#indiewebcamp 2015-12-27

2015-12-27 UTC
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tantek.com
edited /poster_frame (+1124) "why, how, indieweb examples, silo examples, see also"
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Schnitz
Not sure the order is relevant too, personally, but in a kinda improving things mindset, I'm taking the first proposed theme when reading from top to down and see what it does for me
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tantek
that's a good approach
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tantek
and if you have problems with the first thing suggested we should fix the wiki!
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Schnitz
tantek: exactly, provide the fastest mose effective way always first
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tantek
!tell shaners I was trying to test your video poster frame support and noticed that it doesn't seem to work on your squirrel video, e.g. poster http://assets.veganstraightedge.com/videos/2013/5/31/backyard-squirrel-buddy.png returns an XML error "AccessDenied".
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Loqi
Ok, I'll tell him that when I see him next
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Schnitz
interesting... nice Loqi feature right there
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Loqi
who, me?
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Schnitz
yep, you
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tantek
Schnitz, turns out that's all you really need for simple async comms. Not email.
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Schnitz
Gotcha, smart. Really smart
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tantek
we've learned some lessons from things like twitter.
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Schnitz
OK its kinda safe to say that default tumblr indie web theme can be imrpoved
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tantek
I bet
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tantek
feel free to use mine and let me know what I can improve
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tantek
I don't think the author is here much
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tantek
(of the "tumblr indie web theme" you mention)
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tantek.com
edited /poster_frame (+664) "/* IndieWeb Examples */ note Shaners support for poster attribute since 2015-12-13, but poster image does not load currently :("
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Schnitz
tantek: yes I understand, to be honest I think its already and improvement it you put the code of YOUR theme at the exact spot where this one is now
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Schnitz
in the wiki for copy'n
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tantek
Schnitz I suppose I don't understand - where should I put the code of my theme?
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Schnitz
pasty readiness
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Schnitz
ok brb
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Schnitz
second <p>: There is a indie web version theme already marked up that you can use. Click on the customize link and copy and paste this over the existing html.
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Schnitz
indie web version theme is the link to GITHUB
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tantek
so in a gist on github?
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tantek
sorry, sometimes I am slow with this stuff
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Schnitz
No you're not
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Schnitz
I could be wrong too, very likely perhaps
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tantek
lol did you just like my video on tumblr?
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Schnitz
Yes I did
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Schnitz
I was checking whether my like bubbles up into tantek.com
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Schnitz
then I figured it was disabled on your half
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tantek
I don't know if I get backfeed from Tumblr
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tantek
e.g. via Brid.gy
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tantek
ok I forget where to find my profile
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tantek
er, my template
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Schnitz
oh interesting, I thought you had control over this already and decided to not show it
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Schnitz
Can't you take your template out of tumblr?
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Schnitz
'your' tumblr?
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tantek
(for showing backfeed / webmentions)
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tantek
I'm logged into Tumblr and the UI always confuses me
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tantek.com
edited /video (+210) "see also poster frame"
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Schnitz
tantek: OK true, its edit template, that big button in the middle
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Schnitz
understand, interesting the Falcon link
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tantek
when I login the there is no big button in the middle
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tantek
all the little icons in the top right
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Schnitz
yes, icon second to the far right, last option, I guess
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tantek
I have to dig for it every time since I use the Tumblr UI so rarely
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aaronpk
wow so now that I launched Telegraph, and updated my new site to use it to send webmentions, I'm struggling to remember what the thing I was working on before that was. That turned out to be a way bigger project than I anticipated.
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tantek
lightning bolt just shows "activity"
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tantek
aaronpk - stack overflow?
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Schnitz
BTW I used to own Stack Overflow
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aaronpk
something like that. or maybe my LRU cache got purged.
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Schnitz
the domain(s), just as an anecdote, 15 years ago
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tantek
no seriously how do I edit my Tumblr theme?
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Schnitz
oh ok, whats below activity?
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tantek
no more wrench icon
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Schnitz
one next to lightning bold
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Schnitz
the person symbol
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Schnitz
haha :-)
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tantek
they changed it again
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Schnitz
and then it should be the last option the dropdown
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Schnitz
Appearance?
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Schnitz
Yeah they change these things everywhere all the time, no matter where. Why Silos suck, also
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tantek
taking notes
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tantek
lol XHTML 1.0 Transitional. I don't need that
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tantek
xmlns="http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml" xml:lang="en" lang="en" don't need that
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Schnitz
hahaha
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Schnitz
kick it
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Schnitz
that spec has my name on it, I allow you to completely get rid off it at all times forever ...
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Schnitz
*giggle*
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tantek
so much time wasted arguing about XHTML and trying to make it work to appease the XML-heads who didn't actually care or ship anything anyway
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tantek
I just didn't know better at the time, and was trusting people supposedly more senior and knowledgable.
