#dev 2018-12-06

2018-12-06 UTC
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[tantek] a /listen is a *response* to the post with the actual media player / embedded attachment
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aaronpk a listen post could show a link preview of the thing that was listened to, but that doesn't need to be part of the data sent back to the original post
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[tantek] [chrisaldrich] or was it [jgmac1106] - if you want to provide a "player" for the media that you listened to, you could do so, IF you put it inside an explicit /reply-context in your /listen post
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aaronpk or reply context yeah maybe that's better
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[tantek] that way an indieweb social /reader would know that the media is *not* by produced by you at all
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[tantek] just like original post text that you reply to is not by you
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[tantek] or a comment on a photo that you put in a reply context - it's not your photo
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[tantek] might be worth adding to /listen#Brainstorming - a stub/straw proposal for how to embed the media you listened to, inside a [[reply-context]]
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sknebel that's what chrisaldrich does and what they were talking about
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[tantek] wait he is putting them explicitly in a reply-context?!?
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[tantek] example permalink? and either way the media must not be an "attachment" on the RSS item that represents the /listen post
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[tantek] it certainly should not be inside e-content for example
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[tantek] er, must not 🙂
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[tantek] in general your /reply-context MUST NOT be inside your e-content - because e-content is for stuff that YOU are the author of, not the stuff you are replying to that is from someone else
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sknebel yeah, that part is wrong (not sure if intentional or a template issue or whatever): https://boffosocko.com/2018/12/04/deployed-in-the-u-s-just-waiting-for-the-caravan-the-new-york-times/
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Loqi [Chris Aldrich] 🎧 The Daily: Deployed in the U.S., Just Waiting for the Caravan | The New York Times
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sknebel u-listen-of h-cite, but inside the e-content
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[grantcodes] Woah intersection observers are so good. Just implemented then in Together instead of scroll events and it's so much smoother!
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[tantek] so yeah that's the problem. "inside the e-content" is wrong
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[tantek] no u-*-of should be inside the e-content
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[tantek] that's something we could add to indiewebify.me's h-entry validator
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[tantek] it's not technically invalid, but it is bad form and likely to cause misattribution of authorship. so it's like a linting problem
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kisik21 [grantcodes]: seems like alltogethernow.io improved so much I can use it instead of monocle! At least as a reader
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[kevinmarks] I disagree - if it's outside the content it's likely to be omitted entirely, breaking fallback
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[kevinmarks] If I can quote text inside my content, why not other media?
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[grantcodes] Yay happy to have you onboard kisik21
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aaronpk [kevinmarks]: having had to deal with this with the relatively simple case of photos, I really really don't want to encourage duplicating that reply context content inside the content of the post
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Loqi 😃
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[kevinmarks] maybe for a simple listen, but if I am discussing audio then quoting it makes sense
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aaronpk go write a reader and get back to me on that :-)
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kisik21 [grantcodes]: I always liked together's design but it had a bug, but now this bug is fixed, yay
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[grantcodes] Excellent!
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aaronpk [kevinmarks]: discussing an audio post was never part of this, please stop adding unrelated variables
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[tantek] there is no reason left for putting reply-context in content
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[tantek] kevinmarks we already covered fallback as summary at IWS 2018
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[kevinmarks] I see an h-cite as expressing that it is external content.
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[tantek] quoting is a totally different case than a reply context SMH
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kisik21 [grantcodes]: oops, nope, this bug is not fixed yet!
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kisik21 [grantcodes]: when I go to editor and back to home channel, it says "nothing to show", as if the channel was empty
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[tantek] anyway I agree with manton, we have solutions to this, we should encourage them
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kisik21 works with every channel, switching to another channel and back helps
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[kevinmarks] you're thinking note rather than article.
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aaronpk This was never about articles ...
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[grantcodes] Hmm kisik21 can you open an issue on GitHub and I'll fix that
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[tantek] nope I'm thinking /response rather than article
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kisik21 [grantcodes]: cleverdevil/together?
