2017-12-31 UTC
snarfed and [kevinmarks] joined the channel
[tantek] and gRegorLove_ joined the channel
renem, snarfed, [eddie] and tomasparks joined the channel
[miklb] joined the channel
[eddie], gRegorLove_, gRegorLove, [miklb] and tomasparks joined the channel
[kevinmarks] joined the channel
[kevinmarks], [colinwalker], John__ and KevinMarks joined the channel
# 15:16 dgold i am getting increasingly annoyed with mastodon # 15:17 dgold kind of hard to programatically recognise when a reply/repost/like is of a mastodon post [kevinmarks] joined the channel
snarfed joined the channel
# 15:25 dgold sknebel: to send like-of and repost-of actions through to mastodon from micropub # 15:26 dgold so if, e.g. I was using quill to send a like-of to my site, this would automagically be sent to mastodon and show as a like-of there # 15:28 dgold all the 'reactions' to that tweet, like-of, repost-of and reply-to, were done via my micropub endpoint jjuran joined the channel
# 15:36 dgold to be perfectly frank, snarfed, I forgot all about it :( # 15:39 dgold so - I need an atom feed (check) .well-known set up (check) # 15:39 dgold ok - my atom feed needs to advertise a pubsubhub? KevinMarks joined the channel
# 15:44 dgold snarfed: ok - I appear to be present on the mastodon fediverse, as @ascraeus.org@ascraeus.org # 15:44 dgold is that doubling an artefact of poor config on my part? # 15:45 snarfed mastodon sometimes only shows the username, or de-emphasizes the instance domain, so this was a tradeoff # 15:46 Loqi [00dani] #3 allow users to choose their own username # 15:47 dgold snarfed: how do I now post onto mastodon? # 15:48 Loqi [snarfed] #18 figure out user and post discovery # 15:48 dgold I see the data re like/post/reply, but can I use fed.br to _post_? # 15:48 snarfed once your site is set up as described, mastodon users *should* technically be able to follow your site # 15:48 snarfed in practice that's been a bit flaky, but possible # 15:49 dgold well, I've 'followed' myself (and orthodox freudians everywhere are exploding) so I'll see tomasparks and aaronpk joined the channel
# 15:52 aaronpk oh crap, the feed parser library I am using was just updated to say it's not maintained anymore # 15:52 Loqi [miniflux] picoFeed: [Not Maintained] PHP library to parse and write RSS/Atom feeds # 15:53 dgold snarfed: I'm guessing the link to fed.br needs to be _in_ the atom feed? # 15:53 dgold or is it just on the website page? or am I completely misreading here # 15:54 dgold snarfed: from your docs - "To like, repost or reply to a post on a fedsocnet, create an indie like, repost, or reply as usual, and include a link to https://fed.brid.gy/ in that post." # 15:55 snarfed right, just to trigger a webmention. the link itself doesn't really matter, bridgy fed doesn't check for it # 15:57 dgold aaronpk: that's concerning - given that miniflux uses that parser # 15:57 aaronpk "Miniflux 2 is a rewrite of Miniflux 1.x in Golang. The development still in progress and it's not ready to be used." # 16:00 aaronpk welp guess I need to find another feed parsing library if I want to keep that stuff up to date # 16:00 aaronpk on the plus side, RSS/Atom are mostly stable so at least there aren't changes to keep up with in a library # 16:01 Loqi [miniflux] miniflux-legacy: Minimalist RSS reader (version 1.x) # 16:08 sknebel doesn't want to use an ORM, wants to use postgres only features # 16:08 petermolnar miniflux was php+sqlite, moving to go is... ok, why not, but postres brings a whole new level of dependencies # 16:10 dgold but in the docs: "By default, Miniflux uses Sqlite, if you would like to use Postgres or MySQL instead you will have to modify your config.php file." # 16:11 dgold config.example.php line 21: // Database driver: "sqlite", "postgres", or "mysql" default is sqlite # 16:14 dgold oh jeez. "Miniflux doesn’t use any config file, only environment variables. # 16:14 aaronpk I still say feed readers without the ability to interact with the content are a dead end # 16:14 Zegnat I didn’t use Miniflux, but sad to see a PHP project die. It is still infinitely easier to run a PHP self-hosted anything than almost everything else in my experience. Because shared hosting will