#indieweb 2017-02-03

2017-02-03 UTC
nitot, wolftune, davidmead and KartikPrabhu joined the channel
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davidmead
Getting this message after updating indieweb plugin - Fatal error: Cannot redeclare class RelMe_Widget in /nfs/c03/h06/mnt/56448/domains/joshuajohnmead.com/html/wp-content/plugins/indieweb/includes/class-relme-widget.php on line 79
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davidmead
cannot get into WP now. Any ideas?
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aaronpk
that looks like wordpress?
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aaronpk
(wordpress is the magic word to summon GWG)
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GWG
How long ago did you update the plugins last?
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GWG
Syndication Links used to have that widget before it moved in June
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davidmead
this is my sons blog (hardly used) and he was updating it today
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davidmead
don’t know how long since he last did it
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davidmead
GWG can I just FTP in and remove that indieweb folder form the plugins?
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GWG
Yes
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davidmead
think that’ll allow me back in?
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GWG
Yes. But I would update and then see what the conflict was
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davidmead
that got me back in GWG. Think I’ll go through and reinstall, see if it happens again
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GWG
Check versions on Sunday Links
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GWG
Syndication
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GWG
Trying to figure out how to address pfefferle's comment.
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miklb
GWG I seem to recall some discussion about face piles for likes with one of the webmention plugins. Am I imagining it?
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GWG
miklb: No, you are not
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miklb
was it an option or another plugin?
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miklb
or just discussion
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GWG
miklb: The first plugin I ever wrote for the Indieweb
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GWG
I stopped using it
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GWG
Both pfefferle and I discussed reviving parts of it inside Semantic Linkbacks
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miklb
semantic comments?
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GWG
Yes
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miklb
ok. thanks
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Loqi
Just generated the first draft of this week's newsletter! https://indieweb.org/this-week/2017-02-03.html I'll generate a draft again tomorrow, so please add to it before then! https://indieweb.org/this-week#How_to
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@100daysindieweb
Day 44: Cleaner HTML from Quill's HTML Editor #100DaysOfIndieWeb: https://aaronparecki.com/2017/02/02/18/day-44-quill
(twtr.io/1N636NWEZPD)
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@kevinmarks
@100daysindieweb Removing all html classes? What if there are embedded microformats?
(twtr.io/1N66MmMccZt)
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@kevinmarks
@shellen @smc90 @CantHardyWait @sean_a_rose @pt @drafty I told you a while back, make it post via micropub, and #indieweb will help
(twtr.io/1N67AgvXjRc)
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[acegiak_net]
howdy indieweb, how is everyone?
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Zegnat
Good morning [acegiak_net]! I am in bed with a cold (or the flu, maybe). How are you?
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@derhess
@sebastiangreger and me attempt to start an #IndieWeb -inspired "Homebrew Website Club" in #Berlin on February, 8th: https://sebastiangreger.net/2017/02/homebrew-website-club-berlin-first-meeting-8-feb-2017/
(twtr.io/1N6QqwB18cL)
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Loqi
[indieweb] "Comment on This has to be the most awesome Indieweb pull request I’ve seen this year. by Kyle Mahan" by Kyle Mahan on 2017-02-03 http://boffosocko.com/2017/01/30/this-has-to-be-the-most-awesome-indieweb-pull-request-ive-seen-this-year/#comment-33727
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Loqi
[indieweb] "Comment on This has to be the most awesome Indieweb pull request I’ve seen this year. by Ben Werdmuller" by Ben Werdmuller on 2017-02-03 http://boffosocko.com/2017/01/30/this-has-to-be-the-most-awesome-indieweb-pull-request-ive-seen-this-year/#comment-33728
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jeremycherfas
In reply https://chat.indieweb.org/2017-02-03/1486092115583000, trying to see whether IndieHosters will create some machanism to allow installation of plugins from Known admin.
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@davednb
@svensonsan so, gefunden, ich meinte den Blogeintrag über reclaim/indieweb von @diplix http://wirres.net/article/articleview/7082/1/6/
(twtr.io/1N6XoCWd1PD)
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Zegnat
What is IndieHosters?
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Loqi
IndieHosters is a new network of independent hosters who offer CMS Software as a Service https://indieweb.org/IndieHosters
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Janice23
/join #radeon
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petermolnar
https://blog.sucuri.net/2017/01/spotlight-website-security-photographers.html - this is a frightening read; I'm guessing most of us are 1st, maybe 2nd generations, but even we could be in a problematic situation when our site needs to be migrated immediately.
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petermolnar
should we start including tips, options, war stories for "troubled times with your personal site" in the wiki?
