#indieweb 2016-11-28

2016-11-28 UTC
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Loqi [indieweb] "via: @benwerd #platformcoop "Cooperatives might be a solution. Decentralized networks might be a solution. #indieweb might be a solution. Design thinking can help us test" by Grant Potter on 2016-11-28 http://known.networkeffects.ca/2016/via-benwerd-platformcoop-cooperatives-might-be-a-solution-decentralized-networks
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@bitcoinagile via: @benwerd #platformcoop Cooperatives might be a solution. Decentralized networks might http://bitcoinagile.com/991576/via-benwerd-platformcoop-cooperatives-might-be-a-solution-decentralized-networks-might-be-a-solution-indieweb-might-be-a-solution-design-thinking-can-help-us-test_stream https://twitter.com/bitcoinagile/status/803031044438028289/photo/1 (twitter.com/_/status/803031044438028289)
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@Veki551155 via: benwerd #platformcoop Cooperatives might be a solution. Decentralized networks might http://bitcoinagile.com/991576/via-benwerd-platformcoop-cooperatives-might-be-a-solution-decentralized-networks-might-be-a-solution-indieweb-might-be-a-solution-design-thinking-can-help-us-test_stream https://twitter.com/bitcoinagile/status/803031044438028289/photo/1 (twitter.com/_/status/803031296826085377)
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@alt_bit_coins via: benwerd #platformcoop Cooperatives might be a solution. Decentralized networks might http://bitcoinagile.com/991576/via-benwerd-platformcoop-cooperatives-might-be-a-solution-decentralized-networks-might-be-a-solution-indieweb-might-be-a-solution-design-thinking-can-help-us-test_stream https://twitter.com/bitcoinagile/status/803031044438028289/photo/1 (twitter.com/_/status/803031491123048448)
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@residualbitcoin via: benwerd #platformcoop Cooperatives might be a solution. Decentralized networks might http://bitcoinagile.com/991576/via-benwerd-platformcoop-cooperatives-might-be-a-solution-decentralized-networks-might-be-a-solution-indieweb-might-be-a-solution-design-thinking-can-help-us-test_stream https://twitter.com/bitcoinagile/status/803031044438028289/photo/1… (twitter.com/_/status/803032245917335552)
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gRegorLove Been thinking about /read posts lately. I knew Facebook had something for that but hadn't looked into it before today. Documented the UI on https://indieweb.org/read#Facebook
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gRegorLove That status dialog seems new to me, though I don't post much on FB so maybe I'm just late to the game.
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Loqi [indieweb] "Open Source Hardware Camp 2015" by oshug.org on 2016-11-28 http://oshug.org/event/oshcamp2015
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@sandeshkumard The latest The Executives Dairy! https://t.co/wGBbf9N2Mb Thanks to @annkur #indieweb #americanfall (twitter.com/_/status/803038651538030593)
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bignose <URL: https://indieweb.org/How_to_set_up_web_sign-in_on_your_own_domain> tells me “See indieauth.com for a list of which of your services it can use to log you in.”
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bignose at <URL: https://indieauth.com/#supported-providers> I see a collection of logos, including GnuPG.
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bignose what “authentication provider” is meant by that?
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GWG bignose: I think https://indieauth.com/gpg answers that.
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bignose GWG: thanks. there needs to be a link from that GnuPG logo, to that page, then.
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GWG Quite possibly.
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bignose “[…] with typical user interfaces that encourage excessively lengthy messages, in contrast to texting.” <URL: https://indieweb.org/Email>
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bignose I have to hope that's sarcasm, or at least tongue-in-cheek.
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gRegorLove Probably based on real-life experience :)
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tantek good evening #indieweb
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tantek what's with all the bitcoin retweet spam?
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tantek bignose no sarcasm at all. big text field = encouragement to people to type a lot
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tantek in contrast to one-line text filed (IRC, IM, txt)
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tantek or smallish text-field with char-count (Twitter, some commenting systems)
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tantek hmm, I'm going to need to add "interested" support to /Falcon RSVPs for my /2017-01-01-commitment
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tantek realizing how often I click "interested" on FB events, when that really should be a post on my own site
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tantek has anyone seen "interested" RSVP posts anywhere? like "your friends a, b, and c are interested in event e"?
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gRegorLove Hey tantek. I only think I've seen that on FB, though not for "interested", only "attending"
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[kevinmarks] Interested is a rebranded maybe
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bignose tantek: and the implication that longer-than-SMS is “excessively lengthy”?
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bignose that's what I am hoping is not serious.
