#dev 2018-03-26

2018-03-26 UTC
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gregorlove.com created /LibrePlanet (+130) "stub" (view diff)
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gregorlove.com created /Libre_Planet (+25) "prompted by chrisaldrich" (view diff)
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gregorlove.com edited /Planning (+5) "/* MIT */ link LibrePlanet, dates" (view diff)
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AngeloGladding snarfed tantek using HEAD and an async job queue good enough for now -- can understand why brid.gy breaks spec -- will be sure to document my future webmention caching endeavors
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AngeloGladding thanks guys
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AngeloGladding and snarfed++ thanks for the granary port -- looking forward to reuse
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AngeloGladding and tantek, from way back, webactions++ really tie things together nicely
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AngeloGladding snarfed++
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Loqi snarfed has 53 karma in this channel (372 overall)
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AngeloGladding webactions++
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Loqi webactions has 1 karma
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AngeloGladding :)
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tbbrown as a learning experiment, got indieauth login via goodreads working: https://github.com/herestomwiththeweather/IndieAuth.com/commit/5c023e804d46d654b6b4751770d28ce12d73f5ae
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tbbrown (test server is https://indieauth-demo.herokuapp.com but only supports github and goodreads)
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Loqi IndieAuth.com
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[cleverdevil] Fiddling around on a new page: https://cleverdevil.io/overview
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[cleverdevil] I *may* make some variant of this my front page.
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Loqi Recipe: Keto-Friendly Instant Pot Thai Chicken Curry
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[cleverdevil] But, I can't decide yet 🙂
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[cleverdevil] (Lots of work to do to clean up the markup, which is horribly incorrect from a microformats perspective)
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[kevinmarks] https://files.slack.com/files-pri/T03QR2B2T-F9W1ATCKF/screenshot_20180326-070031.png?pub_secret=b1457f3360&name=Screenshot_20180326-070031.png Also layout is off on android
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[cleverdevil] Oh it’s totally boned on mobile at the moment.
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[cleverdevil] In no way responsive 😀
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[gerwitz] @sknebel sorry for late reply: in my case I have a Micropub endpoint that is write-only, so valid-to-spec requests to update or delete must throw errors. Of course, I don’t want to imply the request is malformed.
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[gerwitz] …so 400 is the obvious response code, but I’m not suer whether “invalid_request” is appropriate
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cweiske isn't there some "unsupported http method" status code?
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cweiske no, only "unsupported media type" (415)
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cweiske 501
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cweiske "not implemented"
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cweiske The server does not support the functionality required to fulfill the
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cweiske request. This is the appropriate response when the server does not
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cweiske recognize the request method and is not capable of supporting it for
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cweiske any resource.
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cweiske that's the correct one IMO
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[gerwitz] 🤔 I also felt like 5xx was appropriate, but I do “understand” the request method and it seems contrary to the spirit of Micropub to send a parsable error outside 4xx.
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[gerwitz] i.e. it’s a Micropub error, not an HTTP error.
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cweiske that error is not limited to the request method.
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cweiske it's correct for all types of does-not-support-functionality
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[gerwitz] I’m inclined to agree and since you’ve implemented clients I feel emboldened to use 501. 🙂
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Zegnat 501 sounds good to me too, but you might have to invent your own response code. Maybe file an issue against the spec, [gerwitz]? Including whatever you end up using.
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cweiske.de edited /GitHub (+483) "using github for comments" (view diff)
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vanderven.se martijn edited /birthday (+198) "Add myself as example." (view diff)
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Zegnat kaushalmodi, you can look at the form that dgold is using here: https://github.com/dg01d/reproach/blob/master/layouts/partials/mention.html
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Zegnat As you can see, it submits a source and a target URL to the webmention endpoint. This CMS (Hugo) prefills the target field, and the source filled is then filled by the website visitor.
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Zegnat You can use exactly that same HTML form, you just have to have a way for your CMS to fill the target URL. And you have to point the form action at your receiving endpoint (https://webmention.io/scripter.co/webmention).
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Zegnat kaushalmodi, you can look at the form that dgold is using here: https://github.com/dg01d/reproach/blob/master/layouts/partials/mention.html
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Zegnat As you can see, it submits a source and a target URL to the webmention endpoint. This CMS (Hugo) prefills the target field, and the source filled is then filled by the website visitor.
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Zegnat You can use exactly that same HTML form, you just have to have a way for your CMS to fill the target URL. And you have to point the form action at your receiving endpoint (https://webmention.io/scripter.co/webmention).
