#dev 2017-04-11

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Loqi
[[events/2017-04-12-homebrew-website-club]] !N https://indieweb.org/wiki/index.php?oldid=35696&rcid=35618 * Jkphl.is * (+2701) Created page with "<div class="h-event vevent"> <img style="width:100%" class="u-featured" src="https://indieweb.org/images/9/95/hwc-nbg-header.jpg" alt="Joschi, Sebastian, Nadine, Jule, Dirk, Isab..."
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miklb
!tell GWG my php is poor, and not sure where %1s is coming from here https://github.com/dshanske/indieweb-post-kinds/blob/master/includes/views/kind.php#L86 can you enlighten me?
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Loqi
Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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KartikPrabhu
miklb: looks like the "first variable"
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KartikPrabhu
it is likely replaced by the value of the variable $embed after that
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miklb
I kinda get that, but in the markup, it's quite a bit of HTML
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KartikPrabhu
yeah, from the $embed variable I suppose
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miklb
I just need to add the u-url in there (and assuming, everyone using that default template)
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KartikPrabhu
miklb: you wouldn't add u-url inside the e-summary in most cases. though it will work
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miklb
https://gist.github.com/miklb/3821eb26080943f41373035f2f8e72db that's what that line inserts inside the blockquote from what I can tell. The only place the tweet url is used, which is why I thought the u-url should go there
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KartikPrabhu
what's the url on your site?
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KartikPrabhu
I mean the link to this post you are trying to POSSE
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Loqi
[miklb] @adactio absolutely lovely site. sweet use of grid on the h1 & appreciate the use of mf2. Will be studying markup for sure 👍
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aaronpk
hm the reply h-cite is missing a URL
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KartikPrabhu
aaronpk: yes
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KartikPrabhu
miklb: yeah adding a u-url inside the e-summary does work
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aaronpk
should be fine to add u-url to the link inside the e-summary
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aaronpk
they don't end up nested in the parsed version because they both appear as properties of the parent h-* object
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miklb
cool. Now just to figure out where that markup is being created 😂
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GWG
miklb, the embed overrides native when enabled. There is a setting for that
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Loqi
GWG: miklb left you a message 44 minutes ago: my php is poor, and not sure where %1s is coming from here https://github.com/dshanske/indieweb-post-kinds/blob/master/includes/views/kind.php#L86 can you enlighten me?
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miklb
sorry, don't understand overrides native when enabled
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miklb
shall return
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gRegorLove
miklb: That %1s, the "1" is the argument number. It can be used for argument swapping. Not really necessary in that line of code since there's only one argument, $embed
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gRegorLove
Also can be used to put the same argument multiple places in the string
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gRegorLove
Wait, no. I'm thinking of %1$s
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gRegorLove
I think it's just the width specifier, then. At least one character.
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gRegorLove
Oops, guess those were for GWG actually ^
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[cleverdevil]
Grrrr... anyone here good with `mod_rewrite`?
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[cleverdevil]
I can't for the life of me get this rule to stick 😛
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ben_thatmustbeme
[cleverdevil]: i'm okay with it
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martymcguire[m]
i don't consider myself "good" but i have dealt with a lot of mod_rewrite pain!
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ben_thatmustbeme
better to just ask though
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martymcguire[m]
yeah let's have it
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[cleverdevil]
Use case: I want `/timeline` or `/stream` on my site to be internally rewritten to return the content that is available at `/content/bookmarkedpages/statusupdates`.
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[cleverdevil]
(Along with many other things...)
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martymcguire[m]
some usual gotchas: is rewrite engine enabled with RewriteEngine On?
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[cleverdevil]
I'm doing this inside of the `.htaccess` bundled with Known
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[cleverdevil]
It has the `RewriteEngine On` setting in there.
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martymcguire[m]
might be that you need to indicate that it's a PassThrough
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martymcguire[m]
e.g. "RewriteRule ^timeline$ /content/statusupdates/bookmarkedpages [PT]"
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martymcguire[m]
otherwise apache assumes the path is for a file
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[cleverdevil]
That causes a 500 error.
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martymcguire[m]
ooh
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[cleverdevil]
I thought flags were like: `[PT]`
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martymcguire[m]
ah, i should have read further: PT is implied in .htaccess
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[cleverdevil]
Well, at least I know my `.htaccess` is being read!
