#indieweb 2018-02-06

2018-02-06 UTC
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@schmarty Homebrew Website Club Baltimore meets tomorrow at 7:30pm! Got a domain name, but mystified by hosting options? Join us an hour earlier, at 6:30pm, for an activity that will (hopefully) demystify things a bit! https://martymcgui.re/2018/01/29/111853/ (twitter.com/_/status/960665664963964928)
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@scott_gruber I was looking for the next LA Homebrew Website Club and stumbled across some very helpful tips and tricks for conference photographers by @aaronpk. Good stuff. https://indieweb.org/wiki/index.php?oldid=45098&rcid=44992 (twitter.com/_/status/960758155293544448)
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jeremycherfas Hello IndieWeb
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Loqi [superfeedr] "Dries Buytaert: To PESOS or to POSSE?" on 2018-02-06 https://dri.es/to-pesos-or-to-posse
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[hans] So, I know invisible metadata is considered harmful … but I don’t want my homepage to link to itself, nor do I want to display an avatar on it. What’s the Indie way to host an invisible hCard on my domain?
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Zegnat link and data elements, probably
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[hans] I assume this, too, but feel like I’m inferring more than is healthy.
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Zegnat There is rarely One Right Way™ when it comes to IndieWeb. For things like an h-card, as long as your HTML can be parsed, you are doing it right.
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dgold [hans]: I have an invisible thing on my homepage
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dgold <img src="https://ascraeus.org/pictures/marvin.png" class="u-photo" style="display: none">
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dgold i have neither compunction about it nor desire to change
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petermolnar what about data in <meta>? is that considered invisible?
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petermolnar (can you even add h-card data in meta?)
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[colinwalker] Must admit, my h-card is display:none as well. It sits in my footer but I don’t want it visible. It can be parsed fine. I know it technically falls foul of the “code for machines not humans” ideal but hey...
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Zegnat I think meta elements are skipped by mf2 parsers, petermolnar
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[colinwalker] * humans not machines - (I changed what I was going to say mid sentence 😆)
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Zegnat Double checked, there is no parsing logic for reading meta element attributes. So meta is out.
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Zegnat My whole page is an h-card, so I am not the right person to talk about hidden meta data, probably 😅
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[kevinmarks] You can put an empty link eg <a href="/" class="u-url" ></a>
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@mbutel Encontré esto: http://indieweb.org. Tienen una estrategia de publicación que se llama PESOS (twitter.com/_/status/960874940500267008)
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@calum_ryan 📢 RSVPs open to tomorrow's Homebrew Website Club London ✏️ Register at https://hwclondon.co.uk/meetups/20180207 (twitter.com/_/status/960888144953577475)
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snarfed anyone else catch that post from dries buytaert, founder of drupal? ^ kind of a big deal! https://dri.es/to-pesos-or-to-posse
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[hans] Good idea. I’m not a fan of display:none because some indexers consider that a bad content smell.
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aaronpk neat
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aaronpk oh nice diagrams
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aaronpk https://dri.es/files/images/blog/pesos-vs-posse.jpg
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snarfed also mentions webmentions, wm.io, bridgy in the comments
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Loqi [indienews] New post: "To PESOS or to POSSE? | Dries Buytaert" https://dri.es/to-pesos-or-to-posse (from https://aaronparecki.com/2018/02/06/6/)
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dgold [hans]: i'm not hugely concerned about indexers
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[hans] Maybe not, but in my indie experience thus far, I think parsers are not as inspired by Postel’s Law as I’d prefer. 😉 So there are Many Wrong Ways™.
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[hans] Noted but not relevant to me. 😄
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[miklb] I thought someone was working on a Drupal webmention add-on, maybe for Drupal 8?
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[miklb] I’m going to assume Dries saw this https://github.com/HongPong/linkback-old
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Loqi [HongPong] linkback-old: linkback (rebuilt vinculum) module for Drupal 8
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@Dries Blog post: To PESOS or to POSSE? https://dri.es/to-pesos-or-to-posse Comparing two different approaches that help me take control back over my own data on the web. #openweb #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/960904166280396800)
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@nitishchpr Blog post: To PESOS or to POSSE? https://dri.es/to-pesos-or-to-posse Comparing two different approaches that help me take control back over my own data on the web. #openweb #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/960904472686886915)
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snarfed branding is hard 😂😭 https://github.com/snarfed/bridgy-fed/issues/22
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Loqi [kajmagnus] #22 What's the difference between Bridgy-Fed and Bridgy?