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kaushalmodi_ Hello, correct, I already looked at that
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Zegnat Webmention endpoints actually accept webmentions in “form encoded” format. So any web browser can submit a form to it, no need to have special sending logic.
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kaushalmodi_ But that uses a heroku app as I mentioned in the other channel
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kaushalmodi_ and I cannot join it
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Zegnat dgold uses the heroku app as his receiver, you use webmention.io, they are interchangable
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kaushalmodi_ ah, so I just replace https://webmention.herokuapp.com with https://webmention.io?
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Loqi A WebMention Endpoint
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Zegnat You should use action="https://webmention.io/scripter.co/webmention"
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Zegnat The same endpoint URL you are using in the <head> of your site already :)
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Loqi it is probable
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kaushalmodi_ Thanks very much! I'll try that out
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j4y_funabashi morning all
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kaushalmodi_ Zegnat, done! :) https://gitlab.com/kaushalmodi/hugo-theme-refined/blob/master/layouts/partials/webmention_send.html
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kaushalmodi_ thanks for your help
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j4y_funabashi almost got my micropub server moved over to lambda \o/
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dgold hey kaushal - my hugo theme is _very_ much written for _me_, I put it out there so that others could derive inspiration
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Zegnat The inspiration worked out ;)
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kaushalmodi_ Zegnat, yep. dgold: Your theme helped me; I have credited you for that send webmention button.
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dgold muy excelente!
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kaushalmodi_ "Send Webmention" button deployed! Thanks all :)
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Zegnat Awesome!
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Zegnat kaushalmodi++
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Loqi kaushalmodi has 1 karma
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[eddie] j4y_funabashi: wow! I’ve been thinking about a Micropub Lambda. How cool!
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petermolnar so... if I grab a few million URLs and send each of them as source, in a loop, through the heroku page, who's webmention endpoint would survive it?
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sknebel through which heroku page?
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petermolnar nyah, misread it, doesn't matter, random digitalocean node with cURL would be just as good
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Zegnat My current endpoint should survive it, but it is going to take some disk space.
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petermolnar I'd probably be fine with accepting, but wouldn't be able to build my site for a while, it would take very long to chew through the queue
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sknebel does your site build depend on the queue being finished?
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petermolnar the process can be reversed though, to ask as many webmention endpoints as possible to scrape a specific site
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petermolnar sknebel: I process the queue on build, if there's anything in there
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sknebel yep, the reverse is known as wordpress-pingback-attack
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petermolnar yes
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petermolnar was that ever solved in WP?
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Zegnat Probably not. Not sure how you would ever solve that.
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petermolnar https://indieweb.org/2016/Brighton/webmention - I've talked about these and more with aaronpk a long while ago
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petermolnar one of the ideas was to disallow 3rd party and require 'source' to send webmention for 'source'
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petermolnar well... essentially sPF
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petermolnar SPF
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petermolnar unfortunately nothing has been put to practice so far
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Zegnat I guess that could work. It does stop all those nice URL forms people are putting beneith their comments from working.
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petermolnar you could whitelist the form on your own site
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Zegnat That does up the difficulty level of getting into webmentions from adding a few lines of HTML to keeping DNS up to date
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petermolnar we could leave out dns, in theory: add another meta, say, webmention-spf, into the header, on first fetch, cache it for a while; this only protects from one type of the attacks though
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Zegnat And still requires you visit the website at least once to retrieve meta. But might work.
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petermolnar at least it would stay within HTTP, so no obscure, arcane, distasteful DNS knowledge required ;)
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[kevinmarks] Mention-tech will check the validity itself before sending ding them in, but that will potentially fetch the page.
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[kevinmarks] So if you post to mentiontech.com it will post through to the actual endpoint, and cache it in case there isn't one.
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j4y_funabashi huzzah! my lambda based micropub endpoint passes all the micropub.rocks test I care about
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j4y_funabashi now to move my micropub client across
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Zegnat What is lambda?
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Loqi Lambda is a service from Amazon Web Services that runs individual functions of code rather than running a server https://indieweb.org/Lambda
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Zegnat What is mentiontech?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "mentiontech" yet. Would you like to create it? (Or just say "mentiontech is ____", a sentence describing the term)
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Zegnat What is mentiontech.com?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "mentiontech.com" yet. Would you like to create it? (Or just say "mentiontech.com is ____", a sentence describing the term)
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[kevinmarks] I thought we had a page
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[kevinmarks] Oh it's mention.tech derp
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[kevinmarks] Though I should redirect mentiontech.com
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[kevinmarks] And apparently I should filter it for bogus sale calls instead of urls
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j4y_funabashi some weird sql injection attempts going on there http://mention-tech.appspot.com/
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[kevinmarks] Good luck with sql injection on an app engine data store site
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loqi.me created /endpoint (+113) "prompted by [kim_landwehr] and dfn added by Zegnat" (view diff)
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vanderven.se martijn edited /endpoint (+391) "Examples of endpoints: Webmention, 2× IndieAuth, and Micropub" (view diff)
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[eddie] j4y_funabashi: How are you storing your data? s3? amazon database? somehow pushing the data to a server file system?