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martymcguire[m]
always good to sanity check :}
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miklb
GWG I don't want to turn off ric-embeds, I just want to add the u-url to the link of the tweet that is inside the blockquote
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miklb
s/ric-embeds/rich-embeds/
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ben_thatmustbeme
is that the last rewrite rule [cleverdevil]] ?
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ben_thatmustbeme
as in, do you need [L]
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[cleverdevil]
I've tried it as the first and the last.
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[cleverdevil]
And in the middle, too 😛
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[cleverdevil]
Currently, I am putting it at the top, just under `RewriteEngine on`
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martymcguire[m]
playing with this on my site as well.
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martymcguire[m]
weirdly, if i make it a redirect, it works.
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[cleverdevil]
Oh, interesting.
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[cleverdevil]
It does a 301
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martymcguire[m]
e.g. "RewriteRule ^timeline$ /content/statusupdates/bookmarkedpages [R,L]"
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martymcguire[m]
otherwise i just get 404s
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[cleverdevil]
If this: `RewriteRule ^timeline$ /content/statusupdates/bookmarkedpages [L]`, I get a 404.
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martymcguire[m]
the https:// triggers an automatic redirect, since it's not set up to proxy remote content by default
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[cleverdevil]
Yup, I am thinking that, for some reason, it views all of the rules as remote content.
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[cleverdevil]
Not sure why...
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gRegorLove
Is there a RewriteBase?
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aaronpk
could the problem be that "/content/statusupdates/bookmarkedpages" is not an actual file so it's not hitting another rule after that?
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aaronpk
there's a rewrite rule that routes everything through the index.php file and it's probably not continuing to process rules to reach that point
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[cleverdevil]
No RewriteBase defined.
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[cleverdevil]
Yeah, it should likely *not* be an `[L]` rule.
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aaronpk
it's been a while, but i vaguely remember there's a trick when you're trying to chain them like that. when the target isn't a URL or file.
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aaronpk
(i've been using nginx for a few years now)
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miklb
ok, I see that whole blockquote is stored in the database. Only reference I've seen for it though is in the indieweb press-this plugin
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[chrisaldrich]
cleverdevil I'm far from an expert, but this here's an example I used back in December to rewrite the locations of some of my RSS feeds which may help: http://boffosocko.com/2016/12/18/rss-feeds-a-follow-up-on-my-indieweb-commitment-2017/
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[cleverdevil]
I'll take a look.
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[chrisaldrich]
cleverdevil, btw, I set up oAuth on known.boffosocko.com, so you should be able to install https://github.com/mapkyca/KnownKnown on your personal Known instance and syndicate to the other one, the github page has some reasonable directions.
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miklb
so this is what I'm figuring out and why there is a blockquote inside a blockquote. somewhere the embed is being stored in the postmeta and that's where the link to the tweet without u-url is. Now to just figure out how to customize that.
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miklb
aha. That's coming back from the Twitter oembed and WP caches that. Seems there is a embed_result filter…the plot thickens
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Loqi
[[Mastodon]] https://indieweb.org/wiki/index.php?diff=35699&oldid=35691&rcid=35621 * Tantek.com * (+450) see issues on the github instead, and one primary instance looks fairly resolved
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tantek
ben_thatmustbeme: hey https://indieweb.org/Mastodon#IndieWeb_Support still says "this patch" a bunch - can we change that to "as of 2017-XX-YY" since those patches are now in core presumably?
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ben_thatmustbeme
i was waiting until PR gets accepted
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ben_thatmustbeme
its still not there
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ben_thatmustbeme
but i can update when i get time, though apparently now its failing some build tests
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GWG
miklb, I seem to have missed some stuff
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miklb
from me?
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GWG
miklb, about the Twitter embed cache
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GWG
I would like to improve my presentation so that it is better, and maybe fewer people would prefer the WordPress one. But...stopgap.
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GWG
Acegiak, for example, always turns it off
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miklb
GWG that whole chunk of html (<blockquote class=twitter-tweet">…</blockquote> is stored in the db as postmeta, I'm looking at the filter now to change add the u-url when it's saved
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GWG
I don't have logic to decide if a video or image is the focus...Lot I could do
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miklb
I like the idea of the embeded tweet, especially if it's part of a thread/conversation, more context. Just want to see if I can filter that and add the class.
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GWG
miklb, I want to cover as many sites as possible.