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Schnitz
oh tell me... I hindsight it made me soo sad
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tantek
So now I no longer trust anyone based on seniority or assertion of experience.
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Schnitz
100% PURE AGREEMENT
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tantek
I ask the what is their website, and to show me on their website.
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tantek
If they can't ship their web ideas on their own website, they have no credibility with me.
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Schnitz
very much true
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tantek
I don't care what title they have at what company or how many white papers they have published.
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Schnitz
I hear you!
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Schnitz
BTW, thsi is logged .-)
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Schnitz
and thats a good thing
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tantek
I've made my opinion on this very clear in many forums including W3C Social Web
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tantek
as you might expect, some folks got really upset and decided to be negative and unhelpful
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Schnitz
No I don't want to rant or anything ... since eveything was a great gift in many ways... BUT, one is true, the who is fault question is very complex, lots of weird energies and situations, and to a certain extent its also OK to say that the W3C at that time was just naive as a operating entity, in allowing so many people with no filter to just decide on these things
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tantek
it based its operating culture on the bodies that came before it, IETF, ISO etc.
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tantek
assuming that everyone there was of good will and technical expertise
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Schnitz
tantek: Its your duty today to say this to people and piss them off, seriously
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Schnitz
I know, folks like Larry Masinter for example, THAT level of quality. Different story.
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tantek
Larry is his own person, we've had some good conversations
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Schnitz
I'm sure. He inspired me a lot. He always stuck to simple things.
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tantek
I'm not going to pick on anyone in particular because I am hopeful that anyone can become better behaved.
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tantek.com
edited /Tumblr (+220) "/* Add microformats support */ update instructions to edit a theme in Tumblr, update link to use my Tumblr theme gist since I have no idea what happened to the person who contributed the other one."
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Schnitz
tantek: very wise. I myself was confused any made wrong decisions.
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tantek
Schnitz: ^^^ fixed
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Schnitz
OK going live in 10 secs
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Schnitz
checking...
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tantek
(really just one more step)
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Schnitz
belp.audio
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Schnitz
much better
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Schnitz
maybe one bug
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Schnitz
You're referencing the previous GitHub Theme under your tantek entry, no?
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Schnitz
The first link tho is correct
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tantek.com
edited /Tumblr (+0) "/* Example Tumblrs with microformats */ update indieweb tumblr theme link"
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tantek
thanks!
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Schnitz
Ok thats a small improvement right there... if I read this Wiki page for the first coming from Tumblr, I'll be way more happy with your stylesheet / theme Tantek than the previous one, for sure
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tantek
great!
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tantek
small steps
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Schnitz
no prob, pleasure, anytime :-) of course...
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Schnitz
Sweet. Like my new tumblr already. Now back to some custom CSS...
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tantek.com
edited /Falcon (+201) "/* Videos */ poster frame support added!"
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tantek
Schnitz glad to hear it!
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tantek
I vaguely remember obsessing for like a day and ripping tons of things out of a Tumblr theme and simplifying it until it looked like what you see there
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tantek
now I just copy stuff there from other silos
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tantek
kind of like an incidental backup of sorts
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tantek.com
edited /Falcon (+57) "/* Videos */ cite post with first poster-frame upon posting"
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tantek
poster frames are yet another way my site is now better than Twitter. Twitter video posts do not have nor allow you to pick an explicit /poster_frame. :)
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Schnitz
tantek: updated CSS for belp.audio ... just a really quick CSS hack, still lots of issues, will still fix em of course, but nice for just now
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Schnitz
no that CSS is a mess
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Schnitz
don't look at it
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Schnitz
ok now its ok for today
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Schnitz
tantek: Ah I ok... can I maybe improve your theme just slightly? U seem to have a relative URI reference for the RSS button or icon image at LINE 328 that will result in a broken image, just take that out: https://gist.github.com/tantek/ac27fb0f28c41c4fb2a7#file-indieweb-tumblr-theme-L328
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@t
Happy 12 years of XFN! (11d after the fact:) #microformats rel=me & #IndieAuth continue growing. Previously: http://tantek.com/2015/360/t3/happy-12-xfn-microformats-indieauth-growing
(twitter.com/_/status/680920661859028994)
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tantek
Schnitz, nice!
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tantek
yeah no need for an RSS button
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Schnitz
Oh yeah that was great fun very cool nice result ... I especially like the hovering permalink button, brings it very much to the point, good job Tantek
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Schnitz
12 years of XHTML Friends Network ... jeeesus.
