#indieweb 2018-10-17

2018-10-17 UTC
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[jgmac1106] [snarfed] the follow discussion is really taking off in different parts of the web, exciting to see the focus
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[jgmac1106] A website we made at Cub Scouts tonight as the Wolf Pack (1st graders 5-7) designed their community service project: https://donotlitter.glitch.me/ they wrote all the copy, did the illustration and after playing tag tag revolution learned header and paragraph tags: https://donotlitter.glitch.me/
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[dave] Nice! Tbh that’s really all you need.
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gRegorLove [chrisaldrich], GWG will you be able to make vHWC tomorrow?
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jacky going to try to make it to vHWC - I won't be at the SF HWC b/c of a conflict with https://www.meetup.com/dotbayarea/events/255202528/ (a good friend runs this meetup and it's the first one)
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[kevinmarks] Today in silo shenanigans https://twitter.com/dyfl/status/1052403439613829120?s=19
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@dyfl If you missed it: today it was confirmed that Facebook massively & knowingly inflated its video-view statistics, which had the DIRECT consequence of 90% of media orgs firing writers in favor of expensive video producers, who also got fired when it turned out video was worthless https://twitter.com/jason_kint/status/1052400225602756608 (twitter.com/_/status/1052403439613829120)
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[chrisburnell] Good morning IndieWeb 🙂
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aaronpk good morning!
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swentel how's the jetlag ? :)
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aaronpk what jetlag ;-)
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swentel hehe
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KartikPrabhu what is jetlag?
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KartikPrabhu damnit
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petermolnar there is no jetlag
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[jgmac1106] [gRegorLove] I will make vHWC after soccer practice, barring any meltdowns
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petermolnar ah, no no spoon meme from Loqi
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sl007 @aaronpk Sorry, can't make it to IWC. Just reading https://indieweb.org/WebID where @tantek asked "What additional use-cases" :: LogIn to my SOLID server w. IndieAuth // or can't SOLID just use IndieAuth ?
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aaronpk sl007: sorry to miss you this year! solid should definitely use IndieAuth, since it's basically a profile of OAuth 2.0 to work under the same constraints solid has.
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aaronpk sl007: this post explains why it'd be a good fit https://aaronparecki.com/2018/07/07/7/oauth-for-the-open-web
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sl007 Cool. I am trying to https://solid.inrupt.com/docs/app-on-your-lunch-break - I guess it will be a long lunch break ;) btw: will IWC be streamed ?
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aaronpk yep! we'll be streaming the main room, and will be running Hangouts for remote participation in at least one room
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[jgmac1106] sweet!
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sl007 @aaronpk How about https://github.com/solid/webid-oidc-spec ?
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Loqi [solid] webid-oidc-spec: Specs for WebID-OIDC decentralized authentication protocol (based on OAuth2/OpenID Connect)
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aaronpk looks like how you'd go about turning OpenID Connect into something useful for solid, but IMO is still a lot more cumbersome that is actually necessary
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aaronpk in other words, if you thought the indieauth spec was difficult to implement, that is about 10x harder
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[Rose] IWC as an IWC Nürnberg? Nice!
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[Rose] And regarding HWC: Is there a European one happening online tonight?
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sl007 well, the indieauth spec was KISS when I wrote the node implementation. "Builds on decades of real-world authentication industry experience" - sounds like materials used in space flights
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sl007 - however also written a JWT library I'd use and if you look at https://github.com/solid/webid-oidc-spec#brief-workflow-summary isn't 3) - 5) just IndieAuth
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Loqi [solid] webid-oidc-spec: Specs for WebID-OIDC decentralized authentication protocol (based on OAuth2/OpenID Connect)
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aaronpk happy to chat more of the dev details in #indieweb-dev
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jeremycherfas Good morning IndieWeb
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jgmac1106 [jeremycherfas] just listedn to my first eatthispodcast episode..great job gonna do a bunch of back episodes
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jeremycherfas Cool. Glad you liked it. Let me know if you have comments or suggestions,
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[renem] Hi indieweb folks!
