#indiewebcamp 2016-05-02

2016-05-02 UTC
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tantek GWG, I'd say delete it, because that's the dominant silo UX
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tantek and then if you want to do extra work, you could put a "this comment deleted by author" if there were responses to the comment
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tantek but strictly speaking I don't think that's necessary
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kylewm ^that's what I was wondering, do hackernews and reddit show tombstones even if there aren't replies?
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tantek kylewm: not sure - perhaps worth documenting them? I don't really take either of those to be bastions of UX
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tantek what is hackernews?
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Loqi Hacker News is a bookmark posting silo as well as a silo for comments on those links https://indiewebcamp.com/hackernews
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tantek what is reddit?
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Loqi Reddit is a link aggregator and bulletin board site where community members may submit links and text posts, vote on the submitted entries, and post comments on them https://indiewebcamp.com/Reddit
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kylewm tantek: yeah, I try to avoid both
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aaronpk while they're not the prettiest things in the world, they get a *lot* of traffic, and are definitely worth documenting since they seem to be doing *something* right
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ben_thatmustbeme made a few minor improvements to my reaction emoji UI
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GWG Hello, ben_thatmustbeme.
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ben_thatmustbeme notes not to call it reacji
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snarfed ben_thatmustbeme++
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ben_thatmustbeme hey GWG
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Loqi ben_thatmustbeme has 141 karma
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tantek aaronpk: I suppose they're worth documenting if someone wants to base work on their prior art
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tantek Digg used to get a lot of traffic too
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tantek ben_thatmustbeme, snarfed definitely feel free to add to / start /reacji#Criticism for why you find the term unappealing. worth documenting such impressions.
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snarfed sure! will do. tl;dr: everyone else uses "reactions." common terminology is more valuable than minor semantic differences.
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ben_thatmustbeme thus why i think 'reaction emoji' actually fits my use quite well, as they are reactions that are ONLY emoji, while one could do the same with images or something
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tantek makes sense
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ben_thatmustbeme but...
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ben_thatmustbeme what is poopji?
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Loqi poopji is a reacji of a pile of poop (💩) https://indiewebcamp.com/poopji
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snarfed.org edited /reacji (+324) "reactions!" (view diff)
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tantek snarfed, while you're here, do you think you'll be able to make it to IndieWeb Summit? especially the day 0 leader summit?
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snarfed tantek: sorry, no. wish i could! we'll be in wyoming
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tantek ben_thatmustbeme: how about you?
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GWG If I come to Portland, I'd get to meet snarfed?
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[kevinmarks] Interesting silo quit http://pitchfork.com/news/65175-radiohead-erase-internet-presence/
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GWG The number of pros grows.
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ben_thatmustbeme i will not be able to
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ben_thatmustbeme way too much going on
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ben_thatmustbeme on a side note, we just got 2 offers on our house (open house was today)
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tantek KevinMarks: that sounds more like internet quit rather than just silo quit
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tantek more like pulling a Pilgrim
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tantek KevinMarks: their website radiohead.com return just returned nothing
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tantek though it's still returning 200, unilke 410: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Pilgrim_%28software_developer%29#.22Disappearance.22_from_the_Internet
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kylewm do node people here have any recommendations for template engine? (for a small, pretty simple Express application)
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Loqi [indieweb] "miklb commented on pull request miklb/jekyll-indieweb#4" by miklb https://github.com/miklb/jekyll-indieweb/pull/4#issuecomment-216083700
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Loqi [indieweb] "miklb merged pull request miklb/jekyll-indieweb#4" by miklb https://github.com/miklb/jekyll-indieweb/pull/4
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Loqi [indieweb] "miklb pushed to master at miklb/jekyll-indieweb" by miklb https://github.com/miklb/jekyll-indieweb/compare/34d5da9031...5a20abe274
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miklb might be regretting that project name :-)
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aaronpk i'm still surprised that it's the first one that superfeedr has picked up on
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[kevinmarks] Or should be 447 http://www.diveintomark.link/2003/http-error-447-gone-until-i-get-the-attention-i
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Loqi [markpilgrim] HTTP Error 447: Gone until I get the attention I deserve (posted 2003-11-25T15:34:31+00:00)
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[kevinmarks] I used jade for pestagram.com, it was fairly easy, but a different syntax from jinja et al
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kylewm Loqi++
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Loqi Loqi has 397 karma
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kylewm thanks kevinmarks
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miklb [kevinmarks] that pull request came from someone who saw your presentation last week.
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Loqi [indieweb] "miklb pushed to master at miklb/jekyll-indieweb" by miklb https://github.com/miklb/jekyll-indieweb/compare/5a20abe274...0be7d30ccb
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Loqi [indieweb] "miklb pushed to gh-pages at miklb/jekyll-indieweb" by miklb https://github.com/miklb/jekyll-indieweb/compare/0a5bcc984e...023c42079e
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@arirose_ny A note for testing to receive webmentions. Yes! http://indieberger.mediaberger.com/note/receive-webmentions-here--11/ (twitter.com/_/status/726935723023208448)
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aaronparecki.com edited /2016/Schedule (+149) "update day 1 schedule" (view diff)
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kylewm KevinMarks: it looks like Swig is ~= jinja, think I'll use that
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bear does quill allow for edit/delete testin?
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kylewm bear: I'm pretty sure no
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bear yea, I'm finding that out now
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bear now i'm trying to figure out how to return a 410 GONE using static files only
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Loqi [indieweb] "Indieweb Post Kinds" by David Shanske https://wordpress.org/plugins/indieweb-post-kinds/#post-77573
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kylewm bear: I assume you've seen http://indiewebcamp.com/delete#HTML_meta_http-equiv_for_status
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kylewm although you probably have an nginx trick up your sleeve :)
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bear yea, found it (took longer than I want to admit - gotta start searching indieweb wiki first)
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bear I do have some nginx thoughts - but first I want to validate that static html works
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bear nginx way would be to have a location check for *.delete for location
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kylewm I don't know of anyone that actually supports the meta http-equiv way right now
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kylewm so might be difficult to verify
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bear i'm adding it to my static site
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kylewm whoa, not much precedent for http-equiv=Status outside of our wiki
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bear well - firefox doesn't honor <meta http-equiv="Status" content="410 GONE" />
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bear I have it added to https://bear.im/bearlog/2016/123/testing-delete
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kylewm it's definitely not one of the choices on https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/HTML/Element/meta#attr-http-equiv
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bear yea, even if the only thing in the html is the meta tag it doesn't work
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tantek that's because we invented it here
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tantek it's literally a brainstorm/proposal here in indieweb to solve this particular use-case
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tantek if we incubate it and get it working
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bear inventing it here doesn't help my immediate need tho :/
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tantek then we can add it to Webmention
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tantek bear what's your immediate need?
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bear deleting posts in a static environment
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gRegorLove Was the $5 IWC fee serious or a joke?
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tantek that's what it's for
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tantek gRegorLove: serious
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tantek why did you think it was a joke?
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bear but it doesn't work when used as a meta http-equiv
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gRegorLove What's the reasoning for it?
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GWG What will the $5 be used for?
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GWG gRegorLove: You coming to PDX?
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tantek bear what do you mean by "doesn't work"?
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tantek yes it has to be implemented by indieweb consumers also
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tantek that's how everything we come up with here works
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kylewm isn't meta http-equiv outdated in general, like for any use case?
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kylewm it feels like a weird thing to build upon
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gRegorLove GWG: Yeah, I'm on the RSVP list.
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tantek kylewm: it is the closest existing building block
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bear I created html for a deleted post that contained <html><head><meta http-equiv="Status" content="410 GONE" /></head><body></body></html> and a browser shows it as 200 status
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tantek bear of course there is no existing implementation
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tantek we came up with it!
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bear you are starting to irk me
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tantek that shouldn't surprise you
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GWG gRegorLove: If I get there, I look forward to shaking your hand.