often only offer PHP. # 16:15 petermolnar while I did develop a love for python, php-fpm is certainly a simpler thing than any python wrapper # 16:15 Zegnat But I think several other packages (including XRay?) are using the PHP feed parser that was built for Miniflux? That library losing support might be worse than just Miniflux moving to go. # 16:15 dgold i've been using it these past four or five months, ever since the tt-rss chap went all pepe the frog; I'm pretty upset at these developments # 16:16 Loqi [miniflux] picoFeed: [Not Maintained] PHP library to parse and write RSS/Atom feeds # 16:16 aaronpk Zegnat: yeah that's how I found out about this in the first place # 16:16 dgold Zegnat: :) that discovery is what prompted the entire discourse # 16:18 Zegnat With sink-related code. That is, the port from Sink to licit.li so it can power my blog. [kevinmarks] joined the channel
[eddie] joined the channel
# 16:22 [eddie] So I had a question/though. Is there anyway to detect that websites a given identity can edit provided a URL? My first thought was if it was part of your identity url, like https://eddiehinkle.com can be assumed to be able to edit anything at https://eddiehinkle.com but this would not be the case for Zegnat where identity url and blog url at different domains. # 16:23 [eddie] So has there been any thoughts as to be able to determine if blog post xyz.example/post can be edited by identity.example? # 16:24 aaronpk [eddie]: I think that kind of thing is very implementation-dependent # 16:24 Zegnat No. There exists no connection between those two things. xyz.example/post can be edited by anyone with a token (with correct update scopes) for the xyz.example micropub endpoint # 16:24 aaronpk it's also possible that someone may be able to edit a site and doesn't want that information made public # 16:25 Zegnat Only xyz.example (or its token endpoint) knows what tokens are valid for updates. # 16:25 aaronpk Zegnat: I already forked picofeed to make a minor change, and he merged the PR right before deprecating the library. sadly didn't publish a new release to packagist tho. # 16:25 aaronpk i'm not sure I want to actually maintain the library though, so I will probably just find a new one when I need to # 16:28 snarfed hey aaronpk did the chat.indieweb.org css change recently? i'm now seeing the sidebar on mobile, on top of the transcript...but only for the main channel, not others # 16:28 aaronpk I just added word-wrap: break-word, because without that it went nuts with the really long line from indienews # 16:28 Loqi [Zegnat] #42 Long lines break log display in Chrome for Android. # 16:29 aaronpk might need to refresh to get the new CSS but it looks good to me on chrome (ios) now # 16:29 [eddie] I basically was trying to figure out if there was a way for Indigenous to know if it should display an edit option or not. # 16:29 Zegnat It is still broken for me. Not sure how I can force a CSS refresh. # 16:29 snarfed i'm on android. refresh doesn't fix it. waiting until tomorrow will though, i'll just do that :P # 16:30 aaronpk I can never get hard refresh to work on mobile devices # 16:30 [eddie] But if there’s no way to detect that, I guess I could always show the edit button, and when you click edit, it could try a source query against the Micropub endpoint. If it fails then it returns that you can edit that post # 16:30 snarfed oh also aaronpk nudge on counting wm.io wms! not urgent, i expect it's on your todo list # 16:32 aaronpk [eddie]: whoa are you building in editing support? # 16:32 Zegnat That’s probably the only way [eddie]. You have to know the Micropub endpoint for the specific post and then know if your client has a token stored for that endpoint. # 16:32 [eddie] I am laying the foundation for it. Editing won’t be in the next version but it will likely be within the next month or two and I’m trying to make sure things like up correctly # 16:33 Zegnat But note that separate post URLs might not even expose their Micropub endpoint :/ # 16:33 aaronpk Zegnat: that sounds like a good reason for post URLs to advertise a micropub endpoint! # 16:33 aaronpk like how wordpress and mediawiki both link to their edit URLs # 16:33 [eddie] I do have a