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bignose we need long-form discussion to regain popularity, IMO. the current interfaces that encourage only short-form messages are deadly to nuance, at a time when absence of nuance is itself deadly.
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Zegnat Good morning IndieWeb!
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Loqi Zegnat: tantek left you a message 2 days, 12 hours ago: definitely add any/all HWCs to the template!
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julianf bignose, GWG: I created a pull request for your 'linkify the GPG provider icon' suggestion: https://github.com/aaronpk/IndieAuth.com/pull/132
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julianf bear: Just noticed your "archives" link is broken, on e.g. https://bear.im/bearlog/2016/331/my-2017-indieweb-commitment.html
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Loqi [Mike Taylor] My 2017 IndieWeb Commitment
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Zegnat !tell tantek thanks for adding last week's HWC to the the template before I got to it :)
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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petermolnar Zegnat any suggested exact locations for HWC Schiphol?
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Loqi petermolnar: Zegnat left you a message 4 days ago: you can now RSVP on Schiphol. https://indieweb.org/events/2016-11-30-homebrew-website-club
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petermolnar I'm guessing we should choose from https://www.schiphol.nl/Travellers/FoodRelax/BeforePassportControl2/FoodDrinks.htm
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Zegnat petermolnar, yeah, I am not very versed in the pre-control stuff. Any idea which of those is most likely to provide possible charging points?
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petermolnar no idea, I'm relatively familiar with the inside, the outside I never really dealt with
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Zegnat I am guessing Starbucks and Balcony Bar might be the easiest for us to walk in and secure a table at, without annoying too many people if we pull out laptops.
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petermolnar I simply don't care about annoying people by pulling out a laptop, but I do agree on the locations
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cweiske can you move such discussions to #indiechat?
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petermolnar well.. it's a HWC location, so it's kind of indieweb relevant
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Zegnat I think this is the right channel. We definitely want others interested in HWC Amsterdam (sebsel) to join in the discussion. Or people who are not here right now to read it in the logs (cmal / yobj). indiechat is not logged.
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tantek good morning #indieweb
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Loqi tantek: Zegnat left you a message 1 hour, 18 minutes ago: thanks for adding last week's HWC to the the template before I got to it :)
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tantek !tell bignose we don't need long-form discussion, if by that you mean email. email lists are largely useless, and yes, excessively lengthy, paragraphs of people writing just to see themselves type or something. blog posts OTOH are to be encouraged.
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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tantek worse than short-form is long-form that is short on content. which is what nearly all email is.
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Zegnat Hello tantek :)
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tantek kevinmarks - re: interested vs. maybe - that's not what the research showed http://microformats.org/wiki/rsvp-examples
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Zegnat petermolnar: should we just put the meetup at Starbucks Plaza? If it is crowded we can always move. I'll be wearing IWC merch and should be easily spotable
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Loqi rsvp-examples
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petermolnar yes; that's fairly easy to find as well
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tantek Zegnat - print out a sign too if you can and put it on the table, standing it up if possible
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tantek might get some people to ask what is it
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petermolnar tantek which sign, iwc, or is there a hwc sign?
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tantek "maybe" indicates some intent to try to attend/participate in an event. whereas "interested" is more like "watching" or "tracking" where no actual intention of participating or chance thereof is even communicated
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tantek petermolnar: I believe shaners made signs for some of the HWC LA meetups
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Zegnat Hmm, not sure if I can get access to a good printer before wednesday. We don't usually print here at the office.
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petermolnar I can
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tantek hmm - I can't find a "sign" to just print from the wiki.
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tantek petermolnar: perhaps check some of the past HWC photos of LA?
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petermolnar just send me a sign ( / off https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n9HKsvHgs8Q )
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Zegnat Wiki is updated to list Starbucks as the location, with a caveat of crowdedness and a nudge to reach out to me.
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[sebsel] tantek: isn’t a ‘interested’ more like a ‘like’?
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[sebsel] Starbucks is fine with me!
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tantek sebsel, interested does have similar effects to like, but I think it is something more
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tantek "interested" tends to convey a sense of "send me updates about this thing"
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tantek whereas "like" does not necessarily mean that
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Zegnat "like" on Facebook almost always means that you get updates though
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Zegnat !tell KevinMarks did your HTTPS certificate lapse on your Known site? Are you aware of any issues?