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miklb
understood
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GWG
I fear I am getting wound up about all I want to do but can't right now
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tantek
GWG, get it out of your head and onto a text list (like wiki itches list) and then get others to help you prioritize :)
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miklb
my goal currently is purely for my own site. If it can be useful for others, awesome. I just want to have embedded Tweets and for bridgy to know it's a reply. I'm not sure where else I could put the u-url
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GWG
tantek, a lot of it is in issues on various repos.
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tantek
links are ok
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GWG
But some I wanted to put down as part of what I was writing.
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tantek
miklb interesting, embedding tweets for the reply-context as it were? instead of a quote tweet?
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miklb
bridgy to know it's a reply and what it is replying to (the tweet link)
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tantek
miklb do you have any interest in Bridgy posting them as quote tweets instead?
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tantek
do you use both?
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GWG
Also, every time pfefferle merges a PR, I often pause to send him the next one.
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tantek
GWG, nah, just keep the momentum rolling, without pausing :)
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miklb
tantek if I want to reply to a tweet from my site, and I use the embedded tweet, currently brdgy doesn't see the tweet url
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tantek
miklb right, I get that. I'm curious if you ever mean to quote a tweet
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tantek
or rather if you ever want your POSSE copy to be a quote tweet
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tantek
what is a quote tweet
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Loqi
A quote tweet (also known as a "retweet with comment") is a reply on Twitter to an original tweet that displays the entirety of the original in a reply-context below the reply text https://indieweb.org/quote_tweet
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tantek
yeah that
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miklb
I know what they are. I have done that, I sent the pull-request to GWG to add them to bridgy-publish plugin
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miklb
I just wanted to do a good old fashioned @username reply from my site.
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tantek
wondering if we documented this on /reply-context already
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tantek
because you're essentially using the tweet embed as a reply-context in that use-case
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Loqi
[Ryan Barrett] @therealfitz @nickkokonas fascinating perspective from deep inside the industry. @LexCre8 @dangerdbp you’d probably be interested.
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tantek
miklb like that ^^^ ?
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miklb
basically, without adding the link to the tweet in the reply, yes
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tantek
well since that's what snarfed ended up doing, I'd guess that's the current best practice
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tantek
not saying it can't be improved but if you wanted to get something working ASAP that would be the way to do it
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martymcguire[m]
this reminds me - i (ab?)use quill's reply functionality a lot when i mean "quote this with my commentary"
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tantek
also I bet snarfed would be interested in any improved solution you came up with!
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miklb
takes a deep breath
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martymcguire[m]
mostly because of the UI experience (it's super easy, and i had my site set up to show replies already)
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martymcguire[m]
does anyone use a micropub client that supports u-quotation-of? i don't think quill has it.
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aaronpk
martymcguire[m]: that sounds kind of like a bookmark?
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aaronpk
the bookmarklet in quill will grab the highlighted text on the page and prepopulate the content area with that
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aaronpk
although, that doesn't really solve the "with commentary" aspect i guess
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martymcguire[m]
aaronpk: i agree that the bookmark flow would also be as good, but i want to make a post that is equivalent to a /quote_tweet
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martymcguire[m]
ie - both of these are really close from a UI perspective but i don't think of it as a reply or a bookmark, haha
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Loqi
awesome
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aaronpk
yeah i agree
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aaronpk
i'd say it's closer to just a plain mention of a link that might include quoted text from it, which would be an h-cite embedded
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miklb
tantek here's the thing. If I were just a new user, and managed to get all the plugins installed, hooked up with bridgy and I were to set the type to reply, add the link to the url and write my reply, the plugin would return an error saying bridgy can't find the link to the tweet, even though you are looking at it the link in the post editor, see it on Twitter. I'm trying to fix that. Nothing ground breaking, nothing out-of-the-box
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martymcguire[m]
hmm. that would work for me, but the h-cite has to come from somewhere.
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tantek
miklb I agree 100% with your perspective on that. that should "just work" exactly as you described.
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aaronpk
yeah i'm not sure how that should look in the quill UI
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aaronpk
maybe need screenshots of how it works on twitter
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martymcguire[m]
this is plumbing-y, but i'd be happy with receiving a "u-quotation-of" URL and feeding that into my site's reply context system. i'd display the entire content or a truncated summary.
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tantek
do you mean into your site's comment display system?
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tantek
because you recieving a u-quotation-of would be someone else quoting something of *yours*
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gRegorLove
Think they mean via micropub
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martymcguire[m]
oops, right. i meant my micropub endpoint would receive a quotation-of.
