. just the main thread. its a good question, has not been worked out
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elf-pavlik Sign In with IndieCert https://phubble.tuxed.net/
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ben_thatmustbeme would probably work more like salmention though
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elf-pavlik salmention :D
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elf-pavlik http://www.w3.org/TR/2015/WD-activitystreams-vocabulary-20150722/#dfn-target
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elf-pavlik publish (create, post) to https://phubble.tuxed.net/alice-b-day/
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petermolnar.eu edited /spam (+383) "/* Spam Prevention */" (view diff)
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ben.thatmustbe.me edited /Webmention (+16) "/* IndieWeb Examples */ update my webmention usage" (view diff)
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elf-pavlik ben_thatmustbeme++
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Loqi ben_thatmustbeme has 107 karma
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ben_thatmustbeme the nice thing is that be it a private event, private group, or private post it should work relatively the same way
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ben_thatmustbeme ideally
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ben_thatmustbeme no matter where it is hosted
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ben_thatmustbeme has been thinking about creating a silo that supports indieweb fully
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ben_thatmustbeme that would be interesting
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ben_thatmustbeme to see if i can get friends who are not web devs to join
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elf-pavlik you can give people subdomains on *.indiesilo.com
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petermolnar if indiesilo.com is not an oxymoron, I don't know what is
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petermolnar ben_thatmustbeme, wasn't withknown.com supposed to be the indieweb silo?
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Zegnat Buy indiesilo.com, install Known on it?
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petermolnar or a heavily tweaked wordpress network with all the turns & knobs preinstalled for indieweb
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@carlospache_co It gives me hope for the web every time @kevinmarks is on @twig and talks about @withknown and what the #indieweb movement is doing. (twitter.com/_/status/627105642856054786)
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LanceyWork !tell tantek i'm having issues with urls not being identified properly in cassis.js tw_text_proxy due to their tlds being excluded from the link regex, but i noticed you had intentionally excluded .mobi and .jobs. any precedent for other missing tlds, e.g. .codes, or is that a matter of having to update the regex to include them?
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell him that when I see him next
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GWG Okay...spent the last two hours troubleshooting this...fixed three bugs. Still doesn't work. Darn.
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LanceyWork what's the problem?
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GWG First, it wasn't setting what I wanted it to. I found I had a setting wrong.
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GWG Now, it is setting what I want it to, but when it tries to retrieve the data it uses to make the decision about what to set, it is getting nothing.
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LanceyWork that's always frustrating
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LanceyWork where does it retrieve the data from?
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@oisinlunny RT @matrixdotorg: Kegan's notes on building an #indieweb micropub to Matrix gateway at @IndieWebCampUK are up at http://matrix.org/blog/2015/07/29/micropub-support-as-an-application-service/ for… (twitter.com/_/status/627119117112320000)
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GWG LanceyWork: The database, effectively.
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GWG The same place the thing it is setting is stored. Just different part.
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LanceyWork how bizarre
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GWG I have an idea suddenly.
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LanceyWork if you force it to always set the thing, does it work?
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GWG I wonder if it would work.
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GWG LanceyWork: Yes. That was how I troubleshooted the other problem
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LanceyWork wouldn't hurt to try (or it would)
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GWG I have another idea about where to get the data to set the parameter
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elf-pavlik ben_thatmustbeme, aaronpk https://github.com/converspace/webmention/issues/36#issuecomment-126635121
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GWG I'm retrieving it from where it was stored.
