#dev 2019-05-25

2019-05-25 UTC
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[cleverdevil]
I find that post from Daniel entirely unsurprising.
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Loqi
[cleverdevil]: sknebel left you a message 4 days, 16 hours ago: always feel free to ask Zegnat or me about "do these microformats look right"
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[chrisaldrich]
GWG I'll see your amen and raise you one. It's one thing to have 8+ year old issues, 4 year old issues with potential PRs that need testing, but this is just sadly beyond the pale.
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[tantek]
wow that's pretty bad
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[jgarber]
aaronpk: Knocked out that indieweb-endpoints.cc issue you filed yesterday. Check it out πŸ‘‰ https://indieweb-endpoints.cc/search?url=http://aaronpk.com
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aaronpk
[jgarber]++
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Loqi
[jgarber] has 8 karma in this channel over the last year (9 in all channels)
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GWG
aaronpk: Is there a problem with micropub.rocks?
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aaronpk
Not that I am aware of
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aaronpk
do you see a problem with it?
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GWG
When I hit sign in, it goes to a blank screen
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aaronpk
Hm I got the login email, tho gmail thought it was spam
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GWG
It didn't say anything.
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aaronpk
I just entered your email address and it says it sent you an email
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GWG
I'm trying to figure out why Quill uploads to the media endpoint but Indigenous for Android fails.
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GWG
Okay, found the issue. Indigenous for Android sends all file parameters as arrays and my code expected strings.
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doubleloop
!tell [grantcodes]: ah cool, the wiki page that I found photopostr on links to the https version, I can update it
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Loqi
Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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sebsel
GWG: but there are no arrays nor strings involved..? it should be a multipart/form-data request https://www.w3.org/TR/micropub/#media-endpoint
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sebsel
it's up to the webframework / language to decide how to represent that
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sebsel
this above thing is why I can't make a Siri Shortcut for my MediaEndpoint: sending a multipart is not an option there
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sebsel
But I suspect other media endpoints accept different things
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[Ana_R]
Thanks Neil! No more complaining about my curse at Homebrew Website Club πŸ˜‚
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GWG
sebsel: In the files array
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aaronpk
sebsel: shortcuts should be able to do a multipart request, it's just called file upload instead
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doubleloop
Is state a required parameter for indieauth? indieauth on WP gives a parameter absent error if state is not present, but gimme-a-token does not provide it.
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doubleloop
(if I append it manually to the query string then the rest of the flow works ok)
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sknebel
doubleloop: yes, required
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doubleloop
sknebel++
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Loqi
sknebel has 43 karma in this channel over the last year (113 in all channels)
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doubleloop
Would this be the correct part of the spec to reference? https://indieauth.spec.indieweb.org/#authentication-request
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aaronpk
And the corresponding section under authorization request
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sknebel
https://github.com/sebsel/gimme-a-token/issues/1 - does the xray web api have the rel-discovery exposed? not seeing it in output from https://xray.p3k.app/parse=url=...
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Loqi
[sebsel] #1 Add links to XRay for easier endpoint discovery
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sknebel
( ^^^ aaronpk)
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aaronpk
If I add cors headers to that, then gimme a token could make the request itself and avoid the user needing to copy paste
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sknebel
hm... I should go register nonexisting-domain.dev :P
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aaronpk
Heh, sebsel made that before .dev was a thing huh
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sknebel
probably. I always found it interesting how unknown the actual testing tlds were instead of that
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sknebel
would be interesting to trace where "just use .dev" came from :D
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sknebel
(similar for how it took ages to teach sysadmins to not use ".local")
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doubleloop
sknebel: testing tlds plural? Is there more than just .test?
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sknebel
!tell jeremycherfas seems like my theory was right and webmention.heroku.app uses a parser that doesn't follow the current rules for implied name properties - the post doesn't have one, so it tries to guess one badly :/
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Loqi
Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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Zegnat
doubleloop, for testing using .test is a good bet, but there are multiple reserved TLDs
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sknebel
doubleloop: RFC2606: .test, .example, .invalid - depending on the purpose
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doubleloop
Ah nice, didn't know those others
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sknebel
".example" is recommended for use in documentation or as examples.
