#indiewebcamp 2016-01-17

2016-01-17 UTC
#
aaronpk
I haven't bothered to take a look at it yet
#
aaronpk
well I did briefly but didn't see anything obvious
j12t joined the channel
#
KartikPrabhu1
aaronpk: I like how your "load more" button also changes the URL state. Nicely done
#
aaronpk
it's pretty great seeing all my actual content in the new site!
#
aaronpk
okay! I just finished notes, videos, photos and replies!
#
aaronpk
and reposts!
#
aaronpk
10 types down, 16 to go
#
Loqi
!calc 10 types down, 16 to go
#
matrrix
So presumably ownyourgram works by sending webmentions to your site?
#
KartikPrabhu
wow! you had 26 different post-types!
#
aaronpk
matrrix: no, it sends micropub requests
#
aaronpk
which includes the photo and video as a file upload
#
matrrix
what is micropub?
#
matrrix
Loqi pls :(
#
Loqi
it'll be ok
#
Loqi
Micropub is an open API standard that is used to create posts on one's own domain using third-party clients https://indiewebcamp.com/Micropub
#
matrrix
ah thx :)
#
matrrix
Interesting
#
aaronpk
KartikPrabhu: kinda, I wouldn't call all of these post types anymore. for example "reply" was its own type
#
matrrix
so for a static site generator you'd need a small stub server to take micropub requests and generate the static source or something
#
aaronpk
but if a reply contained a photo, then it fell under the photo post type. and this is the weirdness of explicit post types :)
#
aaronpk
matrrix: yep exactly! a few people have done that
#
KartikPrabhu
yes... i think not having explicit post-types is a very good idea. keep it simple
#
matrrix
aaronpk: interesting, thanks :)
j12t and snarfed joined the channel
#
gRegorLove
Was there a Bridgy change recently to remove the "liked this" as an explicit p-name?
#
kylewm
gRegorLove: no, not intentionally
#
kylewm
got a link?
#
gRegorLove
I should fix my implementation to not rely on it for likes, anyway, but it's giving me that "tag.facebook.com..." stuff currently.
#
Loqi
agreed.
#
gRegorLove
Loqi: Update my impelementation
#
Loqi
who, me?
#
kylewm
snarfed: likely
#
gRegorLove
And my spelling
#
snarfed
interesting, i wonder if that's some mf2 algorithm. there's no e-content or p-name, so it takes the first text, which is the uid...?
#
snarfed
anyway, yeah, sorry gRegorLove. we may have to recommend only using explicit e-content from bridgy, and generating your own otherwise
#
gRegorLove
Think it's the plain text of the h-entry
#
snarfed
(inside p-uid)
#
gRegorLove
s'ok. Just a prompt to put my article 'likes' in a list as on my notes.
#
gRegorLove
snarfed: Not just the p-uid
#
snarfed
gRegorLove: that's the only place i see it
#
gRegorLove
I meant, the parsed content isn't just what's in the p-uid
#
snarfed
well, .h-entry > .p-uid, so i guess we're both right :P
#
snarfed
oh, sure, also the h-card
#
gRegorLove
The name value I got from that was "tag:facebook.com,2013:10101970668845904_liked_by_10152552936582019\n \n \n \n \n Chris Magnusson\n \n\n https:\/\/www.facebook.com\/27301982\/posts\/10101970668845904#liked-by-10152552936582019"
#
gRegorLove
Already fixed on my end. :)
#
snarfed
sorry for the breakage!
lukebrooker joined the channel
#
gRegorLove
Experimenting with limiting the number of 'likers' shown on articles with a link to expand it, similar to Facebook: http://gregorlove.com/2016/01/fifteen-things-i-did-in-2015/#responses
#
gRegorLove
(requires js)
#
aaronpk
very nice
#
aaronpk
next you should tailor the order of the list based on who's reading it ;)
#
snarfed
hah, merrily hand waving through "who's reading it" :P
#
gRegorLove
With a nag "It looks like you haven't liked this yet"
#
aaronpk
gRegorLove++
#
Loqi
gRegorLove has 48 karma
#
aaronpk
snarfed: nah! indieauth login of course!
#
snarfed
oh sure, obviously. i just expect uptake would be...um...low :P
#
aaronpk
maybe a better job for a /reader
j12t joined the channel
#
KartikPrabhu
gRegorLove: do you do a JS data-request to fetch the others?
#
KartikPrabhu
gRegorLove: consider using CSS for that show/hide
#
aaronpk
awesome
#
KartikPrabhu
no actual need for flexbox, see it in action here: https://kartikprabhu.com/papers
#
aaronpk
bookmarkd
#
KartikPrabhu
if you are not requesting new data using JS, then using JS for show/hide is overkill.