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[renem] I maybe missed an information about Brid.gy and Flickr publishing. Something maybe has changed over the last few months. I get an error when trying to publish to Flickr (via Brid.gy web) "Flickr doesn't support type(s) h-card, or no content was found." And I've no idea why this worked months ago and now throws this error. [snarfed] maybe?
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[dave] G’day IndieWeb
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[dave] Gonna do vHWC tonight. Been busy with a sick cat and didn’t have a chance to set anything up local.
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[dave] Anyone else run into problems using IFTTT to post to Twitter from Mastodon RSS feeds? The @ in the URL keeps disappearing and I’m trying to figure out if I’m doing something wrong or if I just need to escalate this bug with one of them.
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petermolnar I did run into problems with IFTTT parsing RSS, but I don't do Mastodon
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petermolnar I can easily imagine a buggy regex email match that drops the initial @
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cweiske question is how it looks, and how it should be looking
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[Rose] I use Zapier to post to Mastodon, but that's from a RSS feed (which also posts to Twitter) and uses webhooks
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petermolnar wonders if he should spin up a mastodon/fediverse instance just to syndicate there, or would fed.brid.gy be enough
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[Rose] I want to do the fed.brid.gy stuff, but I haven't got there yet.
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[Rose] There's a few steps in the process before I get there
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petermolnar is anyone doing a working fed.brid.gy syndication ?
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swentel replies, like and repost work fine
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petermolnar I'm more interested in the mastodon instance wants to follow my site thing
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swentel right
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swentel that's the last part I'm figuring out now :)
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petermolnar :D
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swentel I know how to send an AP request though to mastodon
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aaronpk I have a working implementation of a similar service, but mine doesn't do replies at all 😂
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swentel but snarfed would like to see other way first to get posts visible there
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swentel since it's kind of weird to hardcode a certain instance to send your main toots to
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[Rose] I have been wondering if I would be better off just syndicating the posts to Mastodon myself (as I currently do), but I do lose replies and likes
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[jgmac1106] Why not a syndicated h-card phone book? People could use that for their nickname cache for a local copy. Even if it's just a GitHub repo... though an API to sync be neat
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swentel wel fed.bridgy can send back replies and likes (but it's currently broken heh)
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[jgmac1106] Also activity on the idno/Known repo bumping ActivityPub integration
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[jgmac1106] Hey I admin indieweb.me if anyone wants to hack around at all. Not sure if it helps. Guy running mastohost said he would help with getting access to anything we need but isn't a developer
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petermolnar wow. I loaded indieweb.me, and currenctly my browser is set to 'hu' (Hungarian) locale; the mastodon translation is... interesting.
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swentel hehe
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petermolnar silly word choices, I get, but typos...?
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swentel you'd hope translations are at least peer reviewed .. :)
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cweiske peer review just happened
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skippy how well does Sunlit play with micropub? anyone using it without micro.blog or wordpress?
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[Rose] It uses MicroPub, it works fine with my endpoint 🙂
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cweiske what is sunlit
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "sunlit" yet. Would you like to create it? (Or just say "sunlit is ____", a sentence describing the term)
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skippy sunlit is http://sunlit.io/
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Loqi ok
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snarfed renem: sounds like maybe your site's markup changed? or bridgy's mf2 parsing. that error means it couldn't find your post or photo in the parsed mf2. you can see what bridgy saw in the log for that publish attempt, linked on your bridgy user page
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petermolnar I want to start lobbying at Facebook to create an "ACK" reacji
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petermolnar a neutral reaction
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snarfed heh, just start commenting with it on its own, indieweb emoji reaction style
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petermolnar is there an ACK emoticon?