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[grantcodes] Yep
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[kevinmarks] I think my mental model of this is informed by huffduffer, where propagating the attchement is a big part of the utility.
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GWG kisik21: My Parser has no problem with fireburn.ru
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kisik21 GWG: the new markup isn't in production yet
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GWG Okay. Just telling you
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kisik21 GWG: try to parse this! <span class="u-author h-card"><a class="u-uid u-url" href="{{ site.author.url or request.host }}"><span class="p-name">{{ site.author.name }}</span></a></span>
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kisik21 oh wait sorry
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GWG kisik21: I should add a parse HTML tool. I only have a debugger for URLs.
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GWG I'll make a note.
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[tantek] kisik21 that looks find though you could simplify it further:
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[tantek] <span class="u-author h-card"><a class="u-uid u-url" href="{{ site.author.url or request.host }}">{{ site.author.name }}</a></span>
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kisik21 yeah, I know
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[tantek] and if you wanted to drop the uid (unless you know of a consuming use-case you are depending on), you can make it even simpler thanks to implied url and name
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[tantek] <span class="u-author h-card"><a href="{{ site.author.url or request.host }}">{{ site.author.name }}</a></span>
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[tantek] in general you should use the simplest shortest markup that satisfies the consuming code use-cases
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kisik21 I'm depending on u-uid specifically
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[tantek] by what consuming code?
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kisik21 GWG: parse this then! https://fireburn.ru/test.html
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kisik21 authorship algos for comments. They should recognize u-uid property and grab h-card from there
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GWG kisik21: What should it find?
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GWG It recognizes fireburn.ru as the h-card url and can fetch it.
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kisik21 GWG: try to get my avatar pic
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kisik21 starting from test.html page, get my avatar pic
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[tantek] kisik21 which part of the authorship algo in particular? and which specific consuming code?
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GWG It did on one of your posts, but it isn't now.
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kisik21 [tantek]: I wanted to combine the authorship algorithm + u-uid for an h-card so a consumer would grab my h-card from u-uid and not from given page
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kisik21 but I guess it doesn't work that way...
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[tantek] "would" is not good enough - sounds theoretical
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[tantek] e.g. if there is no such existing consuming code
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aaronpk The authorship algorithm should already capture your use case
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GWG kisik21: According to my algorithm, it it finds an h-card it stops, and only returns the full h-card if it only finds a URL.
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GWG I suppose I should expand it
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aaronpk GWG: did you follow /authorship?
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kisik21 Maybe handle u-uid in h-card, sending you to fetch h-cards from page it contains?
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GWG aaronpk: To the letter
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kisik21 aaronpk: /authorship doesn't contain that, and I'm hereby proposing it as an addition!
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GWG Authorship doesn't say if you have an h-card, but it doesn't have a photo, go look at the url in your h-card
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aaronpk kisik21: I'm not sure i understand what you're trying to do that isn't covered already
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kisik21 u-uid on h-card - what should it do?
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kisik21 isn't it a canonical version of h-card? could the canonical version contain more info?
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aaronpk kisik21: that's not a use case, doesn't some other rule already take precedence in the current algorithm?
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kisik21 well, there is
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kisik21 but u-uid on h-card sounded kinda logical for me to use, and I thought that maybe that will work as good as just sticking to that rule
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aaronpk GWG: that is true! I remember seeing some missing photos in my reader but I thought I reread the algorithm and fixed XRay and now it works
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kisik21 aaronpk: so xray does that, but it's non-standard behavior?
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GWG aaronpk: I'm adding to my code if there isn't a photo, try to parse the URL inside it to find the photo. It isn't standard behavior.
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GWG But people want photos.
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[kevinmarks] how does u-repost-of fit with this no e-content model?
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aaronpk No I mean I read the authorship algorithm again and made sure XRay follows it and then it started working
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aaronpk GWG: if you can find examples of missing photos after you've followed the authorship algorithm that's worth adding as an issue there so we can fix the algorithm
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aaronpk [kevinmarks]: reposts cant have original content by definition so I'm not sure what you're getting at trying to find new edge cases for the fun of it or something?