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[cleverdevil] I'm also curious to hear about it. You should write it up somewhere, j4y_funabashi 🙂
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[eddie] Yes, definitely. Like a blog or something 😉
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j4y_funabashi [eddie] [cleverdevil] I store everything as json files in s3 + dynamoDB
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j4y_funabashi I will do a little write up when it is a bit more polished
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[eddie] :thumbsup: Looking forward to it
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j4y_funabashi the files on s3 are for easy backup, reprocessing etc. dynamoDB is the 'db cache' which powers the views
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j4y_funabashi what is serverless
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "serverless" yet. Would you like to create it? (Or just say "serverless is ____", a sentence describing the term)
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[eddie] That is the combination I was recently thinking about!
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[eddie] Awesome, it’s great to see someone already work on implementing that and that it’s not just an idea in my head
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j4y_funabashi I have had the same setup in one form or another across the many iterations of my site (json files + DB cache)
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[eddie] Currently my files are all YAML, but that means lots of conversion to and from JSON/YAML and I find I have more issues manually editing the yaml because of the white space requirements. I always mess up my whitespace, where as with JSON it’s much more rare to have issues and with a JSON linter it’s almost never happens. So I’m thinking when I transition from a static site to a dynamic site, I might convert all my YAML to JSON
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j4y_funabashi j4y.co uses sqlite
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[eddie] so are you converting j4y.co to dynamoDB or is dynamoDB powering a secondary site?
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j4y_funabashi oof yeah manually editing json or yaml doesnt sound like fun
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[eddie] Yeah, it’s not. But I find JSON is more enjoyable when it HAS to happen
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j4y_funabashi yeah true
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[kevinmarks] as long as you have an editor that is verifying structure
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j4y_funabashi I am converting the code behind j4y.co to lambda/dynamo and also switching domains
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[eddie] kevinmarks: Even without structure verification, I at least, am finding I am better trained to catch missing ,s and {s than missing whitespae
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j4y_funabashi The files I store in s3 are microformats json, then when I insert to dynamo I convert it to 'jf2'
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[eddie] Just yesterday I edited a YAML file and tried to rebuild my site only to find it broke because of a whitespace problem
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[eddie] ohhhh, that makes a lot of sense j4y_funabashi. I definitely was thinking mf2 json, but since it’s a one way data flow from s3 -> dynamo, that does seem like a convenient conversion.
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[eddie] What language do you write your lambdas in?
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Zegnat j4y_funabashi, YAML gets not-fun very fast in my experience
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j4y_funabashi golang
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[eddie] ohhhh goland
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[eddie] lol
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[eddie] Zegnat: Exactly
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[eddie] oops golang*
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j4y_funabashi https://github.com/j4y-funabashi/inari <- thats the non lambda version
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Loqi [j4y-funabashi] inari: Micropub server
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j4y_funabashi https://github.com/j4y-funabashi/inari-sls <- lambda version
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Loqi [j4y-funabashi] inari-sls
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j4y_funabashi aaronpk's lovely sunset https://jay.teamfunabashi.com/p/805330aa-db9b-47b3-9d56-e671f27acacc
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Loqi [Jay Funabashi] Micropub test of creating a photo referenced by URL https://micropub.rocks/media/sunset.jpg
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j4y_funabashi [eddie]: Yeah I am liking storing jf2 in the DBcache as it makes all the view code alot simpler
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[eddie] Cool, I’ll take a look around the repos. Are your website views going to be serverless or are you just going to have a server running the view side of things?
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[eddie] That’s my last question 😄
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[eddie] haha
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Loqi hehe
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[kevinmarks] flashback to when I used XOXO as the bus format at technorati so it was all previewable in a browser.
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j4y_funabashi XOXO?
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j4y_funabashi [eddie]: yeah the views are serverless too (the sunset link I posted above ^^^)
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Zegnat XOXO are outlines in HTML
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[kevinmarks] pretty much json except <ol><li> for [] and <dl><dt><dd> for {} http://microformats.org/wiki/xoxo
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[eddie] ohhh cool. I was thinking about that, but that seemed more complex than the endpoints being serverless
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[kevinmarks] and a bit of extra magic to turn url into clickable links
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Loqi XOXO 1.0: Extensible Open XHTML Outlines
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j4y_funabashi [eddie]: I do want to enhance with some form of js eventually but it isnt v high up on my list :)
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[eddie] But I did save an article by one person that used Amazon’s API Gateway to call Lambdas to serve HTML pages back
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[eddie] Is that what you are doing? or using a different Amazon service?