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Schnitz
I feel old
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tantek
hey I gotta feed that IndieAuth hashtag some actual relevant posts :)
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tantek
Schnitz: like I said, slow & steady
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tantek
gist updated :D
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tantek
ok, got my holiday coding done for the day
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tantek
now let's see what else I can commit to for 2016-01-01
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tantek
Hey Schnitz, now that you're on the wiki and IRC - start with creating your user page! https://indiewebcamp.com/wikify#Wikify_yourself
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tantek
I myself am considering adding RelMeAuth sign-in to my home page / site.
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tantek
As a building block towards enabling login-only viewable posts and other information like /contact
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Schnitz
That makes a lotta sense
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Schnitz
I will definitely do my user page
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tantek
!tell rhiaro you added IndieAuth support to your site recently - what kind of challenges did you run into, and what additional site-features have you built on top of it?
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Loqi
Ok, I'll tell her that when I see her next
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Schnitz
Now I'll check out my user page
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belp.audio
created /User:Belp.audio (+1077) "Created page with "Happy to be here, what a great project. Been involved with computers / networking for a little while, had my own FIDO mailbox in the early 90ies, hooked up to the Internet for th...""
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Schnitz
LOL I should go to bed, so many fucked up typos and twists... well
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tantek
it's a start!
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tantek
now add your h-card there too! like it says on https://indiewebcamp.com/wikify#Wikify_yourself
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tantek
and if you're really feeling eager, an "Itches" section too :)
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tantek
yes! Indie record label!
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Schnitz
and you listen to some stuff here if you're interested: https://soundcloud.com/schamoni-musik
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Schnitz
I'll add that to my page in a little while. I think I'm good for today :-)
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Schnitz
ALright, been great, thanks everyone, going to bed now, cu soon...
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@davidmead
RT @t: Happy 12 years of XFN! (11d after the fact:) #microformats rel=me & #IndieAuth continue growing. Previously: http://tantek.com/2015/360/t3/happy-12-xfn-microformats-indieauth-growing
(twitter.com/_/status/680945530483113984)
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tantek
what is reading?
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Loqi
To read or reading is the act of viewing and interpreting posts or other documents https://indiewebcamp.com/reading
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tantek
is looking at posting "read" posts
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tantek
perhaps starting as notes of a certain format
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@t
read "Arsebestos" in "Some Remarks" #hardcopy by @nealstephenson, while lying sideways. Then sat up to write this note (ttk.me t4ev4)
(twitter.com/_/status/680973554834247680)
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tantek.com
edited /read (+636) "/* IndieWeb Examples */ Tantek, experimenting with plaintext read posts"
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aaronpk
what's the UI element called where typing text into a field and then a space turns the text you just typed into a little rectangle with an X? Facebook does this when typing a person's name into the text box
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aaronpk
I coulda sworn I had bookmarked a library that does that but I can't find it now
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tantek
though with the FB example, a space *does not* turn it into a little rectangle with an X - you have to pick it from the drop down menu
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tantek
but the general concept of text word(s) turning into little boxes with an x is useful - don't know a name for it
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aaronpk
ah I was mixing that up
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aaronpk
I was describing the one more often used with plain text tags
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tantek
I did see kylewm's person-tagging UI do that at IWC SF!
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tantek
it was really slick - so he must have some library for it, or he wrote one
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tantek
the type + auto-suggest menu + blockify pattern is interesting
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aaronpk
here is one, but I thought I saw a better one before http://sean.is/poppin/tags
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tantek
gmail does something similar in the To: and CC: etc. fields
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aaronpk
here's another one, "token input" http://loopj.com/jquery-tokeninput/
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tantek
token input is a good name
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tantek
ok aaronpk, you get to define this one, since you've likely thought about it
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tantek
what is token input?
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Loqi
It looks like we don't have a page for "token input" yet. Would you like to create it? https://indiewebcamp.com/s/10AQ
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aaronpk
token input is a style of form element which allows the user to type free-form text (or select a term via autocomplete), and then turns each term into a new inline element, usually outlining the term and showing a little "x" which allows the user to delete the term by clicking it.
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loqi.me
created /token_input (+308) "prompted by tantek https://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-12-26/line/1451193127333 and dfn added by aaronpk"
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[snarfed]
aaronpk: they're usually called contact chips, or [X] chips
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[snarfed]
pretty sure we had this same conversation a year or two ago :P
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@kevinmarks
“Though curation as a philosophy is a necessity, curation as a business is a bit of a Chimera.” @om http://om.co/2015/12/22/the-curation-conundrum/ #indieweb
(twitter.com/_/status/681043232977891328)
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aaronpk
pretty sure I've resigned to the fact that I'm going to lose my current reply context and repost presentation for v1 of my new site
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GWG
aaronpk: That gives you a chance to make things even better. (insert further encouragement here)
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aaronpk
hehe thanks
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aaronpk
yes I want to make sure I do that right when I do it, so I don't want to rush it
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GWG
I may have to compromise my 2016 goal for that reason
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GWG
I'm thinking I might solve my design problem by varying the design if there is no name set for the URL being responded to.