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@PS_Promoter
follow please #PrabhuStudio I recommended SelfPubShowcase From #Worldwide https://twitter.com/SelfPubShowcase The best books, from the best #Indieauth…
(twtr.io/1QXu_7haCzj)
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martymcguire[m]
reads /quotation and /quote_tweet for ideas
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Loqi
[[quotation]] ! https://indieweb.org/wiki/index.php?diff=35700&oldid=34487&rcid=35622 * Gregorlove.com * (-14) /* Quote entirety with commentary */ rm quotes
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gRegorLove
s/quotes/quotation marks/
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martymcguire[m]
after some reading i think i want something that is a hybrid.
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martymcguire[m]
reading /quotation#reply has me convinced that i want to post an in-reply-to on my own site
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tantek
that's just a reply
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martymcguire[m]
but when i POSSE to twitter i want it to appear as a /quote_tweet, not a /reply
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tantek
really?
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tantek
why not actually threaded on Twitter?
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martymcguire[m]
i want it to be public on my timeline
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miklb
now I just need to find the last instance of an href in a string and a class…
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martymcguire[m]
i've got an example. here i replied to a tweet that was an announcement: https://martymcgui.re/2017/04/04/141550/
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Loqi
[Marty McGuire] Congrats to @thatonegm for publishing Four Sherlock Holmes and a Vampire. One-up your friends, solve the crime, and maybe be a vampire!
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martymcguire[m]
it's implemented as an in-reply-to, and (when i show tweets correctly in my reply contexts) would show the complete tweet that i am replying to. a /reader subscribed to my site would show that context and my text, and that would be what i want.
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martymcguire[m]
however, when i POSSE this through bridgy, it becomes a reply to the original tweet, which would not show up in my main list of tweets.
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tantek
martymcguire[m]: "public on my timeline" just requires not starting with the @-mention in the prose of the note
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martymcguire[m]
absolutely, when i POSSE manually.
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tantek
"it becomes a reply to the original tweet, which would not show up in my main list of tweets." <-- this is not true
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tantek
as long as you don't *start* your note with the @-mention, then it should show up in your main list of tweets
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martymcguire[m]
when i POSSE'd this tweet through bridgy, it became a reply to the original tweet rather than a quote tweet.
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tantek
replies that don't start with an @-name show up in your main profile list of tweets
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tantek
so that should still be ok
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miklb
not true with bridgy I don't think. I had a note I added in-reply-to manually to a link and it showed up as a reply on Twitter even though I didnt' start the note with @
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miklb
this article https://miklb.com/owning-my-feed-reading/ had a in-reply-to in the link to [cleverdevil] site. On Twitter it showed up with @ as a reply
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Loqi
[miklb] Owning My Feed Reading
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martymcguire[m]
i posted a note to my site in-reply-to a twitter URL where the content of the note did not start with an @. however, when i used bridgy publish to POSSE this note to twitter, it was posted as a reply to the tweet rather than quoting the tweet.
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tantek
martymcguire[m]: this tweet https://twitter.com/schmarty/status/849346041392615427 shows up in your profile tweets
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@schmarty
Congrats to @thatonegm for publishing Four Sherlock Holmes and a Vampire. One-up your friends, solve the crime, and maybe be a vampire! QT [@ThatOneGM] Inspired by @JustinMcElroy on the latest @TheZoneCast, I wrote this. Enjoy! @griffinmcelroy @travismcelroy @DocCurm https://www.dropbox.com/s/shafmajj4nzqftr/Four%20Sherlock%20Holmes%20and%20a%20Vampire.pdf?dl=0 https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C8lmLtWXgAAiZQE.jpg
(twtr.io/1QGnDKiztAT)
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tantek
yes it's a reply and yes it also shows up on your list of tweets
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martymcguire[m]
(i deleted the bridgy tweet and manually created the tweet i expected)
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tantek
do you have an example tweet of where Bridgy didn't post what you wanted?
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@miklb
@cleverdevil I’ve been a stalwart _RSS_ (Atom) reader since I started blogging 12 years ago. Back then, in the dark ages, it was the only way to easily…
(twtr.io/1QW8dq5pK_R)
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martymcguire[m]
in other words, i deleted the evidence and made the post that i expected, haha.
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Loqi
awesome
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tantek
miklb: that starts with the @-mention, presumably that came from your site
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miklb
that tweet was created by bridgy from my article
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tantek
if you start your note NOT with the @-mention it should all "just work"
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miklb
tantek nope
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tantek
Oh? Bridgy is forcing the @-mention at the start?!?