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[eddie] ahh yep, I see that in your code now
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[kevinmarks] with html5 syntax the tags are self-closing
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j4y_funabashi yeah thats what I am doing - using the serverless framework makes it easy as it provisions all the infra for you
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[eddie] That’s awesome. I’m definitely going to have to look more into this when I get a chance 😄
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[eddie] Thanks for talking through what you’re doing
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j4y_funabashi awesome! lmk if you need a hand with anything, however I am by no means an expert :)
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[eddie] You’re more of an expert than me!
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[eddie] 😆 Thanks!
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j4y_funabashi puts that on his cv :D
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aaronparecki.com edited /timeline (+431) "/* Microsub */ fill in some dates" (view diff)
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aaronparecki.com edited /timeline (+0) "/* Microsub */ found older draft on my laptop, unsure of start date but this was the oldest date i found" (view diff)
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[cleverdevil] Yes very cool work j4y_funabashi!
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[cleverdevil] Using a framework to set up all the API Gateway stuff is pretty much mandatory. Otherwise it’s sort of painful :P
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aaronparecki.com edited /Posts_about_the_IndieWeb (+190) "/* 2018 */" (view diff)
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kaushalmod About u-photo: I was trying to make sure that I was putting in all the right microformats2 classes by validating my page on indiewebify.me
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kaushalmod But the validation says that u-photo is missing: https://indiewebify.me/validate-h-entry/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fscripter.co%2Fhugo-leaf-and-branch-bundles%2F
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kaushalmod Though I do have an h-card with u-photo on each page
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tantek is your h-card outside the h-entry?
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kaushalmod yes
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kaushalmod it shouldn't be?
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tantek that's probably it. your h-entry needs a author with the h-card on it
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kaushalmod I have h-card on all my site pages in the footer (even non-post pages). So it is always sitting outside h-entry
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sebsel There are ways to reference an outside h-card.
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aaronpk in that case you can do what I do with my h-card which is also outside my h-entry
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sebsel what is authorship?
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Loqi authorship is how to determine who the author(s) of a post are https://indieweb.org/authorship
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kaja.sknebel.net edited /User:Kaja.sknebel.net/upcoming-hwcs (+304) "update from /Events" (view diff)
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kaushalmod @aaronpk so just duplicate the h-card?
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sebsel Although that give be a bit too many options
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kaushalmod one always in footer and another in h-entry too?
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aaronpk no, you add a hidden element with the same URL as your h-card URL
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kaushalmod hmm. so I don't have an h-card URL..
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kaushalmod it's a segment of HTML code inserted using templating on all pages
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aaronpk right but there is a URL property that is your home page
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tantek there shouldn't be any need to add any hidden elements or duplicates
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aaronpk orly
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aaronpk how do I connect my h-entrys on a page to the h-card at the footer of the page without any visible markup then?
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tantek kaushalmod: it's ok to have your h-card outside like that, e.g. in your footer. but it should link to your home page
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tantek aaronpk: I believe that's why we have rel=author in /authorship
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aaronpk that doesn't work for feed pages tho
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tantek oh?
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aaronpk https://indieweb.org/authorship#How_to_determine step 6 is the only reference to rel=author and that is only for permalinks
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kaushalmod @tantek Yes, I already have it that way i.e. h-card in footer with my site url
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kaushalmod ```
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kaushalmod nevermind.. can you do code blocks here? :)
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kaushalmod <div class="h-card"> <img class="u-photo" alt="Photo of Kaushal Modi" src="http://localhost:1313/images/me.png"/> <a class="p-name u-url" href="http://localhost:1313/">Kaushal Modi</a> <p> <a class="u-email" href="mailto:kaushal.modi@gmail.com" rel="me">kaushal.modi@gmail.com</a> </p> <p class="p-note">
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kaushalmod a geek who likes playing with command-line tools. Uses Emacs. </p> </div> </footer>
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tantek looks like a good h-card!