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Schnitz
ok I need quick help
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Schnitz
on IndieWebCamp.com/User:Belp.audio I tried to upload this image http://www.schamoni.de/typo3temp/pics/ed17046d11.jpg and it didn't work
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Schnitz
I cannot remove the file: link now, and it looks kinda bogus
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Schnitz
Actually just to add this an image to my profile page
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Schnitz
I uploaded it to the wiki but it kinda never showed up
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KartikPrabhu
!tell Schnitz: if you want to put an image in the page from your own URL you can use the <img> tag. If you want to upload the image to the wiki then click on the link on top of your page and it will take you to an upload page for the image file
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belp.audio
uploaded /File:ed17046d11.jpg "BELP Avator Logo"
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Schnitz
thanks Kartik
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Schnitz
The red link still exists
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Schnitz
and I cannot get rid of it
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Schnitz
When I click edit on my personal page
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Schnitz
I don't see the file link in the Wike Edit Box
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Schnitz
I've upload it now, ok that works, and I can reference it, now you see the image. But the 'first' link trying to reach this image on the web cannot be deleted
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Schnitz
and I upload, I just get a new file reference like I just did
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Schnitz
now its gone
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KartikPrabhu
i just edited it, check if that is what you want
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Schnitz
yes yes
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Schnitz
thanks
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Schnitz
KartikPrabhu: Did I miss something when I tried to do it? Thanks so much!
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KartikPrabhu
there was an extra [[File: external URL]] line that I removed
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Schnitz
right, why couldn't I see it when hitting EDIT?
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Schnitz
in any case, thanks so much, that is what I wanted, perfect. yes.
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KartikPrabhu
you could revert my change and see if it shows up now ;)
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Schnitz
KartikPrabhu: Nice idea, no thank you, enough for now, need to head of for something else now :-)
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KartikPrabhu
[kevinmarks]: context?
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petermolnar_
I like the wordpress tag input better: the input field is left alone, type things separated with commas and the token list appears below
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petermolnar_
oh, wow, hexchat forgot to scroll
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petermolnar_
this was a response to the things a "few" hours ago :)
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petermolnar_
Loqi, are you here? You should be in #indiechat as well.
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tantek.com
edited /token_input (+313) "add kylewm / Redwind example, see also"
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tantek
looks like we lost Loqi around 2:05am PST
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tantek.com
edited /read (+223) "/* Tantek */ continue with "read" experiments"
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petermolnar_
can we backfill logs or is that not required?
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tantek
aaronpk is likely on it already
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[shaners]
tantek: my poster frame problem is an S3 permissions problem. I’ll fix it today.
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Loqi
[shaners]: tantek left you a message 18 hours, 53 minutes ago: I was trying to test your video poster frame support and noticed that it doesn't seem to work on your squirrel video, e.g. poster http://assets.veganstraightedge.com/videos/2013/5/31/backyard-squirrel-buddy.png returns an XML error "AccessDenied". http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-12-26/line/1451175593090
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tantek.com
edited /text-first_design (+304) "Pre-web examples"
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[shaners]
And my poster frame support goes way further back then what you put on the wiki. That’s only when I added u-featured and fallback img. I’ll dig up the commit with first poster frame support. ...
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tantek
shaners, great. I posted the date that I had a citation for. such support could be measured by the later of: commit + first such video permalink.
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tantek
useful to have both citations of course
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aaronpk
oops. looks like Linode DDOS last night knocked Loqi out of the channel
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tantek
"We need an antidote for bad quotes
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tantek
In digital age, wording and attribution often wrong" - 2012-03-21 Mary Schmich
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veganstraightedge.com
edited /poster_frame (+1) "/* Shane Becker */"
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tantek
who was it that was recently chatting about wanting to log more reviews or library related things to their own site, regarding books, books read, etc.
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petermolnar.eu
edited /text-first_design (+336) "/* Pre-web examples */"
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tantek
!tell gRegorlove,tommorris,rhiaro,GWG you're either listed on https://indiewebcamp.com/read#IndieWeb_Examples or I remember you mentioning wanting to user your own site to track/publish what you've read. I've started experimenting more. Would be interested in discussing.
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Loqi
Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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GWG
tantek: What is on your mind?
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tantek
GWG, I decided spontaneously to start experimenting with "read" posts, and thus posted a couple: https://indiewebcamp.com/read#Tantek
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GWG
Where does the 'while lying sideways' come in?
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tantek
good question. I wrote what I was doing while reading
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tantek
in this case, it was relevant to the topic of the thing being read which was about the problems of sitting too much
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tantek
I'm approaching "read" posts from text-first design perspective
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tantek
before I try anything more fancy with presentation
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[shaners]
what is text-first?
