#indieweb 2019-02-12
2019-02-12 UTC
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[jgmac1106] snarfed yes microblog is in best place but I am thinkign abotu people who have ten years of Blogger posts
# [jgmac1106] just want all the links for a workflow we (I) started brainstorming for different pathways: https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/e/2PACX-1vSKoQonR1xW4mehjGBs9nysgZx876QRZ_BOz3AHBGZnyq2JoFG6mS3mWgq9d9uLKPJzihhkyiOzse34/pub?start=false&loop=false&delayms=30000
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chrisaldrich I like the subtly larger arrow around Yes on that first slide jgmac1106. ;)
# chrisaldrich If you wanted to add some additional subtle bias, you could probably have the right pointing arrows (which usually indicate forward progress) the the Yes/IndieWeb leaning ones.
# [jgmac1106] I did have a fade in on the no but it made for weird UI, just a prototype, gonna make it my Austing project to build an HTML site and a chatbot...but need all the tutorials done...thus the marathon this weekend
# [jgmac1106] really want to spend a time making Weebly theme as well...Wix and Squarespace I think untouchable but Weebly themes doable
# [jgmac1106] [snarfed] can happily report WP to WP webmentions working, and my webmentions to WP.com (which are most important) look fine
# chrisaldrich jgmac1106, did you create a secondary user for your WP.com site so you don't get something like this: http://epeus.blogspot.com/2012/04/draw-something-ceo-grace-and-high.html#comments
# [jgmac1106] chrisaldrich the the webmention came as a mention and not a reply, heading over to dev
# [chrisaldrich] I'm not seeing it now, but it seemed like somewhere we had a table with a variety of common CMSs and which ones had simple support for some of the IndieWeb building blocks like webmention, micropub, et al.
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cambridgeport90[ Speaking of building blocks, any more support for any other frameworks out of that you guys are aware of?
# [chrisaldrich] *insert criticism about up to date wiki tables here* 😉
# [chrisaldrich] aaronpk, perhaps that was the one; I was thinking it might help [jgmac1106] with some beginner onboarding.
# [jgmac1106] [chrisaldrich] yes it was a table on the Getting started page. I replaced with a ul....because tables..plus we only had tutorials for AWS..got some criticism for that
# [jgmac1106] ..oooh see the page you are talking about that is great
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Loqi [tantek]: Zegnat left you a message 1 day, 3 hours ago: Facebook note create UI added to the page you pointed me add :) https://indieweb.org/create#FB_Text_size_adjustment_while_typing
# [jgmac1106] yeah and then I tried to think abotu how would I add other shard hosts and couldn;t think of table...or how the heck to do tables in wikimedia. feel free to revert...but some folks came away from it thinking it was an AWS ad
# [jgmac1106] not defensive just made it not as prominent...more from the ultra FLOSS crowd..but it really had more to do with I tried for awhile to make the tabel in media wiki and couldnt
# [jgmac1106] the downplaying of any one company prominently on the page was a benefit Happy to have mico.blog listed before AWS
# chrisaldrich iirc the AWS tutorial was on a page and prominent because someone went to the trouble to make it and it was the only one there....
# [jgmac1106] as in they support AWS and take money from Google they must be evil capitalist pigs feeding on small children ultra floss crowd
# chrisaldrich plurality of tutorials is a useful thing too....
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# chrisaldrich tantek, thanks for the credit, I don't have the page in front of me and couldn't remember offhand.
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[tantek] [jgmac1106] I've heard enough of that kind of by association-bs. Just point those people to https://fosdem.org/2019/about/sponsors/ with Google as the first sponsor
# [jgmac1106] I have no idea who j12t is, but I couldn't expand it as the companies went across, I just couldn't do it...and a ul beats table anyday for that kind of list
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# [jgmac1106] again had more to do with I had no idea how to make a mediawiki table I asked if anyone had objections nobody responded made the edit
# [jgmac1106] waited no rollback kept going
# [jgmac1106] no I am skeptical of table
# [jgmac1106] yes the downplaying of AWS in prominence was a secondary benefit
# [jgmac1106] I also sent message to Stacey at goDaddy inviting them to put up tutorials, flim_girl for Azure...but seems weird to organize our getting started tutorials by shard hosting companies
# [jgmac1106] I am not worried, I said added benefit
# [jgmac1106] I couldn';t figure out how to make a three column table work for everything
# [jgmac1106] it was that simple if under AWS in row one was microblog what would I put in column two and then column three it just did no tmake sense for the type of data being presented
# [jgmac1106] ]plus it was a table
# [jgmac1106] So I could have for Reclaim Hosting made one for WordPress and Known, but then I got to microblog and there was no equivalent way to set up the table, arranging column A by shared host just didn't work
# chrisaldrich jgmac1106 this page has a reasonable table if you want a good example: https://indieweb.org/content_management_system#Examples