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GWG This is hooking off the Micropub plugin, which stores it based on the POST parameters
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ben_thatmustbeme petermolnar: yes, that too but Known comes off more as a pile of independant blogs. there is no feeds, etc
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GWG Maybe I'll just try to get it pre-processing, instead of post-processing
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ben_thatmustbeme would be cool to do that internally, but then show how everything works with it
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GWG Anyway....that's for later
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@tabatkins RT @t: A POSSE portal, or IndieWeb-Silo Bridge, is a syndication feature that takes a fundamental shortcut through ... http://t.co/eycamn8O… (twitter.com/_/status/627124998629535745)
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KevinMarks__ I suppose ask.willsomeone.com is a kind of indiesilo
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KevinMarks__ as you have user pages and h-entry markup
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aaronpk wow good morning
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Loqi aaronpk: elf-pavlik left you a message 7 hours, 20 minutes ago: does wm.bob can always get auth token with me=https://bob.example.org/ ? it seems to me making delegation not useful if for example https://webmention.io/wwelves.org-perpetual-tripper/webmention can access all the resources which have me in ACL http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-07-31/line/1438328547800
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aaronpk that's quite a lot of chatter about extending webmention
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aaronpk elf-pavlik: I think if you're trusting your webmention endpoint to fetch private posts for you, then you have to accept what that means
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petermolnar heh, interesting how differently I think; I'd just serve a gpg pubkey crypted version of the post for the webmention read request crypted by the pubkey from the remote site
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aaronpk sure but that doesn't really change anything, it means that the thing fetching your private posts has access to your private key
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aaronpk which is analogous to "my webmention endpoint can access all the resources which have me in the ACL"
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petermolnar no, I think you misunderstood: private post on my page; request comes in from remote site to view; my site fetches the pubkey from the remote site; encrypts the post content with the pubkey; displays the data for the request; the remote site should decrypt it with their privkey
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aaronpk right, my point is the *part of the remote site that is decrypting it* must have acess to the private key
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aaronpk in the webmention example this is known as teh "webmention endpoint"
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aaronpk which could very well be part of your own site, but may also be delegated to an external service
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aaronpk and the same would be true in your case with pgp keys
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petermolnar fair point
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@mtony75 Giving IndieWeb Another Shot https://tonyfleming.withknown.com/2015/giving-indieweb-another-shot (twitter.com/_/status/627137843207405568)
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@mtony75 Giving IndieWeb Another Shot https://plus.google.com/+TonyFleming/posts/FLZyQVXR54Z https://twitter.com/mtony75/status/627139206666543104/photo/1 (twitter.com/_/status/627139206666543104)
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elf-pavlik aaronpk, do you have examples of ACL definition?
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elf-pavlik http://indiewebcamp.com/private-webmention#Sharing_with_Groups
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aaronpk in my site it's just a list of URLs
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aaronpk the ACL is an internal implementation detail tho
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elf-pavlik if i link to https://www.nsa.gov/ it don't need to get included in ACL
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aaronpk who said anything about "link to"
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ben_thatmustbeme ACLs are about who has access, not who links to
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aaronpk my private posts contain a list of URLs who are allowed to access the post
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elf-pavlik how would you share post with ACL allowing read only to socialwg members listed on http://www.w3.org/2000/09/dbwg/details?group=72531&public=1
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ben_thatmustbeme which is actually an interesting bit, aaronpk what are your thoughts on how to set access to a post via MP?
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aaronpk ben_thatmustbeme: good question, one sec
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ben_thatmustbeme for that matter, do you list who has access within the post
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elf-pavlik i work on implementing https://www.w3.org/wiki/WebAccessControl but fosuced on JSON-LD not Turtle
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aaronpk elf-pavlik: I would either 1) add that group URL to my site which would pull in all the individual members, or 2) add everyone individually
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aaronpk then I would send a webmention to everyone's home page which would trigger the flow on http://indiewebcamp.com/private-webmention
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elf-pavlik what if someone joins or leaves group ?
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@HongPong #d4dboston @mlncn gives the plug for #indiewebcamp @benwerd @withknown as good internets tool breaking out of walled garden. very good (twitter.com/_/status/627143388136128513)
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aaronpk if I reference the URL then that's taken care of automatically
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elf-pavlik agentClass in https://www.w3.org/wiki/WebAccessControl#Agents_and_classes
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aaronpk problem is "what if someone joins or leaves" actually requires different behavior depending on the desired result, and isn't something I can make a sweeping judgment on
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elf-pavlik how new person joining social-wg will allow her to read posts shared to social-wg ?