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GWG aaronpk: Step 5, if an author property was found, and it has an h-card, use it, and exit.
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GWG There isn't a 5.1.1 saying that if the h-card is minimal, you might want to go look for more data.
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aaronpk GWG: did you find a site that publishes that pattern? Please add an example if so!
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aaronpk I cant remember the details right now but I remember encountering the problem you're describing but it's not a problem for me anymore somehow
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kisik21 my site did that a while ago
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GWG Common WordPress pattern for feed pages
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aaronpk pleas document on the wiki!
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aaronpk Otherwise it will be lost in this chat
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[tantek] kevinmarks the /repost page already documents that, please take a closer look
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GWG aaronpk: I am looking for a good example
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[kevinmarks] no, i'm looking at existing markup rather than theory.
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[kevinmarks] with huffduffer and tumblr as examples
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[kevinmarks] both of which embed the repost in the content.
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GWG Where on the authorship page does that fit?
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[kevinmarks] we can say that they should do something different
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aaronpk GWG: an issues section if there isn't one already
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aaronpk we might need to give it a github issues page soon if it doesn't have one already
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GWG I actually have two issues.
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aaronpk Great! Worth documenting then so we can solve them!
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kisik21 aaronpk: noted in on wiki /authorship#Minimal_h-cards
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GWG kisik21, why do you want the h-card property? If you follow the author property, you retrieve the h-card.
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kisik21 perfectionism probably
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GWG How is that perfect?
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[tantek] it's not, more markup is more work to do & maintain which is the opposite of perfect
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[kevinmarks] tumblr's RSS feed does the attribution as a link+blockquote which is a kind of POSH h-cite
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GWG kisik21: If we have to create a special case for your markup, it is a less than perfect situation.
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GWG I think the two issues I noted are a bit more of a challenge
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GWG kisik21: Thank you. You made my code better
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[jgmac1106] I think the u-uid definition on http://microformats.org/wiki/h-card confuses people
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[jgmac1106] @kisik21 I need a collapsible nav on my blog ofr mobile view as well but trying new approach of not adding any CSS I do not truly understand...amkes my nav ugly for now...which is motivation to learn
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[jgmac1106] but it doesn't have to be hamburger menu, you could write a media query so you grid area displays as a flexbox
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kisik21 I'm thinking about redesigning my site completely now... all because my <nav> looks awful with submenu
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kisik21 And I stumbled upon this: https://www.w3schools.com/howto/howto_js_topnav_responsive.asp
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[jgmac1106] https://jgmac1106.homepage.glitch.me if you want ugly nav
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kisik21 And this: https://www.w3schools.com/howto/howto_css_dropdown_navbar.asp
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[jgmac1106] stay away from w3schools
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kisik21 why?
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[jgmac1106] when searching add !mdn +mdn or -w3schools
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kisik21 they don't use POSH but I can fix it
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[jgmac1106] they are not associated with w3c, manipulate SEO, and often have incorrect markup IMO
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[jgmac1106] they don't claim to have an association....but that's lie geting a burger at McDowells
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[jgmac1106] ohhh...sorry you are in Russia and 17... reference to American move "Coming to America"
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kisik21 Obviously never heard about that movie
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[jgmac1106] why I apologized...here is a dead simple no javascript approach: https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/CSS/CSS_Grid_Layout/Realizing_common_layouts_using_CSS_Grid_Layout
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kisik21 about your ugly nav page: projet not found
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[jgmac1106] https://jgmac1106homepage.glitch.me/
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GWG jgmac1106, they closed the McDonald's that filmed at
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[jgmac1106] sorry....
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kisik21 [jgmac1106]: this nav is as ugly as mine in the testing version
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kisik21 but mine is uglier
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[jgmac1106] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=djI_ret3S9g
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[jgmac1106] well I will share my journey @kisik21 as I want better nav as part of my newwwyear challenge
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[jgmac1106] bc I can't ship as is....I can cut and paste in the css fine...but I don't want to use anythign I can't build from scratch
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[jgmac1106] ...except everythign I can't build...which is everything but a tiny bit of html and css
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kisik21 ok... new base template...