#
KartikPrabhu
is thinking of ways to use that for marginalia instead of JS based toggle ;)
#
aaronpk
is learning all sorts of new CSS tricks lately
#
aaronpk
which makes sense since my CSS knowledge was for the most part last updated in 2008
#
aaronpk
darn, I just realized when I imported all my Strava rides, I didn't save the permalink as a syndication URL
#
KartikPrabhu
hopefully you have the old copies
#
aaronpk
well I have all the data in my site, and it's all still on Strava, but they aren't linked
#
aaronpk
and I didn't want to write a Strava import for this process, so i'm moving the data from my old site to my new site
#
aaronpk
I think I don't care enough about Strava to fix this right now
wolftune, kbs, j12t and tantek joined the channel
#
@CaptainKurtis
@fowlslegs @Arcadian_O @dmytri @ioerror I was using Silo in #indiewebcamp sense. http://indiewebcamp.com/silo Signal can whitelist, but doesn't.
(twitter.com/_/status/688563425757282307)
j12t joined the channel
#
kylewm
snarfed: we definitely don't want name = "liked this" anymore? I think it'd probably be good to set the name to "" if not.
lukebrooker, j12t, tantek, jedahan and wolftune joined the channel
#
@callovarne
RT @aaronpk Happy to announce the W3C Social Web Working Group published the First Public Working Draft of the Webmention spec! https://www.w3.org/TR/webmention/
(twitter.com/_/status/688595606357450752)
wolftune joined the channel
#
tantek
hmm, seems like per that @CaptainKurtis tweet we should update https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Information_silo per indiewebcamp.com/silo
#
tantek
and linked from there, what bizzaro parallel universe did this document come from?!? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metadata_publishing
#
tantek
trying manual Bridgy Publish to Flickr
#
tantek
manual Bridgy Publish POSSE to Flickr result: https://www.flickr.com/photos/tantek/23803704613/
#
tantek
initial anaysis, hashtags from photo title did not automatically make it to Flickr tags
jedahan_ and lukebrooker joined the channel
#
tantek.com
edited /Flickr (+438) "/* Bridgy Publish POSSE */ update! lots of support added, noted a few limitations with feature request issues"
(view diff)
#
tantek.com
edited /Flickr (+0) "/* POSSE to Flickr */ Bridgy Publish and backfeed can be used for how to, note backfeed also supported since 2015-09-17"
(view diff)
#
tantek.com
edited /Flickr (+400) "/* IndieWeb Examples */ POSSED"
(view diff)
KartikPrabhu joined the channel
#
petermolnar.eu
edited /User:Ozten.com (+33) "adding user to Category:WordPress_Examples based on /WordPress/Examples"
(view diff)
#
petermolnar.eu
edited /User:Notizblog.org (+33) "adding user to Category:WordPress_Examples based on /WordPress/Examples"
(view diff)
#
petermolnar.eu
edited /User:Snarfed.org (+33) "adding user to Category:WordPress_Examples based on /WordPress/Examples"
(view diff)
#
petermolnar.eu
edited /User:ShaneHudson.net (+33) "adding user to Category:WordPress_Examples based on /WordPress/Examples"
(view diff)
#
petermolnar.eu
edited /User:Acegiak.net (+136) "adding user to Category:WordPress_Examples based on /WordPress/Examples"
(view diff)
#
petermolnar.eu
edited /User:David.shanske.com (+34) "adding user to Category:WordPress_Examples based on /WordPress/Examples"
(view diff)
#
petermolnar.eu
edited /User:Erinjorichey.com (+33) "adding user to Category:WordPress_Examples based on /WordPress/Examples"
(view diff)
#
petermolnar.eu
edited /User:Christopheducamp.com (+33) "adding user to Category:WordPress_Examples based on /WordPress/Examples"
(view diff)
#
petermolnar.eu
edited /User:Crystalbeasley (+33) "adding user to Category:WordPress_Examples based on /WordPress/Examples"
(view diff)
#
tantek.com
edited /Falcon (+606) "/* auto POSSE photos to Flickr */ why posse to flickr, improved details on how, note manual POSSE attempt for reference"
(view diff)
#
petermolnar.eu
edited /WordPress/Development (-439) "removing obsolete data"
(view diff)
#
petermolnar.eu
edited /WordPress/Examples (-493) "removing obsolete data"
(view diff)
#
petermolnar.eu
edited /WordPress/Plugins (+211) "/* Webmention Support */"
(view diff)
#
tantek
petermolnar: why the use of Category:WordPress_Examples ? Everywhere else on the wiki we merely keep lists of Examples inline
#
petermolnar
the inline examples needs constant gardening; I'm yet to remove any, because I can't make this decision, but the wiki could get much cleaner, if the example descriptions were on the user pages only and it'd be referenced by the category
#
petermolnar
at least this is how I'd like to do my relations to the indie blocks
#
tantek
that is even more vulnerable to bitrot
#
tantek
because the individual user pages are even less frequently updated
#
tantek
so depending on them more is a flawed approach
#
petermolnar
I seriously disagree here
#
petermolnar
spreading semi-copy paste all over the wiki of my implementation is garbage
#
tantek
it's not a matter of opinion, it is trivial to prove by looking t the edit histories of user: pages vs. topic pages
#
petermolnar
are you comparing the entry of the user example edits on the topic page to the user page or the generic edits on a topic?
