#dev 2019-03-31

2019-03-31 UTC
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@ChrisAldrich ↩️ .@jgmac1106 and I did a course last summer that leveraged Webmention so that students could own and control their own identities and data. https://boffosocko.com/2019/03/30/55747621/#Greg%20McVerry%20and%20I%20did%20a%20course (twitter.com/_/status/1112170611873181696)
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jacky today might be the day
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jacky when we get gitea working as a indieauth consumer/client
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aaronpk Wait what why
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Loqi aaronpk: GWG left you a message 4 hours, 29 minutes ago: How do you feel about alternative web hooks that send GET requests?
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aaronpk GWG I am not sure i understand the question
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GWG aaronpk: I missed something there
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GWG I installed Compass.
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aaronpk What do you want the GET hook to do?
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GWG I I was wondering if you would accept a PR for a different type of hook
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GWG aaronpk: I wanted to update the other system I have that does location, and it accepts only GET requests with query strings for the location
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GWG As opposed to a POST with GeoJSON
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aaronpk Oh...
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aaronpk I guess it could be a config option
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GWG I'll see if I can do a PR
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GWG aaronpk: I thought trying to get Compass to do it was better than building something from scratch right now
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aaronpk If you're just trying to get something running you can always make a simple pho file that translates the compass POST to the GET in your format, then you don't have to mess with Compass UI stuff right now
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GWG pho?
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aaronpk Lol
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aaronpk autocorrect
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aaronpk PHP
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GWG So, a script that receives a POST and sends a GET? Interesting
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aaronpk Not a good long term solution obviously but would start working faster than a PR to Compass since that's gonna involve UI work
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GWG aaronpk: I could also learn python and fix it on the other side
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aaronpk True. It does seem weird to accept that kind of data from the query string anyway
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GWG I am going to write a post on how to set up GPS Logger on Android with Compass though
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aaronpk Cool!
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aaronpk I will link to it from the Compss readme
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GWG aaronpk: Any suggestions of how to import a lot of data into Compass?
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aaronpk Use the QuartzDB library to write the files to disk
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aaronpk Compass doesn't store stuff in MySQL other than the list of users and databases
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aaronpk everything is just files
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GWG I have some stuff stored in KML I want to try and get in.
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GWG Could I use the API?
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aaronpk You could but it won't be particularly fast
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aaronpk all the api does is write the files to disk anyway tho
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aaronpk you do have to send the data in date order to the API and also to QuartzDB, it doesn't handle out of order inserts
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GWG How so? Doesn't every submission have a date?
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GWG https://david.shanske.com/2019/03/31/setting-up-compass-with-gps-logger-for-android/
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aaronpk Yes but when it's reading the data back it assumes it's in order already
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GWG aaronpk, but since each date is a file, wouldn't it just be each individual date?
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GWG Also, I see there is a maintenance task for that
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aaronpk Yes but within the file
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aaronpk the date boundary is also UTC
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aaronpk So if you want a days worth of data local time you end up reading two files and it has to decide when to stop reading lines and that's the part that assumes in order
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GWG Well, I haven't tried to write an importer yet
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GWG We'll see what I can do
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GWG Right now, I posted how to get it working with GPS Logger and will get the code set up for reading it with WordPress
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aaronpk Sweet
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BenLubar1 I'm assuming this code is what needs to change to support IndieAuth: https://github.com/go-gitea/gitea/blob/04d78b60f8b12891d5e6d47baec46413eca4c856/routers/user/oauth.go#L167-L201
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BenLubar1 the `h-app` metadata can go here: https://github.com/go-gitea/gitea/blob/04d78b60f8b12891d5e6d47baec46413eca4c856/templates/base/head_navbar.tmpl#L2-L5 (add `<span class="hide p-name">{{AppName}}</a>`)
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BenLubar1 making `response_type=id` the default only if the `me` parameter is present should probably be okay
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aaronpk Nice, has PKCE support already too
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aaronpk is that implementing a client from scratch or is that using a library for it?
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BenLubar1 https://github.com/go-gitea/gitea/blob/master/modules/auth/oauth2/oauth2.go looks like it's using https://github.com/markbates/goth
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jacky awesome BenLubar!
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jacky I'm going to try and pull it down sometime tomorrow night
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jacky IndieAuth in Gitea would make me so happy!
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aaronpk Same!
