#indieweb 2020-08-29

2020-08-29 UTC
Ani and [chrisaldrich] joined the channel
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[chrisaldrich] How to know you're still upset over Google Reader all these years later: https://twitter.com/mathowie/status/1299480141760872448
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@mathowie my friends: you need to let it go and move on with your life me: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EgiuTMVUMAANsAB.jpg (twitter.com/_/status/1299480141760872448)
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mblaney Google Reader shutting down was why I built my own reader :-D
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[fluffy] so, got in a conversation with someone who's been pretty frequently critical of IndieWeb to me. I won't try to characterize some of his recurring complaints but this might be worth a read. https://mastodon.social/@fluffy/104768852508031257
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Loqi [fluffy 💜] New post: Plaidophile: Incremental progress https://beesbuzz.biz/blog/3876-Incremental-progressLately I’ve been seeing a lot of criticism about the IndieWeb movement based on the notion that everything that comes out of it is biased towards people ...
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[fluffy] One of his recurring complaints about IndieWeb tech in general is that it's too reliant on push technologies, which is just baffling to me since the only thing that actually requires push is Webmention and I don't see how that could feasibly be done any other way...
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[fluffy] not that this was a subject of this particular thread but it's a thing he brings up a lot.
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[tantek] WebSub uses push (webhooks)
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[tantek] AP is like 100% push right?
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KartikPrabhu yeah I don't understand the criticism. as far as I see, if you have a personal website and post to it you are indieweb. Everything else is a bonus
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KartikPrabhu it seems like a strawman argument
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[fluffy] yeah but websub is optional
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[fluffy] like on top of polling subscriptions
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KartikPrabhu exactly! most things are optional. Even webmention, IMO
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KartikPrabhu even microformats
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[fluffy] but anyway I was bringing up this particular thread because one of his other refrains is the belief that IndieWeb tech seems to be built with assumptions regarding Internet access and financial status
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KartikPrabhu have a website and post on it, that's it for me
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[tantek] Read your mastodon thread [fluffy]
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[fluffy] which is just like... no, how does he get to that point?
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[tantek] You have so much sympathetic patience, thanks for setting such a good example
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[tantek] Started to tear up near the end
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[fluffy] It helps that I've known this person for like a decade
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[tantek] [fluffy]++
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Loqi [fluffy] has 14 karma in this channel over the last year (72 in all channels)
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[fluffy] anyway he's contributed a couple of minor edits to the indieweb wiki but for some reason he keeps getting it in his head that indieweb is about something other than what it is and I'd like to figure out where the understanding gap is coming from.
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KartikPrabhu also, we talk about performance, costs of hosting a website, costs of admin etc.. constantly
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[tantek] Personally re internet access IMO we should optimize for slow connections
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KartikPrabhu yes ^ that came up in the last HWC West coast
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[tantek] Right we don’t shy away from making a lot of costs visible. That’s the only way we can bring them down
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KartikPrabhu yes!
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[fluffy] Here's his indieweb wiki user page, FWIW: https://indieweb.org/User:Felix.plesoianu.ro
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[fluffy] like I feel like he's already made up his mind about things and isn't willing to engage with the community itself, despite being an "outspoken critic"
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KartikPrabhu people here are definitely open to criticism. I myself have criticized a lot of things
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[fluffy] Anyway, I guess the reason I bring this up is there's *something* that's causing people to continually have this impression of IndieWeb and maybe there's things we can do to address this perception, and maybe have better outreach. Do we still have the ongoing initiative to give indieweb.org a better landing page?
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[fluffy] and yeah me too, Kartik, and I absolutely appreciate that when I have a difference in opinion with people, I feel like I'm listened to, and sometimes those differences in opinion even end up in the IndieAuth draft specification 🙂
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KartikPrabhu [fluffy]: yes. It is valuable feedback to see how we can phrase things better
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KartikPrabhu even if one might think "some people won't change" it will be good to improve for the new people who come this way
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[fluffy] I also wonder just how much people conflate IndieWeb with ActivityPub/Mastodon thanks to a few articles that formed that connection erroneously
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KartikPrabhu that would be weird, since most Indiweb sites are not ActivityPub/Mastodon based!
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KartikPrabhu are they?
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[fluffy] not unless you count ones wired to bridgy fed
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[fluffy] I do eventually want to add native ActivityPub to Publ but it's not a priority.