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aaronpk "Why did the Bridgy-Fed people proceed with creating Bridgy-Fed although Bridgy already exists?" 😂
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snarfed why indeed
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aaronpk I sympathize
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[cleverdevil] waves
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[cleverdevil] Howdy IndieWeb 🙂
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[cleverdevil] Thoughtful Twitter thread on WordPress security -> https://twitter.com/CiPHPerCoder/status/960760569740570624
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@CiPHPerCoder I've drafted several blog posts in the past week and scrapped them all. None of them feel important enough to write about, let alone publish. (twitter.com/_/status/960760569740570624)
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snarfed heh. starts the thread with "i have nothing worth writing about," then proceeds to write a blog-post-length twitter thread
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aaronpk gah what's that twitter unthreader
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[cleverdevil] Peak twitter.
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[cleverdevil] Also: he's the author of a CMS, so he has no excuse.
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[cleverdevil] Still, thoughtful thread.
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[cleverdevil] (And also a reminder of what we're up against: the convenience of publishing on Twitter, even if it makes consumption worse).
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snarfed aaronpk: https://threadreaderapp.com/
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sknebel Aww, sad to hear Scott is being ignored :/ he's one of the people you probably should take seriously if they want to help improve your product
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[cleverdevil] I'm not too surprised.
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[cleverdevil] He's right: WordPress is much more focused on other things, like growing their market share at all costs.
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[cleverdevil] Which requires things like their Gutenberg project, which will help them catch up to the site builders of the world.
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[cleverdevil] Still... I wish they had a stronger focus on security and were willing to make some difficult decisions around backward compatibility to help move the entire web forward.
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sknebel not surprised they didn't do the work themselves, a bit more that they won't even accept it if a lot of the work is already done
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snarfed to be fair, they've worked hard on security for a while now, and modern wordpress's security is actually not bad
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snarfed historically it was up and down, but mostly it's just had the same problem as any big target, similar to e.g. MS windows: it's just the biggest target, since it has a huge installed base, and it also has a huge plugin ecosystem, which means a huge targetable surface area
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snarfed his complaint is actually very narrow: he worries about someone breaking into the auto update servers that automattic run, and distributing a hacked update.
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[cleverdevil] Its far better than it was.
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snarfed ...which is like worrying about someone breaking into google or apple and distributing a hacked version of android or iOS. it's technically possible, but probably not the most practical or realistic concern
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[cleverdevil] I still think that they should start requiring much more modern PHP versions in a major update soon.
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@miklb @holman @jptoto @markrendle This is what I used from @aaronpk https://ssl.indieweb.org/ (twitter.com/_/status/960937883136913409)
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tantek hey does everyone have 280 chars on Twitter now?
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tantek apparently: http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/gadgets-and-tech/news/twitter-280-characters-tweets-start-when-get-latest-a8042716.html
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KartikPrabhu yeah I think so
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Loqi [superfeedr] "“To PESOS or to POSSE?” https://dri.es/to-pesos-or-to-posse Great post @Dries! #openweb #indieweb Go for it. POSSEing to Twitter^1 and Facebook^2 works quite well. Whether notes^3 / status updates (since 2010), or photos^4 (since 2015), it’s totally doable, and brings incredible peace of mind and a greater sense of ownership & control over your content. You may also want to look into POSSEing replies^5, owning your comments as it were. This comment for example, was originally posted on tantek.com as a single post, a multi-reply^6, automatically POSSEd to Twitter where it was auto-ellipsed & threaded^7 with your tweet, and only manually cross-posted on your original post. Lots more on the IndieWeb wiki, and plenty of friendly folks ready and willing to share cross-platform/language development experience implementing all this stuff in the #indieweb-dev channel: * https://chat.indieweb.org/dev Drop by and say hi anytime! Tantek 1^ https://indieweb.org/Twitter#POSSE_to_Twitter 2^ https://indieweb.org/POSSE_to_Facebook 3^ https://indieweb.org/note 4^ https://indieweb.org/photo 5^ https://indieweb.org/reply 6^ https://indieweb.org/multiple-reply 7^ https://indieweb.org/Twitter#original_has_POSSE_tweet" on 2018-02-06 http://tantek.com/2018/037/t1/posse-indieweb-twitter-facebook
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@t “To PESOS or to POSSE?” https://dri.es/to-pesos-or-to-posse Great post @Dries! #openweb #indieweb Go for it. POSSEing to Twitter^1 and Facebook^2 works quite well. Whether notes^3 / status updates (since 2010), or photos^4 (since 2015), it’s totally ... http://tantek.com/t4so1 (twitter.com/_/status/960957843536039936)
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aaronpk 😂
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tantek :D
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@aaronpk @RichGriese @RichGriese Yeah it's a pretty good option, it's what I use for my own site as well. More info here: https://indieweb.org/Jekyll#Related_Tools (twitter.com/_/status/960961318864920577)
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@PercolatorToday Episode 18: IndieWebCamp Baltimore https://percolator.today/episode/18 (twitter.com/_/status/960979938030493696)
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aaronpk I made that entirely on an ipad o.O
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aaronpk including posting it to percolator.today and twitter
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aaronpk \o/
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aaronpk in under an hour
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@aj100kblog The IndieWeb outside of Facebook is full of opportunities https://tpl.host/ILQU2WL #linux #entrepreneur https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DVYWb9_X4AALq-j.jpg (twitter.com/_/status/960980254650232832)
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snarfed aaronpk++ nice!
