#dev 2018-02-07

2018-02-07 UTC
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gRegorLove Because you link to the original post. I'm thinking of my own example and many others who don't link in their POSSE copies.
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aaronpk I don't think Tantek even paginates his front page
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aaronpk How would I crawl Tantek.com to find old posts? One post at a time on the permalinks??
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snarfed nope nope nope
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aaronpk Someone’s gotta do it
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gRegorLove not it.
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gRegorLove :)
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tantek.com edited /Falcon (+439) "/* archives */ consider "day range" archive pages for home page pagination use-case, or fragments on newmonth archive pages to start with" (view diff)
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tantek aaronpk you can crawl bim archives
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tantek 6 per year, 8ish years, only 49 currently
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aaronpk Are they linked anywhere from your home page tho? How would I know they exist?
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tantek URL truncation
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aaronpk That’s not a link 😂
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tantek well, it's certainly not "follow your nose"
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tantek but it's reasonably "well known" ;)
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snarfed works for humans, but not for vouch code
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snarfed the broader question though, could we use silos as a vouch alternative/extension, is definitely worth considering!
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[kevinmarks] does vouch evolve into something like Advogato?
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[kevinmarks] vouch << earlier work on resolving vouch graphs http://www.levien.com/free/tmetric-HOWTO.html
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Loqi ok, I added "earlier work on resolving vouch graphs http://www.levien.com/free/tmetric-HOWTO.html" to the "See Also" section of /Vouch
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schmarty !tell eddie got an error creating a new post through Indigenous. My endpoint returned a 202 status code, which i think is legit, but Indigenous showed a red bar and returned me to the editor with content intact
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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schmarty !tell eddie if i am reading this right, HTTP 202 is legit for a site like mine which is going to go away for a while before the post is done https://www.w3.org/TR/micropub/#response
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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schmarty !tell eddie (the post went through just fine)
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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martymcgui.re uploaded /Special:Log/upload "uploaded "[[File:hwc-baltimore-2018-02-06.jpg]]" https://indieweb.org/File:hwc-baltimore-2018-02-06.jpg"
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mblaney I haven't implemented vouch, but definitely coming around to the idea.
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[eddie] !tell schmarty Good catch! I’ll add 202 to an accepted response code in the if statement
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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Loqi [eddie]: schmarty left you a message 9 minutes ago: got an error creating a new post through Indigenous. My endpoint returned a 202 status code, which i think is legit, but Indigenous showed a red bar and returned me to the editor with content intact
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Loqi [eddie]: schmarty left you a message 9 minutes ago: if i am reading this right, HTTP 202 is legit for a site like mine which is going to go away for a while before the post is done https://www.w3.org/TR/micropub/#response
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Loqi [eddie]: schmarty left you a message 8 minutes ago: (the post went through just fine)
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[eddie] I do need to read through the full standard and look at Indigenous to see where it might not match up
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mblaney !tell snarfed I left you a message in #bridgy the other day about running a dev version, but I think running the tests will be enough for my changes.