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Loqi
[indieweb] "Replacing Baïkal with Radicale" by Peter Molnar on 2017-01-26 https://petermolnar.net/replacing-baikal-with-radicale-for-carrdav-and-caldav
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petermolnar
why did you pick that up again, Loqi?
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cweiske
it seems we don't have a page for "you pick that up again". would you like to create one?
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Zegnat
cweiske++ for being more Loqi than Loqi
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Loqi
cweiske has 69 karma in this channel (78 overall)
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@dictvm
Would have loved to check out this IndieWeb thingy happening during @btconf but I don’t have time for this stuff: https://indieweb.org/IndieAuth
(twtr.io/1N6yw6Mh7D6)
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@petermolnar
@dictvm #IndieAuth is easy: add a rel=me url to your site, your site url to a silo; that's all. Follow https://indiewebify.me/
(twtr.io/1N6zRWVwu6w)
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@schmarty
@dictvm IndieWeb-style RSVP is usually optional for @indiewebcamp events. There seem to be reservations here: https://ti.to/beyondtellerrand/duesseldorf-2017/with/pfaz-vun9pe
(twtr.io/1N70NEFywrC)
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@dictvm
@schmarty @indiewebcamp after registration is says that I must register via IndieAuth.
(twtr.io/1N74nt4Uij0)
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@schmarty
@dictvm Ah. Seems like a badly-worded message. Planning page for Düsseldorf IWC gives more options: https://indieweb.org/2017/D%C3%BCsseldorf#RSVP
(twtr.io/1N75tzvNjZ4)
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[cleverdevil]
!tell aaronpk hey, can you ping back Marissa from DreamHost about HWC in PDX when you get a chance?
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Loqi
Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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aaronpk
[cleverdevil]: ah yeah sorry! yesterday I was out and about most of the day
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Loqi
aaronpk: [cleverdevil] left you a message 14 minutes ago: hey, can you ping back Marissa from DreamHost about HWC in PDX when you get a chance?
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[cdevroe]
GGW snarfed If I would like Bridgy to simply post the title of my blog post + link to Facebook (rather than publishing the plain text version of the post) — How can I do that using Bridgy Publish?
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tantek
cdevroe like a linkblog?
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Loqi
tantek: gRegorLove left you a message 1 day, 13 hours ago: https://indieweb.org/events/2017-02-08-homebrew-website-club#Where looks good to me
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Loqi
tantek: calumryan left you a message 1 day, 8 hours ago: https://indieweb.org/events/2017-02-08-homebrew-website-club#Where this is better, wonder if RSVP part might be improved also, and linked to from above
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[cdevroe]
tantek I suppose. I just don’t like the full text being published to Facebook since it strips out links. E.g. https://www.facebook.com/cdevroe/posts/10158237456420370?pnref=story
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[cleverdevil]
aaronpk no worries :slightly_smiling_face:
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[cdevroe]
tantek I want it to work the same way it handles Twitter, I guess.
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tantek
cdevroe, yes I think I've run into that before too (no rich markup in the FB copy)
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tantek
not sure "same way as Twitter" is the right answer either, as much of what defines that is Twitter's length limitations
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[cdevroe]
Oddly enough, the more I “perfect” this process the less I believe I want to rely on Bridgy.
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[cdevroe]
tantek That may be true… but Facebook has formatting limitations (unless, of course, Bridge published each post as a “Note” on Facebook)
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[cdevroe]
*Bridgy
asheesh, kants, sbruce, rhiaro, petermolnar, XgF, KartikPrabhu, bear, snarfed, hs0ucy, nitot, CherryPuffs and [dgold] joined the channel
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[dgold]
is the slack<->irc bridge used by the channel a publicly available thing, or an in-house jobbie?
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leg1
dgold: The teams administrator must enable it. Then everybody in the team can use it.
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aaronpk
who is leg1?
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aaronpk
[dgold]: it's this: https://github.com/aaronpk/Slack-IRC-Gateway but still in progress
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leg
aaronpk: leg1 is leg, logged in from a different computer..
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aaronpk
who is leg?
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leg
aaronpk: ahh, so you have made en external bridge: very nice!
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aaronpk
yeah he's talking about the bridge from Slack *to* freenode IRC. not just accessing a slack room from an IRC client
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aaronpk
people in here with [] around their name are actually signed in on our Slack team
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[cleverdevil]
That's a pretty small amount of code to accomplish something pretty useful.
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aaronpk
half of it's missing (IRC to Slack) because that's part of Loqi. but that's also an even smaller amount of code cause it just send to the slack web hook
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[dgold]
thanks aaronpk
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tantek
nice!
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tantek
what is archive.org?