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Loqi
[miklb] Owning My Feed Reading
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martymcguire[m]
heads off to create an example.
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miklb
that doesn't start with @
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tantek
yeah ok that's a bug
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miklb
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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tantek
or rather, I can see Bridgy add in the @-mention at the start if your truncated tweet does not have it
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tantek
but if you deliberately put the @-mention already in your txt in the first 100 or so chars, then in should "just work"
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tantek
I find it hard to believe that Bridgy would *duplicate* an @-mention at the start of a reply
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tantek
martymcguire[m]: be sure to explicitly include the @-mention, and not as the very first thing
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miklb
I didn't even really add an in-reply-to a tweet url, just a possed note on [cleverdevil] Known site
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tantek
replied to a note on?
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tantek
if the original has a POSSE tweet copy, then your POSSE tweet reply will get automatically threaded
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tantek
with in-reply-to presumably
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KartikPrabhu
yes, bridgy does find the Twitter POSSE copy and replies to that
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tantek
but bridgy should not be introducing a duplicate @-ref at the start
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tantek
that's what we're trying to figure out
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KartikPrabhu
I think it does (or did?)
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tantek
duplicate?!?
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KartikPrabhu
yeah, testing now
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miklb
goes back to seeing if he can hack this Twitter embed html
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martymcguire[m]
just created this post: https://martymcgui.re/2017/04/11/162245/
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Loqi
[Marty McGuire] Had a blast running Everyone is John on @DnDSVU last night! Looking forward to next week when @thatonegm runs another one-shot.
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martymcguire[m]
about to posse w/ bridgy
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martymcguire[m]
in fact, bridgy informs me that it will create an @-reply
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KartikPrabhu
tantek: hmmm nope, bridgy does not duplicate the @-mention in a reply, in fact it removes it! compare https://twitter.com/kartik_prabhu/status/851894558074052613 to https://kartikprabhu.com/notes/re-nice-ducks
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KartikPrabhu
weird! that Loqi preview has a @t
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martymcguire[m]
and the resulting tweet: https://twitter.com/schmarty/status/851894835086839817
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@schmarty
@DnDSVU Had a blast running Everyone is John on @DnDSVU last night! Looking forward to next week when @thatonegm runs another one-shot.
(twtr.io/1QXxhpQ6UqH)
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tantek
Kartik your example didn't prove anything because you started with @t
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tantek
is about to give up
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tantek
one last time
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miklb
bridgy has specifc markup needed for a quote tweet https://brid.gy/about#quote-tweet
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tantek
you need to put the @-mention NOT FIRST in your text
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tantek
but within the first 100 or so specific chars so it doesn't get truncated out
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martymcguire[m]
not sure if bridgy is sending that with the @ name in front, but you can see that my post did not start with @
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martymcguire[m]
tantek: please read my post above - the post on my site does not start with "@DnDSVU"
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tantek
martymcguire[m]: ok you revealed the duplication bug then
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martymcguire[m]
unfortunately the resulting tweet seems to have it
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tantek
note how the tweet line Loqi provided says @DnDSVU TWICE
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tantek
that's the bug
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tantek
so that's the issue to file
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tantek
on Bridgy
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tantek
Issue: if a reply to a tweet already has the @-name in the content that will get tweeted, DO NOT duplicate the @-name at the start of the POSSE tweet reply copy
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martymcguire[m]
it's a good place for discussion, if nothing else
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martymcguire[m]
heads to github
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martymcguire[m]
(my theory is that bridgy is specifying that the tweet is a reply in the API request to twitter, causing twitter to start the canoe. in that case the @-name at the start of the text is being added by twitter in display of the tweet.)
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tantek
twitter does not start the canoe
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tantek
Falcon calls the Twitter API directly all the time with such "public replies" and it works just fine
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[cleverdevil]
Thanks for the help, folks, I ended up creating a tiny custom Known plugin that does what I want.
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[cleverdevil]
Now, you can visit https://cleverdevil.io/timeline/ or https://cleverdevil.io/activity/ and see filtered versions of my Known stream.
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[cleverdevil]
Not sure I'm totally happy with the categorization, yet, but its getting there!
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tantek
martymcguire[m]: if Twitter prepended text like that, it would break clients that are posting replies of 140 chars
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tantek
(especially before the recent changes)
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[chrisaldrich]
cleverdevil and my, look at that larger typography! What was the secret ultimately to rewrite the pages?