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jacky okay this might be a bit easier than I thought
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jacky this also reminds me that I need to finish working on Fortress so I could just run it locally for testing
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jacky ahhh so if we extend https://github.com/markbates/goth as well; we can give so many other Go apps IndieAuth support for free
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Loqi [markbates] goth: Package goth provides a simple, clean, and idiomatic way to write authentication packages for Go web applications.
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jacky https://github.com/markbates/goth/blob/master/examples/main.go
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jacky oh this'll be a breeze
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jacky hopefully if this goes okay, it can be a precedent to add the flip-side to Gitea
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jacky but for now, sleep
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@jackyalcine Just left a note to consider adding IndieAuth support to ElixirStatus. That would be dope! (https://v2.jacky.wtf/post/e044a006-8fd7-47ba-9d2c-484604ffb465) (twitter.com/_/status/1112323176518819840)
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Jeremycherfas It has been interesting doing the final tweaks on my listen script, because I have restricted myself to one test a day, so as to not run afoul of rate limits. So that forces me to slow down and to think.
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Jeremycherfas And I now think I have it working "properly", but I can't easily check until I have finished listening to another podcast.
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Jeremycherfas Wondering whether to demo it later today. Although there is nothing really to see.
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[jgmac1106] Yes demo. Need all the examples in the wild
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[jgmac1106] Show the page, show how one listen post is marked up
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[jgmac1106] wish I knew more to respond https://twitter.com/Downes/status/1112336811873972225 is the blockchain the best place for storing citations????
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@Downes @jgmac1106 @oldaily The advantage of publishing this data to a blockchain is that the data is stored in a decentralized network. The community owns the data rather than one particular entity within it. This insures against the data eventually being privatized and converted into a commercial product. (twitter.com/_/status/1112336811873972225)
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Jeremycherfas Markup is very poor at the moment. That's sort of trivial, just tweaking the template. Creating the post is the hard part.
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[jgmac1106] then talk about that in the demo...
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Jeremycherfas Actually, I'm not even sure what the canonical markup for a listen post **should** be. Hold on ...
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Jeremycherfas What is listens
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "listens" yet. Would you like to create it? (Or just say "listens is ____", a sentence describing the term)
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Jeremycherfas What is listen
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Loqi A scrobble (AKA a listen) is a passive type of post used to publish a song (music or audio track, including concert recordings or DJ sets) or podcast that you have listened to https://indieweb.org/listen
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[jgmac1106] there isn't experimental technically
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Jeremycherfas I suppose I should follow either [eddie] or [chrisaldrich]. Let me take a look
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Zegnat Jeremycherfas: for sure have a look at what markup is already being used in the wild. But also think about if it works for you. This early on in the process is the correct time to figure out what we want to standardise on in the long run
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Jeremycherfas Right. Also, my inspiration does not appear as an example.
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Jeremycherfas !tell [cleverdevil] You should add yourself to /listen examples
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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sknebel Jeremycherfas: https://github.com/microformats/h-entry/issues/11#issuecomment-401181036
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Loqi [gRegorLove] We have 2+ publishers for `u-listen-of` (more listed on https://indieweb.org/scrobble#IndieWeb_Examples) and at least 1 consumer, so this can be added as a proposed property. I propose adding: > **u-listen-of** - indicates this h-entry is a scr...
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Zegnat [jgmac1106], for storing data that you want the public to always have access too, some form of decentralised storage does make sense. Whether you need all the properties of a blockchain for citations is another matter, you may also not want additions to the dataset to be limited by available miners and for there to be a vote for inclusion (which I believe are all part of what people are calling blockchain).
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Jeremycherfas Interesting issue arises. Eddie and Chris have a link to th episode URL as the title, and wrap that in a div u-listen-of.
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Jeremycherfas I currently have my title as a permalink, and have a separate Listen here link that points to the Overcast URL.
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Jeremycherfas It wopuld be easy enough to make my Title a link to the Overcast URL, and wrap that.
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Zegnat You should be comparing mf2 output, I think
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Jeremycherfas Harder to make it a link to the episode URL, but maybe doable.
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Jeremycherfas I've looked at both sets of mf2 in pin13, and mine.
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Zegnat <div class="u-listen-of">podcast.example.com</div> is the same as <a href="podcast.example.com" class="u-listen-of">The Awesome Show</a>
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Loqi I agree
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Jeremycherfas I didn't explain well.
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Jeremycherfas Eddie and Chris have something similar to what you show ^^^
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Jeremycherfas I have something quite different, because I link to the Overcast url, not the episode url,. And because I have it in a separate Listen here link.