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Loqi aaronpk has 541 karma in this channel (1559 overall)
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schmarty aaronpk++ awesome!
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Loqi aaronpk has 542 karma in this channel (1560 overall)
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schmarty haha oh, improv is in there!
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Loqi awesome
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aaronpk just a bit :)
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[eddie] Awesome, aaronpk!
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[eddie] I feel like your episodes need the cover art as u-featured?
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[eddie] Podcasts in a feed without cover art is sad 😞
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aaronpk oh like in the html feed?
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aaronpk there should be cover art in the mp3 file itself
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[tantek] Eddie do you have examples of podcasts with cover art?
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aaronpk all of them?
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[eddie] tantek: yeah, I haven’t every seen a podcast without it
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[tantek] How is it published in the podcast?
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aaronpk it's in the mp3 file
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[eddie] Ohhhh. Typically in RSS it’s a property
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aaronpk oh yeah there's also an image specified in the RSS feed, not per item, but for the whole feed
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[eddie] Oh yeah it is for the whole feed
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aaronpk but each episode can override it by emedding the artwork in the mp3 file
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[eddie] Hmmm so here is the use case, I wonder what the proper way to handle it is? I subscribed to percolator via monocle. I have a microcasts channel
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schmarty i've been a bit confused by per-episode images in podcast feeds. iirc apple's docs list a way of doing it but then say that it's only used as a fallback if the feed is missing an image.
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[tantek] Feed image sounds per feed rather than per item
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[eddie] Right now I just see the title of the podcast in each item. But it would be great to have the cover art. However you would want it to show up on a per episode basis because there can be multiple podcasts in a channel
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[eddie] I guess it would be on the feed and monocle could then add it to the individual posts?
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[tantek] Is that documented as a how to on /podcast?
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[kevinmarks] It gets confusing with per episode images, I can't always tell which podcast it is
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aaronpk I think "featured" is the right way to think about this
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[kevinmarks] Npr don't brand theirs
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aaronpk here's a web version of a podcast feed https://overcast.fm/itunes1288310161/percolator
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[kevinmarks] So I have to know that planet money is in the 800 episode range
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aaronpk [eddie]: does indigenous know that something is a podcast vs a regular post?
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[kevinmarks] http://www.unmung.com/feed?feed=https%3A%2F%2Fpercolator.today%2Fpodcast.xml
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aaronpk if your browser supports xslt then you can just open the feed in the browser to see a nice version of it :) https://percolator.today/podcast.xml
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schmarty aaronpk++ haha, nice work on the xslt
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Loqi nice
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[kevinmarks] Podle gets a 418
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[kevinmarks] https://podle.audio/v7/feed?url=https%3A%2F%2Fpercolator.today%2Fpodcast.xml
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aaronpk I have no idea what podle is
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aaronpk i'm guessing they have an out of date ssl library tho
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[tantek] More admin tax?
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aaronpk keeping your server up to date? I guess so
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[kevinmarks] Podle is a PWA podcast player
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aaronpk that or dreamhost is blocking their ip address for some reason
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aaronpk getting connection refused on http too, so it must be that
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[eddie] aaronpk: It doesn’t know a podcast, but it does know if there is an audio file
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aaronpk is that new? I don't see any difference in mine
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KartikPrabhu https://timkadlec.com/remembers/2018-02-06-saving-links-to-my-site-with-a-bookmarklet/
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Loqi Saving Links to My Site With a Bookmarklet February 6, 2018 # indieweb ...
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aaronpk course I dont really think indigenous really needs to be a podcast player :P
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[eddie] Oh yes, that is not live yet
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[eddie] Correct
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KartikPrabhu pretty nice bookmarklet flow
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[eddie] However, it’s useful to be able to “play” an audio file that is linked to a post
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aaronpk yeah totally
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aaronpk KartikPrabhu: omg I never knew typing the name of the bookmarklet would work! that's gonna save me a few clicks since I already use essentially that flow in chrome iOS already!
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KartikPrabhu I don't use Chrome much so I didn't know either
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KartikPrabhu but yeah that pretty neat
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[eddie] Basically, there is such a large difference in how I treat microcasts and long-form podcasts, I think it would be nice to have microcasts in Indigenous and leave long-form podcasts to Overcast
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aaronpk ah interesting
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KartikPrabhu similar to notes vs articles?
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[eddie] Yeah, I think that’s a similar comparison
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tantek or maybe sprinkle microcasts between podcasts while playing back
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[kevinmarks] Also, if your playback app is a web page, it could cache microcasts for offline.
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@megarush1024 Current status: Preaching the good word about the open, inclusive, independent web to anyone who will listen. #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/961017002025476096)
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