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[cleverdevil]
Its a Known plugin.
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[cleverdevil]
That basically inherits from the Homepage object in core and forces it to show specific content types.
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martymcguire[m]
ok, unfolding the mystery. did a dive into bridgy publish handling, which hands off to granary to make the actual post to twitter.
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martymcguire[m]
granary isn't adding in the @-names at the front. it's using a twitter API option to have twitter do it.
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martymcguire[m]
code where the auto_populate_reply_metadata option is invoked if the post being published has an in-reply-to: https://github.com/snarfed/granary/blob/master/granary/twitter.py#L735
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tantek
still seems like a bug in behavior and thus worth filing
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tantek
no need for duping, regardless of where the duping happens
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tantek
what is u-featured
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Loqi
It looks like we don't have a page for "u-featured" yet. Would you like to create it? https://indieweb.org/s/10gM
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tantek
u-featured is /featured
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Loqi
[[u-featured]] !N https://indieweb.org/wiki/index.php?oldid=35702&rcid=35624 * Loqi.me * (+21) prompted by tantek and dfn added by tantek
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martymcguire[m]
the more i think about it, the more i think this isn't a bug so much as a use case falling through the cracks of twitter's @-name handling in replies.
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tantek
martymcguire[m]: huh? how is unnecessary duplicating of an @-name not a bug?
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snarfed
hi all. details on the bridgy duplicating @-mentions complaint: https://github.com/snarfed/bridgy/issues/742#issuecomment-293411480
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snarfed
tldr: it's not actually duplicating them. the prefixed @-mentions aren't actually in the tweet text. afaik the problem is that loqi doesn't yet support twitter's new extended tweet format, so it's incorrectly rendering them as though they are
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martymcguire[m]
snarfed++ for the reply! that is what i having trouble articulating. the "@-name" isn't duplicated "in" the tweet as twitter displays it in the twitter UI.
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Loqi
snarfed has 3 karma in this channel (265 overall)
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martymcguire[m]
so i'm back to wanting a way to differentiate "a reply on my site that should be a reply on twitter" vs "a reply on my site that should be a quote on twitter"
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snarfed
yeah that's a pretty new use case afaik. consider just manually posseing those?
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martymcguire[m]
snarfed: that's what i will do for now. :}
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[eddie]
I wonder if at some point you could say if h-cite exists (aka reply context) it would quote tweet with comment, and if a single u-reply-to href exists without h-cite, then it would be a true “reply”
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[eddie]
Because by using an h-cite rather than just a link with u-reply-to, aren’t you in essence trying to point out the content as opposed to just replying to the person?
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KartikPrabhu
[eddie]: you can h-cite just a link too
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[eddie]
hmmm, what would be the use case of h-citing just a link?
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[eddie]
Just curious 🙂
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KartikPrabhu
to cite it :P
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KartikPrabhu
of course it isn't a pretty markup
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KartikPrabhu
but I don't see why h-cite needs to have any content other than a link
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[eddie]
That’s true. I still think whether you have just the link or more, h-cite means you are citing a link, u-reply-to you are just replying
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[eddie]
still seems like it would work as a twitter comparison
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[eddie]
That’s probably what I’ll experiment with when I get regular tweet like notes built into my site
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martymcguire[m]
from the discussion on /quotation, i definitely see these as /reply posts. it's like twitter has a distinction that my site doesn't because my site doesn't have canoes. :}
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[eddie]
martymcguire[m]: what do you have against water sports??
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[cleverdevil]
What is a canoe?
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Loqi
canoe is a long chain of replies on twitter, with many people @'d into it https://indieweb.org/canoe
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[eddie]
I agree with martymcguire[m] I see them as replies, I think the main difference is context. One is you are trying to show context (quote tweet) and one where you don’t care about the context, because you are assuming the person already knows the context
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martymcguire[m]
[eddie]: it's also a question of audience. twitter will put a /quote_tweet on my public timeline under "Tweets", but an @-reply is under "Tweets and Replies" (and may not be visible to my followers? is that still true?)
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martymcguire[m]
whereas my site doesn't make a distinction like that.
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[eddie]
That’s true, although if you click “Reply” to someone and type something before the @-mention (on a third party twitter client, because, Twitter…), I think it might make it public but still a reply
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martymcguire[m]
bridgy publish does support making quote tweets if you replace in-reply-to with quotation-of, but i am not sure it is worth it to build that difference into my site
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martymcguire[m]
[eddie]: it does seem that twitter's new reply-handling implementation breaks expectations of the old behavior that position of @-mentions matters.