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Jeremycherfas Example https://www.jeremycherfas.net/stream/2019-3-31-1
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Loqi [Jeremy Cherfas] 🎧 Listened to: Moment of Truth? https://www.jeremycherfas.net/stream/2019-3-31-1/artwork-resized.png
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Jeremycherfas I'm going to take a quick look at the template and see if I can change my Title to be a link to the Overcast link to the episode. That will be easier than pointing to the actual episode url, for now.
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Jeremycherfas And I need a nap.
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Jeremycherfas I can see why I did it; because it makes it easy to go from the list of all listens to the single post.
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Zegnat Oh, yeah, I think in yours I would want to remove the p-listen-of and make that a u-listen-of on your “here” link
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GWG Naps are good
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Jeremycherfas Will that be picked up because it is within h-entry?
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Zegnat Yes
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Zegnat You want the listen-of to be a property of h-entry, so it should always be a child of that. And as long as there is no other h-* object between the h-entry and the u-listen-of that will work
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Jeremycherfas Let me test that; might be the minimal change needed, at the moment.
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Jeremycherfas Now I'm trapped with Grav's aggressive caching. Always have to wait for the CSS to update, and clearing all cache doesn't seem to do it.
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Jeremycherfas I know there's a technique for forcing a CSS update when anything changes, but I have never managed to get it to work.
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Jeremycherfas I think that's done it. Would you mind taking a look, zegnat? https://www.jeremycherfas.net/stream/2019-3-27-1
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Loqi [Jeremy Cherfas] 🎧 Listened to: 30 and Counting, Episode 23: Apple + Services https://www.jeremycherfas.net/stream/2019-3-27-1/artwork-resized.png
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sknebel !mf2 https://www.jeremycherfas.net/stream/2019-3-27-1
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Kaja https://php.microformats.io/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.jeremycherfas.net%2Fstream%2F2019-3-27-1
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Loqi [Jeremy Cherfas] 🎧 Listened to: 30 and Counting, Episode 23: Apple + Services https://www.jeremycherfas.net/stream/2019-3-27-1/artwork-resized.png
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Zegnat General consensus for CSS cache busting is to have a version number in the CSS path. There may be a way to do that in Grav.
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Loqi [Jeremy Cherfas] 🎧 Listened to: 30 and Counting, Episode 23: Apple + Services https://www.jeremycherfas.net/stream/2019-3-27-1/artwork-resized.png
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Jeremycherfas Yeah, that's the general idea. Need to read up. Always the least urgent thing.
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Zegnat That mf2 output looks good to me
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sknebel can you get the url on eddie's site from the data you have, instead of the overcast-specific one?
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Jeremycherfas Yes, but it will take a little more work. Overcast gives it to me, but I need to jump through a few hoops to get it into the YAML. For now, I get the artwork and the summary from OverCast, because the context there is constant, which means I can always find it.
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sknebel cool
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sknebel also, one might argue that the "photo" should be "featured" instead
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Jeremycherfas If I go to the episode url there are so many different ways of sites indicating the artwork and the summary that it becomes a nightmare.
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Jeremycherfas But Overcast does give me the episode url, so with a bit more effort I can definitely switch to that. That is actually next on my list, now that I have the mf2 more or less OK.
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sknebel I meant just using the URL in your output, not parsing all the data from it
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Jeremycherfas Yes, that is what I merant to. Just offering my explanation. :)
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Jeremycherfas You think I should put u-featured onto artwork-resized?
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sknebel yes, instead of u-photo
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Jeremycherfas Instead of u-photo, I mean?
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Jeremycherfas That's pretty easy. Just out of interest, why? There is only one photo in an entry. I can guarantee that.
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Zegnat Mostly because it is a representative image of the entry, not the entry being a photo post.
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Jeremycherfas Ah. Let me check that. !mf2 https://www.jeremycherfas.net/stream/2019-3-27
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Loqi [Jeremy Cherfas] 🎧 Listened to: Episode 139: 1,347 Birds
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Jeremycherfas !mf2 https://www.jeremycherfas.net/stream/2019-3-27
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Kaja https://php.microformats.io/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.jeremycherfas.net%2Fstream%2F2019-3-27
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Loqi [Jeremy Cherfas] 🎧 Listened to: Episode 139: 1,347 Birds
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Loqi [Jeremy Cherfas] 🎧 Listened to: Episode 139: 1,347 Birds
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Jeremycherfas Very good! I suppose I could even demo it.