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petermolnar 😑 "Expressionless Face" U+1F611 would work
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[eddie] The closed eyes there to me put off a somewhat negative emotion. I think this one might be more “emotionless” 😐
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[schmarty] i'm a fan of 🆗
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skippy where does one file bugs or ask for help with Sunlit? just help@micro.blog? that seems... insufficient.
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[eddie] You can also go to the Micro.blog Slack and there’s a Photos channel
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[jgmac1106] there is a microblog slack instance...
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[eddie] Both Manton and Jonathon (the developers) help out there
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skippy its been ages since I've joined a slack channel without a direct invite. remind me how to do thta?
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[eddie] http://micro.blog/slack
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[eddie] Fill out your email and it’ll send you an invitation 🙂
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skippy thanks
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[eddie] My pleasure!
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jgmac1106 @eddie had this dream in the car (yeah should be driving) of my aperture/indigenous podcast feed, when it hit the end of the audioclip I would get a prompt, This podcast is publsihed, Would you like to publish a “listen post”
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[eddie] I do really want some type of more automated listen post tracking. I…will not admit to tracking listened podcasts in the car. But I won’t say it doesn’t happen either.
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[jgmac1106] Yeah be awesome to plugin into the mic, though easier on Android than iOS
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[jgmac1106] Maybe a listen as an icon choice in Indigenous for rss feeds.
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[eddie] Both Indigenous clients know if there is an audio file attached, so it could be if an audio file exists, then it shows a listen button. My problem is I use a general purpose Podcast player, and I don’t necessarily feel like we need to reinvent podcast players
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[eddie] 🤔 I have more thoughts, but it’s gonna get #dev real quick
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[eddie] So I’ll be over there
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[jgmac1106] Yeah just thinking on Marco Arment recent post that we need to stop using commercial players since they don't support Podcaster. His advice was open players or rss
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skippy micro.blog and sunlit aren't working against my personal micropub endpoint. Indigenous only supports notes, not articles (and doesnt rotate images). Any other ios apps?
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[eddie] Indigenous does support articles (but not with embedded images yet, if that's what you were wanting)
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[eddie] and yeah, I need to figure out image rotation too
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[eddie] lol
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swentel heh, it took me a while to get that right too lol
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jacky [eddie]: you ever consider extracting some of the libraries around IndieWeb stuff in Indigenous?
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[eddie] I definitely want to do that
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skippy quill doesnt seem to like my mobile photos. Wondering if it's accepting the HEIF and passing that through raw, and my endpoint is discarding it because i dont support it server side
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[eddie] jacky: I've kept the files themselves separate so it'll make the libraries easier to make.
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skippy [eddie]: how does one do articles? i dont see a way to do a title to make an article
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jacky [eddie]: nice!
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jacky I'm toying with the idea of making another client app myself tbh
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[eddie] skippy: Same as Micro.blog, if you post more than 280 characters
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jacky but wanted to give back and not reinvent the wheel (too much)
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skippy [eddie]: ah. i see. that's nice, and surprisingly not intuitive to me.
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[eddie] jacky: awesome! Yeah, one reason I haven't worked on the libraries aspect too much is not knowing anyone that wants to use them yet
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[eddie] skippy: Yeah, I've been feeling a little "meh" about it recently, so not sure it's gonna stick that way
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skippy i think i would like articles with images; but it's not presing.
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skippy I'm about to go on vacation to Lodon, and would liek to share some photos, maybe.
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[eddie] Ohhh, very cool!
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[eddie] Yeah, that's definitely something I would like to do. The challenging part is the interface where the photos are intermingled with the text
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[eddie] I have to figure out how apps like Ulysses such embed those
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skippy my phone takes HEIF images, but my endpoint only accepts GIF, PNG and JPEG; so I need photo conversion to happen client side before i upload.