#
tantek
s/t the/at the/
#
Loqi
tantek meant to say: it's not a matter of opinion, it is trivial to prove by looking at the edit histories of user: pages vs. topic pages
#
petermolnar
because the latter is pretty unfair
#
petermolnar
yes, topic edits are frequent
#
tantek
doesn't matter fair or not the incredibly low frequency of user page edits, *especially* by people other than the user, proves the point
#
petermolnar
inline examples are regularly forgotten
#
petermolnar
inline example of MY implementation vs my page
#
petermolnar
I'm not surprised no one else is editing it
#
tantek
where was the inline example of your implementation?
#
tantek
unfortunately the wordpress documentation on the wiki is in general out of date
#
tantek
I ran into that problem myself
#
tantek
with the plugins, what plugins to install etc.
#
tantek
what the page said vs. what people said in IRC was totally different
#
tantek
the problem you are seeing is one with the /WordPress/** pages
#
tantek
not topics in general
#
tantek
yes exactly
#
tantek
that page was horribly out of date
#
tantek
and I had to fix it - as a non-wordpress user
#
petermolnar
? i honestly thought that is the most up to date one
#
tantek
this is my point, the flaw you are finding is not about topics vs user pages
#
tantek
it is now
#
tantek
only because I edited it early this year
#
petermolnar
tantek what I change is that I removed my explicit details from a few topic pages; most were out of date already, and instead, put a reference there; I done this only for myself
#
tantek
that's totally fine
#
petermolnar
but is this is discouraged, we need a howto for the wiki
#
tantek
it was the massmodification of other pages with the category: thing that I was questionining
#
tantek
we do have a how to for the wiki
#
tantek
what is wikify?
#
Loqi
wikifying is the practice of putting stuff on the wiki, or something in particular on the wiki https://indiewebcamp.com/wikify
#
petermolnar
could this be put on the front page, please? I've been attending to this channel for a while, and never thought of searching for 'wikify'
#
tantek
putting it on the front page won't help - that assumes everyone reads everything on the front page
#
tantek
which, when it gets more crowded, people read even less of what is already there
#
tantek
we did a lot of work to simplify the front page, deliberately
#
tantek
also - nearly every week someone here chats to a new person about wikifying their itches etc.
#
petermolnar.eu
edited /WordPress (+6) "/* Getting started */"
(view diff)
nitot, raretrack, John_Duh and catsup joined the channel
#
petermolnar.eu
edited /WordPress/Plugins (+65) "/* POSSE Plugins */"
(view diff)
j12t, loic_m, Lancey, Pierre-O, John_Duh_, catsup, elima, yakker, jgmac1106, minsky and tantek joined the channel
#
tantek
Hmm - I'm suspicious of whether FB really keeps photos "forever" or not.
John_Duh and snarfed joined the channel
#
snarfed
tantek: why?
#
tantek
I'm looking at old (2 yrs +) public photo albums from a public page and they appeared to not load
#
tantek
looks like they loaded like a *minute* later
#
snarfed
2y isn't very old, i'm guessing it's something else
#
kylewm.com
edited /Flickr (+127) "/* Bridgy Publish POSSE */ note posse tags already supported"
(view diff)
#
tantek
ooh! ok, that might enough for me to auto-markup hashtags in my notes with p-category
#
tantek
thanks kylewm
wolftune joined the channel
#
tantek
I'm totally about to edit a two year old note post to put the photo at the top, thus making it a photo post
#
tantek
fixing the link to the img (which broke since I posted it 2 years ago - thanks fb cdn), and linking to the page the photo is in
#
tantek
in case you have any insight into why that may have happened
#
snarfed
nope, only that bugs happen, and they usually don't mean anything deeper
#
snarfed
(sometimes! but not usually.)
j12t, ttepasse and benborges joined the channel
#
@georgkaser
Interessanter Beitrag übers #Indieweb von Matthias Pfefferle im Deutschlandradio http://breitband.deutschlandradiokultur.de/dezentralisiert-euch/
(twitter.com/_/status/688771932188217344)
#
tantek
FYI this is the post I edited to move the photo to the top (thus making it a "photo") post http://tantek.com/2014/017/t1/first-novemberprojectsf-hillsforbreakfast
#
tantek.com
edited /Falcon (+141) "/* auto POSSE photos to Flickr */ note I can make progress by implementing some #-hashtag detection in CASSIS auto_link"
(view diff)
#
tantek.com
edited /Flickr (-6) "/* Bridgy Publish POSSE */ tags supported, narrow what is lacking"
(view diff)
#
tantek
kylewm++ for adding p-category detection/tagging support to Bridgy Publish to Flickr!