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aaronpk elf-pavlik: you're going a little far with this right now
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ben_thatmustbeme haha, @mlncn is over at the NERD center right now
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Loqi awesome
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aaronpk private webmention != groups
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elf-pavlik ok
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elf-pavlik so we focus on bit different use cases
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elf-pavlik i need to document group feeds on a wiki
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aaronpk there's two different ways to handle groups, one being sharing content from your site with a group, the other where the group has its own storage for the group's content
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aaronpk and both are valid in different cases
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ben_thatmustbeme http://design4drupal.org/design-4-drupal-2015/speakers
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ben_thatmustbeme hopefully they will post a video of his talk
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elf-pavlik i look at group having its own storage for the group's content as both w3social groups and indiewebcamp use such spaces (wiki, irc)
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aaronpk in that case the whole private-webmention page is not relevant
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elf-pavlik ok
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elf-pavlik aaronpk, how does pubsubhubbub handle private feeds?
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aaronpk it doesn't yet
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aaronpk the original PuSH authors explicitly left out private feeds from the spec
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aaronpk i want to see how that could work, but haven't explored it much yet
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elf-pavlik it seems having some similarities to private group discussions
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aaronpk i think so
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elf-pavlik i want to subscribe to comments even if they don't mention me
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elf-pavlik comments / replies
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aaronpk yeah
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aaronpk that's a great use of PuSH
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elf-pavlik does PuSH still use 'fat pings' ?
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aaronpk it can, but i know a lot of people have implemented it with thin pings
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elf-pavlik how for private feeds hub.callback would compare to webmention endpoint ?
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elf-pavlik for thin pings
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elf-pavlik > hub.callback
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elf-pavlik REQUIRED. The subscriber's callback URL where notifications should be delivered. It is considered good practice to use a unique callback URL for each subscription.
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gRegorLove Morning, indiewebcamp!
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elf-pavlik morning gRegorLove
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elf-pavlik will need to run soon
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aaronpk refers to mapkyca's IRC protocol walkthrough
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tantek good morning #indiewebcamp!
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Loqi tantek: LanceyWork left you a message 3 hours, 11 minutes ago: i'm having issues with urls not being identified properly in cassis.js tw_text_proxy due to their tlds being excluded from the link regex, but i noticed you had intentionally excluded .mobi and .jobs. any precedent for other missing tlds, e.g. .codes, or is that a matter of having to update the regex to include them? http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-07-31/line/1438348827555
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tantek LanceyWork: yeah it's a matter of disincentivizing all the new carp TLDs. do you have a specific one that you need e.g. for your personal site?
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LanceyWork i use .space
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tantek what's your site?
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LanceyWork http://lancey.space
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tantek ok
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tantek LOL subtweet LanceyWork https://twitter.com/LanceCoyote/status/627150045398183936
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@LanceCoyote 3744 characters on one line. That’s definitely the longest line of code I’ve ever seen. (twitter.com/_/status/627150045398183936)
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LanceyWork tantek, that's with all the extra domains added
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tantek LanceyWork: added .space for you: https://twitter.com/cassisjs/status/627158384161234944
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@cassisjs [cassis] https://github.com/tantek/cassis/commit/5368298790e7ab3a22cd3645749f5c546f24ca9f Tantek Çelik - add .space to auto_link_re for http://lancey.space (twitter.com/_/status/627158384161234944)
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LanceyWork thanks!
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tantek .space sounds generic enough
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tantek I objected to .jobs and .mobi because TLDs should have nothing to do with the content (jobs?!?) or be device specific (mobile?!?)
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tantek that's their layer violation and thus those should be deprecated
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tantek the explosion is also too crazy so I'm only going to bother adding when there's real world indieweb use-cases
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tantek like yours :)
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Loqi slack/ben_thatmustbeme: what if you last name is jobs?