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Loqi
The Internet Archive is a non-profit organization that is building a digital library, including archival copy of much of the public web https://indieweb.org/archive.org
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@ChrisAldrich
@dagutierrez With interests in this area, you might appreciate some of what the #Indieweb community is doing: http://indieweb.org
(twtr.io/1N7VBy4kK_U)
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Loqi
[indieweb] "@dagutierrez With interests in this area, you might appreciate some of what the #Indieweb community is doing: http://indieweb.org" by Chris Aldrich on 2017-02-03 http://stream.boffosocko.com/2017/dagutierrez-with-interests-in-this-area-you-might-appreciate-some
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tantek
!tell chrisaldrich perhaps you could add the Archive.org/Wayback Machine support plugin for @WithKnown to a new Known section here after WordPress? https://indieweb.org/Internet_Archive#WordPress
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Loqi
Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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Loqi
Just generated this week's newsletter! You still have a few minutes to make changes, and I'll re-generate it 10 minutes before it gets sent out at 3pm Pacific time. https://indieweb.org/this-week/2017-02-03.html
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tantek
no photos this week
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tantek
ooh locations for HWC the 8th need to be updated!!!
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tantek
aaronpk - this seems to happen a lot - the newsletter shows locations from /Events whereas the permalink for the event usually has a more accurate list of locations
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Zegnat
tantek, definitely, I am just talking with sebsel to put the Netherlands on this coming wednesday :D
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tantek
obv it's a good prod to fix the /Events listing, however not that many of us are doing that?
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aaronpk
hm yes, part of our DRY problem
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Zegnat
did not know to update /Events
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tantek
I don't have a good answer, except to maybe ask if it's better to grab the event info from the event permalink rather than /Eventds?
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tantek
Zegnat, yeah, that's because you shouldn't have to ;)
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tantek
but we're still do many things manually because it hurts less than trying to actually build a working events system
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aaronpk
i think originally i wasn't fetching the event pages at all, but now I am in order to get photos so it should be a small change
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tantek
oh right
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tantek
that makes sense
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tantek
nothing like touching newsletter generation code right before it goes out
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Zegnat
Added location for the Netherlands :)
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aaronpk
interesting
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aaronpk
the locations on the permalink are venue names, but in the list are cities
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aaronpk
i can work with this
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tantek
hmm are they at least p-locality inside the p-location?
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aaronpk
the location is an h-adr which includes the city in p-locality
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tantek
that's a start at least
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tantek
I suppose you could include the p-region and p-country-name if they're non-empty?
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aaronpk
omg so much nesting
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aaronpk
k i'm not really sure the best way to handle capitalization and such, but the cities now come from the permalinks
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aaronpk
and include venue name when available
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Loqi
[indieweb] "Hello, World Wide IndieWeb!" on 2017-01-23 http://keithjgrant.com/posts/2017/01/hello-indieweb/
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aaronpk
can we drop the vcard markup from the event page though? I realized that's what's causing the extra h-adr nesting. i don't mind the extra nesting, but it seems bad that it's not obvious it's happening
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tantek
aaronpk: permalink or /Events ?
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aaronpk
permalink
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tantek
let me give it a shot
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aaronpk
also something weird is going on with the SF location and I can't figure it out. the city isn't showing up as part of the h-adr
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tantek
oh yeah the "adr" backcompat root thing. I see the problem
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aaronpk
i think it might be a backcompat parser bug
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aaronpk
i have never seen good results when mixing mf1 and mf2 on the same elements with the current backcompat implementations
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KevinMarks
If we used more {{}} includes would that make the updating better or worse?
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KevinMarks
That's supposed to be the mediawiki answer to DRY
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tantek
an answer
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aaronpk
using mediawiki includes at least helps ensure the markup is consistent
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tantek
using mediawiki *templates* helps with that
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tantek
already found a missing /span
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tantek
is fixing more things while in there
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sebsel
(there is also the front page...)
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tantek
so many fixes
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tantek
aaronpk, there's an attempt
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aaronpk
oh hey much flatter
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aaronpk
rewrites his code
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aaronpk
updated
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tantek
do you think it's worth publishing the venue name in the newsletter?
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tantek
and just fixed the abbr for state for SF
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aaronpk
I do actually. I know if I was getting this newsletter regularly and saw that the venue for my city changed I would like to know
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tantek
interesting. would a list format then make that more apparent than a ; delimited para?
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tantek
so you could more easily scan down to your city
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aaronpk
probably. this is getting long
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tantek
it's just starting to look long with the venue name, city, and country/region'
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tantek
compare the listings for the 8th vs the 22nd
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tantek
was much more readable when it was "just" a list of cities
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tantek
hey, micro.blog hit its funding goals and stretch goal!