#
Loqi
kylewm has 285 karma
#
tantek.com
edited /Falcon (+177) "/* auto POSSE photos to Flickr */ apparently my next Flickr POSSE will be a video"
(view diff)
j12t joined the channel
#
tantek.com
edited /2015/ (+398) "stub from last year's"
(view diff)
#
aaronpk
woohoo! done with car2go/bike/runs import script now!
John_Duh joined the channel
#
kylewm
does anyone know if https://github.com/indieweb/php-mf2-shim still works with twitter?
#
kylewm
aaronpk++ nice! gotta be getting close now?
#
Loqi
aaronpk has 55 karma
#
GWG
I use it, but not sure regardless
#
aaronpk
getting close! remaining post types: eat/drink, flight/train, pushups, sleep, weight, presentations and collections
#
tantek.com
edited /2015-review (+1541) "stub a few more sections with some info to start"
(view diff)
#
kylewm
GWG: to be clear, you use php-mf2-shim but don't know whether it works?
#
GWG
Correct.
#
kylewm
hehe ok
#
tantek
see this is why I'm going to restore that image on testing
#
tantek.com
edited /selfdogfood (+63) "Since yes, we tend to do this a lot in the indieweb, keeping the meme image. Undo revision 24531 by [[Special:Contributions/Veganstraightedge.com|Veganstraightedge.com]] ([[User talk:Veganstraightedge.com|talk]])"
(view diff)
#
tantek.com
edited /selfdogfood (+33) "/* testing your code in production */ float"
(view diff)
#
tantek.com
edited /Template:IndieWebCamp (+80) "fix link, 2016 IndieWeb Summit is being planned, and more"
(view diff)
#
aaronpk
[✓] weight
#
GWG
aaronpk++
#
Loqi
aaronpk has 56 karma
#
aaronpk
next up i'm turning "pushups" into a generic "workout" post
#
aaronpk
also making extensive use of h-measure for these things
#
@zeldman
Site deaths are when sites go offline, taking content and permalinks with them, and breaking the web accordingly. http://indiewebcamp.com/site-deaths
(twitter.com/_/status/688791904356581376)
[shaners] joined the channel
#
[shaners]
What is h-measure?
#
Loqi
It looks like we don't have a page for "h-measure" yet. Would you like to create it? https://indiewebcamp.com/s/10BX
#
@ErikBernskiold
RT @zeldman Site deaths are when sites go offline, taking content and permalinks with them, and breaking the web accordingly. http://indiewebcamp.com/site-deaths
(twitter.com/_/status/688793440918831104)
#
tantek
expect a bunch more traffic from that Zeldman tweet
#
tantek
shaners, there is no h-measure - nothing has been properly developed yet
#
tantek
nor hmeasure for that matter even historically
#
@steve_e
RT @zeldman Site deaths are when sites go offline, taking content and permalinks with them, and breaking the web accordingly. http://indiewebcamp.com/site-deaths
(twitter.com/_/status/688793893584896000)
#
@guideagoldfish
RT @zeldman Site deaths are when sites go offline, taking content and permalinks with them, and breaking the web accordingly. http://indiewebcamp.com/site-deaths
(twitter.com/_/status/688794096371023872)
#
@optimiced
RT @zeldman Site deaths are when sites go offline, taking content and permalinks with them, and breaking the web accordingly. http://indiewebcamp.com/site-deaths
(twitter.com/_/status/688794131305463811)
#
@adactio
RT @zeldman Site deaths are when sites go offline, taking content and permalinks with them, and breaking the web accordingly. http://indiewebcamp.com/site-deaths
(twitter.com/_/status/688794687587627008)
#
tantek
^^^ importance of a tweetable definition!
#
tantek
what is site-deaths?
#
aaronpk
well look forward to some examples of h-measure in the wild :)
#
Loqi
Site deaths are when sites go offline, taking their content and permalinks with them, and breaking the web accordingly https://indiewebcamp.com/site-deaths
#
aaronpk
tantek: ha that makes me want to add a tweet button to pages that have a short enough dfn
#
tantek
aaronpk: OMS
#
tantek
and by that you mean a *post* /web-action that falls back to a Tweet button, right? ;)
#
aaronpk
naturally
#
tantek
what is wikify?
