#indieweb 2018-06-18

2018-06-18 UTC
KartikPrabhu and markoong joined the channel
#
@seagl Headed to @indiewebcamp Summit in Portland next week? You should check it out! And while you're there, get inspired and propose some #indieweb talks to @SeaGL! We would love to hear from you: https://buff.ly/2LjtBR0 (twitter.com/_/status/1008513629585625089)
freescholar, KartikPrabhu, [miklb] and snarfed joined the channel
#
@dshanske An Indieweb Podcast: Episode 7: The Reverse Salmention: https://david.shanske.com/2018/06/17/an-indieweb-podcast-episode-7-the-reverse-salmention/ (twitter.com/_/status/1008523759022759937)
eli_oat, renem, snarfed, tantek, tomasparks, tbbrown, wolftune and tantek__ joined the channel
#
@lightcoin Disappointing to see @Medium begin blocking posts like this. The risk of this happening is why I post everything to my own blog first (https://lightco.in/author/lightcoin/) and syndicate to Medium and other sites later. Learned this from @indiewebcamp: https://indieweb.org/POSSE (twitter.com/_/status/1008559242624679936)
#
tantek__ wow
#
tantek__ the post he's referring to https://blog.status.im/status-medium-and-censorship-2aef5921b173
#
tantek__ via https://twitter.com/ethstatus/status/1007640254096990208
#
@ethstatus Our recent experience with #internetcensorship https://blog.status.im/status-medium-and-censorship-2aef5921b173 https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DfvbeIPU8AANe-P.jpg (twitter.com/_/status/1007640254096990208)
snarfed joined the channel
#
@jeena ↩️ @IndieWebCampDE @indiewebcamp Nice pictures but they also show how homogenious our community is, at least in europe. (twitter.com/_/status/1008563695868432386)
KartikPrabhu and [eddie] joined the channel
#
[eddie] Thanks Sebsel! Expect several more betas in quick succession as I try to kick out the 1.0 as quick as possible! (Really there should just be two more betas, 0.4 and then 1.0, before 1.0 gets a public release)
[miklb] joined the channel
#
[miklb] [eddie] do you know anyone testing with WP that has it working?
wolftune, gRegorLove_, snarfed, cweiske, barpthewire, iasai, sivoais, anotheryou, pindonga, swentel and jgmac1106_ joined the channel
#
jgmac1106_ Good morning all. Realizing I have a month or so left to migrate all my wikispaces wikis
#
Zegnat What is wikispaces?
#
Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "wikispaces" yet. Would you like to create it? (Or just say "wikispaces is ____", a sentence describing the term)
#
jgmac1106_ Figure I would just put in on site deaths rather than an article stub
#
jgmac1106_ Maybe I take this one: http://elementaryliterature.wikispaces.com and move it to [GregorLove] site
#
jgmac1106_ [miklb] I have used indigenous and WP when I get an instance where micropub works and I get past the authorization problem.
catsup, iasai, swentel_, barpthewire and jjuran joined the channel
#
petermolnar silo lockdowns are starting to effect my mood... it's more or less impossible to turn instagram to rss these days, tumblr went full retard by showing the cookie consent page in their RSS endpoint. 500px turned off free access to their API ("send us an email to discuss pricing") so forget about archiving/PESOS/POSSE/etc. I'm truly curious if these lockdown - the lack of 3rd party "hacks", alternative clients, etc - will drive people bac
#
petermolnar k to the real internet or just to other, currently emerging silos.
#
petermolnar tumblr was one of the good guys for so long
#
petermolnar (by good guys I mean they more or less aligned with the old fashioned ideas of web diversity, as much a silo can)
#
Zegnat It depends whether people even depended on the silos having an API. How many photographers putting photos on 500px are affected by the API thing? If the answer is 1%, why would the community move to something new?