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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Loqi [indieweb] "@robdolin will check. Need #tech usage guides more than ideas now. And post more on your site than Twitter! #indieweb" on 2016-11-28 http://tantek.com/2016/333/t1/post-more-on-your-site
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@t @robdolin will check. Need #tech usage guides more than ideas now. And post more on your site than Twitter! #indieweb (ttk.me t4kZ1) (twitter.com/_/status/803241153109835776)
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Loqi [indieweb] "@robdolin will check. Need #tech usage guides more than ideas now. And post more on your site than Twitter! #indieweb" on 2016-11-28 http://tantek.com/2016/333/t2/post-more-on-your-site
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@t @robdolin will check. Need #tech usage guides more than ideas now. And post more on your site than Twitter! #indieweb (ttk.me t4kZ2) (twitter.com/_/status/803241459482824704)
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[sebsel] Another thing: what about the RSVP ‘went’.
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[sebsel] I thought I saw that somewhere, but not sure where.
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[sebsel] But it’s like: saying you have gone to the event.
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tantek sebsel - feel free to add to microformats.org/wiki/rsvp-brainstorming
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[sebsel] Or is that not an RSVP?
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[sebsel] will do!
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tantek and when you find examples of actual "went" RSVPs in the wild (e.g. in UIs), add them to microformats.org/wiki/rsvp-examples
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Zegnat sebsel, I think Facebook allows me to do "went" RSVPs.
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tantek screenshots!
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[sebsel] Ah, I will need to make an account then ;)
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tantek sorry!
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Zegnat I don't Facebook @ Work tantek, maybe you should ask petermolnar for that ;)
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Zegnat If Loqi could remind me in about 3 hours to check Facebook and get screenshots, it can be done
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Zegnat !remind in 3 hours Check Facebook for "went" RSVPs.
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Zegnat !reminder in 3 hours Check Facebook for "went" RSVPs.
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cweiske Zegnat, https://indieweb.org/Loqi#Commands_and_Queries
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Zegnat 3 hours until Zegnat should check Facebook for "went" RSVPs and document them.
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Loqi I added a countdown scheduled for 2016-11-28 6:23pm CET (#5966)
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Zegnat cweiske++ thanks, I forgot we had the commands wikified
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Loqi cweiske has 62 karma in this channel (70 overall)
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Zegnat New issue for HWC branding: https://github.com/indieweb/branding/issues/8
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petermolnar I'm not going to screenshot fb@work, I'm fairly certain I'm not allowed to do that
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Zegnat Probably for the best
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petermolnar but to answer the question, I don't see a "went" item there
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petermolnar on past events
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Zegnat Though I would love to see their event interface. I am guessing they do offer something for booking meetings? I haven't taken the "Workplace by Facebook" video tour yet
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petermolnar I'm not aware of any
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petermolnar thing like that
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[schmarty] petermolnar: likewise. on fb events where I RSVP'd "Going", the event page still says "Going", not "Went".
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Zegnat That's too bad. I know a lot of people that use Facebook mainly for events and groups. Would be weird of them not to have capitalised on that for Workplace :/
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petermolnar fb is horrible for events
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petermolnar finding old events on it is terrible imho
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Zegnat Oh definitely horrible interface, but people use it as a hub nontheless.
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Zegnat What is Workplace by Facebook?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "Workplace by Facebook" yet. Would you like to create it?
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Zegnat Workplace by Facebook is https://workplace.fb.com/
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Loqi ok
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petermolnar a long while ago there was a php-based custom cms site, which listed "events" as well. the interface was dead simple, flat, at max. reply-to marked, paged discussion + some event description. Someone posted a going, the rest replied by adding themselves to the list and adding it back as a comment, so you ended up with a long list of people in the most recent comment.
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petermolnar once the event was done people went back to comment how it was
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petermolnar this I really, really miss from fb & similar
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petermolnar kind of like Tumblr reactions, now that I think of it
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Zegnat What I don't like about Tumblr reactions (notes) is that they are threaded but are never displayed that way. Gets very confusing when you get to high numbers.
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petermolnar I'm heavily against threaded comments; it makes it too easy to go off track
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Zegnat But that's what Tumblr reactions are. Someone reacts on a specific instance of a reblog/reaction, without knowing what other people have added on other reblogs. What makes Tumblrs system better to you, petermolnar?
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petermolnar it's not, it was just an observation, that it's similar
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petermolnar I don't like the threadedness, but threads vs quotes-in-quotes are quite similar
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Zegnat I guess quotes-in-quotes is the right description. Though in a classic BBS replies collection I would expect to see quotes-in-quotes while also expecting most people to have read the entire one-thread. In a multi-threaded replies collection I don't think any such expectation is warranted. In the case of Tumblr, posts would display notes in a one-th
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Zegnat read view, but they often get written in a multi-threaded way (people only read the one thread they reblog). O personally think that might be worse than either system by itself.