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ben_thatmustbeme ack, talking in slack notifies me in here
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tantek ben_thatmustbeme: I'm more interested in "my last name is jobs" than "what if ... "
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tantek the bar has been raised
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tantek and yes, if Moby asks me to add .mobi for him then I likely will.
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ben_thatmustbeme lol
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ben_thatmustbeme :D
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LanceyWork i just feel like if you're going to add them one at a time as indieweb sites use them, you might just end up adding them all anyway
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tantek LanceyWork: that kind of reasoning is how we end up with explosions of terms like schema
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tantek it's the other way around, by default, minimalism wins
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LanceyWork i suppose
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[aaronpk] good morning
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[slackbot] good morning
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[slackbot] good morning
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[slackbot] good morning
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[slackbot] good morning
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[slackbot] good morning
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[aaronpk] uhoh what
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LanceyWork good morning
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[slackbot] good morning
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gRegorLove Shh, slackbot
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aaronpk now realizes he did not test this in a two-way integrated room yet
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[aaronpk] let's try that again
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tantek lol
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[slackbot] lol
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aaronpk oh no
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M-Kegan Routing loop?
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aaronpk i think i have to completely ignore everything from slackbot
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aaronpk there's nothing in the post request that indicates the display name that slackbot shows. their webhook integration leaves something to be desired.
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M-Kegan You're trying to do slack to irc?
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aaronpk better slack<->IRC... we've had it for a while
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M-Kegan Shouldn't it just work? Is the irc bridge done by the slack people?
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aaronpk not really. slack provides an irc interface that an irc client can use to connect to a slack room. I want a two-way link with an existing IRC channel
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Loqi gives aaronpk a two
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LanceyWork is the post request coming from slack or irc?
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LanceyWork or rather what's the context of it
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aaronpk Slack supports "outgoing web hooks" so each message that is sent to a slack room causes them to send a POST request to your endpoint
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tantek LanceyWork - hey add yourself to /irc-people ! since you have a personal site and all
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M-Kegan So an irc bot will sit in here and consume irc messages, and post to slack? And how does the bot get stuff from slack?
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LanceyWork i'm listed there as lancey
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LanceyWork my home computer is just powered down atm
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M-Kegan Or does slack just say "give me a channel and I'll spit stuff from slack to it"?
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[aaronpk] and now the IRC logs properly link Slack users from /irc-people
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tantek Lancey you can add your IRC nickname variants too
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aaronpk M-Kegan: from IRC->Slack is handled by Loqi an an "incoming web hook" on Slack
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LanceyWork what are irc people
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Loqi https://indiewebcamp.com/IRC_People
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M-Kegan What about the reverse?
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aaronpk see above
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M-Kegan You said from irc to slack?
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lancey.space edited /IRC_People (+97) "/* Nicknames */ Added my work nick" (view diff)
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M-Kegan What about slack to irc?
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aaronpk slack to irc is handled by their outgoing web hook like i mentioned before
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M-Kegan Right which loqi gets
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aaronpk no
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M-Kegan lol
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aaronpk Loqi sits in IRC and sends messages to Slack
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aaronpk Slack sends post requests to the new gateway which signs in to IRC for each slack user
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M-Kegan You're going to have problems breaking routing loops if they aren't the same entity, short of hacks like checking the nick, username or real name surely.
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[aaronpk] right, which is why I had to ignore "slackbot" which is how all the IRC messages appear when sent back to IRC
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[aaronpk] if Slack's outgoing hook contained more information like the display name in slack, I could be smarter about it. But the outgoing web hook does not include all of the information that you see in the Slack UI.
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M-Kegan Ahhh I see
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M-Kegan Helpful.
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aaronpk the gateway source code is here if you're interetsed https://github.com/aaronpk/Slack-IRC-Gateway
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M-Kegan Very. I do the matrix <-> irc bridge so bridges are relevant to my interests ;3
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aaronpk aha :)
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M-Kegan Handling all the edge cases though is nigh impossible.