#
Loqi
wikifying is the practice of putting stuff on the wiki, or something in particular on the wiki https://indiewebcamp.com/wikify
#
aaronpk
i forgot that twitter also calls it "web intent" https://dev.twitter.com/web/tweet-button/web-intent
#
tantek
legacy naming due to the Google attempt at doing so
#
tantek
they're tweet actions :P
#
tantek
Twitter also conflates the pop-up "dialog" as the "web intent" as well
#
@aTamsSokari
RT @zeldman Site deaths are when sites go offline, taking content and permalinks with them, and breaking the web accordingly. http://indiewebcamp.com/site-deaths
(twitter.com/_/status/688796136300228608)
#
aaronpk
he edited the dfn and removed "their" in order to make it fit on twitter
#
aaronpk
it looks like the <indie-action> tag doesn't have a way to autofill text http://indiewebcamp.com/webactions
#
tantek
what do you mean by autofill the text?
#
aaronpk
twitter's button lets the site suggest tweet text
#
tantek
hey petermolnar did you mean to delete my previous edits?
#
tantek
I'm sensing an edit collision
#
tantek
check your diff above ^^^
#
petermolnar
fixing it
#
tantek
np, it happens. thanks! :)
#
Loqi
uhoh
#
voxpelli
aaronpk: would that be part of the button rather than part of the article metadata?
#
aaronpk
i suppose your site could look for p-summary
#
voxpelli
aaronpk: thinking similar data is often needed for Micropub syndication, right?
#
voxpelli
Personally I try to avoid prefix led tweet texts to some degree as I find it better to encourage personal tweets
#
petermolnar
why is there not edit lock on the wiki?
#
voxpelli
Maybe include title, but not much else
#
tantek
petermolnar: because optimism!
#
@Jekrb
RT @zeldman Site deaths are when sites go offline, taking content and permalinks with them, and breaking the web accordingly. http://indiewebcamp.com/site-deaths
(twitter.com/_/status/688798150732062721)
#
tantek
^^^ Loqi you really ought to respond to those on Twitter ;)
#
Loqi
grins profusely
#
petermolnar
oh, that would generate a massive storm :)
j12t joined the channel
#
petermolnar
what is blockchain?
#
tantek
not really, not many folks ask such short what is questions of jargon
#
Loqi
blockchain is a weapon used in the middle ages composed of a block shaped striking head attached to a handle by a flexible rope, strap, or chain https://indiewebcamp.com/blockchain
#
@seesee
RT @zeldman Site deaths are when sites go offline, taking content and permalinks with them, and breaking the web accordingly. http://indiewebcamp.com/site-deaths
(twitter.com/_/status/688799513411203072)
#
@sergioacosta
RT @zeldman Site deaths are when sites go offline, taking content and permalinks with them, and breaking the web accordingly. http://indiewebcamp.com/site-deaths
(twitter.com/_/status/688799613676056577)
#
voxpelli
aaronpk: Sharing quotes like that is a good use case for indie-action prefilled messages, didn't think about that
#
tantek.com
edited /wikifying (+1546) "Define jargon, Tweetable definitions"
(view diff)
#
tantek
what is jargon?
#
Loqi
It looks like we don't have a page for "jargon" yet. Would you like to create it? https://indiewebcamp.com/s/10BY
#
aaronpk
in order to do that with Loqi, he would have to search using the streaming API for "what is", and then pare down the results for from there
#
tantek
aaronpk: or vice versa, just pare down the existing streaming API search for "what is "
#
tantek
instead of having Loqi answer all what is questions, only what is questions about what he already searches for!
#
tantek
jargon is a specific unobvious concept, or re-use of a word to mean something other than its common meaning.
#
aaronpk
that's the problem
#
loqi.me
created /jargon (+135) "prompted by tantek https://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2016-01-17/line/1453057643777 and dfn added by tantek"
(view diff)
#
tantek
what is the problem?
#
Loqi
The problem is that when you ask what is the problem, you need to be more specific https://indiewebcamp.com/problem
#
aaronpk
there's too many wiki pages for Loqi to search for "what is webmention" "what is jargon" etc
#
tantek
that's what I'm saying, only support it for the current set of terms that Loqi listens for, e.g. webmention, micropub, indieweb, indiewebcamp etc.
#
aaronpk
ah I see
#
aaronpk
thought you meant what Loqi listens for on IRC
#
tantek
I was thinking MVH - minimum viable helpfulness (or humor ;) )
#
tantek
so if someone tweets what is term-that-Loqi-searches-Twitter-for
#
@manualfordesign
RT @zeldman Site deaths are when sites go offline, taking content and permalinks with them, and breaking the web accordingly. http://indiewebcamp.com/site-deaths
(twitter.com/_/status/688800685408817152)
#
tantek
then Loqi answers
#
aaronpk
well a quick twitter search for those turns up about one tweet each, ever
#
tantek.com
edited /wikifying (+0) "/* Tweetable definitions */ typo link"
(view diff)
#
tantek.com
edited /site-deaths (-6) "dfn -their, per Zeldman improvement"
(view diff)
#
aaronpk
[✓] pushups
#
GWG
Trying to figure out Venue properties. Looking at the venue page in the wiki
#
tantek.com
edited /why (+0) "6th. yes we should do this!"