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petermolnar ( btw I wrote this a while ago about this topic: https://petermolnar.net/nested-comments-are-bad/ )
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Loqi [Peter Molnar] Internet, please forget threaded comments
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Zegnat Added to reading list :)
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cweiske petermolnar, what do you think about disqus' solution to threading?
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cweiske threading << https://petermolnar.net/nested-comments-are-bad/
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Loqi There was an error: Array
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Loqi [Peter Molnar] Internet, please forget threaded comments
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cweiske "<Loqi> There was an error: Array"
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cweiske !tell aaronpk "<Loqi> There was an error: Array"
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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cweiske reply << https://petermolnar.net/nested-comments-are-bad/
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Loqi [Peter Molnar] Internet, please forget threaded comments
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Loqi ok, I added "https://petermolnar.net/nested-comments-are-bad/" to the "See Also" section of /reply
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petermolnar wow, I broke Loqi :D
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cweiske "threading" does not exist in the wiki
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cweiske maybe that's the error
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petermolnar ah
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petermolnar I thought it was my site
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cweiske what is threading?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "threading" yet. Would you like to create it?
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cweiske threading is [reply-chain]
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Loqi ok
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petermolnar has unicode chars in the bottom h-card, just for the lulz
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cweiske what is a thread?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "thread" yet. Would you like to create it?
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cweiske thread is [[reply-chain]]
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Loqi ok
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cweiske reply-chain << https://petermolnar.net/nested-comments-are-bad/
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Loqi ok, I added "https://petermolnar.net/nested-comments-are-bad/" to the "See Also" section of /reply-chain
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Loqi [Peter Molnar] Internet, please forget threaded comments
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Zegnat petermolnar: I Have Unicode characters in my name on Facebook. Makes me extra hard to find
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@aronski The latest The essential-minds Daily! https://t.co/MNngyS7OFL Thanks to @shansell @cgerrish #indieweb #soundwalkcollective (twitter.com/_/status/803041478184468480)
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aaronpk good morning!
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Loqi aaronpk: cweiske left you a message 1 hour, 27 minutes ago: "<Loqi> There was an error: Array"
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aaronpk i should really fix that error message
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Loqi agreed.
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aaronpk i miss silopub
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Loqi misses silopub too
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[schmarty] was missing woodwind, spun up a personal instance.
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aaronpk i've never run a python app before, is it complicated?
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petermolnar not really
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[schmarty] in my case i set it up with nginx and uwsgi
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petermolnar aaronpk actually, it depends, is it a plain cli app, a standalone web app or something that should be run in *wsgi?
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[schmarty] created an upstart job to run the uwsgi bits and an nginx config that (i think?) works like it ought to
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[schmarty] i'll turn my notes into a blog post.
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aaronpk petermolnar: lol i don't know :)
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bear aaronpk - depends on what the python app uses for the web parts: flask, django, something else -- that determines how you run it as a daemon to point nginx at
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aaronpk it's a whole new world for me
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bear what is the app?
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Loqi Apps are less functional versions of web sites that are usually restricted to one or more proprietary platforms https://indieweb.org/app
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tantek pretty much
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KartikPrabhu for woodwind see: https://github.com/kylewm/woodwind
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bear ah - woodwind is a Flask app and he provides the uwsgi configuration file -- kylewm++
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bear kylewm++ for woodwind documentation
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Loqi kylewm has 300 karma in this channel (354 overall)
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aaronpk checks silopub documentation
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bear silopub has the same level of docs
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bear oops - not docs, but same files -- read the woodwind README and swap out the silopub files
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tantek reloads https://indieweb.org/2017-01-01-commitments to see if there are any new ones
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aaronpk hasn't totally decided his 2017-01-01 commitment yet
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aaronpk i'll probably try to set up silo.pub on my server later today, cause I really miss being able to POSSE
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tantek what is workplace?
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Loqi Workplace is "enterprise social networking", a corporate focused social media silo feature by Facebook https://indieweb.org/Workplace
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tantek Zegnat - perhaps you could redirect the new article to /Workplace instead?
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tantek KartikPrabhu: any thoughts for 2017-01-01 for your site?
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tantek aaronpk you have til HWC SF to come up with something to announce :)
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aaronpk oh yeah I need to un-rsvp to that :P
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aaronpk last minute change of plans
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[sebsel] in my commitment I name ‘Twitter’ as the silo to own, but now I did Instagram. Including an iOS Workflow.is workflow to make actual POSSE do-able :D
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[sebsel] So Twitter is still on the list for me.
