#indieweb 2024-09-24

2024-09-24 UTC
athan, mooff and [fluffy] joined the channel
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[fluffy] What happened to http://indieweb.xyz and is there a similar thing like it to direct people to?
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[fluffy] ah, looks like Kicks Condor stopped the project and has disappeared from indieweb spaces in general.
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gRegor Yeah, unfortunately. Haven't seen new posts on their site since 2022
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gRegor Not aware of a similar thing currently
[tantek], [aciccarello], [schmarty], [fluffy], [Jo], lockywolf, wobbol, [snarfed], barnaby, doesnm, __DuBPiRaTe__, barnabywalters, rvalue, mia_ and [KevinMarks] joined the channel
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[KevinMarks] https://thenewstack.io/social-web-foundation-launched-how-in-is-w3c-on-fediverse/
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capjamesg[d] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41636491
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Loqi [preview] [DeadSuperHero] Evan Prodromou Launches the Social Web Foundation
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[mattl] A couple of us here are on the advisory board for SWF.
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aaronpk bridgy shoutout!
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Loqi aaronpk: [tantek] left you a message 1 day, 12 hours ago: you're not alone — Disney Halloween started August 23 😂 https://mickeyvisit.com/disneyland-halloween/
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aaronpk yay spooky season
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Loqi 😊
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[KevinMarks] https://socialwebfoundation.org/2024/09/24/launch/
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[manton] I wonder how Bluesky feels about “social web” being defined as only ActivityPub. 🤔
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aaronpk and why micro.blog isn't in that very large list of projects that support activitypub
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Loqi hey [manton], aaronpk, we try to keep dev talk (ActivityPub) out of this channel, can you move to #indieweb-dev?
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[mattl] Manton, I'm sure http://micro.blog can be on the list of projects.
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voxpelli I feel that time and time again that the IndieWeb community tries to accept and document all tech whereas ActivityPub in general and Mastodon in particular focuses on their way and their way only
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voxpelli I’m a bit annoyed by this new foundation
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voxpelli The Social WG felt more well balanced?
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voxpelli We need interoperability and innovation, not land grabs
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capjamesg[d] I'd argue that the web itself is fundamentally social. Are the friendships brokered through making websites on Neocities any less social than the interactions that happen on the Fediverse?
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[mattl] How many people are doing that vs. using social media?
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voxpelli @capjamesg[d]: Yeah, and that it’s not social if it’s HTML fetched over HTTP but it is if it’s ActivityPub semantics pushed over that protocol – feels very narrow
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voxpelli @[mattl]: The entire blogosphere and forums
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voxpelli Reddit?
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voxpelli There’s also mailing lists – they are indeed social
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voxpelli Also IRC
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[mattl] Reddit pushes you to their app and is AI mining their content. Not a great example.
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capjamesg[d] [mattl] Relatively few, but that's not related to my point.
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capjamesg[d] The point is that the web _could be_ so much more.
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[mattl] mailing lists and IRC aren't on the web.
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[mattl] I don't disagree with you capjamesg.
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voxpelli @[mattl]: The AI stuff has no impact on them being a web page or not?
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[manton] There is a little bit of a redefining of “social web” happening in the announcement. When I say “fediverse”, I mean ActivityPub. When I say “social web”, I mean Micropub, AT Protocol, etc.
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voxpelli @[mattl]: What differs email from ActivityPub that makes one web and one not?
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[mattl] ActivityPub is happening over HTTP. Email isn't.
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capjamesg[d] [manton] I thought https://indieweb.org/social_web was well-written. I hadn't seen that page until today.
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capjamesg[d] [edit] [manton] I thought https://indieweb.org/social_web was well-written. I hadn't seen that page until today.
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[mattl] Happy to take the technical part of this discussion to #indieweb-dev
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voxpelli So it’s the Hypertext Transfer Protocol that makes the web? Not the Hypertext Markup Language?
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[manton] [mattl] I like that page stub. I think it could be expanded to talk about specific protocols and platforms, but at a high level it’s basically right.
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jacky semantics will be the end of it all /s
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voxpelli “The “social web”, also called the “Fediverse”, is a network of independent social platforms connected with the open standard protocol ActivityPub” https://socialwebfoundation.org/2024/09/24/launch/
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voxpelli That’s an interesting definition of “social web”
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sebbu so bluesky doesn't count ?
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sebbu nor does nostr
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[mattl] those can be part of ActivityPub via Bridgy Fed, but the foundation is focused on ActivityPub
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Loqi friendly reminder voxpelli [mattl], that's a lot of dev jargon! ActivityPub, protocol... can you move to #indieweb-dev?
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voxpelli @sebbu: nor does h-feed or webmentions
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voxpelli @[mattl]: Is Bridgy part of the foundation?
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sebbu no, it's a singular project by a single person
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sebbu just like curl
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sebbu or zlib
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voxpelli I know, and it’s not just by [snarfed], eg gRegor or such have also helped our
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voxpelli realizes he has been away for many years and that there are many new faces in the chat
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[mattl] curl has thousands of contributors. https://curl.se/docs/thanks.html
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[tantek] I think it's good the energy is being put in to a Social Web Foundation. I expect the stated scope will inevitably grow with time and more participants.
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capjamesg[d] ^^
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voxpelli Yeah, the energy is good, it’s just so needless to use the wording that they use
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voxpelli An ActivityPub Foundation is great, it’s needed to grow it beyond Mastodon and that’s needed to grow the open social web
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[snarfed] https://snarfed.org/2024-01-13_51890
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Loqi [preview] [Ryan Barrett] Nothing has made me feel more like a graybeard recently than seeing people use “the internet” to mean social networking, or what people are saying to each other online, instead of the series of tubes and hardware and software that carry data pack...
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capjamesg[d] [snarfed] To what does "uphill in the snow both ways" refer?
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capjamesg[d] I haven't heard that expression.
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[Joe_Crawford] https://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/I+walked+to+school+uphill+both+ways
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[tantek] What is Social Web Foundation?
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Loqi Social Web Foundation is a project to make the Fediverse bigger and better by bringing together commercial and Open Source implementers of ActivityPub, civil society organizations, and open web standards advocates to build tools, policies and protocols https://indieweb.org/Social_Web_Foundation
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capjamesg[d] [Joe_Crawford] Interesting!
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capjamesg[d] TIL!
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[aciccarello] Maybe articles will finally be supported in mastodon https://socialwebfoundation.org/long-form-text-on-the-fediverse/
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lazcorp Why is there no RSS/Atom feed for https://socialwebfoundation.org/blog/ ??
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[schmarty] 🤫 😏 💁 ⁂
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lazcorp Ah, there is - https://socialwebfoundation.org/feed/ - they just don't have a <link rel="alternate" type="application/rss+xml" > in their HTMLor a mention/link to it on their rendered page
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Loqi lazcorp: it seems like this conversation is more appropriate for #indieweb-dev (ATOM, RSS, XML)
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lazcorp Sorry, Loqi - just venting
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[tantek] Yes, dev-venting to #indieweb-dev please 😂
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pcarrier_com[d] that is a lot of partners. I wonder what their criteria for inclusion is.
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[mattl] I think it's all organizations that support ActivityPub
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[KevinMarks] james, you're one of today's lucky 10,000 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VKHFZBUTA4k
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