#dev 2021-01-19

2021-01-19 UTC
ShadowKyogre, [tantek] and [fluffy] joined the channel
#
[fluffy] Yeah, that’d make sense.
#
[fluffy] My very basic understanding of how magnets work is they rely on a huge distributed hash table which is seeded by a few initial endpoints which are somehow made known to the torrent clients (presumably by having an address hardcoded in them), and the “awaiting magnet metadata” phase is basically just your client sending out pubsub requests for anyone who knows anything about the hash.
#
[fluffy] Someday I’ll have to look at the source for both Transmission and Syncthing to see how they do their things.
#
[fluffy] I was briefly using Syncthing to sync my things but I found that adding/removing machines from the quorum was too annoying and I went back to using my Nextcloud instance. But I can still totally see some use cases for Syncthing.
#
Ruxton_ there is DHT nodes, they share and exchange hashes+seeds. So you create a torrent, share it to a node, that node exchanges with other nodes it knows and so on and so on infinite
#
Ruxton_ clients can also tell the nodes about all the hashes+clients they know about
ShadowKyogre and deathrow1 joined the channel; ShadowKyogre left the channel
#
nekr0z The Syncthing developers have been discussing DHT for at least 4 years, but haven't done it yet. The general consensus seems to be it would be nice to have it, but the existing implementations don't quite fit, and writing a new one is too big a hassle. The thing with Syncthing is that an average Syncthing folder has way less peers than an average torrent, Kademlia file or some such other thing that DHT has been
#
nekr0z successfully used for.
[jeremycherfas] joined the channel; btrem left the channel
#
[jeremycherfas] Thanks all. I’m edging closer to a vague understanding.
schmudde, KartikPrabhu, cweiske, nickodd, swentel and [KevinMarks] joined the channel
#
[KevinMarks] you don't need a lot of peers for the dht part, you do for the torrent part
#
[KevinMarks] or rather you need a good chance of at least 1 peer for the torrent part
KartikPrabhu joined the channel
#
@mauricerenck ↩️ Wie stehen denn eigentlich die Chancen, bei dir im Blog auch kommentieren zu können? Oder Webmentions zu hinterlassen? Das fände ich ganz famos. (twitter.com/_/status/1351486588488966150)
gxt, smacko, IWSlackGateway1 and stevestreza joined the channel
#
@mauricerenck ↩️ Ja, ein elektrisches habe ich auch, für ne Mietwohnung ist der Trittschall aber trotzdem zu laut. Webmentions sind im Grunde so etwas wie eine Weiterentwicklung der Trackbacks damals. Dann kann ich in meinem Blog deinen Post verlinken und es taucht bei dir auf. (twitter.com/_/status/1351499401219465217)
#
@mauricerenck ↩️ Bei mir landen zb über webmentions auch Antworten/Likes bei Twitter als "Kommentar" unter meinen Beiträgen. (twitter.com/_/status/1351499930775519235)
nsh, [Rose] and schmudde joined the channel
#
jeremycherfas Status report: I don't know how, and I'm not sure I ever will know how, but Syncthing just does it from outside my home. I'm very happy.
#
[KevinMarks] probably STUN
#
jeremycherfas What is STUN?
#
Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "STUN" yet. Would you like to create it? (Or just say "STUN is ____", a sentence describing the term)
#
petermolnar https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/STUN
#
petermolnar not really indieweb-wiki material in my opinion
#
petermolnar see also https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traversal_Using_Relays_around_NAT
#
jeremycherfas Thanks for the pointer. I do regard Syncthing as IndieWeb relevant, but not how it works.
[Rob_Watts] joined the channel
#
GWG Does anyone have the ability to show all posts from a location on their site?
#
GWG Or region?
#
GWG For example, show all posts from Berlin?
shoesNsocks joined the channel; ShadowKyogre left the channel
#
aaronpk I've been wanting to do that
ShadowKyogre, [grantcodes], DanC and [tipoqueno] joined the channel; ShadowKyogre left the channel
#
[tipoqueno] Hey, I'm starting to build a web app for the first time and I'm looking for a real indie solution for the backend. I mean:
#
[tipoqueno] • NOT a venture capital backed product/service
#
[tipoqueno] • Don't use services of a mega corporation (AWS, Google, Microsoft)
#
[tipoqueno] My product:
#
[tipoqueno] • Will be small on purpose (no scale or growth)
#
[tipoqueno] • Will have a simple Stack (Mongo or some flavor of SQL, Express, VanillaJS, Node)
#
[tipoqueno] I explored and discarded some (Vercel, Netlify, Cloudfare, Heroku, Digital Ocean, DreamHost, Render, Supabase, Glitch, etc.) but I still can't decide.