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tantek
that's probably newsletter worthy
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tantek
looks for a blog post
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[cleverdevil]
Only thing you'll see that has been posted since the Kickstarter concluded was Manton's post - http://www.manton.org/2017/02/4745.html
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[cleverdevil]
But, WPTavern made a good post discussing the Kickstarter after it had reached its funding, with lots of good quotes: https://wptavern.com/micro-blog-project-surges-past-65k-on-kickstarter-gains-backing-from-dreamhost
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aaronpk
hm oh that was posted to indienews too long ago to make it into the newsletter
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[manton]
Yeah, I've been meaning to write a longer post. Didn't get to it this week.
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tantek
let's see, we got about 20 minutes right?
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aaronpk
tantek: take a look now! i made it switch to a bullet list when it includes venue names
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tantek
is going to see if anyone can figure out the order of the cities from that list ;)
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aaronpk
i'm counting this as my 100days project for today
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tantek
hey aaronpk if I post a blog post, how long will it take you to submit a bookmark for it to Indienews ;) ?
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aaronpk
about 2 seconds
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aaronpk
tho you can just submit it to indienews too! Just link to https://news.indieweb.org/en in your post and your webmention sending will submit it
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Loqi
Generated the final version of the newsletter! This will be sent out at 3pm Pacific time. https://indieweb.org/this-week/2017-02-03.html
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aaronpk
(i can still regenerate it)
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Zegnat
That list for HWC looks nice, aaronpk!
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Loqi
[indieweb] "Day 45: Better Display of Event Cities for the IndieWeb Newsletter #100DaysOfIndieWeb" on 2017-02-03
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tantek
dang I need just a few more minutes!
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tantek
marking up...
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aaronpk
so close! you can do it
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tantek
gonna need you to bookmark
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@t
Indie Microblogging Kickstarter http://Micro.blog Hits Goal & Stretch Goal For Safe Replies! #indieweb: http://tantek.com/b/4mf1
(twtr.io/1N7cy0wNhVL)
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Loqi
[indieweb] "Indie Microblogging Kickstarter Micro.blog Hits Goal & Stretch Goal For Safe Replies! #indieweb" on 2017-02-03 http://tantek.com/2017/034/b1/indie-microblogging-hits-stretch-goal-indieweb
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tantek
posted
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tantek
boy I hope I got that right
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tantek
manton ^^^
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Loqi
[indienews] New post: "Indie Microblogging Kickstarter Micro.blog Hits Goal & Stretch Goal For Safe Replies! #indieweb - Tantek" http://tantek.com/2017/034/b1/indie-microblogging-hits-stretch-goal-indieweb (from https://aaronparecki.com/2017/02/03/10/)
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aaronpk
let's see if we did that right
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aaronpk
s/right/in time/
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tantek
seriously
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aaronpk
oh dear
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tantek
I don't remember when I last wrote a blog post that fast
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aaronpk
i am not sure what happened
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aaronpk
well your post is there! but that's all
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tantek
hopefully not the & in the title
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tantek
also I just *happened* to hit the magical max-safe-retweetable-length in my article name + permalink!
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tantek
(like on the first try)
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aaronpk
i have no idea what happened with the newsletter. the XML (for the email) and the HTML are different.
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tantek
race condition!
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Loqi
Homebrew Website Club Meetup
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aaronpk
haha whoa
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Loqi
nice
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tantek
oh hey it made it!
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aaronpk
yep but the other 3 aren't there!
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tantek
other three ... ?
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tantek
so mine clobbered them?
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tantek
er, your bookmark?
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aaronpk
well also why isn't yours showing up on that html page!
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tantek
wow that is very weird
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tantek
well presumably you can regen the HTML page?
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aaronpk
oh you know what, i think i hard-coded 3pm into here somewhere, and so running it after 3pm may have had some unintended side effects
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tantek
but not resend the newsletter
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tantek
oops missed it by seconds then
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aaronpk
yeah definitely
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tantek
well, about time I wrote an actual blog post, that was a good reason to do so
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tantek
especially since Manton hadn't gotten around to a "success" post yet, and the stretch goal funding is definitely worthy of raising up and celebrating
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tantek
just hope I did it justice :)
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aaronpk
okay fixed HTML
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tantek
woot!
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aaronpk
okay and gave myself an override to generate the newsletter for a specific date just in case i want to generate it after 3pm next time :)
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tantek
we were so close
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tantek
but hey I guess we found some bugs :)
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[manton]
tantek Thanks! Great post.