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sknebel hm, it seems like the summary is in the content, but your commentary on it isn't?
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Jeremycherfas That is correct. Very few have commentary, and it was proving to be really difficult to do the styling, to put the summary in the grid box and my commentary outside it.
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Zegnat Hmm. My first thought is that the summary – being taken from the original podcast page rather than written by you – may fit better in an h-cite. But that also feels like a pretty big reworking while the thing you currently have also seems valid anyway
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GWG Feature 1 implemented
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sknebel yeah, url and summary could be put in a h-cite, but the name then would need to be repeated or hidden (and the featured technically should too? that's also in the wrong spot of the html. the pain of microformats...)
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Jeremycherfas Perhaps making it "proper" could be a project for Utrecht ...
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Zegnat featured would need to go outside, true, sknebel. Name doesn’t need to be repeated. .u-listen-of.p-name.h-cite would work
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Jeremycherfas Never ends, does it?
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Zegnat Hahaha
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Loqi awesome
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sknebel Zegnat: publishing p-name.h-cite is more something for someone like us who then gets to complain at everyone who forgot that case in their consuming code :P
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sknebel also, the p-name of the post should arguably retain the "Listened to:"?
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Jeremycherfas Of course now the collected stream of listen posts doesn't link to the listens-of url
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Jeremycherfas https://pin13.net/mf2/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.jeremycherfas.net%2Fstream
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sknebel listen-of": [ "https://www.jeremycherfas.net/stream/2019-3-31-1/artwork-resized.png \ud83c\udfa7 Listened to: Moment of Truth? 31 Mar 2019" ],
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Zegnat The stream doesn’t include links to the podcast pages at all, you’d need to add those into the stream somehow
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Jeremycherfas Once I can get the podcast url into the YAML, I can add them into the stream and the post. But that is a task for another day.
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Zegnat Ah, yes, if they aren’t in the YAML that is probably harder to add to the stream
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Zegnat it makes it a little awkward though, as there is no real place to put the listen-of on
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sknebel Jeremycherfas++
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Loqi Jeremycherfas has 12 karma in this channel over the last year (32 in all channels)
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Jeremycherfas In the stream, you mean? I can possibly have a hidden <a>. That's I was thinking.
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Jeremycherfas I could even wrap the image in that <a> In fact, I like that idea.
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Zegnat That would work, yes, as long as you have access to the URL :)
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Jeremycherfas The URL is right there in the OPML, I just need to jump through the entities hoops a couple of times. But now, I am definitely off to nap.
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Zegnat Jeremycherfas++
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Loqi Jeremycherfas has 13 karma in this channel over the last year (33 in all channels)
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Zegnat Also: Slow Sunday, best sunday :D
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[tantek] Yes indeed Zegnat!
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[tantek] Is there an "optimum" max resolution for POSSEing photos / diagram / graphics to Twitter?
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aaronpk There's at least a megabyte limit, 5 I think? Maybe 3
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[tantek] Some thinking: most people read Twitter on mobile, pick a resolution that if they tap the photo to "full screen" it, that uses the max height (or width) of the mobile
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aaronpk I was hitting it trying to upload gifs
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[tantek] resolution not mb 🙂
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aaronpk come to think of it I don't actually know whether twitter scales the images uploaded but I assume it does
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[tantek] right, gifs (especially animated) have that additional constraint that is more likely to hit before resolution (dimensions)
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aaronpk in which case you'd get the best quality uploading at their target size to avoid their scaling.
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[tantek] it definitely downscales them to a cap
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aaronpk I know this is true on Instagram and you can find people's tips for posting sharp images to Instagram by doing the scaling yourself first
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Zegnat fullscreening is an interesting question. Sounds like you’d want to know the dominant screen width-height ratio of your followers for that
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[tantek] e.g. Twitter will downscale a multiphoto photo down to 960x720! E.g. https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D2UzteBXgAE74R7.jpg
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[tantek] Zegnat, width/height ratio is not really relevant, or rather, you can assume most mobiles will have a dominant ratio somewhere between 2:1 and 16:9
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[tantek] thus the height (in pixels) is the typical limiting factor for "fullscreening" images on a mobile (assuming you rotate your mobile to see it in landscape)
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Zegnat Oh, I was thinking you wanted to guarantee the fullscreen effect, in which case you need to find the correct aspect ratio to get that (e.g. square images, no matter their height, are never going to give the effect).