markoong joined the channel
#
petermolnar 500px comes with it's own can of worms though
#
@vietlq ↩️ Time to roll your own static pages using @GoHugoIO and self-host and also use @BeakerBrowser & @dat_project for user-friendly anti-censorship. I’m using all 3 (twitter.com/_/status/1008673167949357056)
#
petermolnar https://superuser.com/questions/1332236/what-happens-to-country-specific-tlds-in-a-war-involving-that-country#50867495 - I never thought about this question
#
cweiske that's the main reason I only use my .de domain
#
petermolnar I wonder if .net, .org, .com fall under this category or not
#
cweiske because I probably don't have leverage to get a foreign domain back in the case of problems
#
petermolnar I have/involved in .org, .net, .com, .hu, .eu
#
petermolnar .https://medium.com/@Oskar456/stolen-sk-domain-717e070f6735 - this is a story behind .sk and it's current state o.O
#
Zegnat I am on .net / .se / .li ... Basically banking on SE and LI for sticking to staying the most neutral countries they can be
#
petermolnar what is .li?
#
Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for ".li" yet. Would you like to create it? (Or just say ".li is ____", a sentence describing the term)
#
Zegnat Lichtenstein. It is operated by the same registry as CH (Switzerland)
jjuran, [jgmac1106] and [kevinmarks] joined the channel
#
[kevinmarks] There are well known problems with the .ly registry
#
petermolnar .li != .ly
#
Zegnat Yeah, I specifically went with .li because it still sounds good but isn’t .ly :P
jeremych_ and snarfed joined the channel
#
@srushe My slides from #nidevconf18 on "Playing with the #IndieWeb" are now available at https://noti.st/srushe/7D5URN/playing-with-the-indieweb. The irony of using a silo for this is not lost on me. When I put my new site together there will be a slides section :) (twitter.com/_/status/1008702012593262593)
hs0ucy and [cjwillcock] joined the channel
#
[cjwillcock] good morning IndieWeb
#
Zegnat Good morning [cjwillcock]
eli_oat, snarfed, wolftune, qu4ku and sketchess joined the channel
#
sketchess good morning Indieweb
#
Zegnat good morning sketchess
#
sketchess Oh hello Zegnat. How are you today?
#
Zegnat I am fine. Deep diving into roleplaying games and the possibility of running them off of indieweb blogs.
#
Zegnat How are you?
#
sketchess I am fine, thanks. Is something settled this week?
#
Zegnat Settled? You mean like an IndieWeb event? Not that I know of.
nitot joined the channel
#
sketchess And I thought the double day might just have been any kind of misttake. It is unsual that IWS and HWC happening together.
#
sketchess -t
#
sketchess Or I just have to clean my glasses.
#
Zegnat The planning of IWC and IWS depends a lot on organisers, venues, and collaborations with other events. E.g. the Düsseldorf and Berlin events often happened connected to the Beyond Tellerand conference. They don’t consider HWC dates, because HWC happens on a fixed interval no matter what.
#
sketchess I see.
#
sketchess Hmm. How are roleplaying games are related to Indieweb and blogs?
tbbrown joined the channel
#
Zegnat Some people in the indieweb community like roleplaying games, and the question is if it would be able to play any of them using our blogs. (Posting our actions, sending webmentions to eachother, etc.) So I am idly looking into some asynchronous systems.
#
Zegnat Next events: Homebrew Website Club Meetup https://indieweb.org/events/2018-06-27-homebrew-website-club and IndieWeb Summit 2018!!! https://indieweb.org/2018 Code of conduct: https://indieweb.org/code-of-conduct, log https://chat.indieweb.org/today
#
sketchess That brings memories back. I was a player.^^
#
sketchess What a evolution to be: board -> mail -> chat -> now comments
#
sketchess If you do, I would like to have a look.
#
sketchess further explained: got it running.
#
skippy good morning.
#
sketchess good morning skippy
#
Loqi greetings human
#
skippy greetings, program!
#
Zegnat sketchess, “chat” doesn’t really work well as an analogy, imo. Because that feels a lot more synchronous than asynchronous.
#
sketchess no analogies, just memories
eli_oat and freescholar joined the channel
#
sketchess Time flies.
iasai, jgmac1106 and awolf joined the channel
#
Zegnat sketchess, if you have ideas or prefered systems that you know work well with board/mail let me know! I am still in discovery phase.