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kaushalmod so that's in the footer (ignore the "localhost" as u-url.. it shows the correct scripter.co url in th edeployed site
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aaronpk kaushalmod: so for permalinks, adding rel="author" to that <a class="p-name u-url" will solve it
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kaushalmod cool! But I didn't get what should go in the h-entry
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tantek aaronpk I believe your question is orthogonal, that is, what is (or should be) the scope of /authorship
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aaronpk for feed pages, I include <a href="/" class="u-author"></a> inside my h-entry so that the authorship algorithm step 7.4 catches it
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kaushalmod at the moment I have just " <p rel="author" class="p-author h-card">Kaushal Modi</p>" as my h-card identifying thing in h-entry
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tantek I'm wondering if it would be helpful to have that in general <a href="/" class="u-author"></a> in permalink h-entry s also
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aaronpk if you don't mind having your name visible, then you can change that to <a class="u-author h-card" href="/">Kaushal Modi</a>
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tantek kaushalmod: the <p> tag does not have a rel attribute
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tantek ^^^ yes that would be better
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tantek aaronpk in general I'd like to pursue / advocate solutions that don't depend on rel
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aaronpk agreed
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tantek there's a bunch of long term anecdata that mixing class and rel microformats (even on a page level) tends to confuse authors
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aaronpk i think i use the same empty <a> tag on my permalinks too
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tantek I put rel=author in /authorship for backcompat, not for modern use-cases
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tantek I should note that
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aaronpk oh
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aaronpk i never knew that
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Loqi definitely
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Zegnat I use a u-author on the feed itself for my feed page, a visible one.
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Zegnat But it is also rel="author". Not sure why I choose to use both.
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kaushalmod So with rel="author" added to the u-url in my h-card, I need to add just "<a href="/" class="u-author h-card">Kaushal Modi</a>" in my h-entries. Correct?
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sebsel Zegnat a rel="author" on the feed or on the entries?
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Zegnat On the A element that is the u-author for the feed, sebsel
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tantek Zegnat in the past Google used to advocate for folks to use rel=author. Then they stopped advocating. And there is some anecdotal evidence that they may (sometimes?) ignore rel=author as well
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tantek so that may be why you chose to have both
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Zegnat I doubt any of my markup was written to please Google :P
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Zegnat Although Google might be one of the few automated systems actually reading my site
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tantek right, there's no need to - they can read your mf2
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aaronpk kaushalmod: the rel="author" isn't needed at all actually, you just need the matching `u-url` on both your footer h-card as well as inside the h-entry
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kaushalmod aaronpk: ok
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Zegnat goes to see if the internet archive can access his blog
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kaushalmod so you mean u-url in h-card must match with the u-author in h-entry
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aaronpk yeah
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kaushalmod alright, working on it. Thanks
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sebsel is trying to set up a reader using aaronpk's awesome work, as to create an automated system to actually read Zegnat's site
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aaronpk you can use https://xray.p3k.io/ and https://sturdy-backbone.glitch.me/ to test it too
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Zegnat sebsel, if you use aaronpk’s hosted aperture you are not going to be able to read my blog. Just a heads up.
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sebsel :(
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Zegnat If you are selfhosting, well, YMMV
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sebsel looks for the issue with the description of the edge-cases
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Zegnat The Wayback Machine can’t access my blog either.
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aaronpk btw who's going to implement the next microsub server? that will be the tipping point to 2+ clients and servers! https://indieweb.org/timeline#Microsub
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sebsel aaronpk I wanted to focus on my own frontend for now first, to get to know the thing better.
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sebsel Especially now you've made it so easy :) (they say)
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Zegnat Oh, sebsel, there isn’t an “issue with the description of the” edge-case, if you refer to why Aperture isn’t getting my blog. It isn’t strictly an issue with Aperture at all.
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sebsel Is it XRay?
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aaronpk now i've forgotten the issue again
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Zegnat *cough*curl*cough*
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aaronpk something about http versions?
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Zegnat Yeah
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kaushalmod aaronpk: sorry to intrude again.. but indiewebify.me validator doesn't yet seem to link the h-card from h-entry
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kaushalmod https://indiewebify.me/validate-h-entry/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fscripter.co%2Fhugo-leaf-and-branch-bundles%2F
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aaronpk 👍 https://sturdy-backbone.glitch.me/test?url=https%3A%2F%2Fscripter.co%2Fhugo-leaf-and-branch-bundles%2F
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aaronpk 👍 https://xray.p3k.io/parse?pretty=true&url=https%3A%2F%2Fscripter.co%2Fhugo-leaf-and-branch-bundles%2F
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aaronpk i think this is another case of indiewebify.me not being up to date
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Zegnat There is an h-card nested on the h-entry, so it stops discovery there. That embedded h-card does not have a photo.
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kaushalmod in that second link, photo is null
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tantek how is indiewebify updated? manual? or automatic on tagged release?