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kisik21 I guess I really do need to start from scratch
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kisik21 I'm not sure if I want my h-card to be in the top or in the bottom of the main page and if I should show my h-card anywhere else than the main page...
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GWG kisik21: Everywhere else, just do the u-author to your main page URL?
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kisik21 probably
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kisik21 My old site shows the h-card in the footer on every single page
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[jgmac1106] all choices, at minimum make sure you have an author h-card in the h-entry, and h-card on your home page and after that it's all extra toppings...I have one in my homepage and a gigantic one on my about page, and of course one in each h-entry
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[jgmac1106] then I also include a directory of h-cards of people I follow to help others with discovery
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kisik21 blogroll
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kisik21 my new site has builtin support for blogrolls
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kisik21 and planning to sync blogrolls with Micropub
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kisik21 s/Micropub/Microsub
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GWG I have to get to citations one of these days, which would move me toward some of that
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[jgmac1106] kisik21++
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Loqi kisik21 has 3 karma in this channel over the last year (14 in all channels)
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[jgmac1106] I think and also a microsub reader. Add someone to your reader, a follow post goes out and the h-card gets added to your blog roll
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kisik21 Planning on this
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kisik21 when I implement my own Microsub server
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[jgmac1106] Looking forward to the nav bar... 🙂
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GWG Nav bar?
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[jgmac1106] how conversation started in IndieWeb is the hamburger menu a good CSS design for mobile
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[jgmac1106] we shared our miseries of ugly nav bars
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GWG Oh.
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GWG I missed that.
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[jgmac1106] ...which is why the McDowells metaphor was used for w3school
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[jgmac1106] layers of meaning spread on sesame seed buns
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[tantek] !tell snarfed does this present any hope for Bridgy publish/backfeed for FB? https://techcrunch.com/2018/12/04/facebook-allows-competitors/
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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[grantcodes] [tantek] That Facebook thing doesn't help unless they also change the API, which wasn't mentioned there
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Zegnat Reading all this h-card embedding discussion, I am now slightly tempted to embed my entire h-card on every future h-entry I write.
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sknebel I'm not quite sure yet what the motivation is for having an h-card on every page instead of linking to a comprehensive one
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sknebel I guess its a bit better for archived pages etc where you can't just go fetch the full one?
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Zegnat It makes stuff more self contained. Although to be fair, it does touch on an issue we have seen before: how do you tell a consumer that the current h-card they are seeing is only a subset of a full bio.
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Zegnat Which always comes up when people add truncated h-cards to their homepage and want the full one on an about (or similar) page
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sknebel yeah
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sknebel (afk for a bit)
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[jgmac1106] Why not just add link to full bio... On the h-entry h-card?
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sknebel re
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sknebel Zegnat: true, that's not quite the same though
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sknebel at least if you want to keep the homepage url as identity
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sknebel !tell GWG re your authorship issues: is this also for non-indieweb themes, so we don't have control over the detailed markup?
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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sknebel I guess one could add a (option/suggested?) step to authorship along the lines of "if an h-card was found and no author-page, attempt to use u-uid as author page. if there is no u-uid and exactly one u-url, attempt to use that"?
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[jgmac1106] @snkebel in that example in my h-card would I put the u-uid to my url and u-url to my about me or the other way around?
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GWG sknebel, it is primarily for non Indieweb themes
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Loqi GWG: sknebel left you a message 18 minutes ago: re your authorship issues: is this also for non-indieweb themes, so we don't have control over the detailed markup?
