#indieweb 2018-01-23
2018-01-23 UTC
tantek, electronicmaji and camb joined the channel
# 
camb What do you guys use for websearch? I'm a big fan of the p2p search engine https://yacy.net/ but it doesn't have microformats or schema.org support yet.
# camb It doesn't do me much good to use microformats for videos and products or reviews, if I have no software to render it.
# camb Not to sound arrogant. :)
# camb forums based on microformats are an idea im trying to work with. It's very vague due to my limited technical capabilties. https://github.com/Cam-B/MetaNet
# 
@Yair_Rosenberg Serious thought experiment: If someone bought Twitter and immediately shut it down, would this be a net gain or net loss for humanity at this moment? (twitter.com/_/status/955598362404941829)
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KartikPrabhu camb: what kind of software "that renders microformats" do you mean?
# camb @Yair_Rosenberg people might convert to decentralized web or just convert to facebook etc... I'm always surprised by the general lack of interest in these things
# camb @KartikPrabhu I can post a video to worpress for example and have it properly marked with microformats. The same would go for a product I'm selling. What difference does this make to the consumer. They have no software to search for it.
# camb As I understand microformats is the heart of indieweb communication between servers. My rss reader doesn't know if posts are tagged as videos or products or photos etc...
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# KartikPrabhu camb: sounds more like a drawback of RSS
# camb I can "own my comment" by posting it on my site instead of the article author's site. But If the author decides to censor my comment, then none of his "followers" will see my comment.
# 
[kevinmarks] what's your rss reader? You could point the developers to https://www.w3.org/TR/post-type-discovery/
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ben_thatmustbeme Requesting microformats support from RSS readers on always a great way to start. Even if they say no, at least it's another user asking for it
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# camb I play with different readers. I'm not aware of any that support microformats. How do you effectively follow someone's activity on the "Indieweb" if RSS/Atom readers can't tell different post types appart.
# camb ?
# camb I'm really a noob 4 life. What might be obvious to you might be news to me.
# ben_thatmustbeme Not sure I follow what you mean
# [kevinmarks] there is woodwind.xyz
# ben_thatmustbeme Microformats just marks up a h-feed... If you can follow by RSS, you can follow by h-feed, a reader doesn't need to know about post types necessarily
# ben_thatmustbeme I suppose the question is how you want to define "follow"
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# camb Maybe I'm understanding the idea behind microformats wrong. What good does it do me to post an item for sale mith microformats. Google won't be able to find it and I'm not aware of any other software that would be able to show anyone else that this item is a "product" I could have just as well not used microformats since no machine can recognize it as a product to list.
# camb As far as I know webmentions are the only thing that actually make use of microformats.
# camb Again. My understanding is very limited. I'm trying to learn.
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# KartikPrabhu camb: indie-readers make use of microformats
# KartikPrabhu what is reader?
# 
Loqi A reader (or indie reader) in the context of the indieweb is the portion/feature integrated into an indieweb site that provides a way to read content from other indieweb sites, possibly including posts from the current site as well https://indieweb.org/reader
# KartikPrabhu Microformats can also be used to show reply-contexts
# KartikPrabhu basically anything that needs to parse a post in some sane way
# KartikPrabhu if your goal is to have Google/FB/Twitter to parse your pages then maybe use their own funny markup like Schema/OpenGraph etc...
# KartikPrabhu not sure how much those silos parse microformats
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# ben_thatmustbeme doesn't google still parse MF1 actually
# ben_thatmustbeme for certain types anyway
# KartikPrabhu ben_thatmustbeme: maybe, I have not found any concrete evidence/documentation
# ben_thatmustbeme a better question camb is whats the harm?
# KartikPrabhu ben_thatmustbeme: that is clear: WHy should anyone put random extra markup that seemingly has no use
# KartikPrabhu it is a completely fair and valid question
# ben_thatmustbeme it is
# ben_thatmustbeme I don't see any point in marking up everything, there is obviously some goal to it
# KartikPrabhu ben_thatmustbeme: That is camb's question. Why markup with microformats?
# ben_thatmustbeme indieweb uses a certain subset of microformats, we don't use products, so is there a point to marking up products unless you are planning some use or hoping for some use
# ben_thatmustbeme for me its two-fold, indieweb, yes, but also if I ever need to scrape data back out of my page, the parsing is dead simple
# KartikPrabhu camb: that might be an answer ^
# camb That might be. And I appreciate the insights.
# KartikPrabhu camb: I also use microformats for storing my post in flat-files. That way I can parse them and reconstruct my site if need be