(view diff)
#
tantek.com
edited /Planning (+106) "/* Summit */ Topics: update [[why]] definition!"
(view diff)
#
@dduncil
RT @zeldman Site deaths are when sites go offline, taking content and permalinks with them, and breaking the web accordingly. http://indiewebcamp.com/site-deaths
(twitter.com/_/status/688805887780126721)
#
tantek
wonder if there will be a noticeable traffic spike today or not from that
singpolyma joined the channel
#
GWG
What is the tendency? Revisiting the same venues, or regularly creating more?
#
Loqi
It looks like we don't have a page for "tendency" yet. Would you like to create it? https://indiewebcamp.com/s/10BZ
#
kylewm
happy to report php-mf2-shim works and is amazing
#
GWG
kylewm: Even the Facebook one?
#
tantek
what is php-mf2-shim?
#
Loqi
It looks like we don't have a page for "php-mf2-shim" yet. Would you like to create it? https://indiewebcamp.com/s/10B_
#
tantek
GWG, I would guess that 90%+ of my checkins are to venues I've been to before.
#
tantek
obviously that % starts small and likely grows until it approaches some asymptote
#
GWG
For me, I must often use location properties when visiting interesting places, over checking in to my local hangout.
#
kylewm
GWG: I didn't test Facebook
#
GWG
kylewm: It is more of a permissions issue. Twitter doesn't require an application ID to read a page.
#
kylewm
no I don't think Facebook works
#
kylewm
"Call to a member function getAttribute() on null"
#
GWG
kylewm: I wonder what else we can shimmy.
#
kylewm
I've basically given up on doing anything with facebook in general unless I have to
#
GWG
kylewm: I only asked because those are the two shims in there
#
tantek
what do people think of IG's hashtags that can include any emoji character?
#
tantek
I'm looking at adding hashtag auto-p-category markup to CASSIS auto_link and leaning towards only Twitter-style hashtags
#
tantek
that is, not supporting detection of hashtag emojis
#
tantek
also is there any length limit to hashtags?
#
singpolyma
how do you decide whih printable characters are not allowed?
#
singpolyma
s/whih/which
#
Loqi
singpolyma meant to say: how do you decide which printable characters are not allowed?
#
Zegnat
The only problem I see with emojis in hashtags is the same as with punctuation in hashtags: things might be included as part of the tag that the writer did not intend to be included.
#
tantek
singpolyma: thinking more which *are* allowed
#
tantek
Zegnat, yes that's a good reason
#
singpolyma
Do people use emoji as punctutation often? They're more like pictograms in use I see </anecdotal>
#
tantek
thinking of limiting length to 139 chars :P
#
Zegnat
I personally end a lot of texts with an emoji to show the mood (and thus context) of the thought
#
tantek
singpolyma there are emoji punctuation like ❗️❓”¼ï¸â‰ï¸â”❕
#
tantek
what is mood?
#
Loqi
mood is sometimes expressed explicitly in or about a post, by the post author https://indiewebcamp.com/mood
#
tantek
Zegnat could you add an example/link or two of yours doing that to ^^^
#
Zegnat
Not presently, as my Facebook is pretty locked down on the privacy settings. But I bet I could find some on the public web. I will have a look around
#
aaronpk
[✓] food
#
aaronpk
[✓] drink
#
kylewm
what is G5?
#
Loqi
It looks like we don't have a page for "G5" yet. Would you like to create it? https://indiewebcamp.com/s/10Ba
#
kylewm
asking because indieweb/php-mf2 is "Copyright (c) 2013 G5"
#
tantek
also: https://support.twitter.com/articles/20170082?lang=en "Your Promoted Trend name length cannot exceed ~20 characters. Since not every character is the same width, your actual character limit will vary."
#
tantek
is that Barnaby's thingZ?
#
tantek
s/thingZ/thing
#
Loqi
tantek meant to say: is that Barnaby's thing?
#
loqi.me
created /G5 (+54) "prompted by kylewm https://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2016-01-17/line/1453060609337 and dfn added by kylewm"
(view diff)
#
kylewm
which does not appear to be a barnaby thing
#
tantek
ok that's odd
#
tantek
nor is there anything "mf2" in their repos
#
kylewm
looks like it was copy/pasted from the Ruby parser
#
tantek
kylewm: possible name collision?
#
kylewm
which was under G5 until shaners moved it
#
tantek
but it's php?