#
[tipoqueno] Any experience / recommendation? Huge thanks!
#
aaronpk why did you decide against those?
#
aaronpk i’ve been using Linode for a long time, they’re great
#
aaronpk your other option of course is to buy your own servers and put them in a colo somewhere
#
aaronpk very indie but a lot more work
#
[tipoqueno] Those corporations goes against indie
#
[tipoqueno] Linode is my first option right now
[tw2113_Slack_] joined the channel
#
[tw2113_Slack_] Curious how DigitalOcean and Dreamhost “go against indie” as i use both
ShadowKyogre left the channel
#
[tipoqueno] I was talking about my points (VC backed & corporations), I still exploring options
#
[tipoqueno] Digital Ocean is a VC backed company, I'm not sure about DreamHost
jolvera_ and [Raphael_Luckom] joined the channel
#
[Raphael_Luckom] I'm using AWS exclusively (I think) and lose no sleep over paying them $1.50 / month for hosting--they get more of my business from Amazon Prime (both $ and use of AWS services). I wrote my thoughts about using AWS despite misgivings here https://raphaelluckom.com/posts/practitioner_journey.html#fn2 )
#
[Raphael_Luckom] otoh, one of the points of indieweb is plurality, so by all means go in the direction that makes sense to you.
#
[tw2113_Slack_] gotcha
[snarfed] joined the channel
#
[snarfed] right! we naturally get into tech politics sometimes here, but it’s a big tent, indieweb doesn’t mean we’re unilaterally against big tech co’s, VC, closed source, etc
#
[Raphael_Luckom] I'd be very bored if the only things people talked about here were the same things I would've thought of 😄
#
[Raphael_Luckom] lol, you could almost describe an indieweb goal as "finding the _smallest number_ of things that people have to agree on in order for disparate systems to interoperate"
#
[grantcodes] Hetzner is a popular ish option europe at least, no idea if it's vc funded though.
#
[grantcodes] There is also the high chance that smaller independent hosts use aws or google behind the scenes anyway 🤷
[grantcodes]1 and [christopherche] joined the channel
#
[christopherche] I need help with getting my css to work properly. Is this a good place to ask a question?
[KevinMarks] joined the channel
#
[KevinMarks] It isn't really our focus, but ask and we can see if we can help
#
[christopherche] I can’t figure out how to get the posts on my microblog feed/page to show bullet points. They do show when you click through to the post.
#
[christopherche] For example: see the first post on this page: https://christopherchelpka.com/categories/microblog
#
[christopherche] But styling is present here: https://www.christopherchelpka.com/2021/01/19/wish-you-knew.html
#
[KevinMarks] if you use inspect in chrome, you can see that #post-list li { list-style-type: none; } is overriding this (presumably from the post list template)
#
[KevinMarks] if you make that #post-list > li {   list-style-type: none; } it will only unstyle the immediate descendents, not the nested ones
#
[KevinMarks] is microblog doing that?
leg joined the channel
#
[KevinMarks] if you can't edit that CSS, you may need to add a rule for `#post-list > li li {   list-style-type: disc; }` to enable bullets on the further down ones
#
[KevinMarks] though that looks like a microblog bug
jolvera joined the channel
#
[christopherche] I was able to replace none and get the bullet points on the page, but it weirdly added on a single disc above every post.
#
[christopherche] Okay. I was able to fix it by returning the setting back to “none” then adding the rule you gave me. Thanks!
#
[christopherche] I’ve learned a few other things in the process too that will help for other things. Much appreciated.
#
[KevinMarks] right, the page of posts is marked up as a list (which is reasonable), but the CSS rule wasn't quite specific enough. [manton] might want to check the theme markup
nickodd and [Raphael_Luckom] joined the channel
#
[Raphael_Luckom] Hetzner looks pretty cool. I've started thinking about cloud services in terms of portfolio-diversity. For someone like me using AWS, a provider like Hetzner in a different jurisdiction with better privacy laws is at least an attractive option for backups.