#
skippy Zegnat: old old perl scripts for pbem: http://araw.mede.uic.edu/~alansz/pbemtools/
#
Zegnat Thanks skippy, I’ll have a look!
#
Zegnat There are plenty of tools, and I am finding plenty people recommending websites to run PbP on. But I don’t think the tools are a problem for the IndieWeb crowd (we’d want them on our own blogs anyway). The rules system has me wondering a lot more. E.g. I know some D&D PbP games but all of them use slightly different rules, and I personally do not like the D&D rules for PbP in the slightest.
#
skippy PbP == ?
#
Zegnat Play-by-Post
nitot joined the channel
#
skippy thanks.
#
Zegnat basically the catch-all for RPGs not played face-to-face or synchronously :)
#
sketchess Zegnat, we were doing everything with your own bains and hands. No code. Nothing automated.
#
Zegnat sketchess, yes, I meant system as in the rules system. You could have been playing freeform of course. But a lot of games use an underlying structure of rules, e.g. Dungeons & Dragons.
#
Zegnat But for more RPG chat I’ll point at #indieweb-chat. There isn’t an indieweb application for it yet, so this talk shouldn’t go in this main channel :)
#
sketchess Oh you were speaking about the actual game play. Well that's a different story, of course.
[miklb] joined the channel
#
sketchess I thought, you were searching out technical aspects to implement something during Webmentions or similiar.
#
Zegnat People can already write posts and share them with eachother using webmentions. I don’t think that part is a problem. But for a demonstration game, having simple rules that enable frictionless play in a federated environment is what I am more interested in.
#
Zegnat But I’ll stop spamming everyone in this chat about RPG stuff now :) Like I said, more a topic for the chat channel #indieweb-chat
#
sketchess just have to find drive..
#
sketchess ready..... just have to switch ;)
[jgmac1106] and [eddie] joined the channel
#
petermolnar oh, ffs https://dot-eu-is-going.uk/
#
petermolnar I should have migrated my mail address to .net 2 years ago like I did with my site :/
eli_oat, dougbeal|mb1 and [kim_landwehr] joined the channel
#
[kim_landwehr] The note option of Quill doesn’t seem to be working for me. When I hit the post button nothing happens. There is no error message but nothing post.
#
skippy i used quill just a couple minutes ago to post two notes.
#
skippy [kim_landwehr]: any log messages on your micropub endpoint?
#
aaronpk [kim_landwehr]: try a force refresh in your browser
qu4ku, snarfed, [cleverdevil], hs0ucy, [keithjgrant], eli_oat, aalmazan, jgmac1106_, seekr and KartikPrabhu joined the channel
#
@webstandards Full description of #CentralisedWeb https://indieweb.org/silo by @calum_ryan (twitter.com/_/status/1008772899887632384)
jgmac1106_ and tantek joined the channel
#
@webstandards #indieweb principles 1. Your content is yours 2. You are better connected 3. You are in control @calum_ryan - https://indieweb.org/principles (twitter.com/_/status/1008775295007121408)
#
tantek oh yeah is that tonight?
#
@ilpeach @calum_ryan raises the evergreen problem of ownership and centralised web that #indieweb is trying to tackle through the push of standards for re-decentralising the web #lwsJun18 (twitter.com/_/status/1008776397152759809)
#
jgmac1106_ I have two visiting scholars studying under me from China studying from China, hoping to bring to summit. Fingers crossed
[cleverdevil] joined the channel
#
[cleverdevil] Was just thinking that would be a good idea. Maybe [manton] can?
#
[cleverdevil] Did anyone invite Brent Simmons to IWS?