#
tantek
shaners, can you help with this?
wolftune and j12t joined the channel
#
tantek.com
edited /hashtags (+728) "Limitations - summary"
(view diff)
#
tantek.com
edited /hashtags (-3) "/* Limitations */ -*"
(view diff)
#
kylewm
/#\w{1,239/ is a little shorter
#
Zegnat
Any reason, if you want to go with Twitter’s syntax, for not just pulling in Twitter’s regex?
#
tantek
where is it?
#
tantek.com
edited /hashtags (+292) "/* Brainstorming */ regex(es)"
(view diff)
#
tantek
oh dear: twttr.txt.regexen.validGTLD
#
tantek.com
edited /hashtags (+112) "/* Regex */ Twitter's regex"
(view diff)
#
Zegnat
Well, the regexes might not be perfect, but whenever you want to know what Twitter allows in hashtags or usernames it is a great resource
#
tantek
Twitter's is more international friendly
#
Zegnat
Definitely. Yours would not even allow diaereses.
#
tantek
yeah, might be worth a separate function
Pierre-O joined the channel
#
tantek.com
edited /hashtags (+105) "/* Brainstorming */ put Twitter's regex link at top, note non-international (english-only) limitation of the short regexes"
(view diff)
#
tantek.com
edited /Falcon (+280) "/* linked hashtags */ next steps"
(view diff)
#
tantek
I'm punting on implementing English-only hashtags. I don't think that would set a very good example. Especially when twitter already has open source to be more international friendly.
#
tantek
And that's a project that's big enough for another day. No quick hack hashtag auto-markup today.
#
GWG
Makes me think.
#
GWG
tantek: I may seek your advice on Friday/Saturday in person. You have a way of putting things into simple and clear perspective.
#
tantek
depends on the subject. :)
#
GWG
tantek: The number of subjects I feel I need put in simple and clear perspective makes things seem less simple.
#
GWG
I can't even boil down the question..."What do we want WordPress to be able to do to be Indieweb friendly?"
lukebrooker joined the channel
#
tantek
GWG, there are many sides to that question
#
tantek
presumably you mean WordPress the software
#
GWG
tantek: I'm aware.
#
GWG
Correct. I'm not prepared to tackle Wordpress.com right now
#
GWG
I'm thinking the open source project
#
tantek
which in that case, here is a rephrasing: How can we make it easier for those who run WordPress on their sites to have more indieweb support?
#
tantek
and the answer should include - improve the Getting Started with WordPress page accordingly
#
tantek
like make getting rel=me setup TRIVIAL
#
tantek
because it's still not trivial, and without that, someone with WordPress can't even participate in the community with editing the wiki etc.
#
www.svenknebel.de
created /User:Www.svenknebel.de (+34) "Created page with "[http://www.svenknebel.de sknebel]""
(view diff)
#
tantek
witness the experience we had with David Ascher recently
#
GWG
tantek: I wish I had witnessed it.
#
GWG
I need a witness of my own
#
tantek
GWG, you were in the channel I think
#
tantek
it's all logged - I'm looking for the start of it
#
GWG
tantek: Yes, a bit later on. I read the log
#
GWG
I want to figure out what core Indieweb features people agree on and try to unify them into a single plugin.
#
GWG
Probably rel me is part of that.
#
GWG
However, I know there are good reasons for some of the other plugins to stay separate.
#
tantek
GWG, "core IndieWeb features people agree on" is part of the purpose of IndieMark
#
tantek
so rather than trying to "figure out what core Indieweb features people agree on", just go with what's already been figured out for IndieMark
#
www.svenknebel.de
edited /IRC_People (+55) "/*Nicknames: */ added sknebel"
(view diff)
#
tantek
GWG, here is where davidascher joined: https://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2016-01-04#t1451950147094 - I'd say it's useful to re-read starting from there
#
tantek
welcome sknebel !
#
sknebel
thanks!
#
GWG
I just am trying to reassess. I got feedback that putting rel=me and rel=syndication together only made sense to me.
#
tantek
well it only makes sense from a plumbing-centric (e.g. put rels together) perspective
#
tantek
from a user-centric / feature perspective, it is unclear why the two are related at all
#
GWG
They both refer to a relationship to another site.
#
GWG
But, I think I just got one idea I want to try.
#
GWG
If I remove things from Indiemark already built into WordPress as an exercise, what is left?
#
tantek
GWG " refer to a relationship to another site." is plumbing, not the user feature effect
#
tantek
GWG, start with the difficulties and questions encountered here: https://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2016-01-04#t1451951760908
#
tantek
and try to solve the confusion around the indieweb plugin indicated in that dialog
#
tantek
nevermind the "already built into WordPress" things for now, start with the user-feedback you already got from davidascher
#
tantek
(and indirectly from snarfed who thought the WordPress IndieWeb plugin was deprecated!)