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Loqi
It looks like we don't have a page for "text-first" yet. Would you like to create it? https://indiewebcamp.com/s/10AR
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[shaners]
what is text-first design?
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Loqi
Text-first design refers to the practice of designing information so that it is usable/actionable in its most basic plaintext form https://indiewebcamp.com/text-first_design
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loqi.me
created /text-first (+30) "prompted by [shaners] https://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-12-27/line/1451244353224 and dfn added by tantek"
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[shaners]
Beat me to it, T.
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tantek
shaners, you asked the question, of course I had to answer ;)
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tantek
(having used the term in-chat)
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[shaners]
:+1::skin-tone-2:
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GWG
Read is now a reserved term on my site. I didn't have it as one.
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tantek
what does that mean "reserved term on my site"?
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GWG
tantek: I reserve terms for future use.
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[aaronpk]1
oookay I think I just fixed the issue with links appearing weird from Slack. Testing: http://aaronpk.com/ aaronpk.com
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aaronpk
woohoo
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GWG
The following ones are reserved for future use: Weather, Exercise, Travel, Check-in, Tag, RSVP, Event, Food, Drink, Follow...
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GWG
It generally means I intend on using them at some point
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[shaners]
gwg: do you mean that you intend to use them in the URL or in your UI or both or neither?
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tantek
interesting GWG, have you added all those to your itches list on your User: page?
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tantek
says as he notes that he experimented with /read posts, and implemented /poster_frame support without either one being on his itches list first.
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GWG
shaners, both
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tantek
GWG, from aaronpk's experience, I'd suggest avoiding any use of post-types in the URL
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GWG
tantek: I should do that. But in my case, it is because I release the plugin to the WordPress repository and want to keep those words in case someone extends the plugin.
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aaronpk
indeed
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GWG
tantek: They aren't in my permalinks.
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GWG
They are archive pages
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GWG
That is what I reserve them for
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tantek
even in my own experience, I find myself using the "notes" type for more and more different kinds of posts
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GWG
tantek: For me to do that, my Post UI would grow exponentially, and for anyone other than me, I'd have to hope they understood what those properties meant.
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tantek
GWG, not necessarily. There's no need to grow a post UI exponentially. Just means it's a more challenging UI design problem.
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GWG
Right now, I have a URL property that applies to in-reply-to, like-of, etc based on the type of post explicitly set. If I did implied types, I'd have to switch to separate properties for those examples.
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tantek
GWG, that makes sense.
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tantek
in my hasty storage design I have separate properties for each URL for each of those
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tantek
more of a 1:1 mapping of what eventually goes into the generated h-entry markup in post permalinks
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GWG
tantek: I store a 1:1 mapping, but my UI is not 1:1.
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GWG
The combination of the explicit post type or kind and the Post UI elements forms the properties saved.
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GWG
So, url + reply kin sets the value of url to in-reply-to.
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GWG
I switched to that from storing the properties in a custom format so if the post UI changed, they would be stored appropriately. Also good due the micropub plugin
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tantek
that makes sense
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aaronpk
does the mf2 parser use the "poster" attribute of the <video> tag?
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aaronpk
i'm trying to figure out where to put the poster image for my video
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aaronpk
i want it to show up as the "photo" attribute
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aaronpk
as a fallback for consumers/readers that don't support the video
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[kevinmarks]
The trick is to use an img fallback for now, though we should support u- for a poster property too
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Loqi
[kevinmarks]: ben_thatmustbeme left you a message 1 day, 19 hours ago: supporting reacji from quote tweets is not likely to happen, I have to start removing syndication urls (truncated in the exact same way twitter does with uses the '...' single character) http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-12-25/line/1451092795051
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aaronpk
okay. that's good enough for now.
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[shaners]
aaronpk: kevinmarks: I’ve got a fallback img but I’d like the mf2 parsers to look at that attr too
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brandonrozek
Hello! I create a little userscript that creates a vCard based on the representative h-card of the page: https://gist.github.com/brandonrozek/e0153b2733e947fa9c87 post: https://brandonrozek.com/2015/12/creating-vcards-from-h-cards/
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aaronpk
brandonrozek: that's neat!
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aaronpk
you should post it to IndieNews! :-) http://news.indiewebcamp.com/en
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brandonrozek
Will do :)
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tantek
brandonrozek: welcome and while you're here, add yourself to indiewebcamp.com/irc-people !
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tantek
is braindumping some thoughts on /read posts
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aaronpk
is churning through rendering different kinds of posts now
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aaronpk
just finished video
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tantek
nice. do you have poster frame support for your video posts?
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tantek
ooh! another one
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aaronpk
and now my mf2 for the list view and permalink view both have both properties. that's not working properly on my current site.