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GWG Sknebel, with the author archive issue, I have a setting in the Indieweb plugin that overrides that
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sknebel that's not for that issue
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sknebel (sorry, that was a response to [jgmac1106])
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[jgmac1106] thx
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sknebel an interesting question with such a change would be how often it triggers without doing anything useful. i.e. if it causes the algorithm to follow a link to an author archive that doesn't have a better h-card (or none at all), that's a useless request on all such pages
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sknebel and of course how (if?) to combine information from the two cards
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GWG I assume that the url you follow has more info
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GWG So I return it instead
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sknebel if it has what? a card matching the url of the other? a representative card?
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GWG A representative card, but I need to tweak my implementation a bit still
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Zegnat Have a mini h-card embedded in my h-entry, then what does the consumer do?
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Zegnat 1. Does this h-card have a photo?
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Zegnat 2. If no: follow the url of the h-card and discover h-card there.
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Zegnat 3. The new representative h-card may still not be complete, magically discover /about link.
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Zegnat 4. Is there a magical full-h-card link? Go there.
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Zegnat That feels like a *lot* of requests to figure out the most complete h-card
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sknebel I'd look at 1/2 and 3/4 separately
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sknebel 1/2 is one indirection, we already have that as a very common pattern
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GWG Zegnat, this may be why nickname caches come in handy
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sknebel it's an interesting idea to go by "do I already have the information I want to display"
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sknebel because true, if I want a name and a url and have those from the local card no need to follow links
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Zegnat I see them as two separate things to, sknebel. I am just anticipating the people who may expect them to follow eachother ;)
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sknebel so it isn't necessarily needed to find the "completest" card
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Zegnat Right. Whether you as consumer are even interested in the most complete card is up to you as consumer
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Zegnat And then the second question is: how far do I as consumer want to go to find the information I want. If I need all those 4 steps I said before to find your photo, I may just give up at step 2.
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GWG But I would appreciate it if the publisher made it easier
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GWG Zegnat, this is worth discussing regardless
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Zegnat GWG, definitely!
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Zegnat I just want to be careful not getting into the whole “these 10 combinations are theoretically possible”. I’d like to see publishers having a clear usecase.
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Zegnat The easiest for publishers, to me, stills seems to just have u-author linking to their homepage which includes an h-card
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GWG Zegnat, that's what I said last night
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Zegnat Ah, I might have glossed over that. There was a lot in the backlog!
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Zegnat Sorry if I was repeating arguments :)
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Zegnat is apologising a lot lately. Clearly wrong mindset at the moment.
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GWG But it opened up my concern about WordPress
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GWG WordPress themes declare the hcard to be the author post archive
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GWG There are a lot of WordPress sites
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sknebel GWG: in which situations does the minimal h-card in a WP theme actually lead to more information? e.g. you mentioned https://ma.tt/ on the wiki as an example, but following the link in the hCard there doesn't lead to more information?
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sknebel does it if there's one of your plugins installed?
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GWG sknebel, the Indieweb plugin has a setting that changes the author url from the post archive to a url of your designation
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sknebel but keeps the mini h-cards?
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sknebel since those are in the theme?
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GWG The mini h-cards are in the theme, so can't be removed by plugin
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sknebel ok
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sknebel (detail added to wiki)
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GWG I think trying to work around WordPress is going to be a long challenge
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GWG I have already been struggling for a bit with it
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sknebel is there something we can do for the second scenario, where the link points to an author archive? are there cases where we'd expect parseable profile information there?
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GWG sknebel, not typically, but nothing prevents it
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sknebel ok, but no common pattern that might be worth special casing then?
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GWG Common pattern is no
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sknebel ok, so it's for now only relevant as a case where an algorithm change might fetch the page but not find anything
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sknebel I guess there's also then a case where people have an h-card in their sidebar etc, but *also* a WP generated mini-hCard in the post?
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GWG sknebel, yes.
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sknebel that'd also be a fair extension then, doesn't even require new requests
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GWG I wrote the h-card widget into the Indieweb plugin, but it doesn't stop that.
