#indieweb 2017-02-19

2017-02-19 UTC
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[kevinmarks]
Makes sense
KartikPrabhu, KevinMarks, davidmead, DanC, strugee and [katiejohnsonsf] joined the channel
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[katiejohnsonsf]
Does anyone know if there are any HWCs coming up in Bellingham?
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tantek
katiejohnsonsf! hello!
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tantek
looks like HWC Bellingham is on for next Wednesday: https://indieweb.org/events/2017-02-22-homebrew-website-club
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tantek
and might be good to ping Gregor (organizer) too
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tantek
!tell gRegorLove hey! [katiejohnsonsf] expressed interest in an upcoming HWC Bellingham, perhaps ping her with any timing details etc.
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Loqi
Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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[katiejohnsonsf]
Thanks tantek
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strugee
[katiejohnsonsf]: note also that there will be an IndieWebCamp in Bellingham :)
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strugee
we're targeting May 4 and 5 IIRC
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[katiejohnsonsf]
That's very convenient but that happens to be the same weekend as GAFTA fest. ?
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martymcguire[m]
catches up on the mediafragmention discussion
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martymcguire[m]
aaronpk: I only send webmentions manually at this point and am neglectful about it.
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martymcguire[m]
I can't imagine the actual process for noting to-the-second media fragments for mentions of uses of mentioned media posts, but I do like the idea very much!
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martymcguire[m]
Err, I guess I can imagine it, actually, but I think it's an example of something where "manual until it hurts" becomes "ow ow ow not even once" :}
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sknebel
what is deduplication, Loqi?
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Loqi
It looks like we don't have a page for "deduplication, Loqi" yet. Would you like to create it?
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aaronpk
good morning!
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Loqi
morning!
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GWG
Morning
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GWG
aaronpk, if you were a WordPress user...27% of the known web would be Indieweb capable by now.
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GWG
aaronpk, I occasionally need new ways to acknowledge your prolific nature
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GWG
Looking forward to few more weeks of days of Indieweb
davidmead, KevinMarks, tantek, duper, KevinMarks_ and nitot_ joined the channel
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miklb
good morning
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tantek
good morning miklb!
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GWG
Good afternoon, miklb
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miklb
how goes your weekends?
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GWG
Went to the store, eating lunch, then stuff.
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@Moturoais
Why Hollywood Awards Are Failing Independent TV #IMDb #indie #indiefilm #indieweb #indiedoc http://www.imdb.com/news/ni60798731/
(twitter.com/_/status/833363212095610880)
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miklb
I like lunch and stuff
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GWG
miklb: Up to any stuff?
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miklb
slowly rewriting my theme from scratch.
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GWG
I need to do that. I've learned a lot.
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miklb
yeah, now that I better know what I want, I don't want to get too far down the road with my hacked together code (both front end and WP)
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miklb
and rather than shoe horn in the changes I want, roughly same work i can start over and have a more manageable code base
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GWG
miklb: Working with the WordPress theme system can be frustrating at times.
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GWG
It wasn't designed to accommodate this sort of thing
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miklb
I sorta used to doing things with WordPress it wasn't designed for. :-)
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GWG
miklb: Yes, but the issue is doing it in an inclusive way
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GWG
You go too far from standard, it won't work with anything else.
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GWG
For me, that's an issue because I want to share with others.
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miklb
My current approach is that I'm building this for me first, the way I want it. Then I can take what I learn from that and see where I can help broaden it.
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GWG
So, I need to look for a solution that won't conflict with plugins or other options.
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GWG
miklb: When I take that approach, which I have, it isn't a project I recommend to others.
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GWG
But it is still also for me. Because I have other people's plugins installed.
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miklb
Sure. But if I'm not happy with my site and using it regularly, then I'm not being "IndieWeb".
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GWG
miklb: Agreed. I am still trying to get to owning my bookmarks.
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miklb
which is where I've felt the last 2 months.
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GWG
I certainly don't post enough, I admit
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miklb
I'm still a prolific Twitter user, and I want to break that habit. So having a site that looks and acts as an extension of me is a big part of breaking the habit.
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GWG
All this work is to make it easier for me.
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miklb
I mean, if I see a place where I can contribute back to an existing tool, I'll certainly do that.
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GWG
miklb: I'm not suggesting you wouldn't.
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miklb
Didn't take it that way :-)
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GWG
For myself, I see a convergence of what I'm doing where I am getting better at building these tools and connecting them together to the point where it does click.
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GWG
That is why I'm on the whirlwind tour of fixes right now.
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GWG
Bridgy Publish is accepting Micropub. Syndication Links, Micropub, and Bridgy Publish are all working together now.
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miklb
yes. Quite nicely from my end
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miklb
GWG++
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Loqi
gwg has 189 karma in this channel (206 overall)
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GWG
So, the next step is improve the integration of Post Kinds.
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GWG
So, everything I've been working on so far in 2017 is iterative.
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miklb
Good thing you have 10 more months :-P
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GWG
I'm doing that for myself. But I'm taking input from others because it has made things better.
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GWG
My next hope is to get my workflow into my site
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GWG
Namely....
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GWG
Read on Phone -> Share to Site -> If Public, POSSE.
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miklb
Agreed. A lot of what I'm doing is to facilitate better mobile use.
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miklb
I want it to be as effortless/seamless as possible
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GWG
Ditto
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GWG
It has taken a while for Post Kinds to get close to that.
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GWG
Are you Android, iOS, other?
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GWG
Can't help you there, alas.