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gRegorLove tantek: I didn't understand the reasoning for charging people who might be interested in IWC but aren't set up yet, vs free for the rest of us
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tantek gRegorLove: it's a minimal fee to get more accurate counts for participation, since we're opening it up to everyone who wants to attend
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bear so i'll repeat my above assertion - if my static site has no way of being able to return a 410 for a deleted post how will it work for me to send a webmention update for a deleted post if the receiver gets 404 or 200
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tantek (instead of just people with their own site)
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gRegorLove Hm. It doesn't sit well with me, even if it's a minimal fee.
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aaronpk well last year we didn't charge anything for tickets and had about 50% no-shows from the tickets that were registered
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gRegorLove So it's to help filter out people who might RSVP but then not show up?
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tantek gRegorLove: why?
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tantek yes, that's what happens
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tantek and getting people to pay $5 makes them more vested in attending
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tantek it's pretty typical encouragement
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gRegorLove Did that prevent anyone from coming last year?
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tantek did what?
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aaronpk did what prevent anyone from coming?
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kylewm bear: I think the idea is that webmention receivers would parse the HTML and look for http-equiv specifically.
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tantek kylewm is correct
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GWG What will the proceeds go toward?
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gRegorLove The amount of no-shows last year. E.g. Did it appear to be full and people didn't show up, when they could have?
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bear then that should have been more clearly specified - here I am trying to use it to generate a http status code
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aaronpk we ended up ordering way more food than we should have
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aaronpk which i would not like to repeat
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gRegorLove Ok, that makes sense.
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kylewm we had pretty good turn out in SF last year from people who registered on Eventbrite, but I think that was down to Andi more than the registration mechanism
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tantek gRegorLove: also the language we've had in the past around creators only or people with their own sites only etc. tended to discourage a lot of people, especially those who were not naturally self-assertive
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gRegorLove I guess I would feel more comfortable if it was a minimal fee for everyone then, rather than just those who don't post on their own site.
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gRegorLove tantek: Sure, though I thought we iterated on that pretty well last year.
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tantek so instead, we're opening it up broadly, but simultaneously putting a minor fee on it just so people make it a conscious decision to attend, instead of just the "RSVP to all the things" crowd
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gRegorLove Is a blog post saying you're coming still a valid free RSVP this year?
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kylewm hmm, we should start banging the drum on that "scholarship" fund too
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tantek gRegorLove: good Q. I think aaronpk wanted to reduce the # of ways to RSVP
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gRegorLove I just don't like the tiers it implies, I guess.
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aaronpk okay there's enough chatter here for me to drop a link here
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tantek it's a lot more than $5 worth of time / work to get RSVPs working on your own site, so yes that's incentive
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kylewm gRegorLove: $5 is less than domain registration ;)
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gRegorLove Indie RSVP or edit the wiki? Free. All others, pay.
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aaronpk i made this today http://2016.indieweb.org/
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tantek gRegorLove: no it's more like a discount code
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Loqi IndieWeb Summit
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aaronpk RSVPs are *only* done through ti.to registration
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tantek kylewm: good point
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tantek if someone doesn't want to pay $5 to participate then they're unlikely going to want to pay money to buy their own domain etc.
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aaronpk if you post an RSVP from your site, and send a webmention to that page, you'll show up there
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aaronpk when you check out through ti.to for the "free" ticket, it asks you to provide the link to your RSVP
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bear k, webmention.rocks/delete/1 doesn't like http-equiv
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tantek now we're getting somewhere
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tantek bear++ for posting a meta 410
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Loqi bear has 127 karma
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kylewm dang aaronpk nice work
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gRegorLove It's not really about the amount ($5). Having a domain already wasn't a requirement last year.
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aaronpk it's a classic problem of hosting free events
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tantek gRegorLove: you're missing the point. if someone doesn't want to pay $5 to participate then they're unlikely going to want to pay money to buy their own domain etc.
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tantek nothing about that said having a domain already
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gRegorLove So?
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gRegorLove aaronpk: Yeah, I do get it for food and such, and don't have a good alternative suggestion
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tantek gRegorLove: a lot of this is from experience hosting free events
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tantek part of making them work well is getting accurate counts. a minimal fee works wonders for that
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gRegorLove Guess I'd just feel more at ease if it applied to everyone.
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tantek why?
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tantek the incentive to get indie RSVPs working is a good thing
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tantek or heck, people can always volunteer!
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gRegorLove Why not? :) It's a minimal fee.
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tantek that's certainly open to everyone
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aaronpk can we make an FAQ about this?
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aaronpk "why is it free if I have my own website?"
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bear hmm, most of the example deleted posts on /deleted don't actually return a 410
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tantek bear - definitely worth noting as nested bullet items * on them!
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tantek reverifying IndieWeb Examples of any kind is worth it
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kylewm bear: I added http-equiv support to my webmention receiver if you want to try it!
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bear what is the link I should use to generate a webmention?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "link I should use to generate a webmention" yet. Would you like to create it? https://indiewebcamp.com/s/10KG
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tantek kylewm++
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Loqi kylewm has 327 karma
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tantek kylewm what did you have to add to your webmention receiving code to process the http-equiv properly?
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kylewm like, search the document for the meta tag, parse out the content and convert to an int
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kylewm https://github.com/kylewm/redwind/blob/master/redwind/plugins/wm_receiver.py#L268
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bear.im edited /deleted (+234) "update for those that don't return 410" (view diff)
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bear kylewm what url can I use as a mention to test?
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kylewm bear: oh feel free to reply to any post you like
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kylewm hmm, although your question makes me think we're miscommunicating
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tantek bear how can a HTTP request return both a 410 and do a redirect? I"m confused
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bear so am I
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bear I had firefox dev tools open and that's what happened
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tantek that is so strange
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kylewm bear: if you send me a mention (e.g. on https://kylewm.com/2016/04/cats-are-magical), then you should be able to http-equiv delete it, resend the mention, and the comment shuld disappear from my site
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bear ok, first sent - I see it
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bear deleted and resent...
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bear \o/ gone
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bear kylewm++
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Loqi kylewm has 328 karma
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kylewm woo!
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tantek aaronpk++ for http://2016.indieweb.org/ - this is looking really nice and much more like a "proper" event page than our wiki, and better than a silo event page too
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Loqi aaronpk has 126 karma
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tantek kylewm++ for implementing consuming http-equive status 410!
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Loqi kylewm has 329 karma
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tantek congrats bear and kylewm! that sounds like you just got a pretty big interop milestone working!
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bear goes to see what changes to ronkyuu will be needed for this
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tantek kylewm: how hard was it to "search the document for the meta tag, parse out the content and convert to an int"?
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snarfed sets up a reverse proxy to get around instagram's IP blocking
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tantek whoa
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tantek snarfed, this feels like an unwinnable contest :(
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snarfed tantek: only if they actually noticed and blocked bridgy specifically
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snarfed which i doubt
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tantek huh
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snarfed and lo, it is done
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snarfed apache++
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Loqi apache has 2 karma
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snarfed three config lines :P
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kylewm !karma nginx
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Loqi nginx has 8 karma
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kylewm tantek: like 15 minutes to add the http-equiv stuff?
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kylewm snarfed: are you bouncing it off your snarfed.org server?
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snarfed kylewm: not telling :P
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snarfed ...
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snarfed kidding. no, off huffduff-video. snarfed is on a shared server
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kylewm oh huh, I thought huffduff was running on appengine too
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snarfed nah, it needs all sorts of binaries and C modules that stock app engine (python) doesn't support
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snarfed GCE would be fine, and maybe managed VMs, and *maybe* AWS lambda, except for the 5m request deadline
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snarfed anyone who's been missing bridgy instagram backfeed over the last few days, feel free to go click your poll now button
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tantek what is GCE?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "GCE" yet. Would you like to create it? https://indiewebcamp.com/s/10KH
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snarfed GCE is [https://cloud.google.com/compute/ Google Compute Engine].
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loqi.me created /GCE (+92) "prompted by tantek https://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2016-05-01/line/1462167132267 and dfn added by snarfed" (view diff)
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Loqi ok
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tantek what is Google Compute Engine?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "Google Compute Engine" yet. Would you like to create it? https://indiewebcamp.com/s/10KJ
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tantek huh I thought we actually had a page on it
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snarfed Google Compute Engine is https://cloud.google.com/compute/
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loqi.me created /Google_Compute_Engine (+85) "prompted by tantek https://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2016-05-01/line/1462167205759 and dfn added by snarfed" (view diff)
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Loqi ok
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tantek snarfed, which expression is more often used? the abbr or the phrase?