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Zegnat If you want it to use the h-card from your footer, you can’t have an h-card inside the h-entry
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kaushalmod ah, so I need to remove h-card from that u-author link?
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Zegnat Yes
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tantek wait why
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tantek also this seems like a good opportunity to use a fragment link
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Zegnat If you want to use the more complete h-card with photo from the footer, you can’t have an h-card inside the h-entry.
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kaushalmod ok, right now I have <a href=https://scripter.co/ class="u-author h-card">Kaushal Modi</a>
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Loqi Kaushal Modi
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aaronpk oh right change the one inside the h-entry to just <a href="u-author"></a>
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aaronpk oh right change the one inside the h-entry to just <a href="u-author" href="/"></a>
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tantek like <a href="#footer-h-card" class="u-author">...</a>
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aaronpk take out h-card
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kaushalmod will do
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aaronpk forgot about that, thx Zegnat :)
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tantek would that work? then no need to retrieve another page
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tantek aaronpk ^^^ WDYT of that markup
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aaronpk it doesn't require fetching another page even with href="/"
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aaronpk as long as the full h-card is in the footer with the same href
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Zegnat It already doesn’t need to retrieve, tantek. If there is an h-card where the u-url matches the u-author on the same page, it takes that
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tantek ah with the same u-url?
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aaronpk yeah
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tantek ok I forgot about that step
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tantek that's even better (more robust)
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Zegnat Hmm, is sturdy-backbone right? It seems to say it only checks the current page *after* retrieving the external page? (step 7.4)
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kaushalmod thanks Zegnat
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Zegnat Happy to help kaushalmod!
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kaushalmod aaronpk: Now the xray validation looks good!
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aaronpk \o/
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kaushalmod Though indiewebify.me complains You’re marking up your post’s author as a string — add h-card to make it a full h-card!
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Zegnat Parts of the authorship algo may be newer than indiewebify
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tantek perhaps indiewebify.me needs updating to do more of /authorship?
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tantek worth filing an issue on indiewebify.me for that
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aaronpk yes i believe so
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kaushalmod yes will do
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tantek meanwhile I'll go add some informational notes to /authorship
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tantek a-ha I see we actually have rel=author in the how to publish, I'll fix that
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kaushalmod https://github.com/indieweb/indiewebify-me/issues/72
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Loqi [kaushalmodi] #72 Author linking fails between h-entry/u-author and external h-card/u-url
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tantek kaushalmod++ thanks!
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Loqi kaushalmod has 1 karma
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tantek aaronpk /authorship already describes how to for both posts and streams of posts, thus apparently we decided on permalink + streams (home page or separate feeds)
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tantek.com edited /authorship (+423) "update how to publish to not recommend rel=author explicitly, since it was intended for backcompat, and mixed class/rel suggestions are known to be more confusing than just class, note rel-author link detection for backcompat" (view diff)
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tantek aaronpk, Zegnat review ^^^ ?
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aaronpk what's the use case for recommending p-author at all?
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aaronpk vs u-author
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tantek also just re-seeing https://indieweb.org/authorship#Does_not_implement_standards (which clearly I responded to before) but seriously does anyone here even *know* anyone using or especially *depending on* "meta author" ?
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tantek aaronpk: p-author when there is no separate h-card page
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Zegnat That edit looks fine to me, tantek
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Zegnat I just noticed how many issues there are filed on the indiewebify.me repo :(
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tantek probably could use some triage?
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tantek especially if we figure out a way to semi-automate deployments!
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aaronpk i don't think deployments are the bottleneck
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tantek is top of tree currently deployed?
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tantek (empirical test for that question)
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aaronpk it's missing the latest commit
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aaronpk so it is not automatically deployed, but there has been only one change since june 2017
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tantek who wants extra stack overflow points? provide an updated answer to this question with h-card (currently has an hCard example, that could be drastically simplified with mf2) https://stackoverflow.com/questions/5125856/should-i-use-meta-name-author-content-your-name-or-link-rel-author-hr
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tantek oh interesting I also don't see the OpenID sign-in option anymore
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aaronpk womp womp https://aaronparecki.com/2018/03/07/7/stackoverflow
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Loqi [Aaron Parecki] End of an era. StackOverflow is dropping support for OpenID. https://meta.stackexchange.com/questions/307647/support-for-openid-ends-on-july-1-2018
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tantek today is before july 1 tho
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aaronpk oh for sign-in openid is behind the "more login options" link
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tantek oh its hidden in more options
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tantek notes they handled "tantek.com" :)
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aaronpk nice
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tantek " You are about to create a new account on Stack Overflow using a login from " LOL hmm
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tantek so this account would die in 3 months then?