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[eddie]
Yep, you’re right
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[eddie]
I just tried it and it works differently now
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[eddie]
A reply is always a reply now
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[cleverdevil]
I'd actually like a "repost" with content in Quill, sort of like quoted RTs on Twitter.
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[cleverdevil]
Is that even a thing?
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KartikPrabhu
your site can pull the content from the original being reposted no?
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KartikPrabhu
or so you mean repost with your own commentary?
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[cleverdevil]
The latter.
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[cleverdevil]
Both, though, I suppose?
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[cleverdevil]
It'd be nice if it were formatted very similarly to how Twitter does.
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[eddie]
If you have commentary (including tags) on a quotation, ask yourself:
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[eddie]
Is the commentary merely summarizing what’s in the quotation?
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[eddie]
If no to either question then your post should be a reply instead of a quotation. -> Current documented thinking on https://indieweb.org/quotation#reply
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[eddie]
Does the quotation convey the same or similar intent without the commentary?
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[cleverdevil]
Point taken.
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[eddie]
Hence the above debate 🙂
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[cleverdevil]
Now I've been dragged into it!
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[eddie]
You’re welcome 🙂
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[cleverdevil]
Wake me up when you all sort it out 😛
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martymcguire[m]
hmm. i feel like twitter's replies are reply-with-limited audience, and twitter's quote tweet is more like a /reply
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martymcguire[m]
s/limited audience/limited-audience/
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martymcguire[m]
like it's more a matter of which streams reply post appears in and who gets notified.
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[eddie]
Haha yeah that’s what I was about to say
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Loqi
awesome
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[eddie]
It shows up on profile, so it’s not “private” in any sense of the word
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martymcguire[m]
if i were to implement twitter-style-replies, i'd make the post to my site and send webmentions for it, but it wouldn't appear in my stream(s).
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[eddie]
except maybe your firehose
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[eddie]
(aka Twitter Profile Stream)
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martymcguire[m]
and if i wanted to implement twitter-style-quotes on my site, i'd make the post to my site and include it in my streams. but instead of sending a webmention to the post i'm replying to, i'd send a person-tag??
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martymcguire[m]
(so the original poster gets notified, but it doesn't show up in the mentions for that particular post)
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[eddie]
I think I’ve seen quoted tweets appear in the mentions of tweet
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[cleverdevil]
What you just did on Twitter is exactly what I want, eddie.
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martymcguire[m]
[eddie]: here's a tweet that quotes one of my tweets: https://twitter.com/ThatOneGM/status/851895381906554880
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@ThatOneGM
Everyone Is John is super fun, and I loved last night's episode. Next week, I'm running Wushu! Expect over-the-top action and wackiness. QT [@schmarty] @DnDSVU Had a blast running Everyone is John on @DnDSVU last night! Looking forward to next week when @thatonegm runs another one-shot.
(twtr.io/1QXxuYbzE80)
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martymcguire[m]
clicking through to the tweet in question, that quote is not in the replies: https://twitter.com/schmarty/status/851894835086839817
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@schmarty
@DnDSVU Had a blast running Everyone is John on @DnDSVU last night! Looking forward to next week when @thatonegm runs another one-shot.
(twtr.io/1QXxhpQ6UqH)
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[eddie]
Weird I feel like that’s another twitter change… I swear I’ve seen that show up before lol
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[eddie]
But you’re right. It’s not showing up for me now
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[eddie]
cleverdevil: Yeah, that was using Tweetbot
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[eddie]
sshhh, don’t tell anyone 😳
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martymcguire[m]
well i am not sure what we have learned but i very much enjoyed the discussion.
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[eddie]
lol I enjoyed it as well.
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martymcguire[m]
if i want to make a simple workflow for something like quill, maybe i'd make two twitter syndication targets: one that treats replies as replies (ie - just passes through normal in-reply-to mf2 markup) and one that treats replies as quotes (ie - uses quotation-of mf2 markup for bridgy)
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martymcguire[m]
either way i'd want most mf2 consumers to see it as in-reply-to.
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martymcguire[m]
well, with that i need to get ready for dinner. later on, everybody. and thanks!