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GWG But one would be a top level property
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GWG The other a child of an h-entry
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GWG Either way, there is no easy solution. Even though the tools are there
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sknebel right, but if there is a better h-card on the page, we could find it with the same idea from above
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GWG Agreed
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GWG More code just got a lot more complex
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jgmac1106 [gwg] you mean something like this? https://jgmac1106homepage.glitch.me/buildingapodcast.html
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Loqi [J. Gregroy McVerry] Building a Podcast Feed http://dogzone.jgregorymcverry.com/file/fba9517047520cf22d94187a864e986d/stuffedworldcover.jpg
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jgmac1106 I am not going to do that just trying to see if I can understand what you are asking
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GWG jgmac1106, if you don't have your feed on your main page, your post link should have rel=feed on it so it can be discovered
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GWG That's all
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jgmac1106 including the post kind menu as well I assume
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GWG The post kind.menu could be marked up as rel feed because it is a menu of feeds
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GWG Although how many feed links do you want on your main page that a parser can discover?
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jgmac1106 how would I do that in the top level menu? Menu customizer doesn’t give me anything but title attribute
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GWG That's why I wrote a widget, but let me look later
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GWG See if it is filterable
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[jgmac1106] I wonder if you removed the css class field in 2016-Indieweb I don't see it int he customize menu option
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[jgmac1106] but I think you have to trigger it that when they select a page in the customize menu a function adds the rel="feed" or add a rel= custom field
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[tantek] Ugh this section is a mess https://indieweb.org/authorship#Issues
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[tantek] I'll try to clean-up a bit
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[tantek] GWG your example of ma.tt doesn't make sense for missing an h-card photo, because the site as a whole now misses a photo
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[tantek] going to move to theoretical
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[jgmac1106] !tell kisik21 spent sometime on my nav bar, not collapsing to hamburger menu, just went with a smaller em, and autofill grid columns with a set minmax...aint pretty but aint as ugly https://jgmac1106.homepage.glitch.me
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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[jgmac1106] ooops https://jgmac1106homepage.glitch.me
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kisik21 Your site looks awful on mobile though
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Loqi kisik21: [jgmac1106] left you a message 1 minute ago: spent sometime on my nav bar, not collapsing to hamburger menu, just went with a smaller em, and autofill grid columns with a set minmax...aint pretty but aint as ugly https://jgmac1106.homepage.glitch.me
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kisik21 I think it lost some buttons
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[jgmac1106] I know....learning is hard
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kisik21 ugh... I have all the markup, I just need to somehow squeeze in the responisve part
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kisik21 via CSS
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kisik21 but CSS seems to be a total mess
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[jgmac1106] need to fix the hero image...tempted to cheat and just load a smaller one on media query rather than rebuild how I do it
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kisik21 width: 100%
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[jgmac1106] not sure what buttons you say are missing on my site, I do hide the image on my h-card for mobile view...and do know the article img are off centered...
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[jgmac1106] tried that,
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kisik21 The podcast button is off-screen on the homepage you linked earlier
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kisik21 that's what I mean
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kisik21 oh, it scrolls
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[jgmac1106] how big is your display?
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[jgmac1106] I haven't added my podcasts yet
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kisik21 I'm using "iphone x" setting in the web debugger
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kisik21 since it's the weirdest display I've heard of anywhere
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[jgmac1106] weird, I se all my nav on my pixel3
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[jgmac1106] the issue with my header img is having text on a pic...I really need to just rebuild that..but I lost link to original picture....choosing a new img.....that is a tall order
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Zegnat reverse image lookup isn’t working?
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[jgmac1106] ...not like I also included the license info on the picture and fav any img I use
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[jgmac1106] ..I think Greg isn't working
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[jgmac1106] do realize I need a different media query for 480px phones...does look scrolly there
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[jgmac1106] but not as ugly as last night..at least I upgraded to "looks awful"
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Zegnat [jgmac1106]: https://www.flickr.com/photos/mightyboybrian/4118891505/
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[jgmac1106] thx you so beat me, I was searching flickr
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aaronpk If authorship has this much discussion around it maybe it makes sense to "upgrade" it to give it its own github repo so we can use issues to discuss
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[jgmac1106] later today I can fix my original sin
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sknebel GWG: from looking around a bunch of pages from chat-names, it seems people either use a theme with a full h-card or have links to author overview pages that don't result in finding something better.