# [jgmac1106] Same with Blogger and Wordpress.com how would you fill all three coliumns?
# [jgmac1106] getting started page makes no distinction it is how DoI get started
# [jgmac1106] I can get started on microblog, on wordpress.com, or a shared host
# [tantek] maybe three columns needs to start on /Getting_Started
# [jgmac1106] where does that table indicate it is only for a CMS on a shared host, I read it under the header tutorials and it is for tutorials
# [jgmac1106] yeah three column table like that would make sense, the table we had now did not work for adding mroe tutorials
# chrisaldrich or they likely have their own much better documented details
# [jgmac1106] I try to live by nothign really really needs to go in a table but tabulated data
# [jgmac1106] it isnt 199 tables for layout aren't goog
# [jgmac1106] 1997
# [jgmac1106] good
# [jgmac1106] but revert if it means that much to you
# [jgmac1106] its a wiki rollbackversion was there, just thought it stragne after all this time we had no other turoials added
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# chrisaldrich jgmac1106, tantek I have a feeling that you're both talking about tangential subjects. Unless I'm wrong, I don't think that Tantek's impatience relates so much to the table as you're thinking.
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# [jgmac1106] I don't care how the tutorials are presented really, I just A: had no idea how to use wikimedia tables, and B the data did not fit as the table was organized, the header of the section said tutorials....thus a table under the tutorial header should be set up for tutorials
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# [jgmac1106] like I said revert back and put all the tutorials in the table somehow really could care less..I can bite my bias for tables as layout
# [jgmac1106] and this started with the we have "no three post to send your colleagues" and I realize we had no tutorials explaining all the platforms out there
# [jgmac1106] on Friday you asked everyne, "what would be the three posts you would send to colleagues about the IndieWeb"
# [jgmac1106] that lead me to layout the flow chart of choices and I tried to identify where the holes were, we had nothing for turnkey platforms for microblog or how to hack just enough on wordpress.com or blogger
# [jgmac1106] so I set out to this weekend to make all the tutorials for folks that we didn't have and simply could not figure out how to shoehorn them into the table. Just revert if you want the AWS table back so bad it truly doesn;t bother ,me even if it puts a big visual cue saying "hey look here before all these other tutorials"
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# chrisaldrich jgmac1106, yes having some tutorials for custom domain silos (https://indieweb.org/web_hosting#Custom_domain_silos) can be a helpful thing since so many are already there.
# [jgmac1106] I want to Get Started on the IndieWeb, I have a wordpress.com blog. I go to the wiki, I click on Getting Started, I have no idea what AWS is, I leave and tell my friends IndieWeb isn't for us
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# [jgmac1106] Again... This is where sometimes I do want to build for other people and show them how to do thinga
# [jgmac1106] I would as well but who didn't have geocities, or LiveJournal, or MySpace... Think this hype of jump write in and "self dogfood" forgets everyone's humble roots
# [jgmac1106] And the generation model that leads to this can come off as elitist... Anyone could have hacked on Blogger years ago like I did today and shared with world
# [jgmac1106] I am saying A: don't turn away people who may want a similar scaffold you may have had with whatever got you online. B: some people do want to build for others even if they don't use it and C. I don't like the generation model
# [jgmac1106] I want to push folks to micro.blog or Known (though it involves GitHub so no turnkey) but some times you put out plate of appetizers first
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# [jgmac1106] You have website online you are IndieWeb that is my philosophy... Everything else just extra
# [jgmac1106] Really all I wanted to do was add more tutorials to getting started and I am unsure why this idea caused so much tension
# [jgmac1106] Yes all you can do with WP.com is webmentions and an h-card but for so many that is perfect level of #IndieWeb
# [jgmac1106] Maybe then if we go with the three column table on Getting started we could include a row of limitations and warnings
# [jgmac1106] I don't think it's patronizing. I work with people getting online for the first time there is anxiety and joy and a ton of work. Finding out you are fine with Indie ark level 2 (callback) is okay
# [jgmac1106] I think it actually makes a ton of sense
# [jgmac1106] And makes folks like micro.blog look great
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# chrisaldrich Are you still around cambridgeport90[?
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# [jgmac1106] Good Morning
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# [jgmac1106] for folks like me who don't see colors like the rest of us I love guides like this with color palletes
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jeremycherfas Good morning IndieWeb
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# [jgmac1106] You know...I really like the minimalist features of Blogger and Classic Theme...always said I just want a blank HTML box with all the plumbing..in a way I am getting this vibe
# [jgmac1106] granted I would never build on blogger as I could see Google taking away Classic Theme on any random whim...but I am strangely enjoying this quick experiment
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# Bitweasil yawns
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# Loqi ok, I added "https://drmacsspot.blogspot.com/2019/02/mrkndvs-making-indieweb-blogger-theme.html" to the "See Also" section of /Blogger https://indieweb.org/wiki/index.php?diff=56732&oldid=46076
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