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tantek
do you provide the poster frame as a fallback <img> inside the <video> as well? (I don't know the right answer)
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aaronpk
it's outside the video tag right now
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aaronpk
and has display:none
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aaronpk
acutally i should just change that to an <a> tag with no text
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aaronpk
because there's nowhere to show the poster frame when the video tag is showing
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tantek
there's no need, that's the point
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tantek.com
edited /read (+2232) "brainstorming, tantek thoughts, emoji possibilities for "read" posts"
(view diff)
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tantek.com
edited /📄 (-2) "more like an article"
(view diff)
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tantek.com
edited /article (+0) "use page emoji instead"
(view diff)
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tantek.com
edited /📖 (-3) "open book - read post"
(view diff)
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tantek.com
edited /posts (+20) "/* Kinds of Posts */ update article icon, add "read" posts"
(view diff)
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gRegorLove
What is read?
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Loqi
gRegorLove: tantek left you a message 1 hour, 29 minutes ago: you're either listed on https://indiewebcamp.com/read#IndieWeb_Examples or I remember you mentioning wanting to user your own site to track/publish what you've read. I've started experimenting more. Would be interested in discussing. http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-12-27/line/1451244187284
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Loqi
To read or reading is the act of viewing and interpreting posts or other documents https://indiewebcamp.com/read
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tantek
hmm - that should be expanded ...
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tantek.com
edited /read (+94) "📖 emojicon"
(view diff)
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tantek
"One could create a read post to indicate the target has been read. " - one could say there are at least a few of us doing that now
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tantek.com
edited /read (+29) "update dfn, not just one could, but, we are"
(view diff)
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tantek
what is a read post?
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Loqi
It looks like we don't have a page for "read post" yet. Would you like to create it? https://indiewebcamp.com/s/10AT
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tantek
A read post is /read
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loqi.me
created /read_post (+17) "prompted by tantek https://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-12-27/line/1451249808950 and dfn added by tantek"
(view diff)
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gRegorLove
tantek: Sure, I'm generally interested in /read. Haven't thought about or worked on it in a while though.
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tantek
what is a read post?
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Loqi
To read or reading is the act of viewing and interpreting posts or other documents; on the IndieWeb, a read post expresses that something has been read, like a book or section thereof https://indiewebcamp.com/read_post
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GWG
Someone is filing issues against Post Kinds
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GWG
Whoo!
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GWG
I love it when people have comments
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tantek
gRegorLove: I started experimenting with "read" posts as I started doing some reading during the holiday. And then I documented what I thought of as a result. https://indiewebcamp.com/read#Tantek
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tantek
gRegorLove: definitely interested in your feedback / thoughts as well! Have you been posting any more "read" posts recently?
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gRegorLove
I posted a few for that Harry Potter book back in January, that's all.
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tantek
did you finish it?
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tantek
did you post a special "read" post when you finished it?
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gRegorLove
Yes, but no different format than the other posts.
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gRegorLove
I would prefer "Started reading" and "Finished reading"
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tantek
both those make sense
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tantek
I'm using just "read" to indicate both started and finished in close proximity
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gRegorLove
I would probably work on a posting UI as my next step; I had to manually craft those, which is why I haven't done much more.
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tantek
right, mine are manual as well
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tantek
manual experimenting is a good way to figure out text-first design however
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tantek
can you add both of those examples to https://indiewebcamp.com/read#gRegor_Morrill ?
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gRegorLove
Sure. One is linked in the date already
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gRegorLove
I'll split out the links instead of linking the date
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brandonrozek
Hmm, I'm having trouble adding my post to indienews, it comes back with an error saying that I don't have an h-entry on the page.
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brandonrozek
Though Shrewdness recognizes my h-entry. I'm confused
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aaronpk
that's odd! what's the link?
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gregorlove.com
edited /read (+165) "/* gRegor Morrill */ More links, formatting"
(view diff)
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GWG
tantek: Have a look at this...
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GWG
Just found it.
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GWG
This is why I reserve words.
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aaronpk
brandonrozek: oh I think it's because the h-entry is a child of the h-card
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aaronpk
so it makes it look like the h-card is the main thing at that URL
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aaronpk
also *sigh* pin13.net can't read the page because it doesn't recognize the SSL cert root
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aaronpk
I really need to move that to the new server
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brandonrozek
Oh okay, I'll have to change that then
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[snarfed]
doesn't tantek also do that?
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[snarfed]
with h-feed at least
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aaronpk
on his home page yeah
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aaronpk
but this is a post permalink
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aaronpk
it makes sense on the home page because it makes it look like the main object at the home page is the h-card, which is accurate
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[snarfed]
at long as this is in some spec or documented algorithm
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tantek
aaronpk: do you post /read posts when you start, or in the middle of, or finish reading a book (or other things) ?