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[fluffy] This is the main article I had in mind: https://www.newyorker.com/tech/annals-of-technology/can-indie-social-media-save-us
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[fluffy] But it also mischaracterizes IndieWeb a lot by calling it "artisanal twitter/facebook"
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[fluffy] I don't feel like we're cloning those things, we're building similar sorts of stuff based on how the web was before they were a thing.
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KartikPrabhu "artisanal" is such an annoying adjective; I blame the "hipsters" ;)
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[fluffy] and as much as I hate the timeline/dashboard/microblogging setup (which is why I'm building Subl to be very much Not That and haven't really clicked with any of the existing social readers) there's still stuff to be said in its favor as things that some people do want.
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[fluffy] And the fact that there's a very clear distinction between indieweb sites that are microbloggy vs. ones which are blog-bloggy vs. ones which aren't even timeline-contenty at all (like most of Kicks Condor's weird experiments) speaks a lot to just how nebulous IndieWeb even is.
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KartikPrabhu yes! that also came up on the last HWC WEst coast; how /why do you deviate from the reverse-choronological timeline/feed model
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KartikPrabhu for me it works, but for others it might not and that is good
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KartikPrabhu people can make their websites anyway they want
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[fluffy] yeah at some point I want to get around to implementing proper tag browsing for my site, like what I have on the publ blog or on my storefront page.
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[fluffy] I want to completely redo my site templates at some point now that I have a better understanding of HTML5 semantic markup and mf2 and so on.
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[fluffy] not to mention now that Publ's capabilitites have grown to make it a lot easier to do things that I'd previously hacked in.
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KartikPrabhu this a very nice tag-filter design: https://jasonsantamaria.com/articles/
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[fluffy] ah, that is nice. I don't much care for the SPAness of it but it seems like it'd be easy enough to work either way.
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[fluffy] I should probably fake-SPAify the tag browsing on https://biz.beesbuzz.biz/ - shouldn't be hard to do and it'd make things look much nicer.
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Loqi yea!
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KartikPrabhu right the JS parts could easily be optional
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[fluffy] wellp, Felix has continued his responses to me and they're still incredibly puzzling. Clearly he's getting these ideas from SOMEWHERE and I'm trying to figure out *where*
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[fluffy] He seems to be under the impression that IndieWeb is about reinventing everything and seeking credit for it, and that there's an insistence on real names.
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KartikPrabhu :confused: I don't know what is being reinvented; and real names are definitely not something that is insisted up on
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KartikPrabhu like lot of the IRC names here are nicknames. Also I don't have an actual picture either
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aaronpk [fluffy]: Is he thinking of an organization with an oddly similar name perhaps?
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[fluffy] he claims it’s specific pages on indieweb.org but he won’t say which ones, just “all of them”
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[fluffy] so I’ve asked him to clarify with specific pages and paragraphs thereof
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[fluffy] okay https://meow.social/@claude/104770808005804503
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Loqi [Claude LeChat] @fluffy Right here: https://indieweb.org/Getting_Started#Set_up_your_home_page Maybe it doesn't seem to insist so much on real names (and photos) specifically, but it's very much implied throughout. See the /h-card page, or better yet /homepage
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aaronpk So like if we take out all specific advice then people will just say "but the page doesn't say anything at all it's all just hand waving" lol
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[fluffy] yeah I’m just like… baffled about what he’s reading into things
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aaronpk One improvement to make to that section would be to say "desired name" or "chosen name" maybe? I still feel like you'd have to have a lot of personal baggage to assume that someone saying "your name" is *requiring* that it be your "real name" tho
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aaronpk What is a real name?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "real name" yet. Would you like to create it? (Or just say "real name is ____", a sentence describing the term)
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aaronpk what is a name?
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Loqi Naming is hard https://indieweb.org/name
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aaronpk What is identity?
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Loqi A personal domain is a domain name that you personally own, control, and use to represent yourself on the internet https://indieweb.org/identity
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[fluffy] I’m getting close to the point of giving up again until the next time he slides into my mentions after I write something about IndieWeb. https://mastodon.social/@fluffy/104770856729703790
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Loqi [fluffy 💜] @claude Your interpretation of the words on the wiki is absolutely different than how anyone intends them to be read. And we as a community would like that gap to not exist. I think everyone would be very interested to know why you're interpreting th...