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sknebel
".invalid" is intended for use in online construction of domain
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sknebel
names that are sure to be invalid and which it is obvious at a
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sknebel
glance are invalid.
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sknebel
so really, for use like .dev, .test is probably best
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sknebel
but for gimme-a-token .invalid might make sense
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Zegnat
I wonder if there are local equivalents to example.com/.org/.net on other TLDs.
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jeremycherfas
!tell sknebel Do you think it is worth raising an issue (or seeing if there is one already)?
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Loqi
Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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Loqi
jeremycherfas: sknebel left you a message 22 minutes ago: seems like my theory was right and webmention.heroku.app uses a parser that doesn't follow the current rules for implied name properties - the post doesn't have one, so it tries to guess one badly :/
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sknebel
jeremycherfas: yes, sure
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Loqi
[EdwardHinkle] #75 Implied p-name issues
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jeremycherfas
And it was a webmention from [Rose]!
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sknebel
ah, it's a node app :/
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sknebel
the JS parser hasn't been maintained in ages
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jeremycherfas
And Pelle has been very busy elsewhere. What would be a positive suggestion to make?
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Zegnat
Best would be to find some people who work with Node for their indieweb tools and see if they are willing to have another look at the mf2 parser? It is a little murky
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jeremycherfas
Isn't schmarty a node person?
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jeremycherfas
!tell [Rose] when you were developing your site in Grav, were you using a child of Antimatter, or something else? I feel I ought to switch to Quark, as it is now the default and Anitmatter is not being developed much, but I don't really like it, so there would be a lot of customisation.
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Loqi
Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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[Rose]
I used a child of Antimatter
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jeremycherfas
I thought so. Torn between bending Quark to my will and the much bigger job of building my own.
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[Rose]
Tip: Copy Quark and then edit that
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[Rose]
No need to develop from scratch πŸ˜‰
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aaronpk
my fake microsub server is coming along :)
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[Rose]
Nice!
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snarfed
aaronpk: out of curiosity, could it be a static mapping of urls to static files?
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snarfed
there'd be lots of duplication in the static files, granted
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aaronpk
it mostly is yeah
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aaronpk
plus a little PHP to handle parameter switching and validation
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jeremycherfas
[Rose] Copy the whole thing, rather than develop a child?
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aaronpk
doesn't look like anything yet, but if you sign in to monocle with https://microsub.rocks you'll see stuff :)
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aaronpk
and if anyone wants to contribute sample content feel free to add stuff to https://github.com/aaronpk/microsub.rocks/tree/master/data/channels
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voxpelli
jeremycherfas: Zegnat: sknebel: What would help from a Node.js perspective is to add to issues and help dig into and pinpoint shortcomings
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voxpelli
A well described problem is lots easier to solve :)
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Zegnat
voxpelli, while true, I think the real problem is also users. E.g. I do not think I have ever used the node parser, so I do not really notice the problems
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jeremycherfas
I'd like to help, voxpelli but the best I can do is point out the issue and offer links.
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jeremycherfas
In the case I reported, it seems that name was picking up stuff from an on-this-day widget in WP.
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voxpelli
Also: If we get a wrongly parsed post added to https://github.com/voxpelli/node-webmention-testpinger then me and others will pull that into our projects
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Loqi
[voxpelli] node-webmention-testpinger: A tool to ping your site with a variety of real world WebMentions
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voxpelli
So add an issue or PR to that project mentioning the problematic content. You can also mention the other issue there
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jeremycherfas
OK, I'll try that.
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jeremycherfas
OH no, hang on. It is for [Tonz] to add his site, as that is the one giving the problem.