#
GWG
Both are right
#
GWG
The plugin doesn't do much on its own. Which probably should be fixed.
j12t joined the channel
#
tantek
Let's make it a goal for the next davidascher WordPress user to come along to have a more clear (not as confusing an) experience.
#
GWG
Maybe that is where the rel=me code I wrote should be moved.
#
tantek
Anything that someone is asked to install should immediately provide *some* value.
#
GWG
The value right now for that plugin is only installing other plugins.
#
tantek
that's plumbing only - that's not actually immediate user/feature value
#
GWG
Achieving Indiemark Level 1 seems like a useful goal on top of installing other plugins.
#
tantek
If the IndieWeb plugin got you to IndieMark Level 1 (or at least walked you through testing your site with indiewebify.me) that would be quite useful!
#
GWG
tantek: At the last IWC in PDX, I recall two people were trying to make tutorials. I hoped they would appear, and we could integrate with them in the plugin. But that may be something to revisit. I'd love to find some volunteers just to help on that end. Not everyone is going to code, but documentation is nice.
#
tantek
GWG, I don't really believe in separate tutorials
#
tantek
the instructions / steps need to be so simple
#
GWG
tantek: Inside the plugin?
#
tantek
that you can just list a few things on the wiki
#
tantek
there should be no need for a tutorial anywhere - nobody has time to read through a lenthy tutorial
#
tantek
and if something needs lengthy instructions, it's probably poorly designed
#
GWG
And I agree that I need to find the right simplification.
#
tantek
GWG, btw, and other IWC NYC attendees - looks like we will be getting 1-3 inches of SNOW each day of IWC NYC!
#
GWG
Oh joy
#
GWG
Lucky I'm taking public transportation
#
GWG
But guess I'd better leave early.
#
tantek
since when do weather websites *need* JS? seriously?!?
#
GWG
Hmm...abundant sunshine on Sunday
#
tantek
what better to do on a snowed in weekend than hack on the indieweb indoors?
#
GWG
I only see it for Saturday anyway
#
tantek
per Dark Sky, 1-2" snow Fri, 1-3" snow Sat
#
tantek
that should be enough to stick on the ground
#
tantek
and rain too
#
GWG
I'm an accuweather person
KartikPrabhu1 joined the channel
#
tantek.com
edited /email (+429) "Brainstorming / Redirect to public issues"
(view diff)
#
loqi.me
created /txting (+30) "prompted by tantek and dfn added by tantek"
(view diff)
#
loqi.me
created /texting (+30) "prompted by tantek and dfn added by tantek"
(view diff)
#
loqi.me
created /txt (+30) "prompted by tantek and dfn added by tantek"
(view diff)
#
loqi.me
created /SMS (+30) "prompted by tantek and dfn added by tantek"
(view diff)
#
tantek.com
edited /email (+101) "email UIs encourage excessive length, in contrast to texting"
(view diff)
lukebrooker joined the channel
#
tantek
hey aaronpk are you preserving your indieweb private messages?
#
tantek
or heck I suppose I should be able to put the permalink here if the security is working :D http://aaronparecki.com/messages/2013/08/04/1/first-indieweb-private-message-thread
#
tantek.com
edited /private-webmention (+837) "IndieWeb Examples / Experiments / first-indieweb-private-message-thread"
(view diff)
catsup and almereyda joined the channel
#
petermolnar
tantek, aaronpk yep, security is working on that thread, I can't see it :)
wolftune and snarfed joined the channel
#
snarfed
eyes the instagram API lockdown announcement, sighs, starts to work on scraping IG's html
tantek, raucao, acegiak and MrClaw joined the channel
#
tantek
snarfed: that really makes me want to make my IG private
#
snarfed
tantek: why?
#
tantek
to direct people to view my photos from my site/feed instead
webhat joined the channel
#
tantek
I may tie that to getting automated POSSE to Flickr working
#
tantek
since Flickr has no such API shenanigans going on
#
tantek
moving toward a world where I primarily use IG as a client for posting photos to my site, rather than a place for others to see my photos
j12t, brianloveswords, cleverdevil, ben_thatmustbeme, Gold, tommorris, bigbluehat, CaptainCalliope, acegiak and MrClaw joined the channel
#
snarfed
makes sense!
#
tantek
snarfed,kylewm: while I'm struggling with coming up with a clever/easy/international-friendly way to auto-markup /hashtags, how hard is https://github.com/snarfed/bridgy/issues/574 ?
#
snarfed
rereads
#
snarfed
looks like not very hard
#
snarfed
(kylewm is the flickr pro though)
#
tantek.com
edited /Falcon (+642) "/* auto POSSE photos to Flickr */ flip Instagram profile to private as a consequence"
(view diff)
#
@georgkaser
IndieWebify.Me - a guide to getting you on the #IndieWeb https://indiewebify.me/
(twitter.com/_/status/688868206841344005)
Lancey and j12t joined the channel