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[fluffy] This feels like a good stopping point: https://meow.social/@claude/104770866889130541 https://mastodon.social/@fluffy/104770877728649508
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Loqi [Claude LeChat] @fluffy Very well then. I'll settle for what *I* find valuable about the IndieWeb movement, which is people actually thinking about the current state of affairs and trying to figure out better paths forward for a change.
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[fluffy]1 nope, still went on a bit since then. But that’s okay. I do ask that folks read the whole thread again. I disagree with the perception he’s coming away with but he’s built up that perception for a reason, and I know he’s not alone in it.
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[fluffy]1 Also I have no idea why his Mastodon instance isn’t showing the whole conversation on his end. I wonder if meow.social defederated from mastodon.social for some reason. Or maybe this is just another case of mastodon--
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Loqi mastodon has -1 karma over the last year
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GWG Okay, my website is now sorting date archives in chronological order as opposed to reverse.
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[chrisaldrich] GWG++ for https://github.com/dshanske/date-archive-order so quick after the conversation earlier this week.
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Loqi GWG has 31 karma in this channel over the last year (139 in all channels)
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Loqi [dshanske] date-archive-order: Changes WordPress Date Archives to Sort from Oldest to Newest
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[chrisaldrich] Riffing on the earlier mention of time-based order, I had meant to bring up the completely non-ordered set up on Kicks Condor's site at the moment. It becomes a massively large single page and one sort of flies in and out of various close up views of it while exploring.
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[jeremycherfas] [fluffy]++ for patience, tolerance and goodwill. I would have given up. And I am reminded of the Jonathan Swift quote paraphrased as “you cannot reason someone out of a position that they did not reason themselves into”.
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Loqi [fluffy] has 15 karma in this channel over the last year (73 in all channels)
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[chrisaldrich] Took me a minute to remember the reference, but Kicks site in it's incarnation a few clicks in actually has a larger map feel and reminds me a bit of Mark Bernstein’s 1998 essay Hypertext Gardens...
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[chrisaldrich] [fluffy]++ for being generally awesome every day 🙂
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Loqi [fluffy] has 16 karma in this channel over the last year (74 in all channels)
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[James_Gallaghe] Good morning everyone!
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[chrisaldrich] We didn't touch on the real name/pseudonym question this week, but I feel like there were a few discussions about how to represent one's self with one or more websites and how to split personal/professional.
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[chrisaldrich] Good morning btw!
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[chrisaldrich] There was a question about how to choose a URL and some examples there as well. While many have names as urls even that's not necessary...
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[chrisaldrich] It may be the case that some of us have done it so long that we haven't managed to document some of these things or suggestions of how to work around them for those who may want/need suggestions about how to better protect themselves online.
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[chrisaldrich] What is name?
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Loqi Naming is hard https://indieweb.org/name
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[chrisaldrich] and I just read the response aaron got... how quickly I forgot...
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[chrisaldrich] What are nymwars?
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Loqi nymwars is the name for the assumption, made by facebook and google+ that enforcing "real names" improves a social website; this was opposed by many people who have very good reasons for pseudonymity or anonymity https://indieweb.org/nymwars
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[chrisaldrich] What is anonymity?
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Loqi https://indieweb.org/anonymity
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[chrisaldrich] what is pseudonymity?
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Loqi Pseudonymity is the concept of having an anonymous identity that is the same across multiple sessions or websites https://indieweb.org/pseudonymity
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[chrisaldrich] that anonymity page is so old it has no definition! These could be better linked and filled out for sure...
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[chrisaldrich] I did read a post this week by a community member considering creating a website for a pen name they were using to write novels in a genre they didn't feel might fit in with their personal/professional web presence.
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[chrisaldrich] I'll ask to see if they'd document it publicly on the wiki...
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[chrisaldrich] We could certainly have more examples of these types of patterns to help serve as guideposts for others who might be served by pros/cons and personal experiences in how to navigate these waters.
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avalos Why does the indieweb.org wiki has a definition for everything?
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avalos Lol.
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[chrisaldrich] Not everything... some of them have snarkinitions 😁. ( Though we're even progressively working on that....)
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avalos https://indieweb.org/snarkinition
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avalos Really? 😂
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[chrisaldrich] Having /fun is an important /principle....
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[chrisaldrich] I took a pass at breaking away the redirect of /name if anyone wants to iterate on it, particularly for welcoming language in line with our /principles.
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[chrisaldrich] What is name?