# camb I believe Google does render H-card and recipies from microformats2. I might be wrong.
# camb I don't really know what I'm talking about. just quoting stufff.
# KartikPrabhu camb: yes, I have heard that said, but unless there is some documentation I am not believing it :P
# KartikPrabhu camb: nothing wrong in asking questions :)
# ben_thatmustbeme i had seen it in the past, but not seeing it now
# KartikPrabhu ben_thatmustbeme: exactly! unless it is documented Google can choose to use it or not as they please without telling anyone
# KartikPrabhu if it is documented then atleast there is some limited acocuntability
# ben_thatmustbeme it looks like they removed it from their docs
# KartikPrabhu I don't know of any docs even, but now the point is moot
# ben_thatmustbeme heh, it still finds the pages when searching
# ben_thatmustbeme but the pages no longer have the content
# KartikPrabhu yeah, they are all RDFa, JSONLD and microdata
# KartikPrabhu no actual microformats
# ben_thatmustbeme it was definitely there in 2010
# KartikPrabhu ben_thatmustbeme: yes and it links to https://developers.google.com/search/docs/data-types/recipe?visit_id=1-636522693626807706-1291595670&rd=1 which has no microformats
# ben_thatmustbeme yeah :/
# ben_thatmustbeme as i said, it seems they removed it from all documentation
# camb it was there at some point. apparently Google lost interest.
# KartikPrabhu camb: yes. So if your interest is in Google parsing them, then maybe microformats is not the solution for you
# camb Google is certainly not my interest.
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# camb Wider acceptance by the average user is my concern.
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# [kevinmarks] Google does not parse the formats they recommend consistently
# [kevinmarks] As I found out when making http://kevinmarks.com/partialsilos.html
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# camb What is your search engine friends? I am not aware of any other collaborative search engine than http://yacy.net
# camb *open source and collaborative
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chrisaldrich KartikPrabhu: did your set up for the prior UI for https://kartikprabhu.com/articles/marginalia change? It doesn't seem to show the marginalia anymore... :(
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# [chrisaldrich] Hmm... Maybe I'll take that back. It's working for me on Firefox but not Chrome for some reason.
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# 
@sdepolo Celebrate 1 million mentions using #indieWeb tools. 🎉🔁ℹ️
Learn how to use social networks without getting played.
https://snarfed.org/1-million-webmentions
Retweet to spread the word https://pbs.twimg.com/tweet_video_thumb/DUNf1ekV4AEi_ZK.jpg (twitter.com/_/status/955714723206512641)
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jeremycherfas Good morning IndieWeb
# jeremycherfas Just came across an old plugin that I used to use to style pull quotes and wondering whether I can do something similar in my newish setup. Well, I know I can, the thing is to do it.
# jeremycherfas On the other hand, it does seem too much like tinkering for the sake of it.
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# 
petermolnar morning
# jeremycherfas Good morning petermolnar
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# petermolnar !tell camb re microformats: all the reasons are here: https://aaronparecki.com/2016/12/17/8/owning-my-reviews
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# petermolnar european hours are surprisingly quiet these days
# jeremycherfas I suppose everyone is working. I know I have been, but not as busy now.
# jeremycherfas !tell aaronpk Reading the page petermolnar linked to ^^^ and then your most recent review https://aaronparecki.com/2017/03/11/11/conquistador it seems that you are now using h-review rather than hreview. Is that correct? Or are you using different markup for different kinds of review?
# jeremycherfas Oh no, both are there. Apologies.
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# 
@pvagner Although recently I have created a mastodon account on a local server I am finding #indieweb is the future. With https://fed.brid.gy/ you can just follow @pvagner.tk@pvagner.tk and it should work. Hmmm. awesome. (https://pvagner.tk/s/1Jz4Rg) (twitter.com/_/status/955791965328691200)
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# 
sl007 !tell rhiaro : just wrote some JSON Schema for ActivityPub : https://github.com/redaktor/ActivityPubSchema
# Loqi aaronpk: jeremycherfas left you a message 1 hour, 38 minutes ago: Reading the page petermolnar linked to ^^^ and then your most recent review https://aaronparecki.com/2017/03/11/11/conquistador it seems that you are now using h-review rather than hreview. Is that correct? Or are you using different markup for different kinds of review?
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@pfefferle @pubsubhubbub is now called WebSub and a W3C recommendation https://www.w3.org/TR/websub/ 😍 #indieweb #socialwg (twitter.com/_/status/955810819446591488)
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@khurtwilliams (Instagrammers) has been published on Island in the Net - https://islandinthenet.com/instagrammers/ #IndieWeb #Instagram https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DUO9furWkAA9pef.jpg (twitter.com/_/status/955815903328956417)
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tantek interesting article about taking a break from the news: https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2018/jan/18/my-year-of-living-ignorantly-i-entered-a-news-blackout-the-day-trump-was-elected
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# Loqi [superfeedr] "Embracing the IndieWeb" by Peter Vágner on 2018-01-23 https://ascraeus.org/embracing-the-indieweb
# Loqi [superfeedr] "Although recently I have created a mastodon ..." by Peter Vágner on 2018-01-23 https://pvagner.tk/2018/although-recently-i-have-created-a-mastodon
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# [tantek] Wow somehow I missed this last month: https://twitter.com/chronotope/status/940630693687808000
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@Chronotope Storify announces it will disappear from the web on May 16, 2018. Once a core part of social-focused journalism projects like @acarvin's work, it's larger archives and URLs will be gone. https://storify.com/faq-eol (twitter.com/_/status/940630693687808000)
# [tantek] I see it’s already in /site-deaths
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# 
@schmarty Your < 10min update on the #IndieWeb community! This Week in the IndieWeb audio edition for January 13th - 19th, 2018. https://martymcgui.re/2018/01/23/120410/ (twitter.com/_/status/955849111848259586)
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# 
gRegorLove Howdy, #indieweb
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@huffduffer This Week in the IndieWeb Audio Edition • January 13th - 19th, 2018 https://huffduffer.com/schmarty/455492 (twitter.com/_/status/955851562647203842)
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# gRegorLove Yeah, it was a great IWC!