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sknebel
voxpelli: https://github.com/glennjones/microformat-shiv/issues is a start. If someone says they're actually going to look into fixing it again I'm more than happy to start filing issues again
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sknebel
but it's effort to file a good bug report, so I'm kind of wary to do it as long as even bugs where I've provided fixes are open for 2y+
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voxpelli
jeremycherfas: you can always add an issue there and ping him, or add a PR for it and mention that it shouldn’t be merged until [tonz] approve it
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jeremycherfas
I don't understand the difference between adding the issue there and adding it at https://github.com/voxpelli/webpage-webmentions/issues
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voxpelli
sknebel: would be great if the formerly mentioned issue could be linked to an issue there, then I’ll find it and maybe fix it when I arrive at fixing the issue in my repo
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voxpelli
jeremycherfas: the other project provides real world HTML for endpoints to use when testing their endpoints and is included as a β€œreal world” test in my webmention endpoint but also used by others
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jeremycherfas
I'll mention it on sknebel's PR and link to the two posts.
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voxpelli
What’s more important than fixing a bug here and now is to ensure that the same bug doesn’t occur again and tests are great at that – great in avoiding a bug whack-a-mole
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sknebel
https://github.com/voxpelli/webpage-webmentions/issues/75 already mentions what the relevant microformats change is at least
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Loqi
[EdwardHinkle] #75 Implied p-name issues
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GWG
I want to split the code that allows an endpoint to authenticate to an IndieAuth endpoint into it's own library as it is bundled with both Micropub and Microsub for redundancy.
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GWG
Thinking of calling it IndieAuth-Client
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GWG
Trying to decide if it should be in my repo or the Indieweb one
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aaronpk
There's already an IndieAuth client library in PHP, maybe clarify that this is for Wordpress?
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GWG
aaronpk, the name would be wordpress-indieauth-client
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aaronpk
Also if you're building stuff that's part of a micropub and Microsub server, how is it an IndieAuth client?
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GWG
Probably move the web sign in piece in there
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GWG
It is the piece that enables a client, I suppose
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GWG
I need a better name
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GWG
I use the Indieauth endpoint
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aaronpk
Ok then definitely don't include "client" in the name
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GWG
This is the code for people to use a third party endpoint
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GWG
Not sure what to call it
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aaronpk
something "external"?
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GWG
I could call it websignin as I want to bring that piece in
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GWG
Ot doesn't belong in the endpoint code
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aaronpk
If it's the thing that lets people sign in to Wordpress via web sign in then that'd be a good thing to include in the name
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GWG
Yes
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GWG
But if it does that and let's them use IndieAuth with a remote endpoint, should it be called that?
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GWG
Both go together, I think
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GWG
Because web signin makes no sense if you have a built in endpoint
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GWG
[tonz] was asking about this. I have all the code, but not in an easily configurable place.
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sknebel
sounds like it's token verification code?
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GWG
It does the Authorization flow
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voxpelli
GWG: indieauth-barbecue? Because that can give no one the wrong perception and gives you the opportunity to describe what it is in code
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GWG
And maps urls to users on a site
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GWG
I have no idea what that is though
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GWG
Barbecue seems random
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aaronpk
I think that's the point
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GWG
Yes
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GWG
But I may have to brainstorm on this a bit more
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GWG
Is web signin worth making it's own repo?
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aaronpk
one thing I've learned about naming is that it's not actually a good idea to use the name of the technology in the name
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GWG
aaronpk, will give you that
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GWG
But what can a Wordpress site do with web signin?
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Zegnat
If a plugin does nothing other then replacing the usual username & password login flow for the WP admin with a web sign-in flow, that is when I would call it web sign-in. Nothing else, as it may just make it murky what tech is meant or what feature is expected to be part of web sign-in.
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aaronpk
I do think how you log in to your site is independent of whether your site is its own IndieAuth server
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aaronpk
If it were me, I would make a new plugin for the web sign in part, which replaces the Wordpress login form with web sign in, and then keep the IndieAuth plugin doing just the IndieAuth server parts of issuing tokens and managing the consent screen. I would drop the external IndieAuth endpoint thing entirely, as I really don't think it provides much value and is mostly just confusing
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GWG
aaronpk, I wanted to
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GWG
snarfed is against it
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GWG
So I wanted to split it
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GWG
Also, tonz had a use case
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aaronpk
What's the use case?
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GWG
Using the IndieAuth endpoint on one wordpress site to log into another wordpress site
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aaronpk
I don't see how that requires the external IndieAuth part
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aaronpk
Make one Wordpress site an IndieAuth server, then set up web sign in on the other one
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GWG
Would that work for the Micropub/Microsub flow?