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[eddie] Ahh yeah, that's understandable
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[eddie] jacky: I'll push up the priority of the libraries knowing that you're interested in using them
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tantek__ what is HEIF
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Loqi tantek__: [jgmac1106] left you a message 23 hours, 31 minutes ago: as far as I can tell, and the first reference I can find to #toptentuesday is this IGN article on best games and metal bands: https://www.ign.com/articles/2007/10/02/top-ten-tuesday-games-or-metal-bands it then took off among librarian blogs after the launch of Twitter and is now a hashtag used primarily from librarians and #bookphiles
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "HEIF" yet. Would you like to create it? (Or just say "HEIF is ____", a sentence describing the term)
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jacky definitely! if you have tickets on it too, I'll see if I can contribute. I'm better with Kotlin than with Java
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[eddie] Ohhhh! :D oops Android?
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[eddie] That would be swentel :)
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[eddie] Not sure if he is planning on building out libraries
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skippy HEIF is High Efficiency Image Format. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_Efficiency_Image_File_Format
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jacky ahhh okay okay
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Loqi ok
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swentel reading backscroll
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swentel hmm no plans for libraries yet
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swentel although I can see indieauth as an interesting library
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swentel not so sure about the rest atm
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jacky gotcha
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jacky I think the biggest one for me would be leaning on a microformats lib
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jacky micropub and microsub rely on a networking library and people got a lot of opinions on which one to use lol
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[renem] [snarfed] I have already had a look in the log, but don't understand it 😉 Brid.gy identifies the photo post as "article", maybe from schema.org notation. the mf2 tags are correctly there, h-entry and the img has the class u-photo.
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[renem] 2018-10-16 22:03:58.975193 D publishing object type article to Flickr
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[renem] 2018-10-16 22:03:58.986843 I Flickr doesn't support type(s) h-card, or no content was found.
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[renem] 2018-10-16 22:03:58.986564 I Object type(s) set([u'h-entry']) not supported; error=Cannot publish type=article to Flickr.; trying next.
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snarfed renem: what's your bridgy user page?
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petermolnar [renem]: may I see the page you want to post?
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jacky actually change of plans
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jacky I might be able to make it to the indieweb hwc today in SF!
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jacky would be leaving around 7:15 PM tho
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jacky is that still happening today tantek__?
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tantek__ yes it is!
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jacky awesome!
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snarfed renem: looking at https://renem.net/photos/2018-10-16-ausfahrt-neue-kamera/ , its img u-photo has data-src instead of src. mf2 parsing expects the image url in src.
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Loqi [René] Kurze Ausfahrt mit der neuen Kamera https://renem.net/photos/2018-10-16-ausfahrt-neue-kamera/
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aaronpk HWC Nürnberg is a wrap! Photo is on the page!
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aaronpk We made excellent progress processing IndieAuth issues and cleaning up the wiki page
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jacky snarfed: is that post JS rendering?
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jacky from a curl, I see what you're saying
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snarfed jacky: probably
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jacky ah, not post, I meant pre-
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jacky hmm this is interesting of an edge case
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jacky is this how the <picture> tag works?
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jacky _nope_
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jacky https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/HTML/Element/picture
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jacky it expects a value for "src"
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jacky prob some JS lib that's being clever
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[eddie] Yeah, modern JS libs like doing data-src because they use that to "dynamically" render different size images
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[eddie] Not something I do but I've seen references to it
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[renem] [snarfed] Looking at the first image it is in a <figure><picture> tag construct included. Inside it the <img> tag as a proper "src" attribute. But maybe Brid.gy expects a standalone img-tag and that's not the case?