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[tantek] aaronpk, that may be a good idea, want to add an issue for it? 😉
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[tantek] Seriously, perhaps that means I should write-up a more formal spec to start with
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aaronpk sknebel: that reminds me I've seen that failure happen as well, where someone's "about" page actually contains less information (usually no photo) compared to their home page h-card
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sknebel not really surprised the wordpress default doesn't result in a better page. was kind of surprised I didn't find a user of the option GWG mentioned in my quick scan
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sknebel although it makes sense, people are quickly sent to use a full theme or probably don't understand all the options
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[jgmac1106] we coach people to run into the conflict by including the side-bar h-card widget on post displays
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[jgmac1106] sometimes if people have been around for a long time they may also have one hard coded in their header or footer, have a minimal h-card in the h-entry and then also have the widget in the side bar..
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sknebel huh? what does the sidebar widget have to do with any of this?
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[jgmac1106] I mean we tell people to NOT also use the h-card widget on their post displays
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[jgmac1106] I was hoping that is partially why you didn't find any users
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sknebel I don't think that's tied to the h-card widget in any way?
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[jgmac1106] <-- goes to put a photo on his about me page and slowly walk away
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sknebel (well, if it included the overview page as a u-url having it would actually make the change helpful for people that haven't set the homepage as user url)
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GWG sknebel: Anyone who installs the Indieweb plugin, people in our community, would probably enable the option to set it to a page other than the author archive page
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sknebel as I said, I picked a bunch of examples from chat-names, and those that didn't have h-cards with photos already in the posts didn't have a different url set... but if you know an example of course happy to look at it
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GWG Okay
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GWG Will look at non-community WordPress sites a bit later
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GWG I'm on lunch
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sknebel how much do people rely on the fat pings in WebSub vs just taking it as a notification to refetch? on the other side, do you send just new posts for h-feeds or the entire file?
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sknebel i somehow thought fat pings were optional, but unless I'm misreading the spec they're not?
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snarfed sknebel: dunno about the spec, but bridgy's blog webmentions feature depends on fat pings, it doesn't fetch
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Loqi snarfed: [tantek] left you a message 13 hours, 49 minutes ago: does this present any hope for Bridgy publish/backfeed for FB? https://techcrunch.com/2018/12/04/facebook-allows-competitors/
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snarfed https://github.com/snarfed/bridgy/issues/590
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Loqi [Belp-audio] #590 blog webmentions: fetch and parse HTML directly to find links instead of using superfeedr's content
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sknebel thx
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sknebel not sure why I thought otherwise. (looking into it for AutoAuth)
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mblaney sknebel: fat pings were optional but when the spec was formalised the optional part was dropped.
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sknebel ah
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mblaney how do AutoAuth and WebSub fit together?
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sknebel thats the question :D can we get e.g. private feeds with WebSub support
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mblaney aaah yes sounds fun :-)
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sknebel with thin pings it's probably fairly straight forward to trigger the reader to refetch, especially if you're willing to leak that you posted *some* private post to everyone. without them, does the websub hub now have to handle private posts? or do we use it for thin pings by having it push out a placeholder?
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mblaney yeah I think you might be a level above the websub spec here. all language of fat/thin pings was removed and was simplified to assume payloads are always sent. The spec does mention capability urls, which might be an interesting way to work with private posts?
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mblaney I'm not sure how that would fit with what you've already done with AutoAuth though.
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sknebel yes, since supporting autoauth of course needs application changes on all sides it's ok if there's extra rules for websub, at least to a degree. e.g. I think I'd prefer it if you could still use an unmodified hub, but authenticated clients could use a different topic url so normal clients don't notice anything weird, e.g. if placeholder posts are needed
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sknebel will make a few notes in the repo issues tomorrow
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