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[sebsel] twitter is harder because it’s more.
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tantek sebsel, to me Instagram is harder because there's no posting API to POSSE to it
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[sebsel] yeah, Workflow has a action ‘Post to Instagram’, which takes you to the app, and it has a ‘Get contents of URL’, which is able of POST-requests.
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[sebsel] Maybe I should document my workflow then
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tantek oh that's interesting!
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tantek sebsel - yes please do!
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[sebsel] should I document my progress on my commitments on the commitmentpage as well?
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aaronpk I really *want* to have 2017 be the year I own my checkins, but I feel like there are still a few missing pieces before I can do that
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tantek sebsel - yes! see previous years commitment pages for how people did that
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tantek aaronpk: can you document what you figured out so far, what you think is missing, and what you don't know in a section on https://indieweb.org/checkin#Brainstorming ?
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tantek sebsel - could you document how you POSSE to IG here? https://indieweb.org/Instagram#POSSE
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miklb perks up at POSSE to IG
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[sebsel] What is Workflow?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "Workflow" yet. Would you like to create it?
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[sebsel] Workflow is an iOS app used to automate various actions. With the advanced ‘Get contents of URL’ it can be used for Micropub
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Loqi ok
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[sebsel] Workflow << https://workflow.is
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Loqi ok, I added "https://workflow.is" to the "See Also" section of /Workflow
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Loqi Zegnat should check Facebook for "went" RSVPs and document them.
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Loqi Countdown set by Zegnat on 2016-11-28 at 3:23pm CET
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Zegnat Thank you Loqi. There is no “went” RSVP but I will still try to capture some screenshots
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tantek interesting side-effect of my code auto-internet-archiving everything my notes link/reply-to - any tweets I reply to are backed up in the internet archive, even if people delete them
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tantek and because of the slight (1-2min?) delay in actual crawling of anything by the internet archive, it gets my replies to those in-reply-to tweets as well! e.g. https://web.archive.org/web/20161128172810/https://twitter.com/evanwolf/status/803021682382229504
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@evanwolf @t simple/fast/cheap/sure: assign small team to walk through every executive order from the last 3 presidents, select to undo, and signaway (twitter.com/_/status/803021682382229504)
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tantek for some reason Twitter thinks the internet archive crawler is in Korea though (note the UI)
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tantek really needs a payment page too
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tantek people keep asking me for my Venmo name
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tantek what is payment?
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Loqi payment in the context of the indieweb refers to a feature on an indie web site that provides a way for the visitor to that website to pay (currency, gift card credit, etc.) the person represented by that indie web site https://indieweb.org/payment
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[sebsel] I got my workflow in /Workflow, tantek!
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tantek has anyone made a /payment page with simple links like that? similar to my /contact page on my site?
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tantek sebsel++ thanks!
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Loqi sebsel has 2 karma
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Zegnat What is Venmo?
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Loqi Venmo is a payment application and social network that recently stopped allowing new developers to use their API https://indieweb.org/Venmo
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aaronpk hm good idea. i was just working on my contact page last night.
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[sebsel] I’ll also share the workflow, but I wrote it all out in plaintext for the sake of documenting :)
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aaronpk simplified "communications protocol" like documentation, and updated with icons and headers: https://aaronparecki.com/contact/
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tantek nice aaronpk!
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tantek I think since you include at least a few links to direct specific comm methods, you should add it to https://indieweb.org/contact#IndieWeb_Examples
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[sebsel] what is workflow?
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Loqi Workflow is an iOS app used to automate various actions https://indieweb.org/Workflow
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[sebsel] workflow is Workflow
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[sebsel] ah.
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[sebsel] nvm.
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[sebsel] Loqi is not case sentitive, but the wiki is
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miklb sebsel++
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Loqi sebsel has 3 karma
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tantek right, and better to use the proper capitalization for proper nouns
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[schmarty] hello, indieweb! i wrote up a quick document on how i set up a self-hosted Woodwind on my own server: https://martymcgui.re/2016/11/28/124055/
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Loqi [Marty McGuire] Self-Hosting kylewm's Woodwind Indie Reader
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[schmarty] and i immediately see a comma splice in my intro text only now.