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snarfed renem: bridgy uses the output of a microformats2 parser, and i think the mf2 parsing rules expect img src, yes. background: http://microformats.org/wiki/microformats2
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snarfed probably time to move to #-dev
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jacky [renem]: try looking at that page using something like `curl` or `wget`
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jacky the `src` attribute only get filled by javascript it seems
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jacky b/c I don't see `src` being set when I do a view source in Firefox
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jacky but I do if I inspect the page in the browser
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Loqi [indienews] New post: "Following in the IndieWeb: The Next Frontier" https://eddiehinkle.com/2018/10/17/12/article/
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snarfed (jacky: we moved to #-dev)
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[eddie] jgmac1106 👆 that indienews article is the follow-up to yesterdays conversation that I said my reply thoughts should be turned into a blog post
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[tantek] Thread 😂 https://twitter.com/mathowie/status/1052659479462871041
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@mathowie as one of the last four active users of Swarm left on earth, I hope they didn't change the check-in screens too much. https://medium.com/foursquare-direct/introducing-swarm-6-0-a-social-way-to-discover-new-places-82c42743f759 (twitter.com/_/status/1052659479462871041)
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[dmitshur] is it just me, or is the idea of creating indie-Pull Requests via WebMentions (or a similar mechanism) super cool?
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[tantek] what is edit?
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Loqi An edit (AKA diff, change) is a special type of reply that indicates a set of suggested changes to the post it is replying to. A collection of (presumably related) suggested edits in open source is often called a patch or pull request https://indieweb.org/edit
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[tantek] [dmitshur] ^^^
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[eddie] I do think that would be pretty awesome. I’m currently thinking through how to take over the process that GitHub issues currently solves by having posts send a webmention to a project page
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[eddie] !tell aaronpk Swarm added “saved places”, would be a nice upgrade to OwnYourSwarm! 😁
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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[dmitshur] [eddie] I've made my own issue tracker that I use for my projects (see https://indieweb.org/issue_tracker#IndieWeb_Examples)
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[eddie] Awesome, I’ll have to read more about it. Thanks 😁
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[kevinmarks] Can we recruit for indiewebcamp Berlin at https://web3summit.com/
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jacky it's interesting b/c they announced how one could "commit" from GHE -> GH public
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jacky some are seeing as federated merge request support
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jacky :rip: email for this tho lol
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sknebel GHE?
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Loqi sknebel: [eddie] left you a message 23 hours, 56 minutes ago: wait my html was right?? Yay!! 👏
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sknebel [eddie]: yeah, for a permalink that works
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jacky sknebel: GitHub Enterprise (their on-site solution for GitHub)
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sknebel ah
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[dmitshur] is there a summary of the announcements from this year's GitHub Universe?
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jacky not yet
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jacky it's still happening iirc
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jacky there's random things I'm seeing from Chris Coyer and others on Twitter
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[dmitshur] I guess https://blog.github.com/2018-10-16-future-of-software/ covers most of it
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jacky oh okay
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jacky lol
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[dmitshur] so I've been prototyping and testing out creating repos implicitly on push at this NYC HWC meetup. will need to think it over and see how it fits into everything else, but so far it seems/feels pretty cool
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[dmitshur] corresponding events:
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[dmitshur] http://instantshare.win/1tw522lrt3ik.png
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jacky interesting
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[dmitshur] obviously "created repository" events no longer make much sense... it's not possible to provide a description, etc.
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[dmitshur] but I can parse the package documentation from the code in the pushed commit, and use that instead
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[dmitshur] it'd look like this: http://instantshare.win/1ph3sspqsgbf3.png
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[dmitshur] what bothers me about this approach is that some of the events will be overlapping. e.g. pushing a new commit and creating a package would happen at the same time. which do I display first, which second? previously, all events were more orthogonal and mapped 1:1 to explicit human-driven actions.
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[dmitshur] I'm not directly creating a package; I'm pushing a git commit that happens to contain a new package and hence it's indirectly created...
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[dmitshur] there's some precedent for it though. e.g. pushing a git commit with "Fixes #nnn." in commit message makes you close an issue at the same time, so that's 1 direct action (git push) mapped to two separate events ("you pushed commit", "you closed issue").
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KartikPrabhu [dmitshur]: sounds like indieweb-dev talk
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[kiai] Hello. Indieweb. I just bought the domain anterogradeamnesia.com.