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Zegnat I am guessing they will prompt all OpenID users to get a username and password setup at some point
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aaronpk "April: We will email all users that rely on deprecated OpenID credentials and request that they add a new provider to their account"
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tantek didn't enter an email
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Zegnat I used to use OpenID via indieauth.com on SO, but at some point that stopped working for me and I haven’t used OpenID since.
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tantek wonders what will happen
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aaronpk it didn't make you?
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tantek nope
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aaronpk wow
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tantek just a display name so I chose "t" :P
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kaushalmod I'm now onto representative h-card validation.. Is it a normal practise to set rel=me for the site URL (homepage) too?
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kaushalmod in addition to the usual twitter, github, email, etc. link tags
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Zegnat Hm, I haven’t set rel="me" from my homepage to my homepage
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KartikPrabhu I don't see the use in setting a rel=me from a page to itself
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kaushalmod no.. from the page to the site baseurl
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kaushalmod .. because: https://indiewebify.me/validate-h-card/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fscripter.co%2Fhugo-leaf-and-branch-bundles%2F
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kaushalmod Add a u-url property which matches a rel=me link on the same page so this h-card can be identified as the h-card which represents the page.
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Zegnat No, you wouldn’t have representative h-cards on posts.
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kaushalmod Ah, I thought the "representation" meant that I truly was the author of that post
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Zegnat That’s what the author markup takes care of.
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kaushalmod hmm, ok. Sorry for the noise, learning a lot of new lingo
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kaushalmod Zegnat++
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Loqi zegnat has 51 karma in this channel (189 overall)
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Zegnat The word representative means that the current URL refers to the h-card. On post pages, the current URL usually refers to the post itself.
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kaushalmod I see
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kaushalmod Also I missed "homepage" in "Check your homepage h-card:" on that validation page
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kaushalmod the h-card validates as being representative on the homepage alright
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Zegnat The question behind the representative h-card: “Given a URL to a page that represents a person, how do you determine which hCard on that page is the hCard for that person?” - http://microformats.org/wiki/representative-hcard
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Loqi representative hCard
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Zegnat What is a representative h-card?
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Loqi The representative h-card for a page is an h-card on that page that represents that page, if any, as not all pages are about a person or organization, a page might not have a representative h-card https://indieweb.org/representative_h-card
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tantek alright I'll give it 24h but I'm already testing the waters with seeing about deprecating meta name=author from HTML, just asked if anyone knows any browser support in the #whatwg channel
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loqi.me edited /404 (+188) "tantek added "<nowiki>http://webmarketingnow.com/tips/meta-tags-meta-author.html</nowiki> via "source" linked from https://stackoverflow.com/questions/942575/how-to-search-google-for-meta-name-author" to "See Also"" (view diff)
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tantek ^^^ feel free to add pages you want to point out for the 4/04 party/wake
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www.boffosocko.com edited /silo-quits (+605) "Leo Laporte Facebook quit on 3/18" (view diff)
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tantek wow
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tantek.com edited /mobile_posting (+66) "including reply and share in dfn since that's a key scenario the page covers" (view diff)
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loqi.me created /sharing_on_mobile (+27) "prompted by tantek and redirect added by tantek" (view diff)
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loqi.me created /mobile_sharing (+65) "prompted by tantek and dfn added by tantek" (view diff)
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loqi.me created /mobile_replying (+27) "prompted by tantek and redirect added by tantek" (view diff)
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sebsel ? it seems like my homebrew token endpoint both grants and verifies tokens with a POST on /token
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sebsel But according to https://indieweb.org/token-endpoint it should be a GET for the verification
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sebsel has this changed? how did this ever work for me before?
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sknebel sebsel: if I'm not mixing up things, only your micropub endpoint is using the verification, so as long as you did the same there or are using a shared database you wouldn't notice
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sebsel Ah you're right. That must be it. And then I just missed this when I build it.
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sebsel beh, I don't think I ever implemented it. I should probably go back to rebuilding my site before going on this reader-adventure :(
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sknebel Heh, I know the feeling
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tantek.com edited /Posting_From_Mobile_Devices (-13) "r--" (view diff)
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www.boffosocko.com created /use_case (+2624) "stub page with links to extant broad use cases" (view diff)
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tantek in reading http://kimberlyhirsh.com/dear-indieweb/ has anyone else had this problem/challenge? "Posting notes to Facebook and Twitter without weird link previews or my Gravatar popping up"
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Loqi [Kimberly Hirsh] Dear IndieWeb, it may be time to start considering the user, not just the technical spec. by Eli Mellen (eli.li) I’ve been working on a series of walkthrough posts that outline how to IndieWebify a Wordpress site. I presumed the initial setup would...