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tantek Woodwind << https://martymcgui.re/2016/11/28/124055/
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Loqi ok, I added "https://martymcgui.re/2016/11/28/124055/" to the "See Also" section of /Woodwind
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Loqi [Marty McGuire] Self-Hosting kylewm's Woodwind Indie Reader
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[sebsel] I will leave it as is then
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[sebsel] But I added templates to my workflows to /workflow
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[schmarty] thanks, tantek!
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miklb [sebsel] I'm confused on getting the token
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miklb probably needs to look at this when can focus completely
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[sebsel] Ah, yeah, I assumed you got a token.
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[sebsel] You can steal one from Quill...
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[sebsel] if you want your own, see /obtaining-an-access-token
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[sebsel] I added the link to the wiki too
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[sebsel] Ah, also: on indieauth.com/developers is a guide on how you can get web signin working, but that is NOT an access token. It took me some time too.
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[sebsel] aaronpk: maybe add a guide for obtaining an access token too?
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[sebsel] can’t we make a page that requests access tokens for people who otherwise steal a token from Quill? :P
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GWG Afternoon
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GWG How are people committing for 2017?
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aaronpk [sebsel]: obtaining an access token is dependent on your own token endpoint, not indieauth.com
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tantek GWG, so far, by blogging their commitments then adding a link to their posts to the /2017-01-01-commitments page
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[sebsel] oh, good point :o
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aaronpk i wrote a command line script to generate tokens for myself since my token endpoint is part of my p3k software
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GWG tantek, I am looking for inspiration
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gRegorLove bear: am I reading your 2017 commitment right that you're setting up a copy of your Twitter stream (everyone you follow), or just your own tweets?
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bear both
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gRegorLove Nice!
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bear my goal is to make my tweets originate from my posts (classic POSSE) but I also want a feed/list/stream of who I follow
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GWG davidmead's commitment makes me sad.
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GWG I am always hoping people want to make great plugins greater before stopping their use.
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snarfed bear: https://twitter-atom.appspot.com/ ! (and/or https://granary-demo.appspot.com/ )
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tantek GWG, I did ask him to document the challenges he is running into so that others can at least try to help improve them
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bear snarfed - yea, I saw your earlier ping and have that github repo bookmarked
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snarfed great! they're hopefully usable as end user apps, no need to touch the code, but up to you
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tantek GWG, I think you can mix both your observations. looking for inspiration, and instead of feeling sad about what davidmead has committed, look at it as an opportunity to get real feedback (inspiration!) on what to fix in WP plugins for 2017-01-01
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bear my ego wants me to use python-twitter (since I maintain it) but my OSS brain says to use granary to help make it better
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gRegorLove I thought the API was restrictive for getting your whole following stream, except for the limited list of approved app developers
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GWG tantek, so did I. You know how hard WordPress can be to work with Microformats due its design.
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tantek GWG, but you and others here have made WordPress work, reliably too
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tantek so that means that figuring out what's happening with davidmead's site is likely going to help fix some bugs in plugins, or at least provide better instructions about which plugins to use together (and which not to)
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GWG Yes, but it means an out of the box solution limits the freedom to use any theme you want.
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GWG I am always willing to help, I was speaking big picture.
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tantek make it clear that that's due to WordPress limitations (you can even cite the bugs you filed)
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GWG And which got closed wontfix.
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tantek regardless, I think you would have a very productive conversation with davidmead
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tantek right that's my point
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tantek because they got closed wontfix, you can pretty much blame wordpress for the theme limitations.
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GWG I just wish I could easily achieve what people want. One click conversion of an existing site.
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tantek I'm not even sure what that means
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GWG Maybe I should update pfefferle's wordpress-uf2 plugin.
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GWG tantek, you have an existing WordPress site and you install something that makes it an Indieweb site with one click?
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GWG That is what people expect
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GWG But I keep pushing forward I guess.
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aaronpk gRegorLove: I didn't think twitter was locked down *that* much ... yet
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gRegorLove "make it an indieweb site" is really ambiguous
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gRegorLove aaronpk: I have no idea, just vaguely recalling years ago when they locked down third-party developers a lot. May not affect single users.
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aaronpk i thought that was more of a policy thing rather than technical thing
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tantek gReg say IndieMark level 2 or so :)
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tantek gRegorLove: ^^^
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gRegorLove Heh, points for each part of IndieMark. Hadn't seen that before. And a calculator: https://aaronjorbin.github.io/indiemark-score/
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miklb curious little WP Plugin https://github.com/SchemaCreator/schema-creator
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tantek miklb do you have a 2017-01-01 commitment for your personal site?
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miklb tantek not yet. I'm a bit in flux currently. I want to switch back to Habari from Jekyll and build out indie tools for it, but doubtful I can get it done before 1st.