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Loqi A name can be an important part of one's online identity and can be almost anything one chooses to represent themselves https://indieweb.org/name
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[KevinMarks] name << Falsehoods programmers believe about names https://www.kalzumeus.com/2010/06/17/falsehoods-programmers-believe-about-names/
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[KevinMarks] name << Falsehoods Programmers Believe About Names – With Examples https://shinesolutions.com/2018/01/08/falsehoods-programmers-believe-about-names-with-examples/
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Loqi ok, I added "Falsehoods programmers believe about names https://www.kalzumeus.com/2010/06/17/falsehoods-programmers-believe-about-names/" to the "See Also" section of /name https://indieweb.org/wiki/index.php?diff=72341&oldid=72340
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Loqi ok, I added "Falsehoods Programmers Believe About Names – With Examples https://shinesolutions.com/2018/01/08/falsehoods-programmers-believe-about-names-with-examples/" to the "See Also" section of /name https://indieweb.org/wiki/index.php?diff=72342&oldid=72341
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[Ana_Rodrigues] Good morning everyone!
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[Ana_Rodrigues] [fluffy]++ for your blog post and the above patient convo. Gave lots to think about.
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Loqi [fluffy] has 17 karma in this channel over the last year (75 in all channels)
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[fluffy] thanks
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[Ana_Rodrigues] Regarding pseudoanonymity: That’s what happened to me. In 2012 when I came “back online” I didn’t want to be easily found by my last name. Which is why my username and “main domain” are ohhelloana and kept a “Ana Rodrigues” domain for work.
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[Ana_Rodrigues] Only in 2018 I started to share my last name online.
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[Ana_Rodrigues] I will try to document this somewhere soon and link it. Unsure if it helps anyone.
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[James_Gallaghe] Morning, [Ana_Rodrigues]!
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[James_Gallaghe] [Ana_Rodrigues] What were you doing before 2012 (when you were presumably “not online”)?
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[James_Gallaghe] I’m fascinated by the concept of pseudonymity as well.
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[James_Gallaghe] My issue is that I feel like I am doing work without getting any credit for it as my own. For instance, I’ve been thinking about doing a pseudonymous quantified self experiment. I like the idea because it would give me privacy but, on the other hand, I wouldn’t be able to talk about it with people like this community 🙂
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[James_Gallaghe] I feel the same way about sharing my name. I prefer to use “jamesgoca” on as many platforms as I can. I know that “jamesgoca” is linked to my real name but I just don’t like the idea of someone Googling my full name and seeing a list of every service that I’ve signed up for in the past.
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[James_Gallaghe] (It’s a small distinction but one that matters to me)
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KartikPrabhu [Ana_Rodrigues]++ very nice article on Smashing Mag
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Loqi [Ana_Rodrigues] has 11 karma in this channel over the last year (19 in all channels)
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KartikPrabhu [Ana_Rodrigues] and [James_Gallaghe] : feel free to document what you find on /names, even if you are unsure that it helps anyone
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KartikPrabhu even if does not help anyone now, it might later
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KartikPrabhu and might encourage others to think of this issue
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KartikPrabhu I used a "nickname" online for a long time, but when I got my domain I did switch to my name since I felt this was "my space"© ;) But that was my decision, others might use a pseudonym even for their domain or any web identity and tat is their choice
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Zegnat Name and identity discussions are always interesting. I too felt like the definition of mf2 name got very close to "real name", which is why I have previously argued that maybe nickname (or a similar term for display name) is more suited in places (e.g. https://github.com/indieweb/indieauth/issues/31#issuecomment-468918215)
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Loqi [Zegnat] As [mentioned in #23](https://github.com/indieweb/indieauth/issues/23#issuecomment-414152219) @aaronpk (at least at that point) wanted to keep IndieAuth as straight-forward as possible. I wasn’t there for the original discussion that started this i...
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Zegnat goes to think about how to broaden the definition of name
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[James_Gallaghe] There’s parts of my identity that I feel comfortable sharing, just not openly, too. For instance, I don’t broadcast my age on my website but people generally know that I am young. I totally get why people choose pseudonyms.
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KartikPrabhu yup! it isn't all or nothing
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[grantcodes] Yay, got my website synced up to my daily theme generator now 😄 so my website, twitter, phone and computer backgrounds are all in sync
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Loqi yay!
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[KevinMarks] The h-card heritage from vcard does imply given names to some extent. In practice though a lot of address books have nicknames in
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KartikPrabhu there is a p-nickname no?