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[tantek] no that's futile and kinda pointless. the point is what [aaronpk] said: posting sharp images
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[tantek] e.g. reducing / eliminating pixel (up/down)scaling
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Zegnat Ah, I’ve never bothered thinking about that. Probably because I have shared less than 10 photos on Twitter ever, ha
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aaronpk The iPhone is taller than 16:9 now too
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[tantek] when you're posting a graphic / line-art where you want sharp edges to lines / rectangles etc., it makes sense to worry about sharpness
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[tantek] aaronpk hence my generalization of between 2:1 and 16:9
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aaronpk it's taller than 2:1 too
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[tantek] I don't think typical mobiles have exceeded - wat
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[tantek] More data: on a single-photo post, Twitter will downscale the image to 1440x1440 https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D18_qYnXcAUnp2m.jpg:large or maybe that's artificially upscaled from their storage of a downscaled 1200x1200 https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D18_qYnXcAUnp2m.jpg
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aaronpk 2436x1125
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aaronpk https://i.imgur.com/oAmAURW.png
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[tantek] hmm wait, my original image of that square was 1440x1440 https://fastly.4sqi.net/img/general/original/476_rEjJjzsGjhmyKVnR69OFxbFs1Yb_3sEatCUbrOF9CfI.jpg
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Zegnat Huh, who knew, my XR is apparently a 19.5:9 screen according to the internet
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sknebel you can append one of :orig :large :medium :small to a twitter image url to get different versions (although sometimes multiple are the same, probably when the source image is below a threshold)
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[tantek] wow ok will adjust. phones are still not quite at Star Wars 2.35:1 🙂
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[tantek] fell down this rabbithole http://homecinemacity.com/Aspect%20Ratios/aspect%20ratios.htm (also that URL 😂)
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sknebel I'd suspect they always serve one of those (or maybe just the first 3?), depending on the client
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sknebel (which of course then also might be scaled by the browser additionally)
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sknebel they'll also reencode jpgs with > 85 quality setting to 85
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[tantek] what is resolution
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "resolution" yet. Would you like to create it? (Or just say "resolution is ____", a sentence describing the term)
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[tantek] hmm
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[tantek] looks like 750px is a decent mid-level sweet spot for the smaller (landscape height) dimension on iOS devices at least: https://developer.apple.com/library/archive/documentation/DeviceInformation/Reference/iOSDeviceCompatibility/Displays/Displays.html
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sknebel PNGs that are grayscale or 8bit palette are left as is, as are PNGs <900px (larger dimension). higher depth PNGs are compared to a JPG transcode and the smaller file used
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[tantek] is there an easy PNG inspector / validator that will tell you if your PNG is 8bit palette?
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[tantek] looks like 1200x750 will work
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sknebel (for a while there was the trick to keep your images pristine by uploading them as PNG with a single slightly transparent pixel, but those recent changes killed that)
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sknebel I'd say "unless you specifically generated them that way, they aren't" :D
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[tantek] sknebel, not helpful, since most PNGs I generate these days is with the MacOS "screenshot" gesture
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[tantek] hence why I was asking for a tool that could inspect/validate accordingly
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sknebel that's probably "no". On windows and KDE the file manager shows the bit depth in the file details, might work on mac too?
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[tantek] unfortunately no. just the color space 😕
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sknebel (a screenshot is going to be of a screen with potentially many colors, so unless the screenshot tool specifically tests for <256 colors and then converts to a smaller format, it's not gonna work. and I doubt it does that)
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[tantek] are there web-based tools that will do that? "tests for <256 colors and then converts to a smaller format"
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[tantek] wow I just searched, found, and tried https://tinypng.com/ and it cut my sample PNG slide/diagram by 75%!
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[tantek] drag & drop to upload, one-click download. ridiculously easy
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[tantek] "By reducing the number of colors, 24-bit PNG files can be converted to much smaller 8-bit indexed color images. All unnecessary metadata is stripped too."
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Zegnat A lot of graphics tools let you do that pretty easy too. I think both Pixelmator and Acorn (image editors for macOS I have used / use) allow me to export as indexed PNGs. Can give huge size savings.
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[tantek] I definitely prefer things I don't have to install
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[tantek] Wonder if such PNG compression would be worth adding / requesting in Bridgy Publish
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[tantek] though maybe it's more worth doing it all up front so your "original" copy is also smaller / loads faster
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[tantek] works on improving his own workflow first before filing any Bridgy issues
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[tantek] what is PNG
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "PNG" yet. Would you like to create it? (Or just say "PNG is ____", a sentence describing the term)
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