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snarfed tantek: not sure
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snarfed if you're picking where to document, go with the phrase
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tantek ok
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tantek.com edited /Main_Page (+45) "explicit no bg on the th cells" (view diff)
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Loqi [indieweb] "IndieWeb Summit 2016 - Portland, Oregon http://2016.indieweb.org/" by Chris Aldrich http://stream.boffosocko.com/2016/indieweb-summit-2016---portland-oregon
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tantek ^^^ hey aaronpk was that ready to broadcast? ;)
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@ChrisAldrich IndieWeb Summit 2016 - Portland, Oregon http://2016.indieweb.org/ (twitter.com/_/status/727011732443398144)
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gregorlove.com edited /deleted (+494) "/* IndieWeb Examples */ +me" (view diff)
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@btconf 5 days for the #IndieWebCamp kick off. 7 days until #btconf Düsseldorf happens for the sixth time! #excitement https://beyondtellerrand.com (twitter.com/_/status/727018708590297088)
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tantek.com created /2016/newskin (+1773) "draft with dfn why, non-goals, issues, to do, participants, completed, see also" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /2016/newskin (+107) "to do: CSS to float:right the TOC on all pages by default" (view diff)
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@eay @btconf @sipgateDE @indiewebcamp Sehr gut, danke. :) (twitter.com/_/status/727025323343249408)
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@btconf @eay @sipgateDE @indiewebcamp Kommt heute eine Email. Kann man. ;) (twitter.com/_/status/727024247764307968)
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@eay @sipgateDE Guten Morgen! Eine kurze Frage: Kann man für’s @IndieWebCamp am Sa/So bei euch oder irgendwo in der Nähe parken? /cc @marcthiele (twitter.com/_/status/727024133620547584)
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@bastianallgeier RT @btconf 5 days for the #IndieWebCamp kick off. 7 days until #btconf Düsseldorf happens for the sixth time! #excitement https://beyondtellerrand.com (twitter.com/_/status/727022765342121984)
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tantek.com edited /2016 (+43) "/* Schedule */ some tentative shuffling of keynotes" (view diff)
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bear.im edited /deleted (+326) "add mine to the examples list" (view diff)
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tantek I'm tempted to implement deleted the same way to help provide incentive for more webmention receivers to implement it
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tantek !tell snarfed, kylewm Bridgy Publish to FB web UI is failing weirdly. several times in a row it is redirect to make me re-login to FB (I'm already logged in), then strangely failing with a FB UI error message, and then eventually it seems to randomly work (after 3-4 attempts?).
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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tantek.com edited /GCE (-57) "redir to phrase" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /Google_Compute_Engine (+43) "note abbr" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /Google_Compute_Engine (+79) "tweak dfn, see also" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /Amazon_EC2 (+10) "see also GCE" (view diff)
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bear ugh - had no idea it was already 0400 !
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bear but on the bright side - my site is now handling updates and deletes for posts and webmentions
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tantek bear clearly you must have been having fun :)
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tantek that's pretty epic
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bear yea, lots of little refactorings to the support flask app I use for micropub and webmentions
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tantek you got micropub update/delete working, and webmention sending of updates and deletes?
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bear filed a bug for webmention.rocks - once that is done I will be 21/21 for webmentions 2/2 for updates and 1/1 for deletes
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tantek that's awesome
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bear yes, micropub create, update and delete -- just using my own command line tools for now - haven't tested it with any online editor
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bear and during any update of a post/article it scans webmentions for "freshness"
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tantek how about micropub undelete?
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bear that is ready to implement
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bear I save the original html and secondary data when I flag a post as deleted
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bear so undelete is clearing a flag file and regenerating
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bear but I don't want to say it's fully implemented until I test it with at least one external client
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tantek makes sense
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sknebel bear: is your micropub endpoint open-source somewhere?
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bear yes, https://github.com/bear/kaku
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sknebel bear++ :)
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Loqi bear has 128 karma
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bear it's still very much oriented to how I do things, but it's a flask app and shouldn't be too hard to tweak
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tantek what is kaku?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "kaku" yet. Would you like to create it? https://indiewebcamp.com/s/10KK
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bear kaku is a Python Flask app that is used to handle incoming micropub and webmention requests for bear.im
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loqi.me created /kaku (+130) "prompted by tantek https://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2016-05-02/line/1462177224931 and dfn added by bear" (view diff)
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Loqi ok
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tantek and open source!
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bear.im edited /kaku (+29) "add links" (view diff)
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bear what is kaku
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Loqi https://indiewebcamp.com/kaku
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bear sleeps
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tantek.com edited /kaku (+140) "open source, self-dogfooded, see also, linky linky" (view diff)
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@bastianallgeier I’m really looking forward to my 2nd IndieWebCamp: http://indiewebcamp.com/2016/D%C3%BCsseldorf/Guest_List There are still 4 seats left. Join if you can! (twitter.com/_/status/727062831204589568)
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@btconf Welcome to the #IndieWebCamp, Mr. @glennjones ;) See you on Saturday. (twitter.com/_/status/727074647771074561)
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glennjones.net edited /2016/Düsseldorf/Guest_List (+183) "Added participant" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /tag-reply (+930) "/* How to */ person tag reply adapted from brainstorm example in [[person-tag]]" (view diff)
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@glennjones @bastianallgeier had to leaving booking very late this year, but looking forward to been in Düsseldorf for @indiewebcamp this weekend (twitter.com/_/status/727079681208516608)
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tantek.com edited /person-tag (-336) "/* Basic Person Tagging example */ move to tag-reply how to" (view diff)
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tantek awesome! Glenn Jones will be there too!
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marcthiele tantek: Yip. Has to remind him to come, last week ;)
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Loqi marcthiele: voxpelli left you a message on 4/29 at 4:44am: My guess is that the IndieAuth.com issue is caused by a ü-char. I opened an issue for it at the repo http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2016-04-29/line/1461930239271
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Loqi marcthiele: aaronpk left you a message on 4/29 at 7:44am: voxpelli is right, the problem with the login is when it's trying to take you back to the Düsseldorf page. if you click on the home page and log in from there it will work fine. http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2016-04-29/line/1461941090580
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Loqi marcthiele: aaronpk left you a message on 4/29 at 7:52am: it looks like for whatever reason, Google is not actually showing the link to your website in the HTML response that indieauth.com gets. They have a nasty habit of changing the HTML they send back depending on who's fetching it. I would start using Github instead of Google. http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2016-04-29/line/1461941543544
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tantek.com edited /tag-reply (+53) "/* person tag reply */ notifications in order" (view diff)
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tommorris.org created /chatbot (+2895) "new article about chatbots which will change everything, apparently" (view diff)
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tommorris.org created /conversational_UI (+21) "redirect" (view diff)
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voxpelli :( looks like Düsseldorf will be a really awesome event, so wished I could be there
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tommorris same.
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cyberjar09 hello all just learned about indiewebcamp am excited to being my journey
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cyberjar09 I have just bought my own domain and have setup a RPi2 at home but not sure how to go about setting up synamic DNS so it is available online .. any guides out there?
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cweiske maybe your router supports dyndns
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cweiske that would be the easiest option
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cyberjar09 oh ok Ill have to check in that case
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cyberjar09 will be back
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cyberjar09 i use archer c7
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cweiske I made my own dyndns utilizing a ssh on my home server to the DNS server that's on a "real" server - http://cweiske.de/tagebuch/ssh-dyndns.htm
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Loqi [Christian Weiske] DynDNS via SSH
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[jgarber] Good morning/afternoon/evening, all! DC’s still looking for a home for this week’s HWC. Is anyone here local to the Washington, DC area and know of a good place to meet?