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[manton]
This line reminded me of something I wanted to ask the group:
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[manton]
> aggregator service that displays a timeline, replies, favorites etc. from multiple sites instead of a social media silo
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jonnybarnes
I’ve tried making emoji on my site more accessible: https://jonnybarnes.uk/notes/DR
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Loqi
[Jonny Barnes] My site is now on Laravel 5.4! ? Also emoji on my site are now more accessible ?
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[manton]
Right now I just have favorites centralized. Thinking I could use Micropub for sites that support it and want a favorite notification. But curious what other people are doing to track that in a more distributed way.
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Loqi
[Tantek Çelik] Indie Microblogging Kickstarter Micro.blog Hits Goal & Stretch Goal For Safe Replies! #indieweb
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tantek
manton, architecturally speaking, favorites distribute just like replies. They have their own permalinks, they send (and are received as) webmentions, they follow webmention CRUD protocols.
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tantek
same for reposts
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aaronpk
[manton]: when you see a list of people who favorited my posts, each of those "favorites" is actually from its own permalink, and that site sent me a webmention
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aaronpk
so when I want to post a "favorite" of something, I post it to my website and send a webmention. this means all of the things I've favorited appear on my website at https://aaronparecki.com/likes
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[manton]
Got it, thanks. I think there's a little disconnect too because I currently view favorites more as a way to keep track of things for a user, rather than viewing a post and seeing how many favorites it has, which is more the Twitter UI.
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aaronpk
where Micropub comes in is when I'm using a reader like woodwind and the reader wants to show a "favorite" button
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aaronpk
woodwind *could* keep track of what i've favorited (which sounds liek what you're talking about) and it can *also* post it via micropub to my website
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KartikPrabhu
[manton]: I could make a list of all of my favs on my site or by any other response type
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KartikPrabhu
is that what you are asking?
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tantek
manton, I think classic Twitter favorites (stars) were often used like that "way to keep track of things for a user", however two things have happened since which I think has relegated favorites to pretty much "just" likes
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tantek
1. Twitter switched favorites (stars) to likes (hearts)
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tantek
2. Instagram introduced (private) bookmarks as a "way to keep track of things for a user"
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tantek
thus distinguishing that functionality from the "like" / heart functionality
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tantek
Instagram's implementation (UX) is quite nice too
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[manton]
aaronpk Very cool. I hadn't seen your /likes page before.
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[manton]
tantek That's a great observation. I'm more in the "bookmark" camp. Possibly I should rename what I'm doing after some more feedback.
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[manton]
I'm not super interested in turning Micro.blog posts (and user follower counts, for that matter) into a popularity contest. But some of that is hard to avoid, I know.
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tantek
manton, I strongly praise your leanings in that way
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tantek
such counts create games that create behaviors
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tantek
I for one like the facepiles :)
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tantek
(feels much more social than just a number)
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KartikPrabhu
I keep bookmarks separate from likes
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tantek
KartikPrabhu: that's my point, so does Instagram now :)
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KartikPrabhu
:thumbs-up:
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[manton]
tantek Yeah, good point. Shows there are real people vs. just comparing how high the number is.
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tantek
exactly
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aaronpk
i really like the feedback of seeing which of my friends have "liked" certain posts
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aaronpk
but it's about the specific people more than the number
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tantek
agreed
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aaronpk
i could care less about getting 100 egg-likes on a post :P
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KartikPrabhu
aaronpk: come on! eggs have feelings too ;)
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[manton]
Thanks y'all. I'll think more on this for what I'm doing... It just jumped out for me while reading Tantek's post since distributed favorites wasn't really on my radar yet.
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tantek
manton I just figured you were treating likes (favorites) just like replies, as first-class responses that could come from anywhere :0
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tantek
that is, the fundamental assumption is that any "state" contributed by a user, even "just" a like, is considered content, and thus distributable, and thus at a permalink of the user's choosing
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tantek
I just checked twitter search for my domain (seeing if my blog post got any pickup at all), and found that js;dr is *still* dominating what people on twitter link to on my domain. Amazing
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@m_ott
In case you ever wondered how data loss thanks to “JavaScript required” looks like… /cc @t @sarasoueidan https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C2PDTIoXgAIqpK7.jpg
(twtr.io/1MSKFjWvdNw)
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KevinMarks
Also, brid.gy maps twitter favorites to indie u-like-of already
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tantek
KevinMarks, I think that happened *before* Twitter switched their UX from favorite (star) to like (heart)?
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KevinMarks
True. I show them as stars though
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aaronpk
I still show twitter favorites as stars. Maybe when I add support for reacji I will convert twitter favorites to hearts
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Loqi
Love Twitter