snarfed joined the channel
#
@webstandards IndieWeb Standards: #MicroFormats - https://indieweb.org/microformats http://indieauth.net -https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XE0AA6gVRSI @calum_ryan (twitter.com/_/status/1008777010594926592)
jjuran joined the channel
#
@webstandards #WebMentions https://indieweb.org/Webmention let another service when you've linked to it @calum_ryan (twitter.com/_/status/1008778177588727810)
#
@webstandards Try https://indiewebify.me/ says @calum_ryan to find out how #IndieWeb you are (twitter.com/_/status/1008778946576637954)
#
@webstandards @calum_ryan is working on simplifying the indieweb docs https://indiewebguides.org/ (twitter.com/_/status/1008779676297416704)
#
@webstandards Join @calum_ryan at #HomeBrewWebsiteClub https://hwclondon.co.uk/ (twitter.com/_/status/1008779863384383489)
snarfed joined the channel
#
@ramsey ↩️ You should check out the IndieWeb project, Micropub specification, Web Mentions, and more. Links: https://indieweb.org • https://www.w3.org/TR/micropub/ • https://www.w3.org/TR/webmention/ • https://www.w3.org/wiki/Socialwg (twitter.com/_/status/1008786776629051393)
marclaporte, swentel, snarfed, marclaporte1, [grantcodes] and eli_oat joined the channel
#
tomasparks I wear different "hats" depending on what is being discussed, I am wondering how identify what hay i'm wear on my website
#
tomasparks H-card?
#
Zegnat I am not sure what you mean, tomasparks. The h-card markup expresses you - the person behind the website.
eli_oat joined the channel
#
tomasparks sometime I can reply to something 6 different way depending my interest crossovers
#
Zegnat All from the same website?
#
tomasparks yes
eli_oat joined the channel
#
Zegnat That still sounds like you are making all the replies as “tomasparks” then, so surely 1 h-card would work there?
#
tomasparks i am starting think that my website should be multi-author based
[cjwillcock] joined the channel
#
[cjwillcock] hi tomasparks and zegnat. I understand tomasparks wants to include information like, from what perspective was this reply written, in the h-card. I have found the properties seem to apply to the objective nature of the root element. Like, a url or a full name or something like that. I understand that tomasparks is considering including subjective nature of root element. State or mind, or perspective. Something like that.
#
[cjwillcock] @zegnat is this a good time to suggest a p-thomasparks-hat property, for him to use?
#
[cjwillcock] I think including properties like this is neat, and could be useful to data consumers later
#
Zegnat you could use p-note to attach a short bio that clears up how you are looking at something. Or p-role if you are answering from some sort of function. Wouldn’t need the invention of new properties.
snarfed and eli_oat joined the channel
#
[cjwillcock] it's okay then, if h-card properties are different in different h-entry 's then. As you suggest, use p-note or p-role
#
[cjwillcock] sound okay tomasparks?
marclaporte joined the channel
#
tomasparks yes
#
Zegnat It is fine to use different h-card objects on different h-entry objects. Nobody is actually using it to separate facets of the same person at the moment, AFAIK. Definitely an interesting idea though!
#
tomasparks thats the way i thinking
#
[cjwillcock] aha! that's the idea i like so much and wish to consider
#
[cjwillcock] for example, a p-mood ( a little different than thomasparks use )
[jgmac1106] joined the channel
#
Zegnat There is a page for brainstorming on h-card extensions here: http://microformats.org/wiki/h-card-brainstorming
#
Zegnat I think acegiak has done mood, you may want to have a look at how they did it.
#
Zegnat Who is acegiak?
#
Loqi Acegiak is a web and game developer from Adelaide, South Australia https://indieweb.org/User:Acegiak.net
eli_oat and KartikPrabhu joined the channel
#
Zegnat What is mood?
#
Loqi mood is sometimes expressed explicitly in or about a post, by the post author https://indieweb.org/mood
#
Zegnat Some more information, [cjwillcock] ^^^
eli_oat and tantek joined the channel
#
@jgmac1106 ↩️ So @mozilla has taken a few approaches with the Global Sprint (plus and minus as most projects go nowhere). The first bug approach (assumes a skill level but okay) while trying to model some (but often less) practices in the open. #IndieWeb does a… http://jgregorymcverry.com/3613-2/ (twitter.com/_/status/1008803885052461059)
#
@schmarty Countdown to the IndieWeb Summit, improvements for WordPress beginners, and a new kind of book club. It's your < 10min update on the #IndieWeb community! This Week in the IndieWeb audio edition for June 9th - 15th, 2018. https://martymcgui.re/2018/06/18/155946/ (twitter.com/_/status/1008804010827173888)
marclaporte1 joined the channel
#
tantek jgmac1106: "#IndieWeb does a scratch your itch approach. That works as well but they don’t have to generate bad data for KPIs that can be turned into pretty decks." 😂😂😂
#
[cjwillcock] thanks @Zegnat
#
KartikPrabhu what is KPI?