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miklb I suppose if I make a commitment to a subset of tools and converting back, it might be doable. The indieweb webmention. library should help for sending and just continue to use webmention.io for receiving is a possibility. I'd loose micropub for the foreseeable future too.
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miklb I just don't see my current set of tools as maintainable and need to do some serious reflection as to how to achieve in a controllable fashion what I'd like
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KevinMarks1 I made a HWC variant of the old logo, but I wouldn't really recommend it http://svgur.com/s/1k
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Loqi homebrew website club logo http://svgur.com/i/1k.svg
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KevinMarks1 Zegnat, I don't have an https cert for any of mysubdomains on kevinmarks.com
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tantek miklb - it would definitely be interesting to understand what about Jekyll you have found to be not maintainable
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tantek miklb, maybe consider adding a "Maintenance" section on https://indieweb.org/Jekyll ?
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tantek even if it's just vague thoughts / experiences
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miklb I'm working on a post mortem.
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miklb it's less about Jekyll and more about what I want out of my blog and the tools necessary to accomplish that
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Loqi [indieweb] "Homebrew Website Club San Francisco 2016-11-30" by Kevin Marks on 2016-11-19 http://known.kevinmarks.com/2016/homebrew-website-club-san-francisco-2016-11-30
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Loqi [indieweb] "A face detection api in the browser? Interesting #indieweb applications there: https://paul.kinlan.me/face-detection/" by Kevin Marks on 2016-11-23 http://known.kevinmarks.com/2016/a-face-detection-api-in-the-browser-interesting-indieweb-applications
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Loqi [indieweb] "“CAP only applies to writes. Reads can be consistent, available and partition tolerant.” https://bentrask.com/?q=hash://sha256/6f16ec6e773bb9747d4d3af0 #Indieweb" by Kevin Marks on 2016-11-27 http://known.kevinmarks.com/2016/cap-only-applies-to-writes-reads-can-be-consistent-available
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Loqi [indieweb] "“Debates about workers rights are increasingly debates about code.” @richardjpope http://blog.memespring.co.uk/2016/11/23/oscon-2016/ #Indieweb" by Kevin Marks on 2016-11-27 http://known.kevinmarks.com/2016/debates-about-workers-rights-are-increasingly-debates-about-code-richardjpope
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KevinMarks1 post to known, superfeedr wakes up?
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Zegnat printer << https://uxdesign.cc/i-totally-forgot-about-print-style-sheets-f1e6604cfd6
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Loqi There was an error: Array
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Zegnat printing << https://uxdesign.cc/i-totally-forgot-about-print-style-sheets-f1e6604cfd6
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Loqi ok, I added "https://uxdesign.cc/i-totally-forgot-about-print-style-sheets-f1e6604cfd6" to the "See Also" section of /printing
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Zegnat oops
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tantek what is a printer?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "printer" yet. Would you like to create it?
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tantek lol
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Zegnat I don’t know why I could not write printing in one go
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tantek printer is a low-cost device that runs proprietary software, consumes thin sheets of dead plant matter, and makes marks on them, often with ink sold in expensive proprietary cartridges specifically designed to create recurring revenue to the manufacturer of the device.
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Loqi ok
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tantek And I didn't even say anything about planned obsolescence proprietary printer driver software :P
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bignose tantek: thanks for that entry about printers. it puts into context the utterances about email.
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Loqi bignose: tantek left you a message 7 hours, 45 minutes ago: we don't need long-form discussion, if by that you mean email. email lists are largely useless, and yes, excessively lengthy, paragraphs of people writing just to see themselves type or something. blog posts OTOH are to be encouraged.
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tantek aaronpk: where did you get the icons for your /pay page?
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tantek what is pay?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "pay" yet. Would you like to create it?
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tantek pay is /payment
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Loqi ok
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aaronpk from each service's website
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aaronpk SVG when available
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Loqi [indieweb] "I Love Webmentions" by Chris Aldrich on 2016-11-28 http://boffosocko.com/2016/11/28/i-love-webmentions/
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@ChrisAldrich I love that Twitter @mentions of me ping my @WordPress site at http://boffosocko.com/mentions/ Thank you #IndieWeb! http://boffosocko.com/2016/11/28/i-love-webmentions/ (twitter.com/_/status/803355562813652992)
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aaronpk and with a little bit of JS... https://aaronparecki.com/pay/?5
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aaronpk not quite as nice as a URL like https://cash.me/$aaronpk/5 but it would take actual server side code to do it that way
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tantek server side code is worth it to get rid of the '?'