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tantek open source tool for POSSEing git commits to GitHub? https://code.facebook.com/posts/1715560542066337/automatically-push-commits-to-github-with-fbshipit/
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@RikMende RT @aaronpk New @W3C Webmention draft! Minor clarifications + linked to the https://webmention.rocks/ test suite. https://www.w3.org/TR/webmention/#changes-from-20-april-2016-wd-to-29-april-2016 #RoadToCR (twitter.com/_/status/727148694101983232)
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kylewm Jgarber: cc Kevinmarks I think he had a place to recommend
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Loqi kylewm: tantek left you a message 7 hours, 33 minutes ago: Bridgy Publish to FB web UI is failing weirdly. several times in a row it is redirect to make me re-login to FB (I'm already logged in), then strangely failing with a FB UI error message, and then eventually it seems to randomly work (after 3-4 attempts?). http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2016-05-02/line/1462174846944
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dym_cx > "Notifying post authors of webmentions, comments and other interactions with their posts" /chatbots
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dym_cx this would be a big leap since right how webmentions only go to those who have it
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cyberjar09 I use namecheap they have a guide for setting up dynamic dns. I did not need to use my router but I installed a client on my RPi instead .. am I missing anything?
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Loqi [indieweb] "Testing Reactions Known plug-ins : it would be great to have the idnoOpenGraph plug-in into core and Allows Known Reactions to take advantage of it" by Rick Mendes http://www.rmendes.net/2016/testing-reactions-known-plug-ins-it-would-be-great-to-have
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sknebel cyberjar09: benefit of using the router is that it knows immediately when the IP has changed
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sknebel but you can do it from the Pi as well
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tantek.com edited /GitLab (+395) "advocacy, see also" (view diff)
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@btconf RT @getkirby I’m going to be at IndieWebCamp & @btconf in Düsseldorf next week. Let’s meet, if you are there as well. (twitter.com/_/status/727164934598053889)
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@getkirby I’m going to be at IndieWebCamp & @btconf in Düsseldorf next week. Let’s meet, if you are there as well. (twitter.com/_/status/727164857754259457)
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tantek getkirby++ nice!
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Loqi getkirby has 1 karma
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tantek what is Kirby?
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Loqi Kirby is a filed-based CMS https://indiewebcamp.com/Kirby
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Loqi [indieweb] "@obra I'm converting to the PESOS religion. #indieweb" by Ben Werdmüller http://werd.io/2016/obra-im-converting-to-the-pesos-religion-indieweb
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tantek huh
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aaronpk i get that, to some extent
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tantek from reading the thread I think (hope?) benwerd omitted a ;)
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aaronpk for checkins, i'm still planning on checking in from foursquare and backfeeding them to my site
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tantek PESOSing them to your site?
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aaronpk yeah
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tantek backfeed is for responses ;)
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@benwerd @obra I'm converting to the PESOS religion. #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/727168595864637440)
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aaronpk I don't see a lot of value in POSSE'ing to foursquare, it would only add a lot of complexity to whatever interface I make
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tantek LOL: "On its first day, my horrible affliction test had received 60,000 visits."
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tantek benwerd++ for still using his own domain and a subdomain: https://words.werd.io/we-are-the-monkeys-of-rum-70f81d4a02df
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Loqi benwerd has 112 karma
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kylewm tantek: I would guess ben wasn't kidding. have you seen this? https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/known-dev/_GGQpLHqdQI
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tantek I cringe at every Google Groups permalink
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tantek otherwise known as "Loading..."
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tantek Loqi, why is Google Groups so slow?
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aaronpk it would be amazing if the Medium app supported micropub and could be used to post to your own site
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kylewm Firefox is incredibly slow to load google domains for me
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kylewm pushing me off firefox altogether
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tantek kylewm: it does the opposite for me, it makes me want to avoid google domains
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tantek aaronpk, same for the WordPress mobile app!
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aaronpk definitely!
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tantek kylewm - I don't think mobile vs. POSSE is a dichotomy, or rather, it's a false dichotomy
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tantek though I do think there is something to be said for your idea (and plugin!) for a backfill approach
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snarfed morning all!
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Loqi snarfed: tantek left you a message 8 hours, 50 minutes ago: Bridgy Publish to FB web UI is failing weirdly. several times in a row it is redirect to make me re-login to FB (I'm already logged in), then strangely failing with a FB UI error message, and then eventually it seems to randomly work (after 3-4 attempts?). http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2016-05-02/line/1462174846944
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tantek morning snarfed!
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snarfed ugh, sorry about that. we can look, but if it worked eventually, i suspect FB API flakiness
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tantek well the fact that I get login prompted every time is a bug
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tantek I'm guessing that's the cause of the flakiness
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tantek (login prompted into FB when Bridgy bounces to FB briefly)
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tantek (when I should already be cookie'd in)
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kylewm a FB bug you mean?
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tantek kylewm: good question. the buggy behavior is new as of perhaps the last month.
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kylewm well bridgy has you auth before publishing by design
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tantek but I'm already auth'd
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kylewm because it doesn't have any persistent idea of you being authed
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tantek oh - to prevent random people from POSSEing from my site to my FB profile?
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kylewm ya
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snarfed tantek: https://brid.gy/about#security
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snarfed also, funny
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snarfed apologies for putting on his pedantic hat
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snarfed tantek: POSSE to github is arguably just git push. looks like that FB project is about mapping an internal code base to an external project, sanitizing confidential strings, etc
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tantek appreciates URLs as answers :)
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snarfed oh, except, that url doesn't actually answer this specific q
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snarfed sorry :P
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snarfed wait, no, it does, just tersely
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snarfed i must have written it :P
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tantek yep - I got it.
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tantek huh - I wonder if I have the backlink to bridgy publish for FB, does it need to auth?
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snarfed no. eg it doesn't auth for webmention publish, only for interactive
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tantek that is if I use the Bridgy web UI to POSSE a post, but the post already has the link to bridgy to publish, it the web UI could do it without auth right? since someone could send a webmention without auth?
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tantek that's what I mean. interactive + backlink = no auth?
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snarfed yeah we could consider removing it
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snarfed the backlink is required anyway
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kylewm it is??
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kylewm i thought interactive was ok without a backlink
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snarfed sorry, yes. i mistyped.
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snarfed tantek: thanks for the idea! filed https://github.com/snarfed/bridgy/issues/666
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tantek >:D
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tantek.com edited /Kirby (+292) "community participation, see also" (view diff)
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[shaners] Morning, Loqi.
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Loqi [shaners]: tantek left you a message on 4/28 at 6:40pm: were you able to take/post a photo from HWC LA/SM? https://indiewebcamp.com/events/2016-04-27-homebrew-website-club#Photos http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2016-04-28/line/1461894005966
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Loqi [shaners]: tantek left you a message on 4/29 at 12:35pm: little over an hour to post a photo from HWC LA/SM before the newsletter gets sent out http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2016-04-29/line/1461958545876
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Loqi who, me?
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[shaners] I’m seeing a bunch of broken avatar images in Slack. Anyone else?
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aaronpk the same images are used in the web logs, are they missing there too?
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[shaners] Nope. Web logs look good.
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[shaners] Maybe a local cache problem in my Slack.app.
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tantek words to keep keeping in mind: "And even if the damned thing worked, it would not offer me the functionality I really want: which is to connect with my real friends, who are all on Twitter, Facebook, or (yes, even some) on G+. "
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snarfed tantek++
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Loqi tantek has 289 karma
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tantek snarfed, that was from https://matej.ceplovi.cz/blog/tag/ostatus.html
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tantek hey kylewm, ben_thatmustbeme did you either of you implement receiving tag-replies? especially person tag replies?
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tantek I feel like we talked about this but don't remember where it ended up
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tantek (this is for someone else person-tagging a post of yours, like a photo)
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tantek https://indiewebcamp.com/tag-reply
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tantek.com edited /tag-reply (+18) "/* See Also */ location-of" (view diff)
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@megarush1024 @marcysutton @wilto Predecessor to webmentions. https://www.techwyse.com/blog/internet-marketing/what-is-a-pingback-are-pingbacks-good-for-your-blog-seo/ (twitter.com/_/status/727186273614462976)
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gRegorLove Good morning, indiewebcamp
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kylewm tantek: I don't recognize them as anything beyond person mentions
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tantek wow that's a tipping point of sorts
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tantek seing pingback framed relative to webmention rather than vice versa
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[shaners] benwerd!