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[KevinMarks] Yes, that is from vcard too. But if its a name you're known as then name is better. One reason we de-emphasised the structured names was because of their restrictive framing
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[manton] About anonymous identities, I’d be surprised if this was a widespread concern about the IndieWeb… If someone has a misunderstanding, it’s definitely good to make sure the wiki is accurate, but I think it’s also possible to over-explain this everywhere.
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[manton] As an extreme example, you wouldn’t want to rename every occurrence of “name” to “name (doesn’t have to your real name)“.
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[snarfed] right. afaik indieweb doesn’t take a stand, we’re open to real names, pseudonymity, and anonymity. (eg https://commentpara.de/)
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petermolnar could the source of confusion be the word itself "name"?
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petermolnar does the word "name" indirectly suggests real name?
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[fluffy] So hey could we not rush to wikify every conversation about indieweb stuff, or think a bit more about what gets put on the wiki? https://meow.social/@claude/104773474402077087
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Loqi [Claude LeChat] @fluffy After our earlier argument, a *lot* of content about use of names online was added / updated to the IndieWeb wiki. How cool is that.
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[fluffy] Oh wait I misread his toot. I think there’s just no pleasing him.
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aaronpk "how cool is that" <-- actually pretty cool i think? it shows we're actively interested in improving things when given feedback?
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[manton] I didn’t read “how cool is that” as sarcasm. Definitely a good thing if the wiki gets updated for anything that is confusing / out of date.
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petermolnar Unless someone comes with the mindset that believes the previous wording stood for something, the new one is making it different, thus not standing up for our initial beliefs.
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[fluffy] Yeah I read it as sarcasm due to the lack of a question mark and read in some assumptions based on prior conversations with him. Which is definitely me bad.
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[fluffy] *my bad. I should stop trying to have conversations from my phone. Autocarrot is so bad.
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aaronpk autocarrot 😂
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[KevinMarks] Very indieweb relevant thread https://twitter.com/doctorow/status/1299741637116010502?s=20
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@doctorow The copyright scholar James Boyle (@thepublicdomain) has a transformative way to think about political change. He tells a story about how the word "ecology" welded together a bunch of disparate issues into a movement. 1/ (twitter.com/_/status/1299741637116010502)
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deltab less extreme: using "name/pseudonym" in some places
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[chrisaldrich] [grantcodes]++ for syncing daily theme generator... I can only see portions of it obviously, but how cool to have even your visual identity follow you across the web and technology!
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Loqi [grantcodes] has 6 karma in this channel over the last year (21 in all channels)
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[chrisaldrich] What is food?
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Loqi Food is a post type that represents eating or drinking particular food or drink https://indieweb.org/food
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[chrisaldrich] [James_Gallaghe] I just ran across your awesome looking coffee page https://coffee.jamesg.app/, you should totally add that to the /food examples ^^
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petermolnar there should be an "office sludge" category on that page
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[James_Gallaghe] [chrisaldrich]
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[James_Gallaghe] Thanks for the comment! I shall. I haven’t updated that page in a few days.
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[James_Gallaghe] Should it be part of my main blog or should I keep it as a separate page? I’ve already written the code for the blog version but I have not pushed it yet.
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[chrisaldrich] Also, your post on quantified self has got me starting a long-overdue stub page for that topic as well.
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[chrisaldrich] Who is [James_Gallaghe]?
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[chrisaldrich] If you'd like to James, you can wikify yourself as well: https://indieweb.org/wikifying
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[James_Gallaghe] I need to wikify myself 🙂
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[James_Gallaghe] I’ve got so much to do on the IndieWeb. I feel like I should be writing a manual.
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[chrisaldrich] Small posts on your website over time while syndicating links to them to the wiki will accomplish much the same thing and prevent it from feeling like work.
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[James_Gallaghe] Yeah haha. I’m probably going to blog a bit more about the IndieWeb soon. I’ve been in a bit of a funk lately so I’m trying not to commit to anything big.
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[chrisaldrich] What is quantified self?
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Loqi Quantified self refers both to the cultural phenomenon of self-tracking with technology and to a community of users and makers of self-tracking tools, many of whom are using their personal websites to own their data https://indieweb.org/quantified_self
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[chrisaldrich] ^^ I've fleshed out a stub (finally) for that if anyone wants to add some examples. Not sure how we've had multiple camp sessions on it and it doesn't have it's own page...