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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schmarty 👍
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Loqi schmarty: [eddie] left you a message 36 minutes ago: Good catch! I’ll add 202 to an accepted response code in the if statement
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tantek.com edited /Facebook (+26) "/* How to wean yourself from */ add id since apparently it ws there before per autocomplete" (view diff)
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@switch_company Aujourd'hui en interne on implémente Webmention. Mais pourquoi donc ? 🤔 https://indieweb.org/Webmention (twitter.com/_/status/961161350448910336)
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@Dries Thanks for your comment on my blog post @davewiner. I wanted to let you know that I replied: https://dri.es/comment/134601#comment-134601. We really need #webmention. (twitter.com/_/status/961165562226380806)
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@nitishchpr Thanks for your comment on my blog post davewiner. I wanted to let you know that I replied: https://dri.es/comment/134601#comment-134601. We really need #webmention. (twitter.com/_/status/961166175249031171)
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1500wordmtu.com edited /site-deaths (+134) "Add shutdown for Bumpers and Captioned" (view diff)
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hans.gerwitz.com edited /IRC_People (+3) (view diff)
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@nhoizey @foobartel @smashingmag Both posts are great! But where is the Webmention linking them? 😁 (twitter.com/_/status/961271272167694336)
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@foobartel @nhoizey @smashingmag Thanks! Webmentions only implemented half way so far :( Hopefully coming soon. (twitter.com/_/status/961273870698213377)
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aaronparecki.com edited /p3k_naming_convention (+9) "/* Unused Names */" (view diff)
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www.svenknebel.de edited /Do_Not_Track (+122) "move EFF recommendations up the page, add sentence for context" (view diff)
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www.svenknebel.de edited /User:Www.svenknebel.de (+65) "itch: DNT review" (view diff)
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www.svenknebel.de edited /User:Www.svenknebel.de (+61) "/* short-term itches */" (view diff)
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[kevinmarks] A parse mf2 and return oembed would be doable
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tantek sounds like a good unmung service
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dgold i might have a read of the hugo forums, see if its ever come up
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[kevinmarks] I did make one, but I tried to use the html version and that wasn't supported
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dgold https://libraries.io/github/diplix/mf2-oembed
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[kevinmarks] http://www.unmung.com/oembed?url=kevinmarks.com
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[kevinmarks] I could do a basic one I suppose
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sknebel felix' blog post about his library is interesting, e.g. it seems fully working embeds in wordpress require the oembed to be on the same domain as stuff linked to from it
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snarfed anyone here have experience with the github v4 api's rate limiting?
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Loqi snarfed: mblaney left you a message 15 hours, 48 minutes ago: I left you a message in #bridgy the other day about running a dev version, but I think running the tests will be enough for my changes.
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snarfed evidently the github v4 API's rate limit (5000 "points" per hr) is per app, not per authenticated user, which is unusual, and unfortunate. https://developer.github.com/v4/guides/resource-limitations/#rate-limit
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aaronpk oh noes
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snarfed thinking about github backfeed in bridgy...if i estimate a poll will cost ~22 points, and i poll hourly, that sets a scaling celing of ~227 github accounts. beyond that, i have to start dropping poll frequency. :(
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aaronpk you determined there isn't enough in the web hook api to avoid polling?
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snarfed maybe they expect to talk to individual apps once they get big and raise their limits individually?
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snarfed aaronpk: webhooks get me part of the way, but not everything. https://github.com/snarfed/bridgy/issues/333#issuecomment-358442097
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Loqi [snarfed] particularly interesting: the v3 API has [webhooks for many events we care about for backfeed!](https://developer.github.com/webhooks/) e.g. new issue comments. not for reactions though.
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aaronpk darn
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snarfed (not to mention i'm always reluctant to write new code against an old version of an API)
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aaronpk yeah
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aaronpk I wonder if they plan on adding more web hooks to the new api
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snarfed s/more/any/
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aaronpk heh
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snarfed i also can't tell from the docs if you can register for a webhook programmatically, or if users would need to go into their github settings manually and add it themselves
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www.boffosocko.com created /Refback (+21) "initial redirect to fix some redlinks elsewhere" (view diff)
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snarfed ah, found it. looks like you can programmatically. https://developer.github.com/v3/repos/hooks/#create-a-hook
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snarfed ...except ugh that's per repo
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snarfed no user-wide webhooks
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sknebel at least they have a support forum for the new API: https://platform.github.community/c/graphql-api (but I didn't find anything relevant to your question from a quick search :/)
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tantek let's see if I can RSVP to my own indie events - not sure I've done that before
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tantek yay it worked. uh now there's a random twitter URL in my RSVPs display lol
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tantek whoa since when did wm io start sending back p-syndication?
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aaronpk I think a while?
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tantek maybe that's the first time I've indie RSVP'd to my own indie event, and I'm the first person to indie RSVP to one of my events while POSSEing the RSVP to Twitter?
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www.boffosocko.com edited /Posts_about_the_IndieWeb (+278) "Dries Buytaert (creator of Drupal) on PESOS or POSSE" (view diff)
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tantek fixed
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jjuran http://www.securityweek.com/one-computer-can-knock-almost-any-wordpress-site-offline
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KartikPrabhu ruh roh
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tantek wow. zero day DoS that's pretty bad
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[eddie] Making the jump on my local Monocle to Aperture. :crossed_fingers:
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aaronpk hehe
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aaronpk should be pretty seamless I think. tho I actually installed a new one from scratch when I moved mine.