#
Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "KPI" yet. Would you like to create it? (Or just say "KPI is ____", a sentence describing the term)
#
tantek KartikPrabhu: enwp.org/KPI
#
KartikPrabhu oh! some advertising jargon
#
[jgmac1106] @karthikPrabhu sorry Key Performance Index, been a major quarterly focus for MoFo and MoCo last few years....with quarterly and annual goals shifting. Makes people do dumb stuff with data because numbers make graphs and bar charts
#
tantek no, management jargon: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Performance_indicator
#
tantek yes to jgmac1106 said
#
KartikPrabhu aah ok <shrug>
#
[jgmac1106] but forgot there is so much Mozilla Indieweb crossover, don't mean to bad mouth anyone's employer
#
tantek jgmac1106: I'll let you know if you say anything inaccurate 😂
#
tantek more on the "dumb stuff": https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Performance_indicator#Problems
#
tantek we can take that to chat for more
#
KartikPrabhu which reminds me I should write papers ;)
[kevinmarks], qu4ku, oodani, snarfed, eli_oat, KartikPrabhu and [manton] joined the channel
#
[manton] [cleverdevil] Not sure if anyone here invited Brent... I'm guessing it's too late for him to come down (he's in Seattle) but I'll mention it to him.
#
aaronpk seattle is a short train ride! :)
JasonO and tantek__ joined the channel
#
GWG aaronpk, I know. I am taking it
[cleverdevil] joined the channel
#
[cleverdevil] We will have people joining remotely, I believe, right [aaronpk]?
#
[cleverdevil] Having Brent join virtually would still be great!
[grantcodes] joined the channel
#
aaronpk Yeah! Planning on a similar setup to what we had at Baltimore
marclaporte joined the channel
#
@ChrisAldrich Some brief thoughts on the overlap of #openscience and the #IndieWeb movement after watching @michael_nielsen's short video. https://boffosocko.com/2018/06/12/open-science-michael-nielsen-at-tedxwaterloo-youtube/ (twitter.com/_/status/1008836208309354496)
[kevinmarks] joined the channel
#
[kevinmarks] Thinking about games, a webmention driven dice roller would work
#
[kevinmarks] You mention it saying 3d6 or whatever, and it webmentions you back with the result
#
[kevinmarks] There are a lot of games you can play with an append-only log
#
[kevinmarks] http://www.dunx.org/mc/webmc.html
snarfed and [asuh] joined the channel
#
aaronpk wasn't someone playing chess via webmention?
#
aaronpk oh it was on twitter
#
KartikPrabhu knight to d4
tantek__ joined the channel
#
tantek KartikPrabhu: see https://twitter.com/alapapa/status/312053522755641344
#
@alapapa ♜♞♝♚♛♝♞♜ ♟♟♟♟♟♟♟♟ ▓ ░ ▓ ░ ▓ ░ ▓ ░ ░ ▓ ░ ▓ ░ ▓ ░ ▓ ▓ ░ ▓ ░ ▓ ░ ▓ ░ ░ ▓ ░ ▓ ░ ▓ ░ ▓ ▓ ░ ▓ ░ ▓ ░ ▓ ░ ♙♙♙♙♙♙♙♙ ♖♘♗♔♕♗♘♖ #linebreaks #chess (twitter.com/_/status/312053522755641344)
#
tantek ^^^ and this is why Loqi should render linebreaks from twitter :)
#
KartikPrabhu ha! Loqi messed up te linebreaks :P
#
tantek KartikPrabhu: indeed, we documented webmention chess a while ago as a use-case for https://indieweb.org/note#Why_Preserve_Whitespace
#
KartikPrabhu tantek: yes should be in the new mf2py. I should check this Twitter use case with bridgy though
eli_oat, [eddie], ajft, snarfed, [grantcodes], gRegorLove and [miklb] joined the channel