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[chrisaldrich] quantified self << 2020-08-24 [https://jamesg.app/ James Gallagher] [https://jamesg.app/2020/08/24/quantified-self-and-the-indieweb.html Quantified Self And The Indieweb]
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Loqi ok, I added "2020-08-24 [https://jamesg.app/ James Gallagher] [https://jamesg.app/2020/08/24/quantified-self-and-the-indieweb.html Quantified Self And The Indieweb]" to the "See Also" section of /quantified_self https://indieweb.org/wiki/index.php?diff=72363&oldid=72362
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[James_Gallaghe] I’ll take this in tomorrow and flesh it out.
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[James_Gallaghe] In fact, I might livestream a build of my new QS site. Would anyone tune in? :)
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[James_Gallaghe] If one person says yes I am doing it. I haven’t live-streamed since I tried to build a project in 24 hours.
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sknebel I think jacky also did some indieweb coding streams
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Loqi [indienews] New post: https://jamesg.app/2020/08/24/quantified-self-and-the-indieweb.html (from https://boffosocko.com/2020/08/29/quantified-self-and-the-indieweb-james-gallagher/)
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jacky wow so I just came across this somehow
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jacky https://thoughtshrapnel.com/2020/01/01/microcast-81/
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jacky and 100% to it
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Loqi [Doug Belshaw] This week’s microcast answers a question from John Johnston about federation and the IndieWeb. https://thoughtshrapnel.com/2020/01/01/microcast-81/ https://thoughtshrapnel.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/01/Libertarianism-groups-diagram.png
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sknebel hm, I think I've seen that before somewhere
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sknebel ah yeah, see the familiar names in the comments - guess it was shared here
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jacky I think [fluffy] linked it from their blog
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jacky what is audio
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Loqi audio is a sound recording indieweb post that is spoken or otherwise created by the author of a site https://indieweb.org/Audio
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jacky is there any micropub clients that allow for publishing audio to one's site?
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jacky what is sound
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Loqi audio is a sound recording indieweb post that is spoken or otherwise created by the author of a site https://indieweb.org/sound
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jacky hmm lol was curious
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aaronpk what is gramophone?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "gramophone" yet. Would you like to create it? (Or just say "gramophone is ____", a sentence describing the term)
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aaronpk it's... rough, but it works https://gramophone.p3k.io/
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jacky let's see if I've written my site well enough lol
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jacky ooh interesting
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jacky I'm realizing that as much as I like writing, doing like audio forms might be more easier for me
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jacky audio forms of content
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jacky it's like as fast as writing for me but also releases me of the need to hit backspace (granted, editing audio is _tedious_, lol)
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jacky hmm I got a 500
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aaronpk darn!
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jacky I can't see anything in my logs
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jacky it's so noisy because of feed polling
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jacky can't wait to pull that out
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sknebel What is Screech?
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Loqi Screech is a simple app for posting audio content, such as podcasts, to your website using Micropub https://indieweb.org/Screech
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jacky got a 500 with Screech :(
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jacky this is all good!
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Loqi http://meme.loqi.me/m/58PnmMh4.jpg
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jacky lol
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jacky if anything, this is motivation to consider this for the site
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jacky for me, I'd want the podcast feed to be coming from my own site so I might have to do some 'magic' / add a flag to generate the proper XML from entries
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jacky something like https://jacky.wtf/feeds/podcast/$TAG
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[snarfed] jacky if you have the podcast in mf2, eg from screech, you can use granary to generate the RS with enclosures, itunes, etc
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jacky hmm
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[snarfed] er RSS
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jacky ha
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jacky I think I can do that then
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jacky that'd be a good pilot for it
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jacky but first
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jacky fixing a lil' bug on my site first
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[tantek] wow scrollback. hello peoples.
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[tantek] so, about names, we've (as a community) been pretty openly critical of "real names" policies since pretty much the beginning
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[tantek] I'm going to be a bit bold here, and state that if someone interprets the use of "name" as "MUST BE YOUR REAL NAME", then maybe they're projecting their own fears into their interpretation.
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[tantek] so I say no to conditionalizing, caveating, parenthesizing name like name (real or pseudo), name (what you feel comfortable with), name (full name if you like or whatever else you want to be known by, or your handle, alias, pseudonym of choice)
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[tantek] if there's specific improvements that we can make to the mf2 parsing spec (about "name") or vocabularies that provide a more thorough inclusive description (e.g. h-card definition of "p-name"), suggestions welcome!
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[tantek] follow-up -> dev
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[tantek] #indieweb-dev