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[eddie] Yeah, one major benefit is because the name is changing, I’m changing the url too, so as you said, it’s kind of just like creating a second instance and then removing the first
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tantek jjuran note the irony of *securityweek* being on http (not https)
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tantek just saying
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tantek and if you try to load the https version, it's a different site and you get a 404!
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[eddie] aaronpk: comparing my .env to the .env.example in Aperture, I don’t see XRAY_URL anymore. Is that just embedded in Aperture now?
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aaronpk yeah, it was never actually used
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[eddie] ahhh gotcha
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aaronpk I think I put it in the example when I first created the project
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aaronpk wow okay I just made making indieauth clients super easy
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aaronpk pushing up some changes to the indieauth-client-php library in a few minutes!
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[eddie] 👏
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aaronpk https://github.com/indieweb/indieauth-client-php#quick-start
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Loqi [indieweb] indieauth-client-php: Sample implementation and helper methods for an IndieAuth client.
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aaronpk a complete indieauth client in two very short files
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sknebel aaronpk: resolveMeURL() seems to be used nowhere?
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aaronpk oh crap you're right, I thought normalizeMeURL did that
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aaronpk got ahead of myself there
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@keithjgrant @AaronGustafson @nhoizey @foobartel @smashingmag Does your jekyll webmention plugin pull them in at build time, or live on the client? (I’ve got the latter working with Hugo on my site) (twitter.com/_/status/961322865256747009)
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aaronpk fixed
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aaronpk next up i'm gonna make indieauth.rocks into a whole bunch of different identity URLs you can use to test clients
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[eddie] That’s awesome
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aaronpk https://aaronparecki.com/2018/02/07/7/indieauth
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Loqi [Aaron Parecki] IndieAuth-Client-PHP 0.3.1
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[kevinmarks] [dgold] if you're using Hugo you could make a template for the oembed json and link from each post
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sknebel aaronpk: given that oversight that would have been my next question ;)
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aaronpk yeah I basically want to have a whole set of URLs you can use to test all the cases
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aaronpk including making sure you don't let someone's auth server claim to be someone else
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aaronpk looking forward to ripping out *so much code* from all my projects haha
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Loqi rofl
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[eddie] Hmmm something feels fishy with Aperture’s scoping
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[eddie] I got:
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[eddie] “error”: “unauthorized”, “error_description”: “The access token provided does not have the necessary scope for this action”
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[eddie] My token endpoint returns the following when I verify my token:
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[eddie] “me”: “https://eddiehinkle.com/“, “client_id”: “https://aperture.eddiehinkle.com/“, “scope”: “create read”
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Loqi Eddie Hinkle
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[eddie] (I generated it with gimme-a-token
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aaronpk Oh hm I think it's expecting the token endpoint to return an array but now that you mention that it might be wrong
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aaronpk Yeah, my bad
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[eddie] Gotcha 🙂 no worries. Just glad I wasn’t losing my mind
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Zegnat Hmm. I’m thinking about retiring some rel-me links. Because RelMeAuth is a thing, I would really only want to allow that from silos that support 2FA. Anyone else thought about that?
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sknebel Zegnat: I asked ages ago about a way to specify the trust of rel=me's but nobody seemed interested, and I think I saw a similar request recently
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sknebel Zegnat: https://github.com/aaronpk/IndieAuth.com/issues/175
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Loqi [Dan-Q] #175 Allow site owners to mark some rel="me" links as being unsuitable for contacting them
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aaronpk I don't really want to add that to relmeauth implementations, I'd be more interested in adding that kind of thing to myIndieAuth.com so you can really control it better
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aaronpk Another good reason to split these up
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sknebel makes sense
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Zegnat On one end I feel like removing them is counter their use of distributed verification, but as long as RelMeAuth is a thing I also feel a need to point out those I do not trust enough to handle authentication on my behalf.
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aaronpk It's an interesting question for relmeauth
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sknebel guess the question is "do we assume RelMeAuth is actually thing outside indieauth.com, or don't we? :P
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jjuran What about using rel=“auth”, and deprecating rel=“me” for authentication?