list of all Micropub endpoints that are authorized within the app so that seems like a good solution # 16:34 [eddie] I know all my posts have Micropub endpoint displayed # 16:34 aaronpk yeah the client should know which micropub endpoints it has a token for, and whether the token has the "update" scope, so if a post advertises a micropub endpoint that matches one then the client can assume it can edit the post # 16:34 Zegnat I think I am going to expose my micropub endpoint in the HTTP header domain-wide, so mine will have it too. # 16:36 Zegnat is it safe for the client to check for a specific scope value, aaronpk? Is there an authoritative list of scopes that Micropub servers must adhere to? # 16:37 sknebel there is a list of common ones, but nothing explicitly demanded in the spec # 16:37 aaronpk the spec doesn't list them out but that's just because I didn't want to hard-code the list so early # 16:38 Zegnat I just checked the online logs again, and display seems to have been fixed aaronpk! # 16:39 Zegnat (I cleared data in Chrome for Android, and to be sure, navigated to the CSS file and manually refreshed there.) snarfed joined the channel
# 17:01 [eddie] Right now that scopes that Indigenous recognizes are: create, update, delete and of course microsub ones eventually KevinMarks joined the channel
# 17:07 [eddie] I also like the media scope, so I’d like to add that to my endpoint and indigenous when Indigenous supports uploads KevinMarks joined the channel
# 17:20 GWG I can't figure out how to map them to WordPress # 17:21 aaronpk does wordpress have the concept of users with limited permissions? # 17:27 GWG But do I want to add extra users? # 17:27 Zegnat I’d say the client gets the permissions of the authenticated user? snarfed and mifga joined the channel
# 17:56 GWG If I map a token to a user, the app gets all the permissions of the user # 17:57 aaronpk if you use any third-party app with your wordpress site that app has full permissions to do everything you can do within wordpress, right? # 18:00 aaronpk if wordpress users are accustomed to third-party apps having full access, then it's fine for micropub apps to work the same # 18:03 GWG aaronpk, what is the best way to test an Indieauth client implementation? # 18:05 GWG At IWC Austin I used a temporary application password to post to my site. I want to use an Indieauth token instead # 18:11 GWG aaronpk, I am finding it a challenge still # 18:11 GWG Even though I got it working last night KevinMarks joined the channel
KevinMarks joined the channel
# 18:36 Zegnat GWG, the goal is to make it easier for me to handle IndieAuth per spec. # 18:36 GWG I am working on that now too, amongst other things # 18:37 GWG I have to talk to snarfed though. There is an Indieauth implementation inside his Micropub plugin and I have to figure out how to avoid conflicts # 18:46 Loqi Countdown set by ben_thatmustbeme on 2017-01-31 at 1:44pm EST [eddie] joined the channel
# 18:55 Zegnat GWG, aaronpk also has an open source helper library for handling IndieAuth. [kevinmarks] joined the channel
# 19:07 Zegnat I am not sure if my domain validation is correct yet... It looks like I will have to depend on an external library :( CamB and gRegorLove joined the channel
# 20:38 sknebel aaronpk: also, your calendar view on your site you linked earlier looks messed up with tons of overlapping elements. known issue? KartikPrabhu joined the channel
[kevinmarks] joined the channel
# 20:52 Zegnat Whenever I use curl in PHP I am always sure I messed up one of the million parameters :/ # 20:53 dansup Happy gnu years everyone! # 20:54 Zegnat If you are making the properties public, why do you still need a __get and __set? # 20:56 Zegnat just realised he is doing the IndieAuth thing all wrong # 20:56 dansup Zegnat: good question, I added the magic methods for additional properties. # 20:57 Zegnat I need to validate the profile URL *after* resolving redirects # 20:59 Zegnat I am so tired I wrote “infalid” in the DocBlock. What am I even doing?! # 21:00 dansup heh, too much egg nog? # 21:01 Zegnat So far I have only had a single glass of rose. # 21:01 Zegnat Maybe I am worrying about my arbitrary midnight deadline too much. Hurrying