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[shaners] Long time. Hi!
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[benwerdmuller] waves
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boffosocko.com edited /events/2016-04-27-homebrew-website-club (+331) "Added photo" (view diff)
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[shaners] Are you gonna be at IWC PDX in June?
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[benwerdmuller] Categorically yes
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[benwerdmuller] Really looking forward to it
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[shaners] Righteous. Me too.
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[benwerdmuller] Awesome!
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tantek shaners, while you're here, is IWC LA/SM happening Wednesday? https://indiewebcamp.com/events/2016-05-04-homebrew-website-club#Where
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tantek aaronpk: you too - need a venue for PDX (assuming you're in town before flying out!)
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tantek shaners, hoping for a quick yes/no before updating the wiki
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tantek sorry, HWC LA/SM
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tantek chrisaldrich: maybe you know - is HWC LA/SM happening this week
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tantek ?
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@jkphl I could need some #IndieWeb-savvy co-organizers for https://indiewebcamp.com/2016/Nuremberg/IndieWeb-Hack-Day during the @openSUSE conference. Pls ping me if you can help! (twitter.com/_/status/727194710738124800)
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chrisaldrich Shaners: if it helps, I'm going to be stuck this week and can't make it across town...
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chrisaldrich Shaners: if it helps, I'm going to be stuck this week and can't make it across town...
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Loqi [indieweb] "WeeklyUpdates/2016-05-02" by Tantek https://wiki.mozilla.org/index.php?title=WeeklyUpdates/2016-05-02&diff=1130569&oldid=1130567
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chrisaldrich tantek: I think his intention was to do it weekly going forward to start softening the ground for IWC LA in November
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chrisaldrich I can't speak for Shaners as he's got the keys to the location, but I'd suspect it's on, though not sure how attendance will do this week with me out....
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[benwerdmuller] I’m so behind the times, but count me in for IWC LA too
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[shaners] http://veganstraightedge.com/articles/2016/05/02/first-homebrew-website-club-in-la-santa-monica-california
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Loqi [Shane Becker] First Homebrew Website Club in LA/Santa Monica, California
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Loqi [indieweb] "WeeklyUpdates/2016-05-02" by Tantek https://wiki.mozilla.org/index.php?title=WeeklyUpdates/2016-05-02&diff=1130572&oldid=1130570
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veganstraightedge.com edited /events/2016-04-27-homebrew-website-club (+684) "/* Photos */" (view diff)
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[shaners] benwerdmuller: https://indiewebcamp.com/2016/LA
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tantek.com edited /events/2016-05-04-homebrew-website-club (+499) "/* Where */ add LA!" (view diff)
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[shaners] Thanks, T. That was on my list for today.
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[benwerdmuller] Sold. My aunt and uncle live over by the Mormon Temple, so it’s also incredibly convenient for me :thumbsup:
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tantek.com edited /events/2016-05-04-homebrew-website-club (-8) "LA RSVP too" (view diff)
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ben_thatmustbeme tantek, no i haven't done tag replies
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tantek thanks for confirming and getting a venue shaners
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ben_thatmustbeme for me tagging is something i would prefer others not be able to do. If i do implement it, it would really be as a suggestion i would have to approve
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Loqi [indieweb] "First Homebrew Website Club in LA/Santa Monica, California from 4/27/16 #IndieWeb" by Chris Aldrich http://stream.boffosocko.com/2016/first-homebrew-website-club-in-lasanta-monica-california-from-42716
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[shaners] benwerdmuller: https://indiewebcamp.com/2016/LA/Guest_List
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@ChrisAldrich First Homebrew Website Club in LA/Santa Monica, California from 4/27/16 #IndieWeb (twitter.com/_/status/727198463255945216)
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[shaners] http://veganstraightedge.com/notes/2016/05/02/indieweb-lunch-time-lightning-tech-talk-from-2016-04-26-at-pivotal
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Loqi [Shane Becker] My #indieweb lunch time lightning tech talk (from 2016-04-26 at @pivotal).
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[shaners] tantek: Did you mention some place on the wiki where I should link to that talk?
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tantek what are videos about?
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Loqi Videos about the indieweb are a great way to get a quick visual introduction to what is the Indie Web, why we need it, and how you can make a difference for yourself, and others https://indiewebcamp.com/videos_about
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[shaners] Doot doot doot. A Daily Double!
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tantek !tell adactio is HWC Brighton on this week? https://indiewebcamp.com/events/2016-05-04-homebrew-website-club#Where
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell him that when I see him next
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tantek !tell jgarber is HWC DC on this week or still looking for a venue? https://indiewebcamp.com/events/2016-05-04-homebrew-website-club#Where
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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tantek aaronpk: I see you're in PDX on Wednesday night - HWC PDX venue? https://indiewebcamp.com/events/2016-05-04-homebrew-website-club#Where
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tantek ben_thatmustbeme: re: " If i do implement it, it would really be as a suggestion i would have to approve" in that case I should upload the screenshots I took of FB prompting me to approve a tag from someone else of somethird else in a photo of mine
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aaronpk is debating whether he should spend that time packing for Germany instead
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aaronpk 6am flight in the morning means getting up eaarrrrly
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bear packing is always a good thing - it doesn't grow stale ;)
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veganstraightedge.com edited /videos_about_the_indieweb (+194) "/* 2016 */" (view diff)
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tantek aaronpk: did you see that bear got webmention deletes working from his site to kylewm's site via the meta 410? time for webmention.rocks to support meta 410!
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veganstraightedge.com edited /events/2016-05-04-homebrew-website-club (+24) "/* Los Angeles */" (view diff)
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aaronpk I did! that's awesome
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aaronpk i will add that to webmention.rocks soon!
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tantek I'm thinking of following in bear's footprints and implementing delete with meta 410 as well
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aaronpk is that easier than http 410?
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tantek I think so?
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aaronpk interesting
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bear for those with no access to the web server - yes :)
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aaronpk you don't need web server access, just a scripting language
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aaronpk header('HTTP/1.1 410 Gone'); in php for example
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tantek aaronpk - I have another use-case for it for you in particular: spiderpig :)
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bear is that why the known instances both serve up 410 and then continue to deliver a page?
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aaronpk HTTP allows a response body with 410, so that's not unusualy
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@veganstraightedge My #indieweb lunch time lightning tech talk (from 2016-04-26 at @pivotal). https://vimeo.com/165022563 (twitter.com/_/status/727200015362449409)
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aaronpk tantek: interesting point! should spiderpig keep pages that returned an http 410 or meta 410?
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tantek it may need to *generate* a minimal html meta 410 page when it gets a 410 status code back!
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tantek since the point is an archive you statically host
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aaronpk should it do that? or should it just not archive the page?
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bear yea, so for folks with static only pages then meta 410 is the only option
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tantek I think it should archive the 410. not archiving the page would result in a 410 -> 404 information loss
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aaronpk true
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tantek my ideal for how this should work on the server, is that web servers that serve static HTML files should pre-parse them for meta http-equivs, and then use those http-equivs as default HTTP header return values
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tantek thereby allowing HTML-level configuration of all that stuff instead of mucking with web-server-specific config files
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aaronpk interesting, is there precedent for servers to do that for other headers?