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aaronpk Relmeauth is certainly a thing outside of IndieAuth.com
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aaronpk At least in spirit if not in number of implementations
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sknebel then such a request is still relevant even if indieauth.com wants to solve it somewhere else
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aaronpk Yeah I'm more saying it's an issue for the relmeauth spec rather than IndieAuth.com
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Zegnat Oh yes, I do not think this is up to indieauth.com (or any implementation) to solve
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jjuran You could even switch seamlessly: Ignore rel=“me” for auth if any rel-“auth” is present, otherwise use rel=“me”.
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jjuran s/-/=/
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aaronpk want to start brainstorming here? https://indieweb.org/RelMeAuth#Issues
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Zegnat I will add my thoughts there in ~15 minutes aaronpk :)
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Zegnat sknebel if you have any more references for people asking about this do add there
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dgold aaronpk: trying watchtower - i got the files, ran composer install; its failing with: https://pastebin.com/2tZbL8AC
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aaronpk oh yeah yay for no documentation :)
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Loqi woot
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aaronpk copy lib/config.example.php to lib/config.php and fill in the blanks
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aaronpk er, config.template.php
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dgold :)
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dgold documentation! its not just a good idea :) {and yes, I acknowledge with thanks you say this isn't ready}
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aaronpk I will document everything later I promise :)
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dgold what class of db does it want?
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aaronpk I run it on mysql, tho I think it'll handle anything idiorm can use http://idiorm.readthedocs.io/en/latest/
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[eddie] I run it on mysql as well
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dgold last question, I promise - does that mean setting up an entire mysql:localhost as the $dbhost setting
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aaronpk do you not already have a mysql server somewhere?
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dgold as opposed to just $dbhost = '127.0.0.1'
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dgold no, there's a mysql on the server
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aaronpk you can replace the ip address with the hostname of the server
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dgold that's fine, was just wondering if I had to specify mysql in the config.php somehow
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aaronpk oh yeah, that's right, it is sorta hardcoded to mysql
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aaronpk would be relatively easy to change if you need tho
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dgold hardcode is best
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dgold (less things for me to put FUBAR)
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dgold and it works! not terrible excitement to look at, but it does work!
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aaronpk haha
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aaronpk cool
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aaronpk yep it has no UI at all :P
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Loqi nice
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[eddie] aaronpk: The “channels” action requires a “channels” scope. Even if you are just doing a read… is that right, or should I create an issue for that?
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aaronpk oh yeah, listing channels should require read scope not channel scope. channel scope is for managing channels.
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aaronpk plz file issue :)
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[eddie] will do :thumbsup:
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[eddie] I think I might have a fix but it seems like it caches token response data? Any easy way to purge the cache?
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aaronpk hm I should make a command for that
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[eddie] I’ll just generate a new token :thumbsup:
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dgold looking at the source, i'm guessing aperture is a more involved startup? or is it the same - clone, db, config ?
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aaronpk it's pretty similar, but there's a command line thing to make the database for example
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dgold php artisan make:migration ?
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aaronpk php artisan migrate
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dgold #amlearning
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aaronpk need to create the empty DB first so it has a place to put things
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dgold that I can do - managing to surprise myself
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dgold i'm running out of culture ship names though
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Zegnat “culture ship names”?
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sknebel Zegnat: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_spacecraft_in_the_Culture_series
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tantek.com edited /cross-posting (+108) "linky, note original pesetas use-case (one place to follow for all the things), and reword the worst option for a more memorable acronym" (view diff)
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loqi.me created /POOSNOW (+152) "prompted by tantek and dfn added by tantek" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /cross-posting (+86) "add subheads for frag linking" (view diff)
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loqi.me edited /POOSNOW (+42) "tantek added "/cross-posting#POOSNOW" to "See Also"" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /POOSNOW (+3) "fix link" (view diff)
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loqi.me edited /POOSNOW (+30) "tantek added "[[Single Point of Failure]]" to "See Also"" (view diff)
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dgold sknebel / Zegnat exactomundo! all my subdomain sites are culture ship names
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sknebel I had that as a VM naming scheme on my homeserver for a while
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Zegnat All my devices are names after national personifications.
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Zegnat What is naming?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "naming" yet. Would you like to create it? (Or just say "naming is ____", a sentence describing the term)
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Zegnat Hmm
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snarfed POOSNOW 😱
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vanderven.se martijn edited /RelMeAuth (+1129) "/* Issues */ Consolidated identities do not carry inherent trust" (view diff)
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Zegnat That definitely needs a better header ... but I am tired.