when implementing a spec is never a good idea. # 21:05 Zegnat I could also skip implementing section 4.1’s redirects, because my domain isn’t going to redirect. But then the completionist in me gets angry. # 21:11 dgold lookit, leave it tide over to the morrow, watch the New Years Concert from Vienna, then you can make your commitment part of the 2018 thing [eddie] joined the channel
# 21:19 [eddie] Zegnat: I feel like a 2018-01-01 commitment you should have until 11:59 PM on 2018-01-01 tantek, KevinMarks and AngeloGladding joined the channel
# 21:48 Zegnat I love how everyone is helping me come up with excuses not to launch :P # 21:52 gRegorLove This is why I like the #newwwwyear challenge, since it asked you to set your date. I chose 2018-01-07 :) # 21:53 Zegnat Thing is, I just know it will end up shelved until next year if I don’t actually sit down to finish it. KartikPrabhu and KevinMarks joined the channel
KevinMarks joined the channel
# 22:14 Loqi Realtime generally refers to a user experience where content is updated live; for example: a new comment shows up on a page while you're viewing it, or chat notification "your friend is typing a message." https://indieweb.org/Realtime KevinMarks joined the channel
# 22:16 tantek gRegorLove: ^^^ not sure if there's a way for you to capture a screenshot (e.g. if it outlined the comment or something in a colored border), but feel free to add any commentary about your experience in seeing that [kevinmarks] joined the channel
KartikPrabhu joined the channel
tomasparks, KevinMarks, [miklb], gRegorLove_, tantek, tantek_, KartikPrabhu and snarfed joined the channel
upon2020.com edited /Special:Log/upload () "uploaded a new version of "[[File:ubos-logo-big.png]]": Updated logo" (view diff)
aaronparecki.com edited /Special:Log/upload () "uploaded a new version of "[[File:indiewebcamp-button.png]]"" (view diff)
@lobsters Announcing lazymention: elegant outbound Webmention for ...
by @strugee2
https://lobste.rs/s/kip3yk #show #release #web
https://strugee.net/blog/2017/12/announcing-lazymention-elegant-outbound-webmention-for-static-sites (twitter.com/_/status/947286243322109952)
@hubertlepicki Junior developer: "I will just copy over this code to reuse it" Middle developer: "I will make it DRY with code sharing/inheritance/macros" Senior developer: "I will just copy over this code to reuse it" (twitter.com/_/status/946725454043598849)
[kevinmarks] Did their mf2 go bad?
dgold in the same way as I can do, e.g. https://twitter.com/ROUZealot/status/947452527548751872
@ROUZealot New instantiating tweet, for a new set of tests.… https://steelyglint.ascraeus.org/micro/1514725259 (twitter.com/_/status/947452527548751872)
snarfed dgold: you've seen https://fed.brid.gy/ , right?
petermolnar golang, ok - postgres WHY?!
Zegnat Yep. picoFeed (also used in XRay) is now officially deprecated. https://github.com/miniflux/picofeed
[eddie] So I had a question/though. Is there anyway to detect that websites a given identity can edit provided a URL? My first thought was if it was part of your identity url, like https://eddiehinkle.com can be assumed to be able to edit anything at https://eddiehinkle.com but this would not be the case for Zegnat where identity url and blog url at different domains.
aaronpk [eddie]: can you add those to https://indieweb.org/scope#Scopes_used_by_IndieWeb_apps
eddiehinkle.com edited /scope (+97) "/* Scopes used by IndieWeb apps */ added indigenous" (view diff)
@lobstersbot Announcing lazymention: elegant outbound Webmention for static sites https://strugee.net/blog/2017/12/announcing-lazymention-elegant-outbound-webmention-for-static-sites https://lobste.rs/s/kip3yk/announcing_lazymention_elegant #release #web #show (twitter.com/_/status/947533353405898754)
gRegorLove This is why I like the #newwwwyear challenge, since it asked you to set your date. I chose 2018-01-07 :)
Loqi Realtime generally refers to a user experience where content is updated live; for example: a new comment shows up on a page while you're viewing it, or chat notification "your friend is typing a message." https://indieweb.org/Realtime
loqi.me created /realtime_comments (+21) "prompted by tantek and redirect added by tantek" (view diff)