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tantek.com
edited /read (+20) "tommorris's book checkin prototype is brainstorming (and design screenshots are a good thing!)"
(view diff)
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aaronpk
tantek: nope, nothing like that right now
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tantek
anywhere on the itches horizon? or more in the don't care for now category?
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aaronpk
I don't often read books where I'd want to track them that way
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Schnitz
is back
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tantek
and there was much rejoicing ;)
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Loqi
does a happy dance!
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tantek
reviews 2015-01-01 commitments
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GWG
I'd want to track my reading of a book partially the way I'd want to share an article and partially to see what I had read(personal reasons)
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GWG
So, for me, completion is the thing I'd be tracking.
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tantek
same here
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tantek
(so far)
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aaronpk
time to design my new RSVP posts
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tantek
!tell bret hey bret did you get this working and are you still using it? http://bret.io/2014/12/20/goal-to-get-photo-ho/
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Loqi
Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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GWG
aaronpk: Do you have mockups?
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GWG
I'm trying to tackle that problem too, and I always like inspiration from others.
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aaronpk
i can post screenshots
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aaronpk
i'm using semantic-ui.com thanks to andigalpern's suggestion so I am using some of their UI elements since it makes it quicker for me
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GWG
Interesting
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Schnitz
is still working on his stylesheet... getting there...
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tantek
!tell ben_thatmustbeme are you still owningyourcheckins? Last one I see on https://ben.thatmustbe.me/checkin is from 2015-01-10 (per https://ben.thatmustbe.me/note/2014/12/18/1/ )
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Loqi
Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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Schnitz
Tantek: did you yourself write the CSS for the tumblr template from scratch or did you take it from somewhere else?
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tantek
I probably just modded it a little from somewhere else
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tantek
!tell snarfed how has your checkin frequency been for 2015 vs 2014? Wondering about how well https://snarfed.org/indie-checkin-flow has worked out. Do you have a "checkins" archive page?
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Loqi
Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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tantek
and finished reviewing latest evidence (or not) of last year's commitments still going strong (or not).
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tantek
Overall it looks pretty good. Just a few that seem to be down (or lost), and a few more with open questions (as asked above).
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snarfed
tantek: it's worked out well! no dedicated archive section for checkins though
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Loqi
snarfed: tantek left you a message 1 minute ago: how has your checkin frequency been for 2015 vs 2014? Wondering about how well https://snarfed.org/indie-checkin-flow has worked out. Do you have a "checkins" archive page? http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-12-27/line/1451255221653
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snarfed
(would be on or near https://snarfed.org/responses if i did)
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tantek
snarfed: any off-the-cuff estimate of # of checkins this year vs. last?
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snarfed
checkin frequency is still low
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snarfed
i just don't post often in general
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tantek
your hope was that more automation would increase the frequency
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tantek
curious if it was insufficient automation, or you stopped caring about checkins, or ... ?
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snarfed
lightly yes, somewhat off the cuff. wasn't a high priority
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tantek
but presumably your updated checkin flow still works?
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tantek
great!
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tantek
nice!
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tantek
that's pretty sweet - likes backfed from three different silos!
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Schnitz
is seriously considering writing a indie web tumblr template from scratch...
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Schnitz
I'm a bit overwhelmed by the heady usage of absolute size values as pixels in this CSS
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tantek
Schnitz, perhaps before that, start an "Itches" section on your User: page
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tantek
and get an h-card up on your user: page too - unless you're waiting for someone else to add it ;)
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KevinMarks_
Schnitz: did you see silo.pub will post to tumblr with micropub?
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@t
Reviewing #indieweb 2015-001 commitments, found all but 3! @_pius @davidpeach1 @haxor could you check yours: http://tantek.com/2015/361/t1/reviewing-indieweb-2015-commitments
(twitter.com/_/status/681244289435750400)
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belp.audio
edited /User:Belp.audio (+1559) "/* Happy to be here, what a great project. */"
(view diff)
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Schnitz
KevinMarks_: Nope, not yet, thanks for that
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Schnitz
tantek: h_card is coming next... had to clean up the CSS mess in the tumblr template first, or like stopped doing so now 'cos its kinda making rethink everything, so leaving this for now
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Schnitz
tantek: you know, you can make money with tumblr templates
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snarfed
dozens, maybe hundreds of dollars!
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tantek
Schnitz: yeah? perhaps you can add that to https://indiewebcamp.com/business-models !