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[eddie] !tell aaronpk: Created two PRs on Aperture for the scope string/array and the different channel scopes.
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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tantek naming is hard
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Loqi ok
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loqi.me created /naming (+42) "prompted by Zegnat and dfn added by tantek" (view diff)
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Zegnat Ha
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tantek hey folks, keep a lookout for @Dries showing up as I invited him to stop by and chat here as he implements POSSE in Drupal for his site (and hopefully for Drupal in general) https://dri.es/comment/134641#comment-134641
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tantek also this is a great reply with several insightful gems that are worth taking note of (maybe even FAQing) https://dri.es/comment/134646#comment-134646
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tantek what is reach
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "reach" yet. Would you like to create it? (Or just say "reach is ____", a sentence describing the term)
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tantek really? I thought I defined that
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tantek ah
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tantek what is pay for reach
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Loqi pay for reach is a business practice by Facebook, Twitter, and other social media silos, whereby they charge publishers (ask them to pay) to have their posts be shown to users on their site, even if the users have already opted-in (followed, subscribed) to posts from those publishers https://indieweb.org/pay_for_reach
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tantek what is write
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "write" yet. Would you like to create it? (Or just say "write is ____", a sentence describing the term)
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tantek hmm
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tantek what is why post
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "why post" yet. Would you like to create it? (Or just say "why post is ____", a sentence describing the term)
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vanderven.se martijn edited /RelMeAuth (+651) "/* Consolidated identities do not carry inherent trust */ Add Dan Q and jjuran’s proposed solutions" (view diff)
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tantek why post is /post#Thoughts_on_why_post
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Loqi ok
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loqi.me created /why_post (+38) "prompted by tantek and redirect added by tantek" (view diff)
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tantek why << why post
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Loqi ok, I added "[[post]]" to the "See Also" section of /why
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tantek no
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tantek ^^^ aaronpk, redirect loss of frag bug
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tantek.com edited /why (+4) "/* See Also */ why post" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /post (+404) "/* Brainstorming */ add Dries quote on why post" (view diff)
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tantek what is reach?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "reach" yet. Would you like to create it? (Or just say "reach is ____", a sentence describing the term)
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tantek reach is usually used to refer to the number or extent of people that see or are at least shown a specific post (of yours) in whatever aggregator or [[reader]] app, site, or home (news) feed feature of a silo that they use to view posts. Many [[silos]] use algorithms (like [[The Facebook Algorithm]]) to limit which posts are shown, as one method to pressure publishers to [[pay for reach]].
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Loqi ok
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loqi.me created /reach (+419) "prompted by tantek and dfn added by tantek" (view diff)
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tantek what is The Facebook Algorithm
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "The Facebook Algorithm" yet. Would you like to create it? (Or just say "The Facebook Algorithm is ____", a sentence describing the term)
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tantek wat
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tantek what is The Master Algorithm
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "The Master Algorithm" yet. Would you like to create it? (Or just say "The Master Algorithm is ____", a sentence describing the term)
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tantek what is Master Algorithm
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Loqi Facebook Master Algorithm is the name given to Facebook's algorithm for determining what content to show in Facebook's reader (AKA News Feed shown on their logged-in homepage), also adopted and tweaked by Instagram for their reader (app home screen) https://indieweb.org/Master_Algorithm
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tantek The Facebook Algorithm is /Master_Algorithm
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tantek what is Facebook Algorithm
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Loqi Facebook Master Algorithm is the name given to Facebook's algorithm for determining what content to show in Facebook's reader (AKA News Feed shown on their logged-in homepage), also adopted and tweaked by Instagram for their reader (app home screen) https://indieweb.org/Facebook_Algorithm
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tantek.com created /The_Facebook_Algorithm (+39) "r" (view diff)
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tantek.com created /The_Master_Algorithm (+39) "r" (view diff)
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loqi.me edited /pay_for_reach (+12) "tantek added "[[reach]]" to "See Also"" (view diff)
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loqi.me created /💩🌨️ (+20) "prompted by jjuran and redirect added by jjuran" (view diff)
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