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tantek AKA .htaccess is not a standard :P
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tantek aaronpk: I'm saying webserver should do it for *all* meta http-equivs. not just meta 410
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tantek shaners that sounds like a pretty productive first HWC SM meetup! any HWC where someone walks away setup with their own site is a huge win
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[chrisaldrich] mapkyca++ for https://github.com/mapkyca/KnownGithub
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Loqi mapkyca has 6 karma
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tantek shaners, I'm getting a "something went wrong" from http://veganstraightedge.com/events/2016/04/08/homebrew-website-club-los-angeles-santa-monica
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tantek (linked from the in reply to of http://veganstraightedge.com/articles/2016/05/02/first-homebrew-website-club-in-la-santa-monica-california )
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Loqi [Shane Becker] First Homebrew Website Club in LA/Santa Monica, California
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[shaners] tantek: fixing
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[shaners] tantek: fixed
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veganstraightedge.com edited /events/2016-04-27-homebrew-website-club (+109) "/* Blog posts */" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /videos_about_the_indieweb (-133) "dropping "Digital Emancipation" video; 1st 15m (before vimeo failed), no mention of indieweb, more political rants/strawmans about surveillance, capitalism, silicon valley, also claims "The Web is the problem" whereas IndieWeb uses web as solution!" (view diff)
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tantek.com uploaded /Special:Log/upload "uploaded "[[File:2016-05-02-vimeo-issue-playback.png]]""
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Loqi [indieweb] "#video: Why you need your own website in advance of Homebrew Website Club on 5/4/16 http://indiewebcamp.com/events/2016-05-04-homebrew-website-club #indieweb" by Chris Aldrich http://stream.boffosocko.com/2016/video-why-you-need-your-own-website-in-advance-of
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tantek.com edited /Vimeo (+356) "Issues, Unknown problems with playback, screenshot" (view diff)
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Loqi [indieweb] "#indieweb lunch time lightning tech talk" https://vimeo.com/165022563
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tantek shaners thanks for doing a 2016 indieweb video so we have at least one :)
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@ChrisAldrich #video: Why you need your own website in advance of Homebrew Website Club on 5/4/16 http://indiewebcamp.com/events/2016-05-04-homebrew-website-club #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/727212139576889345)
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veganstraightedge.com created /events/2016-05-11-homebrew-website-club (+2821) "Created page with "<div class="h-event vevent"> <img style="width:100%;height:18em;object-fit:cover;object-position:50% 50%" class="u-featured" src="http://assets.veganstraightedge.com/articles/201..."" (view diff)
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veganstraightedge.com edited /events/2016-05-18-homebrew-website-club (+523) (view diff)
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veganstraightedge.com created /events/2016-05-25-homebrew-website-club (+2821) "Created page with "<div class="h-event vevent"> <img style="width:100%;height:18em;object-fit:cover;object-position:50% 50%" class="u-featured" src="http://assets.veganstraightedge.com/articles/201..."" (view diff)
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veganstraightedge.com edited /Template:Homebrew_Website_Club (+108) (view diff)
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tantek now needs to adjust any LA trip schedules to be sure to stop by HWC LA/SM!
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veganstraightedge.com edited /events/2016-05-04-homebrew-website-club (+74) "Add FB POSSE RSVP link" (view diff)
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kylewm shaners++ nice talk, particularly given the circumstances
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Loqi shaners has 34 karma
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veganstraightedge.com edited /events/2016-05-11-homebrew-website-club (+76) "/* Los Angeles */" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /MediaWiki:Sidebar (+64) "+Brighton, Göteborg, Portland" (view diff)
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tantek I mean LA there obv Portland was already in there
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[shaners] kylewm: thanks, kid
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[shaners] tantek: Stoked to see you down in LA/SM
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[shaners] kylewm: think you’ll make it down this way in November?
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tantek shaners I will try to make it there several times before November also
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kylewm Very good possibility for me
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tantek.com edited /Main_Page (+303) "add LA HWC 05-11 since it's weekly! -DC this week" (view diff)
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aaronpk just realized that Dreamhost has an office in portland apparently
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aaronpk http://calagator.org/venues/202395211
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[shaners] tantek: :+1::skin-tone-2:
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aaronpk cleverdevil: do you know who works there?
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aaronpk thinks that might be a great place to move Homebrew Website Club :D
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tantek kylewm: would you be available for remote participation in an IWC Düsseldorf mf2 parsing issues resolutions session this weekend?
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[shaners] afk
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tantek.com edited /2016/Düsseldorf (+37) "/* Participating */ session ideas page" (view diff)
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kylewm tantek: I don't think so, family in town this weekend, but more than happy to defer to you three and/or weigh in asynchronously
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kylewm Four even
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tantek cool. was hoping you could share any insights as well, as I know I've seen you come up with answers/suggestions/refinements that have improved many an issue resolution
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tantek if you time between now and Friday to go through http://microformats.org/wiki/microformats2-parsing-issues and comment on the ones you haven't commented on, even if you just say +0 no strong opinion.
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tantek s/you time/you have time/
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Loqi tantek meant to say: if you have time between now and Friday to go through http://microformats.org/wiki/microformats2-parsing-issues and comment on the ones you haven't commented on, even if you just say +0 no strong opinion.
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Loqi microformats2-parsing-issues
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cleverdevil aaronpk, yeah, I know lots of people who work in portland :)
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cleverdevil who work out of the DreamHost office
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aaronpk WELL then
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aaronpk think any of them would be interested in indieweb things?
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cleverdevil thinks
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cleverdevil maybe?
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gRegorLove Indie RSVP sent to http://2016.indieweb.org!
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Loqi IndieWeb Summit
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gRegorLove Some text overlap issues with the RSVPs
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aaronpk my URL is too long
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aaronpk considers showing the date there instead of the URL
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tantek.com created /2016/Düsseldorf/Session_Ideas (+743) "stub with mf2 issue resolutions session idea" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /2016/Düsseldorf/Session_Ideas (+126) "kbd, more description, link mf2 parser issues" (view diff)
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tantek aaronpk: any thoughts for https://indiewebcamp.com/2016/D%C3%BCsseldorf/Session_Ideas ?
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tantek (e.g. maybe webmention(.rocks) or maybe one on micropub?)
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aaronpk I would love to do a "up and running with webmention.rocks" session or something
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tantek Yes!
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tantek add it!
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tantek (even just that quick session title)
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aaronpk wonders how "up and running" translates to German
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aaronparecki.com edited /2016/Düsseldorf/Session_Ideas (+131) "add webmention.rocks session idea" (view diff)
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tantek wonders what Twitter "app" would look like if you could set a setting to only show you tweets with photos (not just links to photos)
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tantek a Tweetgram app as it were.
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gRegorLove I would love if they'd let me filter tweets by source. Source=instagram, hide it.
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gRegorLove I think the Tweetbot app has that.
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gRegorLove But I've never used it.
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KartikPrabhu manual filtering... but what about the algorithms?!
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gRegorLove Think about the algorithms! :)
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tantek Before they think about you?
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tantek is watching http://veganstraightedge.com/notes/2016/05/02/indieweb-lunch-time-lightning-tech-talk-from-2016-04-26-at-pivotal
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Loqi [Shane Becker] My #indieweb lunch time lightning tech talk (from 2016-04-26 at @pivotal).
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tantek wow I need to get myself a whiteboard scribe ;)
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gRegorLove aaronpk: I do something like this for wrapping long links. Can't find the original source, but this is close: https://kenneth.io/blog/2012/03/04/word-wrapping-hypernation-using-css/##The+solution
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Loqi [Kenneth Auchenberg] Word wrapping/hyphenation using CSS.
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aaronpk oh gosh. no wonder i always get it not quite right
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gRegorLove Super easy to remember! Haha
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tantek laptopstolen-- :(
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Loqi laptopstolen has -1 karma
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tantek "walled garden - too rosy of a description. I don't want to eat anything grown there." LOLOL shaners is killing it.
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tantek what is a walled garden?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "walled garden" yet. Would you like to create it? https://indiewebcamp.com/s/10KM
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tantek walled garden is /silo
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loqi.me created /walled_garden (+17) "prompted by tantek https://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2016-05-02/line/1462219573925 and dfn added by tantek" (view diff)
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Loqi ok
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GWG Afternoon
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Loqi [indieweb] "I am going to IndieWeb Summit 2016 in PDX, can't wait! I'm not sure yet if I'll be able to attend Day 0." https://kylewm.com/2016/05/i-am-going-to-indieweb-summit-2016-in-pdx-can-t-wait
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Loqi [indieweb] "I am going to IndieWeb Summit 2016 in PDX, can't wait! I'm not sure yet if I'll be able to attend Day 0." https://kylewm.com/2016/05/i-am-going-to-indieweb-summit-2016-in-pdx-can-t-wait
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GWG I have news
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GWG I think I can summit
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tantek kylewm: really hope you can attend day 0
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tantek GWG you too!!!