#
[Raphael_Luckom] and there is a terraform provider, so I can probably integrate it relatively seamlessly
#
[Raphael_Luckom] all very long-term thoughts
[fluffy] joined the channel
#
swentel I used to run my site on hetzner, good service too, and fast machines
KartikPrabhu joined the channel
#
@ambrwlsn90 Adding webmentions to my blog posts has been helping me discover really great writers I never heard of before who w… https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1351613233464016906 (twitter.com/_/status/1351613233464016906)
[tantek] joined the channel
#
Seirdy does anybody know of any software that can grab webmentions and send from Fediverse (specifically, Pleroma) accounts without running a daemon like brid.gy? I'd like to run a command in CI that can connect to my Pleroma account and fetch webmentions from replies to a syndicated status.
#
Seirdy basically i'd like to run a command once instead of leaving a daemon running.
swentel and [KevinMarks] joined the channel
#
[KevinMarks] are you looking for a webmention endpoint, or something that converts fediverse replies to webmentions?
#
Seirdy the latter. lemme elaborate, one sec
#
Seirdy i already post my site to the fediverse via my pleroma account whenever i make new posts
#
Seirdy i'd like a program to fetch that URL (i can include it at the bottom of the article) and scan for replies/reactions, then convert those to webmentions, send them to my already-existing endpoint (webmentiond), and exit before CI runs `hugo build`.
#
Seirdy if one doesn't exist, i could whip one together, but i don't want to re-invent the wheel.
#
sknebel I dont think something like that exists, but it sounds like a very cool idea!
#
Seirdy basically i have daemon-phobia.
#
[tantek] pretty sure bridgyfed "converts fediverse replies to webmentions"
#
[KevinMarks] Hm. This is a bit like that, but not quite focused on syndication https://fed.brid.gy/ you may be able to borrow code
#
[tantek] I should just start calling it fridgy
#
Loqi yea!
#
Seirdy but that's a web service/daemon, not a "run and exit" CLI.
#
[KevinMarks] I thought bridgy fed was for making your site look like a fediverse instance
#
Seirdy yeah bridgy fed requires running mastodon on your server which is a hekkin chonker of a service.
#
[tantek] KevinMarks it's for handling all the AP interactions
#
Seirdy like a full rails app
#
[tantek] Seirdy no it doesnt!
#
[tantek] bridgyfed is specifically for folks WHO DON'T run masto
#
[KevinMarks] Right, I think it will have the bits you need (remapping formats), but you can extract those to build a run once thing
#
Seirdy [tantek]: i thought bridgyfed is different from regular bridgy because it makes your site a fediverse instance and lets it interact with the fediverse without POSSE.
#
Seirdy regular bridgy works with the fediverse through POSSE
#
Seirdy but both are daemons that need to always be running
#
aaronpk yeah it's still different than what you're describing, but the whole point is that it turns _your website_ into a fediverse instance without any special activitypub code or apps running
#
aaronpk i'm sure there's some examples of even static websites with bridgy fed
#
Seirdy aaronpk: ah so it's a single-user fediverse server.
#
Seirdy that lets your existing site be the frontend
#
aaronpk once you point your domain at it, it handles speaking all the activitypub parts
#
aaronpk but you don't need any special code or daemons
#
[tantek] right, none of bridgy requires running any daemons
[snarfed] joined the channel
#
[snarfed] fridgy++
#
Loqi fridgy has 1 karma over the last year
#
[tantek] 😄
#
Seirdy well i'd rather not rely on additional external services either; i self-host webmentiond and have a pleroma account on an instance hosted by someone else. i just think that grabbing replies from a known fedi URL at build-time doesn't need a daemon running 24/7, either hosted by me or someone else.
#
[tantek] Seirdy, sure, and I think Bridgy is built with that intention, providing a service for folks to get things up & running, and enable them to eventually replace that plumbing when that becomes their next priority
#
[snarfed] agreed! i would _love_ to see more backfeed implementations
#
Seirdy i basically see brid.gy as a daemon run by someone else, which seems like too much for extracting comments from one known URL per article. it makes sense for knowing where your site has been linked in all of twitter or the fediverse. speaking of which, does anybody know of a brid.gy alternative that's more lightweight/easy to self-host?
#
Seirdy (for if i ever get over my daemon-phobia)
#
[tantek] backfeed is still an art, to be sure
#
[tantek] what is backfeed
#
Loqi Backfeed is the process of syndicating interactions on your POSSE copies back (AKA reverse syndicating) to your original posts https://indieweb.org/backfeed
#
[tantek] start there Seirdy ^
nickodd left the channel
#
Seirdy cool thanks!
#
Seirdy bookmarks the link
ShadowKyogre, [Rob_Watts], [chrisaldrich], saptaks, [tantek]1, kitt, schmudde and [tantek] joined the channel; ShadowKyogre left the channel