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[aaronpk] yeah also handling the intricacies of Slack is fun, like how they handle emoji :simple_smile:
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aaronpk (i typed a literal :-) in slack for that ^^)
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M-Kegan Currently doing win95 style LONGNA~1 support for usernames since matrix ids have a bigger namespace
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@dgd7 RT @HongPong: #d4dboston @mlncn gives the plug for #indiewebcamp @benwerd @withknown as good internets tool breaking out of walled garden. … (twitter.com/_/status/627172575467151360)
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tantek Bridge all the things!
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tantek sigh, Loqi
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Loqi :)
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[ben_thatmustbem looks much nicer now
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ben_thatmustbeme wonders how the bridge back the other way handles things like :simple_smile: and :)
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ben_thatmustbeme it changed the first one in to an image, but not the second
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Loqi Welcome, indie-visitor! Set your nickname by typing /nick yourname
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KevinMarks__ hi TinoKremer
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TinoKremer Hey KevinMarks__
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KevinMarks__ what brings you here?
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TinoKremer I'm working on my website. I'm trying to setup a self hosted Known instance. So far so good, I figured Ben would be in here as well
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KevinMarks__ he often is; there's also #knownchat
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KevinMarks__ A wild benwerd appears
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TinoKremer Lol
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benwerd briefly
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tantek yes that was impressive
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TinoKremer thinks benwerd is monitoring this channel for his name or Known
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tantek or any mention of "Ben"
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benwerd This was an accident - I'm in a meeting, needed to find a link to share and IRC is always on when I'm online :)
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tantek sure, sure. ;)
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benwerd And now I disappear ;)
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TinoKremer Lol :)
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KevinMarks__ that was pure Kibo
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tantek now you've done it
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TinoKremer KevinMarks__ you are also on the hosted WithKnown (pro) I see, I figured you would have your own site
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tantek he does
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KevinMarks__ I have my own site, but not my own known instance
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TinoKremer Sorry, that's what I meant
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TinoKremer known.kevinmarks.com is resolving to the same IP as my site :)
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tantek ooh clever
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TinoKremer I want TLS support, so I decided to selfhost
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KevinMarks__ yep, I thought that was more interesting for me to try things out, though it means I can't patch the code.
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ben_thatmustbeme wow, benwerd showed up on command
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ben_thatmustbeme i thought you had to say his name 3 times in the mirror
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TinoKremer That's another reason for selfhosting. Ben has been talking about 0.8 and specifically the ability to set privacy for each post individually. That's not on the service yet :)
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TinoKremer Do any of you know if it's possible to 'import' content from one known site to another?
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KevinMarks__ yes, there is an export/import process, though I haven't done it
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KevinMarks__ #knownchat may know more
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TinoKremer You can export, which I did, but there currently is only Blogger and Wordpress import :) I'll try later on #knownchat, ty
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TinoKremer I'll fiddle around. Are there Indiewebcamp sessions in The Netherlands yet?
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@mlncn RT @HongPong: #d4dboston @mlncn gives the plug for #indiewebcamp @benwerd @withknown as good internets tool breaking out of walled garden. … (twitter.com/_/status/627180335491600384)
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snarfed does anyone have recommendations for software bounty marketplaces? (non security related)
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snarfed i'd like offer a bounty for a way to get your FB news feed programmatically after FB turns off the /me/home API endpoint in october. https://github.com/snarfed/facebook-atom/issues/6
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tantek snarfed what was the HTML-only view of FB?
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[aaronpk] still can't believe they're doing that
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tantek there was a URL / domain to use to see your FB news etc. in HTML w/o JS
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KevinMarks__ you still need a cookie though
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tantek can I micropub a cookie to my server?
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tantek considers running a personal bridgy-like proxy box from his home, so to the silos it just looks like a random home access
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snarfed tantek: sorry i don't follow the q re html-only view
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snarfed do you mean, could i scrape?