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Schnitz
No seriously, I'm thinking on writing on and calling it 'Non Evil' or so and charging for it, because marketing reasons
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Schnitz
not because I want money
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Schnitz
psychologically people will take this more seriously when it costs something
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Schnitz
*those* people at least, not *us*
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snarfed
eh. maybe. i suspet it's not that simple any more. especially for consumer internet software, which people now generally expect to be free
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snarfed
e.g. the silos themselves
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Schnitz
snarfed: that true, but inside tumblr, this is like 'design'... like furniture? People 'buy themselves' an expensive chair, just to feel good. Similar with Templates
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snarfed
sure! some people may well buy your theme and feel good. i just doubt it will have much impact on making indieweb seem more "serious," though. and it will definitely mean way fewer people actually use your theme.
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Schnitz
snarfed: the theme will be avail as well on GITHUB and this Wiki
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Schnitz
I you know how to copy'n'paste markup, you get it for free
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snarfed
huh. so you'd only charge for it in tumblr's store, or something?
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Schnitz
Exactly
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snarfed
up to you!
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Schnitz
and make the controls all work so don't have to code
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Schnitz
like those fancy color settings etc. inside tumblr template editor
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snarfed
we've avoided charging for bridgy so far :P https://brid.gy/about#cost
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Schnitz
snarfed: thats a good thing
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snarfed
but there's no obvious store to sell it in, so there's that
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aaronpk
I only feel comfortable charging for something if I wouldn't mind paying for it myself
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tantek
hmm - doesn't seem like publify got favorite/favourite/like support
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Schnitz
aaronpk: wrong thinking, as we move along, you do not represent the target audience (eventually)
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aaronpk
no, it's personal opinion. I don't want to make something for a target market that I am not part of.
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Schnitz
aaronpk: perfectly valid.
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tantek
gets popcorn and flips on archive logs view.
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aaronpk
of course there's no problem with others making things for a market they aren't part of, that's just not something I am interested in doing
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snarfed
aaronpk: Schnitz: i can definitely commiserate with both sides. https://snarfed.org/2014-11-06_happy-1000th-bridgy#worked
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Schnitz
aaronpk: but thats something thats also a lesson learned for me, the masses are different. That needs to be respected and taken from there. At some point. Maybe not yet. For sure. You don't have to do this. But that may become important when Indie Web wants more outreach
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snarfed
aaronpk++ heh i was about to cite the same page
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Loqi
aaronpk has 42 karma
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[shaners]
The way I’m building Homesteading is for both me right now and others soon.
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[shaners]
Nerds who can create a Heroku account and set some settings next. Non-nerds soonish after that.
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tantek
shaners - BTW did you see the whole discussion (months ago?) about how "homesteading" as a term upset a bunch of people due to historical usage vs american indians etc.?
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@schock
@benwerd except for that whole settler colonialism and native genocide thing? #indieweb #dml2015
(twitter.com/_/status/609105871130378240)
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tantek
(see thread)
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KartikPrabhu
wow that is quite the important feedback!
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KartikPrabhu
was completely unaware of it
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[shaners]
I had not seen that.
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[shaners]
As I understand it, lower case h homesteading is the back to land subsistence living. Upper case H Homestead Act was the US government granting “free” land to settlers willing to go where was relatively undesirable by Europeans/Americans. (“Free” in that it was stolen from the indigenous peoples that lived here [the US] before white people.)
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[shaners]
The use of the word and the act of homesteading predates the Homestead Act.
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[shaners]
But maybe I need to start looking around for a different name. Before I really ship is easier than after.
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@veganstraightedge
I'm thinking about moving away from the name Homesteading for my #indieweb software because of its historical baggage. Any ideas for me?
(twitter.com/_/status/681254149271367680)
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KartikPrabhu
what is projects?
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Loqi
These are projects you can use to get your site on the IndieWeb and improve your IndieWeb support https://indiewebcamp.com/projects
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Schnitz
how about 'Goodness'
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Schnitz
(dunno how to reply back to veganstraightedge thru Loqi
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KartikPrabhu
Schnitz: veganstraightedge is [shaners]
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Schnitz
KartikPrabhu: thanks
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Schnitz
[shaners] call is Goodness
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[shaners]
(I would be veganstraigthedge in here too, but Freenode doesn’t allow usernames that long)
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Schnitz
[shaners]: Oh.. ok, well you asked, right? Its just a good term, positive and such. Thats it. Maybe sticky. Maybe. Thats it. Just off top of my head. Nothing special.
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[shaners]
Ok. I’m looking for something that conjures what HS did for me. Self sufficiency, agency, autonomy, ownership, your own little space in the internet. Goodness is not that. Thanks though.
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Schnitz
... alright I'm slowing packing my vinyls together, I have a DJ gig at 4 am, its nearly 1 am here now... need to get over to that location and start syncing with the energies there
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Schnitz
[shaners] no prob, anytime
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Schnitz
is away
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aaronpk
what color are reposts?
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[shaners]
aaronpk: huh?