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GWG I just got the time off okay. Need to explore flight/accommodation
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aaronpk hooray!
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kylewm.com edited /User:Kylewm.com (+159) "/* Itches */ custom slugs" (view diff)
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tantek shaners++ that was a great off the cuff no slides talk, nicely done
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Loqi shaners has 35 karma
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[kevinmarks] I wonder why chrome doesn't do hyphenation
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aaronpk fixed the broken css, but i still think i'm going to replace it with the date instead of showing the URL
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[shaners] thanks, t!
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[shaners] kylewm: I have the same slugging problem on my “to fix” list. Contractions should have ’s removed before replacing spaces with hyphens, imo.
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[shaners] /2016/05/i-am-going-to-indieweb-summit-2016-in-pdx-can-t-wait
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kylewm yes good point. I noticed known does that
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kylewm also it removes https?://domain.com from URLs
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[shaners] aaronpk: Still seeing all the broken images in Slack. I’ve quit and re-opened. And it’s only the bridged (“bot” / irc) users’ avatars that are borked.
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[shaners] DMed you a screenshot
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[kevinmarks] They look OK in the android app
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[aaronpk] Huh yeah I see it too
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aaronpk everything looks fine in the backend. gonna blame it on a temporary slack error for now. if it stays broken til tomorrow i'll check again.
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@veganstraightedge I'm going to the IndieWeb Summit : http://veganstraightedge.com/articles/2016/05/02/rsvp-yes-to-indieweb-summit #rsvp (twitter.com/_/status/727241003195764737)
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Loqi [indieweb] "Comment on Happy #IndieWeb Birthday to Me! by Kevin Scott Creed" by Kevin Scott Creed http://boffosocko.com/2016/04/25/happy-indieweb-birthday-to-me/#comment-30411
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[shaners] Ok :+1::skin-tone-2:
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tantek I'm considering implementing /deleted in my storage back-end with a dt-deleted property
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tantek and then if present, returning a meta 410 for that post permalink, no title/content, as well as skipping it in stream / archive views
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gRegorLove aaronpk: Ti.to event says it's not live yet for IndieWeb Summit
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aaronpk oops yeah
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aaronpk i guess it's ready to go live :P
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@indiewebcamp RT @veganstraightedge My #indieweb lunch time lightning tech talk (from 2016-04-26 at @pivotal). https://vimeo.com/165022563 (twitter.com/_/status/727241412299751424)
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tantek aaronpk: how about a schedule is subject to change note on the 2016.indieweb.org page?
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tantek and perhaps a link to check the indiewebcamp wiki for the latest schedule details?
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aaronpk sure
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aaronpk oh also i only half finished updating the schedule grid
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aaronpk I did day 1, but day 2 is still old
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tantek oh? I think I tweaked day 1 on the wiki
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aaronpk no i mean the full grid
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aaronpk not the summary
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tantek oh yeah I've been updating https://indiewebcamp.com/2016#Schedule
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aaronpk http://indiewebcamp.com/2016/Schedule#Sunday_2016-06-05 doesn't match /2016
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tantek maybe we should fuzz /2016/Schedule until the summary gels
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aaronpk probably
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tantek.com edited /2016 (-9) "/* Schedule */ keep iterating day 1 talk thoughts" (view diff)
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[kevinmarks] Yay, woodwind no longer has glitched syndication targets from known
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[kevinmarks] Though they are a bit verbose now.
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tantek.com edited /2016 (+57) "/* Schedule */ more iterating" (view diff)
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tantek kevinmarks can you make it to IndieWeb Summit including Day 0 for the leaders summit?
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Loqi [indieweb] "Too many syndication targets to fit more than one post onscreen at a time #indieweb" by Kevin Marks http://known.kevinmarks.com/2016/too-many-syndication-targets-to-fit-more-than-one-post
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[kevinmarks] I need to see if I can fund it.
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tantek.com moved /2016/Düsseldorf/Session_Ideas to /2016/Düsseldorf/Sessions ""Sessions" was the page name we've used in the past for capturing session ideas etc."
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aaronpk okay, tito registration page is live!
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tantek.com created /2016/Sessions (+895) "stub with a bunch of leader summit sessions" (view diff)
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tantek aaronpk: should that be linked to from https://indiewebcamp.com/2016#RSVP ?
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aaronpk yes i need to update the /2016 page now
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aaronpk tweak the URLs and such
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aaronpk i won't be able to do that until later tonight
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tantek.com edited /JavaScript (+276) "criticism, Can Encourage Bad Engineering" (view diff)
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sandro aaronpk, tantek, I just discovered http://www.decentralizedweb.net/ Makes me very frustrated we made the F2F June 7-8 instead of 6-7.
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tantek sandro, I believe we scheduled first
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tantek thus I blame the organizers of "decentralizedweb" for not paying attention to W3C Social Web work
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sandro Any chance we can change? Do you think anyone's flying to Portland on the 6th, ie not for IWC?
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aaronpk heh speaking of pricing discussion, that conference is $75 for a ticket
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tantek sandro - it's also a bit odd since announced the IndieWeb Summit June 3-5 long before as well
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tantek not really reasonable to expect people to fly back/forth just for one day of a conference that has not seemed to try to engage anyone else in any actual "decentralized" web community or implementation for that matter
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sandro I don't follow your logic. Just IWC and DW go together fine in my travel. Actually if we had SWWG on June 6-7, then everything would work perfectly.
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tantek sandro both IW Summit and SWWG are in Portland
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tantek doesn't make sense to fly back/forth to SF just for one day
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aaronpk DW is *after* both
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aaronpk 8-9
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Loqi !calc 8-9
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tantek ok I'm confused
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tantek I thought they were overlapping?
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aaronpk right, w3c meeting is 7-8 right now
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aaronpk it *could* be IndieWeb Summit 3-5, W3C 6-7, Decentralized Web 8-9
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tantek aaronpk - sounds exhausting
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aaronpk indeed
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tantek would prefer the day off between IWS and SWWG to recharge
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sandro Yes, I was looking forward to that day off. But I'd also like to go with DW, especially since I'm going to be on the west coast.
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sandro I was *also* looking forward to....
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sandro I note the summit appears to have 17 organizers and 2 participants. :-)
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tantek which summit?
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tantek IndieWeb Summit only has 2 organizers currently :)
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aaronpk IIRC we specifically chose the w3c dates to include a day in between to recharge/prepare
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tantek sandro, perhaps you could try contacting them and asking if they could move theirs forward by a day?
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tantek to June 9-10?
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tantek since W3C SWWG meeting has been scheduled for quite some time
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[benwerdmuller] Whoa. Just seen that event. A little sad that nobody pinged us (right?) about it, even though there are definitely some organizers who overlap with this community
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tantek (thus I'm assuming flights / hotels have been purchased especially by those traveling long(er) distances)
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tantek I see what sandro was referring to: http://www.decentralizedweb.net/people/ 17 organizers vs. 2 participants?!?
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sandro They're using eventbright, so presumably a human needs to fill in the participants and hasnt done it yet. I registered and didn't show up automatically.
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aaronpk you can add yourself to the IndieWeb summit list by sending it a webmention! ;-)
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tantek in reviewing http://www.decentralizedweb.net/learn-more/ there also seems to be an odd plumbing-centric focus
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sandro ben_thatmustbeme, I don't know any of those folks. Any you know well enough to ask for some backstory? It looks fairly IPFS + Blockchain in style.
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tantek misread that as "fairy IPFS + Blockchain in style"
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aaronpk it actually looks like an IPFS meetup more or less
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tantek wait, is anyone who has actually worked on a Mars mission participating in IPFS? Otherwise I dispute the "IP" part of that acronym.
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[shaners] what is ipfs?
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[shaners] Loqi?
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Loqi is done
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Loqi IPFS is an abbreviation for “InterPlanetary File System”, self-described as “a new hypermedia distribution protocol”, yet does not appear to be selfdogfooded, and thus should be considered risky and experimental at best https://indiewebcamp.com/IPFS
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[shaners] Thanks!
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aaronpk can we get a few more indie RSVPs here? :D http://2016.indieweb.org/
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Loqi IndieWeb Summit
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aaronpk Loqi needs to have better text expansions of h-events
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Loqi woot!