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snarfed no clue. honestly i'm reluctant to try
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snarfed i'd really rather not maintain scraping like that over time
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snarfed also i expect the auth part would be difficult, especially to get a reasonable UX. API tokens and cookies are usually totally separate. if the onboarding includes "extract a cookie from your browser and paste it here"…ugh
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tantek indeed
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snarfed if someone does all the investigation and packages up a nice minimal chunk of code, i'd maybe consider it, hence bounty
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snarfed i'd pay for that with money right now, but not time and effort :P
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tantek gah now it's bugging me that I can't find that URL
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KevinMarks_ it was in logs before
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snarfed (btw tantek you'll at least be happy to know that losing /me/home won't affect bridgy at all. just facebook-atom.)
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tantek they had some atom support?
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tantek darn it I really thought I'd added this to the wiki
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KevinMarks_ gah, medium ficks up my fragmention by putting a "back to top" link on top of it
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@kevinmarks “I do want to go forward to a web based on relationships” @zeynep #indieweb https://medium.com/message/the-web-of-relationships-we-have-to-save-7f337de03e34 (twitter.com/_/status/627189943568236545)
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snarfed tantek: sorry, no, by facebook-atom i meant https://facebook-atom.appspot.com/
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snarfed hence https://github.com/snarfed/facebook-atom/issues/6
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KartikPrabhu Loqi messages?
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Loqi is done
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@mjUX RT @kevinmarks: “I do want to go forward to a web based on relationships” @zeynep #indieweb https://medium.com/message/the-web-of-relationships-we-have-to-save-7f337de03e34 (twitter.com/_/status/627198264836780033)
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@andrewfnewman RT @kevinmarks: “I do want to go forward to a web based on relationships” @zeynep #indieweb https://medium.com/message/the-web-of-relationships-we-have-to-save-7f337de03e34 (twitter.com/_/status/627201757131636736)
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tantek.com edited /repost (+907) "/* Tumblr */ Tumblr reblog persistence with real world example with multiple levels of reblogging, including a deleted original" (view diff)
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kevinmarks.com edited /repost (+89) "/* Tumblr reblog persistence */" (view diff)
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GWG Okay, finally got the Post Kinds plugin to set the kind when the post is created by Micropub.
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GWG Seem to have broken the ability somehow to change the post kind in the WordPress Post UI
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ben_thatmustbeme need to get reposts working
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ben_thatmustbeme and displaying
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aaronpk kylewm: are you POSSEing your instagram comments?!
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kylewm yes!
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kylewm cheating with Selenium/PhantomJS
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aaronpk orly!
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aaronpk whoa did you just send a webmention to me because your post was updated?
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aaronpk i just got a notification "aaronparecki.com commented on a post you were tagged in"
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aaronpk haha i should probably not send myself a notification if i'm the one that commented
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aaronpk but that was kind of cool
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snarfed ooh kylewm want to extend your selenium service to do fb too? i'm totally imagining a service i could give an access token and get back the user's news feed
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snarfed (only half joking! :P)
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kylewm snarfed: sadly, it would have to be your username/password...which i don't want to be responsible for
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snarfed awww man true
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snarfed well or a cookie
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aaronpk oauth++
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Loqi oauth has 1 karma
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KevinMarks_ a browser plugin live brad's one
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KevinMarks_ s/live/like/
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Loqi KevinMarks_ meant to say: a browser plugin like brad's one
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kylewm oh haha, yeah it sent you a salmention notification!
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@aaronpk @papapelz hmm that's on the Wordpress side. If you hop in #indiewebcamp IRC I'm sure someone would be happy to... http://aaronparecki.com/replies/2015/07/31/3/indiewebcamp (twitter.com/_/status/627258448149786624)
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Loqi [mention] Aaron Parecki commented '@papapelz hmm that's on the Wordpress side. If you hop in #indiewebcamp IRC I'm sure someone would be happy to figure it out! http://indiewe...' on a post that linked to http://indiewebcamp.com/IRC (https://aaronparecki.com/replies/2015/07/31/3/indiewebcamp)
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