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aaronpk
You'd need the IndieAuth server plugin on both, but again how you log in to your site is independent of whether that site is an IndieAuth server
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Zegnat
I agree with aaronpk ... You'd still run all the same plugins, micropub/IndieAuth, just also happen to run a webs sign-in plugin to replace your login screen with something that accepts IndieAuth
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GWG
The code inside the IndieAuth server plugin can only be used with the local endpoint
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Zegnat
Kinda like how sink.zegnat.net has its own IndieAuth server, but will ask you to login with your own external IndieAuth
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GWG
I have another version of the code that uses IndieAuth.com
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aaronpk
you have to separate the idea of logging in to your site from the idea of providing an IndieAuth endpoint to micropub apps or IndieAuth clients
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GWG
So, three scenarios
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[Rose]
!tell jeremycherfas Yes, there's no need to start from nothing.
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Loqi
Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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GWG
I am confusing my terminology
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GWG
So, I can split web signin
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GWG
That's not an issue
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aaronpk
Remember when I suggested writing all these use cases down on the wiki and even started doing that but then the page got collapsed and everything was removed? This is why I was trying to do that
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GWG
The issue is using Micropub or such with a Wordpress site that doesn't want a built in IndieAuth endpoint
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GWG
I think they are still there
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Zegnat
If you have micropub you probably want the IndieAuth endpoint yourself, always. Because you can trust tokens that you yourself have issued the most.
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GWG
Zegnat, I do
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GWG
I am maintaining two sets of code
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aaronpk
I think you should just drop the whole idea of using external token endpoints for the IndieAuth server
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Zegnat
That too
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GWG
Which is why I want to split the code into its own repo
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GWG
So I can stop maintaining it
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GWG
Anyone who wants it can
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Zegnat
I still wonder if splitting token and Auth endpoints were a mistake in IndieAuth...
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Zegnat
steps out for dinner
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aaronpk
Zegnat: they are different in OAuth for good reason, which translates to IndieAuth as well
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aaronpk
if anything, using an external token endpoint or auth endpoint should be a totally separate plugin that you'd install instead of the IndieAuth plugin.
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aaronpk
Kind of like how if you want a Microsub server for your Wordpress you can install yarns (built in) or aperture (external)
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aaronpk
Please nobody make a plugin called Microsub that tries to do both with config options
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aaronpk
That's the situation we're in with IndieAuth right now
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GWG
aaronpk, that is exactly what I am trying to do
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GWG
I just need a name for that plugin
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GWG
I could call it open web oauth
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GWG
I hate naming things
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aaronpk
Me too
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aaronpk
ExAuth - short for external auth haha
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GWG
How about castle garden?
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GWG
I like the dual meanings
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GWG
I also like descriptive names
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GWG
But will run with it
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Loqi
[dshanske] #201 Split Indieauth client code into separate library
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GWG
Anyone for a plus 1
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GWG
I keep getting pulled in multiple directions
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GWG
In this case, fixing media uploads made me want to finally stop worrying about 3 forks of the same code
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GWG
aaronpk, you have a lot of projects..how do you keep on task when there is so much to do?
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aaronpk
Have you seen how many open issues and PRs there are on my repos?
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GWG
aaronpk, yes
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GWG
I wrote some of them
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GWG
That's why I thought you might have given the matter of having many open projects to maintain some thought
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GWG
How do you decide to switch from doing one thing to another?
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aaronpk
not well
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GWG
For me, I always stop for certain types of bug fixes
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GWG
And once I've embedded myself in code I always look at the issue list for other quick fixes
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aaronpk
seems reasonable
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GWG
I went to fix media uploads via Indigenous, which was due to single properties in the files array being arrays, which my code didn't expect
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GWG
But I also adjusted the last query to only look for recent media.
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GWG
Fixed some PHP notices
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GWG
An issue with automatically setting location
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GWG
And now the Indieauth piece as a separate plugin
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GWG
Then I can work on documenting h-feed
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[grantcodes]
aaronpk: I have a repo with a bunch of examples you could pull into your test server
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