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tantek aaronpk do you POSSE your indie event posts to Twitter?
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aaronpk i don't think i have
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tantek I'm wondering if there is any prior art for plain text event design that could/should document
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[shaners] I tried to indie RSVP from the CLI, aaronpk. But got an “unknown errror”.
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tantek because that's basically what you're asking for when you say "text expansion"
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KartikPrabhu I have received text invitations through email
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[shaners] Someone mind looking at mf2 on my rsvp post to make sure I’m not messing something up?
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[shaners] http://veganstraightedge.com/articles/2016/05/02/rsvp-yes-to-indieweb-summit
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Loqi [Shane Becker] I'm going to the IndieWeb Summit
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[shaners] http://pin13.net/mf2/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fveganstraightedge.com%2Farticles%2F2016%2F05%2F02%2Frsvp-yes-to-indieweb-summit
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aaronpk ooh i think I wasn't looking for "Yes", only "yes"
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[benwerdmuller] I wonder if it’s too late to apply to that event with a “why I don’t believe in a completely distributed web [and indieweb is a better answer]” talk proposal
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tantek benwerdmuller worth trying just to see what the response is
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[shaners] aaronpk: Gotcha. Should I change on my end? Or you wanna downcase on your end?
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sandro The person who pointed me at DW disputes the "IPFS Meetup" label, vehemently. Apparently, the meeting is inspired by http://brewster.kahle.org/2015/08/11/locking-the-web-open-a-call-for-a-distributed-web-2/
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tantek aaronpk, shaners should p-rsvp be case-insensitive?
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tantek I'm thinking yes
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[shaners] I think so
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aaronpk i just added downcase, although that isn't the actual problem, cause you would have seen a different message
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tantek yeah we should have written a response position piece to Brewster's post a while ago
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tantek too busy actually building & shipping though ;)
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aaronpk [shaners]: i just sent a WM for you from curl and it worked fine
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aaronpk tho you don't have a picture
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tantek Loqi, how long until blockchain-all-the-things implodes the way XML-all-the-things imploded?
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Loqi I don't know
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Loqi woot!
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[shaners] Dang. I have my photo in my footer’s h-card. But not my h-entry’s h-card.
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aaronpk hm, that isn't covered on /authorship i think
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[shaners] Guess not. I’ll get that fixed.
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@benwerd The Indie Web Summit in Portland is go. I'll definitely be there. http://2016.indieweb.org/ #openweb #socialmedia (twitter.com/_/status/727262555714932736)
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aaronpk i did a pretty faithful implementation of /authorship for XRay (which is what the site is using)
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tantek sandro, did the person who pointed at DW have any answers for why they seem to be completely ignoring or ignorant of W3C Social Web or IndieWebCamp state of the art?
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[shaners] If I fix and re-webmention, will it update my image or add a second rsvp of me to the list?
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aaronpk it *should* update
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aaronpk as in, it's a bug if it adds you twice
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tantek exactly
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aaronpk pretty sure i did that right yesterday
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aaronpk (just don't change your source URL otherwise it counts as a different webmention)
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[shaners] Ok. I’ll do it and we’ll see what happens.
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aaronpk 👍
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tantek aaronpk: what about redirects?
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aaronpk i'm not doing any redirect handling on that site right now
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tantek shaners, and then add yourself to https://indiewebcamp.com/rsvp#IndieWeb_Examples
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aaronpk is that even in the spec?
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tantek aaronpk it's in webmention yes
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tantek or certainly was in the wiki version :)
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aaronpk what do you mean "what about redirects" then?
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aaronpk the only thing in the spec is that the receiver should follow redirects when fetching the content
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aaronpk nothing about updating the canonical URL of the webmention
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tantek updates too right?
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tantek if not, then the updates section should explicitly mention it!
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tantek so redirects don't count as new webmentions
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aaronpk there are two different cases to handle for redirects
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aaronpk both worth documenting
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tantek ok made p-rsvp enums case-insensitive
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aaronparecki.com edited /2016 (+14) "update URLs and cost" (view diff)
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Loqi [indienews] New post: "Registration for IndieWeb Summit is open! http://2016.indieweb.org Pretty thrilled to be doing this for the 6th year in PDX!" https://aaronparecki.com/2016/05/02/9/indieweb-summit
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@aaronpk Registration for IndieWeb Summit is open! http://2016.indieweb.org Pretty thrilled to be doing this for the 6th year in PDX! (twitter.com/_/status/727267594915352576)
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@indiewebcamp RT @benwerd The Indie Web Summit in Portland is go. I'll definitely be there. http://2016.indieweb.org/ #openweb #socialmedia (twitter.com/_/status/727266154717188096)
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Loqi [indieweb] "Registration for IndieWeb Summit is open! http://2016.indieweb.org Pretty thrilled to be doing this for..."
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tantek sandro, would "IPFS + blockchain meetup" be a more accurate description then?
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Loqi [indieweb] "IndieWeb Summit 2016 - Portland, Oregon" http://2016.indieweb.org/
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kylewm KevinMarks: do you have any ideas for shrinking those syndication targets so they're a little more manageable?
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[shaners] aaronpk: Add my image to my entry’s h-card. Webmentioned from CLI again. Same error.
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[shaners] https://gist.github.com/veganstraightedge/82d474e4a89e8aeaca58df7394aa30d9
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aaronpk What's the actual response you're getting?
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aaronpk that looks like an error from whatever tool you're using to send webmentions
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veganstraightedge.com edited /rsvp (+196) (view diff)
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[shaners] aaronpk: I don’t know the actual error. My gist is the only error I’m shown.
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[shaners] Is there a curl snippet that I can copy/pasta from somewhere?
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aaronpk curl http://2016.indieweb.org/webmention.php -d source=* -d target=*
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aaronpk webmentions are easy!
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aaronpk what's that tool tho? it could really benefit from a little more error reporting
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[shaners] I’m using https://github.com/indieweb/mention-client-ruby btw
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aaronpk wow I forgot there was a CLI command in that
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[shaners] :stuck_out_tongue:
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aaronpk i made a point of returning helpful errors from the webmention endpoint
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[shaners] "Thanks! Your RSVP is listed on the event page now! Go ahead and register for the "Indie RSVP" ticket!"
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[shaners] Image did not update, it seems
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aaronpk heh
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aaronpk i didn't add svg support
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[shaners] Do you need to? Should Just Work™, right?
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aaronpk svg isn't one of the image types returned by the exif library, so i will have to check for the explicitly
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[shaners] It’s a URL in the @src
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[shaners] oh i see
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aaronpk well, it will Just Work™ the same way that it will Just Work™ to upload executable php code to the server and pwn it
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aaronpk (I download the image to the server and host it locally)
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[shaners] Riiiiiight. That. :smile:
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sknebel hm, sanitizing svgs is probably really tricky
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[shaners] aaronpk: Lemme know when you get time to add svg support and I’ll re-wm.
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kylewm (KevinMarks: nevermind, I think the right answer is a service icon, and those are TODO atm)
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sknebel with javascript embedded and all that
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tantek aaronpk, sknebel you may be interested in SVG Secure static mode: https://www.w3.org/TR/svg-integration/#secure-static-mode
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aaronpk fixed!
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aaronpk but yes i should do more thorough svg sanitization probably :/
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[shaners] :+1::skin-tone-2:
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aaronpk in the mean time, plz don't webmention with an svg with javascript in it
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sknebel if they are in <img> tags, they should be relatively secure if I read tanteks link and https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/SVG/SVG_as_an_Image correctly
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aaronpk oh okay cool
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aaronpk wow 3 registrations already!
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[shaners] ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ All I know is that my avatar was MUCH smaller as svg than as png/gif/jpg
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aaronpk even smaller than png/gif? i'm surprised! it seems like it would compress well that way
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[shaners] GIF: 14kb
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[shaners] PNG: 4kb
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[shaners] SVG: 1kb
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tantek impressive
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[shaners] Wouldn’t be true for a photo, of course. I just happen to have an image that works well as vector.
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[shaners] And no complicated curves
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aaronpk wow
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