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[cleverdevil]
This is my weekly reminder to ask you how its coming, eddie 🙂
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[eddie]
cleverdevil++ Ran into DNS issues over the end of last week/weekend when I switched to DreamCompute 😉 (DNS issues weren’t DreamHost’s issue, other servers issue). So I couldn’t do micropub all weekend. But the DNS issues seem resolved, so I’m looking forward to getting some testing done on it this week 🙂
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Loqi
cleverdevil has 2 karma in this channel (25 overall)
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[cleverdevil]
No worries. Sounds good!
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[cleverdevil]
Looking forward to it. I think its a real key to making the entire user experience better. Integrated sharing in both iOS and and macOS will be fantastic.
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[cleverdevil]
Might also be interesting to contact the Dropshare people and see if they might be interested in integrating Micropub.
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[cleverdevil]
What is Dropshare?
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Loqi
It looks like we don't have a page for "Dropshare" yet. Would you like to create it? https://indieweb.org/s/10gN
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[cleverdevil]
Dropshare is an app for [[macOS]] and [[iOS]] for sharing files to popular cloud services and to your own server. https://getdropsha.re
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Loqi
[[Dropshare]] !N https://indieweb.org/wiki/index.php?oldid=35704&rcid=35626 * Loqi.me * (+163) prompted by [cleverdevil] and dfn added by [cleverdevil]
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Loqi
[[reply]] ! https://indieweb.org/wiki/index.php?diff=35705&oldid=33547&rcid=35627 * Eddiehinkle.com * (+1272) Added brainstorm section with a summary of @-reply vs. quote tweet brainstorm
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[eddie]
cleverdevil: I completely agree. It’s the critical piece to whether I do native tweets/replies/quotes, etc, or do posting on my site
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[cleverdevil]
Same reason I made my Nextcloud News plugin.
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[cleverdevil]
Reduce friction for doing the "right thing" vs. the easy thing.
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[eddie]
Exactly
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[cleverdevil]
Eventually, I'd like to move back to a native feed reader like Reeder.app, which I love, but it (a) doesn't sync with Nextcloud News's API yet, and (b) Doesn't support Micropub sharing yet.
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Loqi
Mentions as quotes 2015-05-22
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[chrisaldrich]
tantek: It doesn't look quite like a time zone issue. Maybe every time they update their web server for some reason? https://indiechat.search.cweiske.de/?q=A+short+note+about+web+standards+from+your+friends+at+Known&page=1
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[kevinmarks]
With the new canoe replies, they don't show in your timeline by default even if you don't start with @
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[kevinmarks]
You have to retweet your own post to put it in your public timeline
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gRegorLove
I think if you start off a tweet with an @-mention of someone, not @-reply, that's visible to all your followers, regardless if they follow that user. All subsequent replies are *not* shown your followers, unless they also follow the initial @-mention user.
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gRegorLove
So it's sorta like you can see the start of a conversation, but not the rest unless you click through / follow the people in the convo
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KevinMarks_
It is so much better than their app on android
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miklb
[kevinmarks] I had not, but will look closer
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Loqi
[[WordPress]] ! https://indieweb.org/wiki/index.php?diff=35706&oldid=35434&rcid=35628 * Ignite.digitalignition.net * (+0) Fixing link that had moved and formatting that broke linking of post after that
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[cleverdevil]
I'm tinkering this evening on a webhook for Plex that will Micropub a "now playing" event to my site.
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[cleverdevil]
Any recommendations on an easy Webmention client library for PHP?
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[cleverdevil]
I've already got the entire webhook payload processing, and can pretty easily build the content at this point.
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[cleverdevil]
But, I'd prefer not to hand-roll the Micropub...
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miklb
[cleverdevil] library for sending?
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aaronpk
There's an IndieAuth client for PHP which handles the authorization part
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aaronpk
the actual Micropub request is just a post so you don't gain much by using a library
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[cleverdevil]
Yah, library for sending.
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[cleverdevil]
Good point...
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[cleverdevil]
Its not that complicated... I've done it from pure Python before.
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aaronpk
Wait webmention or Micropub
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[cleverdevil]
Ah, I see, I said Micropub in the first message and Webmention in the second 🙂
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[cleverdevil]
Yeah, definitely Micropub.
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miklb
what is featured
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Loqi
featured is a proposed mf2 property (typically as u-featured) for h-entry that indicates a representative image for a primarily textual post https://indieweb.org/featured
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@captaxin
ReadersGazette: BLOG Indie Author Answers by Jim Heskett http://www.thejugglingauthor.com/indieauth/ Get help writing your book #bookbloggers 53
(twtr.io/1QYsw7MziMb)