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# Loqi [superfeedr] "Microblogging" by Paul Robert Lloyd on 2018-01-23 https://paulrobertlloyd.com/2018/01/microblogging
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[keithjgrant] Omnibear progress update: visual edition https://files.slack.com/files-pri/T03QR2B2T-F8YCMKBST/screen_shot_2018-01-23_at_12.45.45_pm.png?pub_secret=2f9f1739e9&name=Screen Shot 2018-01-23 at 12.45.45 PM.png
# [keithjgrant] (do those come through on the IRC channel?)
# [keithjgrant] oh, BTW, if any of you subscribe to my Notes feed… sorry for all the spam. You can probably always tell when I’m working on Omnibear 😆
# KartikPrabhu it isn't spam if people are subsribed right?
# [keithjgrant] haha
# [keithjgrant] those changes are in master now, if anybody feels like kicking the tires
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@RobJefferson @wadds The Indie Web initiative is a great resource on this very topic. You may well have already seen it to be fair. https://indieweb.org (twitter.com/_/status/955868714255241218)
# [kevinmarks] Interesting self dog fooding audit of Silo heads https://www.theguardian.com/media/2018/jan/23/never-get-high-on-your-own-supply-why-social-media-bosses-dont-use-social-media
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# 
aaronpk woohoo, it's alive! https://aaronparecki.com/grid
# Loqi [superfeedr] "Fragmentions for Better Highlighting and Direct References the Web" by Chris Aldrich on 2018-01-23 http://boffosocko.com/2018/01/23/fragmentions-for-better-highlighting-and-direct-references-the-web/
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# gRegorLove Awesome, aaronpk!
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# camb[m] need more rows to do proper pixel text :)
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# gRegorLove Maybe tagboard.com could be used for that
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@kidehen Stumbled across old @indieWeb page about #RDF. Here’s a gentle correction: https://id.myopenlink.net/DAV/home/KingsleyUyiIdehen/RWW/indie-web-wiki-page-rdf. #SemanticWeb #LinkedData #OpenWeb https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DUQIqbtW4AEXGis.jpg (twitter.com/_/status/955898550461845505)
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@mpbishop This is why I hate propriety cloud services. Not that I really used this one, but it’s the principal. Going #IndieWeb all the way. #panoramio https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DUQJGtJWAAInv6C.jpg (twitter.com/_/status/955899055669948418)
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@quispler @corinnamilborn Finde ich so gut dass ich mich spontan angemeldet habe. Vielleicht wirds ja doch was mit dem indieweb ( habe ich vor 3 Jahren gut gefunden ). (twitter.com/_/status/955908731631558657)
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# Loqi [superfeedr] "Micro.blog on Social Media with Manton Reese" by Lyle Troxell and Brian Young on 2018-01-23 http://geekspeak.org/episodes/2018/01/19/
# Loqi [superfeedr] "Indieweb replacements" by Colin Walker on 2018-01-23 https://colinwalker.blog/indieweb-replacements/
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@ChrisAldrich A collection of articles, replies, and posts about #IndieWeb philosophies and technologies primarily geared toward… https://twitter.com/i/web/status/955916290798993408 (twitter.com/_/status/955916290798993408)
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# Loqi Thanks [kevinmarks] and snarfed! https://twitter.com/indiewebcamp/status/955925852750995456
# [kevinmarks] so are we doing this in london?
# gRegorLove And is there going to be a cake?
# Loqi [superfeedr] "By: IndieWeb Collection" by IndieWeb Collection on 2018-01-23 http://boffosocko.com/research/indieweb/
# snarfed SF will have custom cupcakes! with https://indieweb.org/File:1000000webmentions.svg
# KartikPrabhu how do you make cupcakes from SVG?
# snarfed i used https://cako.com/ , they even have an app (!)
# KartikPrabhu woah!
# gRegorLove snarfed++ awesome
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# Loqi [superfeedr] "Liked this tweet: Chris Aldrich on Twitter: “A collection of articles, replies, and posts about #IndieWeb philosophies and technologies primarily geared toward use with #WordPress https://t.co/mdy5lpLRSN“" by Scott Kingery on 2018-01-23 http://techlifeweb.com/17199-2/
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