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tantek I feel like there's an opportunity here to document a /link-preview#How_to that specifically says how to *not* have a link-preview
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gRegorLove That sounds like messed up mf1 in WordPress templates.
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tantek possibly. gRegorLove did you see https://github.com/microformats/h-entry/issues/7 ?
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Loqi [tantek] #7 Can we improve h-entry backcompat to handle common WordPress hentry streams?
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@ChrisAldrich Thinking about going #IndieWeb, but haven't made a platform choice? @GrabaPerch is an interesting choice with Webmention support and more. Also currently on sale! #DeleteFacebook https://twitter.com/grabaperch/status/978314153705295877 (twitter.com/_/status/978397591355437062)
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gRegorLove Or maybe not. Could be OGP finding their gravatar as the only image on a post and showing that in the preview. That would make more sense. I mis-read the comment at first.
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gRegorLove I have run into this: the image I specified for OGP quite a while ago is smaller than FB's "required" resolution, so link preview finds other larger images on my links and defaults to them instead.
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gRegorLove And that's explicitly using their ogp tag, so that's frustrating.
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gRegorLove The UI does give the option to select other images, so I can click an arrow until it shows my icon instead of the larger photo.
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tantek but that requires manual 'fixing' of POSSEd posts to FB
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gRegorLove Yep
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gRegorLove I've been mostly manually POSSE to FB. I haven't tried in a while, but when I was using Bridgy Publish I wasn't always getting backfeed if the post showed a link-preview underneath.
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gRegorLove So I paste in my link and remove the link-preview.
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gRegorLove And sometimes, like with that Ars Technica piece, I actually post the entire note text to FB instead of a title+link, so manual is easiest for me currently.
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tantek I'm rethinking all my FB POSSEing in light of all the privacy/CA betrayals
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tantek and frankly even locking down things like wall posting
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kaushalmodi tantek: Continuing from the indieweb channel: (1) Export Disqus XML.. there's only one way: https://help.disqus.com/customer/portal/articles/472149-comments-export
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kaushalmodi (2) this was a one time thing.. so I just googled to see if there's an easy way to convert xml to json and found this: http://www.utilities-online.info/xmltojson/
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kaushalmodi (3) Once I have JSON, Hugo has amazing Data reading methods: https://gohugo.io/templates/data-templates/
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tantek ok that's still a lot of work and still amazing
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tantek what is disqus
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Loqi Disqus is a comments hosting silo https://indieweb.org/Disqus
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kaushalmodi I save that JSON to <site repo>/data/disqus_comments.json and then just loop through it, and output the comments where the page RelPermalink matches that in the db
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kaushalmodi It took about 45 mins to get this: https://gitlab.com/kaushalmodi/hugo-theme-refined/blob/master/layouts/partials/disqus-json.html, but still a lot less time than I expected :)
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tantek cool https://indieweb.org/Disqus#Exporting_a_blog.27s_comments links to the help disqus page - but it would be great if you could add the others! Perhaps
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kaushalmodi I didn't go into the hassle of created nested comments (figuring out parent/child, etc)
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kaushalmodi But came up with this: https://scripter.co/command-to-every-pane-window-session-in-tmux/#comments
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tantek kaushalmodi: better yet - could you add a "From Disqus" section here? https://indieweb.org/Hugo#Migrating_to_Hugo
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kaushalmodi I simply put a snippet from parent comment and the parent author, so anyone reading that can get some sense out of it
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kaushalmodi I plan to write a blog post soon (on this and everything I learned about webmentions, syndication, etc)
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tantek great!
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www.boffosocko.com edited /micro.blog (+1253) "Stub for Why section; some criticisms" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /Getting_Started (+120) "disambig link at the top for folks that are already on WordPress or know they want to" (view diff)
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tantek yeah the photos / articles criticism should be updated
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tantek.com edited /micro.blog (+67) "reduce criticism about post type, note features explicitly" (view diff)
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www.boffosocko.com edited /silo-quits (+861) "Singer/Actress Cher quit Facebook on 3/20/18" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /micro.blog (+562) "slight copy editing / splitting into three different why / entry points for Why micro.blog" (view diff)
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www.boffosocko.com edited /silo-quits (+1338) "Actor Jim Carrey Facebook quit; Actress Tea Leoni Facebook quit" (view diff)
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tantek chrisaldrich: can you review edits to https://indieweb.org/micro.blog#Why ?
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tantek in particular please review the new "1" I added about "Want to try out the IndieWeb without a domain?"