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[sebsel] what is print?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "print" yet. Would you like to create it?
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[sebsel] print is printing
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Loqi ok
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aaronpk i think so too, but that's another project
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[sebsel] printer << /printing
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Loqi ok, I added "/printing" to the "See Also" section of /printer
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[sebsel] I really need to practice this, sorry guys :/
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gRegorLove The << is to add see also links.
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Loqi ok, I added "is to add see also links." to the "See Also" section of /The
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gRegorLove Ugh
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aaronpk lol
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tantek what is The
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Loqi The IndieWeb is about owning your domain and using it as your primary identity, to publish on your own site (optionally syndicate elsewhere), and ownyourdata https://indieweb.org/The
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tantek gRegorLove: the challenge is that the "is" syntax allows /something but the double-left-angle-bracket syntax does not
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tantek so you have use the [[something]] syntax with that instead of the /something syntax
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gRegorLove Yeah, it'd be nice to have a plain language version of <<
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tantek ChrisAldrich are you around? See you editing the wiki - but not here on IRC (maybe on Slack?)
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tantek was hoping to see about HWC LA
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[schmarty] slack member list shows ChrisAldrich as not logged in
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ChrisAldrich Tantek, you rang?
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Loqi ChrisAldrich: tantek left you a message 2 weeks, 2 days ago: could you confirm venue for HWC LA next week? https://indieweb.org/events/2016-11-16-homebrew-website-club#Where
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Loqi ChrisAldrich: tantek left you a message 2 weeks ago: HWC LA this week? https://indieweb.org/events/2016-11-16-homebrew-website-club#Where
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Loqi ChrisAldrich: tantek left you a message 1 week, 2 days ago: Could you confirm venue for HWC LA? https://indieweb.org/events/2016-11-30-homebrew-website-club#Where
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Loqi ChrisAldrich: tantek left you a message 3 days, 18 hours ago: any plans for HWC LA 2016-11-30? https://indieweb.org/events/2016-11-30-homebrew-website-club#Where
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ChrisAldrich I actually put HWC on my list of things to do figure out today.
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ChrisAldrich I borked my IRC client over the holiday and need to reconfigure from scratch, but I'm always lurking around.
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tantek chrisaldrich: hey! you're back!~
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tantek yes there seemed to be quite a bit of follow-up interest at IWC LA in a HWC LA
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tantek hoping that momentum could be tapped!
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tantek is Wednesday a possibility?
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ChrisAldrich i'm pushing to get this wednesday, but if not will definitely do mid month and end of the month.
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tantek you did the Eventbrite for IWC LA so you contact everyone and email them right?
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ChrisAldrich Shaners set it up, but I've got access to it. I've got reasonable access to most of the contact info for everyone who RSVPd or attended though.
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ChrisAldrich my tougher concern is getting a final exam for a complex analysis class I'm taking out of the way...
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ChrisAldrich Eventbright seemed to have an atrocious RSVP to attendee ratio followed shortly thereafter by meetup.com which I'd tried experimenting with
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tantek meetup is much worse since they spam you about unrelated things
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tantek much worse UX that is
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ChrisAldrich I'll keep running the experiment for a few more months into the Spring and then kill Meetup as a POSSE location for LA.
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tantek do you remember how each person at IWC LA found out about it?
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tantek I vaguely remember one person saying meetup but I can't be certain
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tantek curious how you're tracking effectiveness of different POSSE channels
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ChrisAldrich I keep a small tally of RSVPs and attendences; the numbers are generally small enough to do direct one to one matches. I find that the best methods are person-to-person rather than via web anyway.
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tantek agreed - direct contact tends to work best
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ChrisAldrich I've got a list of how most found out, I think outside of the IWC "faithful" there were two from eventbright, 4-5 from meetup and the balance were acquaintances from various friends/family or other exterior groups
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ChrisAldrich Congratulations, btw, Tantek on 3 years! It's pretty impressive to see how it's grown, even in the last 9 months.
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ChrisAldrich Perhaps if my location doesn't confirm for Wed HWC, GWG and I can put together a Google Hangouts version for people too far from a local/nearby in-person version? Thoughts GWG?
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@benwerd Neat! https://mailinabox.email/ #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/803375760920760322)
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Loqi [indieweb] "Neat! https://mailinabox.email/ #indieweb" by Ben Werdmüller on 2016-11-28 http://werd.io/2016/neat-indieweb
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GWG Chrisaldrich, I am always onboard for that. I am booked between 10 and 11 Eastern.
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