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miklb
what is workflow
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Loqi
Workflow is an iOS app used to automate various actions https://indieweb.org/Workflow
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GWG
But if I support get/post actions..
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miklb
I can run micropub through the phone with a python library. Also that app is super powerful
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KevinMarks1
today in missing the point of semantic html https://www.quora.com/Do-people-still-code-HTML-and-CSS-by-hand/answer/Ady-Ngom-3
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GWG
Good day, KevinMarks1
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miklb
KevinMarks1 that's kinda funny as I'm "coding by hand" today. lol
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GWG
We need a controversial topic to debate in here.
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GWG
The DRY principle and processing multiple forms of semantic markup. Go.
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miklb
sorry, I got nothing
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GWG
Favorite post type?
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miklb
? I'm only using posts
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GWG
miklb: Indieweb Post Type aka Post Kind
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miklb
ah. Well, I use notes most, and like having quotes now, but want to utilize Bookmarks more as I get rolling. But truthfully, I haven't scratched the surface of post-kinds. One reason I want to modify my design, so I can present more post kinds.
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miklb
and thus delve into kind templates
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miklb
what is a jam
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Loqi
jam is an active type of post used to share a song that you are recently enjoying https://indieweb.org/jam
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miklb
^ I also want to use that more
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dansup
anyone know of an activitystreams 1 validator?
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GWG
miklb: Kind templates, as you saw, can be set in the theme. The ones built in are fairly simple right now, but if any you write better present a specific kind, tell me, I'd like to look and learn.
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GWG
dansup: Haven't done much with AS, but I'm sure there is one
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GWG
Too many verbs for me.
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miklb
sure. Like I said, adding the quote kind allowed me to see how it is constructed, so now I see how to use them in the theme. I will probably put this theme on GitHub for reference when I'm done. Won't really be something anyone can just use. But some of the code could be useful.
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GWG
I'm still annoyed at the number of custom types in OGP.
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miklb
where are you adding open graph?
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GWG
miklb: The Post Kinds Parser falls back to OGP if it detects no MF2
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GWG
And clearly people didn't read the spec very carefully or don't care, because no one seems to stick to a consistent set of properties.
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GWG
miklb: Didn't know you didn't realize.
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GWG
It parses OGP and converts it to mf2 property names, then does an array merge.
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miklb
no, I knew you were working on enhancements to the parsing, but didn't realize you were adding a fallback
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GWG
miklb: It's been there actually.
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GWG
I'm just enhancing it
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miklb
oh :-)
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GWG
I insisted on it. Half the sites I read don't do mf2.
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miklb
totally makes sense
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GWG
I like microformats, they are much more consistent. Although I think I need to reconsider my decision to place my h-card on my h-feed, as no one seems to recognize that.
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GWG
Maybe I should take tantek's statement..."My homepage is my h-card" as a guide
begriffs, begriffs_, miklb, wolftune, dch_, mlncn, tantek and [kevinmarks] joined the channel
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[kevinmarks]
P-author h-card on h-feed?
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GWG
[kevinmarks]: Yes
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[kevinmarks]
Oh, you mean if they're looking for the representative h-card?
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GWG
[kevinmarks]: Correct. But I think I'm the only one doing it. I might as well change
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[kevinmarks]
Hm. I think I did that too
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miklb
I think my h-card is going in my h-feed. Is that not kosher?
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GWG
miklb: I think it is.
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miklb
I had same set up on my Jekyll site, assumed it was passing parsing.
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GWG
miklb: It is being parsed, but I found not everyone codes for it.
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GWG
I haven't worked on my mf2 markup in a while. Maybe I have a different problem.
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[kevinmarks]
Which url?
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GWG
My homepage
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[kevinmarks]
Hm, I get a lot of urls in the h-feed and 2 names
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GWG
[kevinmarks]: So probably due for a refresh.
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tantek
GWG re: "27% of the known web would be Indieweb capable by now", that would make it a bit harder to evolve the indieweb. It's good that we're moving/evolving/iterating quickly with a smaller community, has made bugfixing etc. more possible.
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tantek
whereas you know more than anyone how "stuck" things get when "27% of the known web" depends on something (or even a fraction of that might break because of a change)
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GWG
tantek: I was complimenting how far aaronpk had come. I agree with you that you can't move too fast.
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tantek
in addition there is the monoculture problem, which WP is somehwat experiencing with all their WP-specific APIs
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tantek
that is, say we got Vouch to work in a specific way in WP and it was deployed in core, then we would be stuck with *only* that way of making it work, since everyone would have to interop with it
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tantek
I still maintain that we need solid multiple implementations of Vouch, tested with some sort of test suite, before Webmention+Vouch are ready for "27% of the known web" - then it can hopefully be committed with tests so that random changes to WordPress don't break Webmention+Vouch spec compliance
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GWG
tantek: I'm still stuck on the implementation problem for more than basic webmentions.
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GWG
The Semantic thing
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tantek
GWG, I still think the key there is to start moving implementation of Webmention presentation of replies etc. into the main Webmention plugin, and decommission anything with "Semantic" or "Linkback" in the name
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tantek
simplifying the plugin situation for the sake of the WordPress user
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tantek
both in number of plugins (to get Webmention to "work" according to user expectations), and in naming
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GWG
tantek: I agree, but I can't disagree with pfefferle's point that the current implementation is, to quote him, 'a bit hacky'. So, we'd need a better implementation of that portion.
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tantek
that's ok, reimplement it feature by feature in the Webmention plugin
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tantek
without copying the "hacky" code as it were
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GWG
tantek: That is what I am contemplating.
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