#dev 2022-01-14

2022-01-14 UTC
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@gtsb_webmention
↩️ Review of DeFi ecosystem will be really helpful. Thanks for the great content!
(twitter.com/_/status/1481792031345238018)
KartikPrabhu joined the channel
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[schmarty]1
Oh no the account name has webmention in it
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aaronpk
it looks like they forgot what twitter account they were logged into
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aaronpk
looks like a test account
darkkirb, nertzy, Loqi, tracydurnell[d], PK[d], corenominal[d], edburns[d], balupton[d], Jeremiah[d], wackycity[d], rattroupe[d], shaunix[d], capjamesg[d], Myst[d], P1000[d], Christian_Olivie, gnoth[d], hoenir, cygnoir[d], RIZY101[d], aspenmayer[d], kimberlyhirsh[d], Silicon[d], sarahd[d], marksuth[d], MarkJR84[d], sayanarijit[d], Darius_Dunlap[d], gRegor, petermolnar and tetov-irc joined the channel
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[tantek]
https://blog.jim-nielsen.com/2022/a-web-for-all/ something we can do better on our own sites than the silos
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Loqi
The Optional Chaining Operator, β€œModern” Browsers, and My Mom
Seb[d] and chenghiz_ joined the channel
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[tantek]
that's an interesting distinction capjamesg[d] between /projects and /open_source
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[tantek]
I think it's worth exploring
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[tantek]
my first impression has been that the two would end up largely duplicated, however if we can come up with a crisp purpose / scope for each that matches different user needs
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[tantek]
then maybe we can make them each "work" and better serve their specific audiences
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[tantek]
I suppose that starts with identifying *who* is the audience for each
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[aciccarello]
Is this a #indieweb-meta conversation?
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[tantek]
I do like all the observations that edgeduchess[d] has made about developers wanting to help
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[tantek]
aciccarello, sort of, it's a dev x meta conversation, very specific to devs but yes meta about wiki pages
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[aciccarello]
cool, just wanted to check before continuing
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[tantek]
you're right to ask!
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[aciccarello]
My impression was also that it would be duplicate but I could see where it would be helpful to see what projects want contributions
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[aciccarello]
The projects page seems hard to scan outside of the TOC
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[aciccarello]
RE: Web for all. I've thought about the unsupported devices problem when trying to open web pages on old computers. I think it's good to call out that not everyone has the option to update browsers.
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capjamesg[d]
[tantek] I thought it was an appropriate choice to have two separate pages.
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capjamesg[d]
While a page on /projects may be open source, I wanted a hub that could act as the main point of reference for projects looking for / accepting contributions.
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[aciccarello]
what is contributing?
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Loqi
It looks like we don't have a page for "contributing" yet. Would you like to create it? (Or just say "contributing is ____", a sentence describing the term)
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capjamesg[d]
As a way for someone like me who wants to contribute to open source a bit more to find out how they can help in the community.
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[aciccarello]
what is contribute?
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Loqi
Here are a few ways to participate in and contribute to IndieWebCamp, before, during, after, and even if you can't make it: join online live discussion, add your projects to your IndieWeb User Page, help wikify the current / upcoming IndieWebCamp! https://indieweb.org/contribute
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[aciccarello]
I'm surprised there's nothing about open source/software contributions on that page
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capjamesg[d]
contribute << [[Open Source]]
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Loqi
ok, I added "[[Open Source]]" to a brand new "See Also" section of /contribute https://indieweb.org/wiki/index.php?diff=79099&oldid=61846
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[aciccarello]
capjamesg, My first impression was that the projects page should have a section for projects looking for contributors but it's already so long as is
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capjamesg[d]
Yes. And that's after I pruned it earlier today.
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capjamesg[d]
I hope the page will stay updated with only active projects.
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capjamesg[d]
I'd be inclined to say that personal website implementations only being used by one person might not be worth showing on the page just yet, or maybe having on a separate page.
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capjamesg[d]
That would help bring the focus to projects that have at least a few community implementations which are more likely to have more docs, people to speak to who know the tech, etc.
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[aciccarello]
Right, those should probably be on their user page
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capjamesg[d]
I didn't make that change because I did not want to do it without asking how people would feel about it.
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[aciccarello]
I can see how projects is currently more organized with the lens of "I want to use a project" than "I want to get involved with a project"
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capjamesg[d]
Yes. And I wanted to make the open source part explicit.
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capjamesg[d]
Someone searching for open source projects to contribute to should be able to do so with minimal effort. It's hard enough to find projects looking for contributions imo.
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[aciccarello]
I would be interested to see a [looking for contributions] badge on the projects page
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[aciccarello]
Something that stands out enough to see when scanning the page
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[aciccarello]
Also, I think it's funny that the projects page is tagged as a stub. "Help by expanding it" πŸ˜…
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aaronpk
what's the opposite of a stub? "this page is a long rambling mess, please help us by contracting it" πŸ˜‚
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[aciccarello]
Interesting to look at the CMS page. It just has a list of links to project pages rather than a full section for each
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[aciccarello]
what is a cms?
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Loqi
A content management system (often abbreviated as CMS) is software used to create, enter, edit, update, delete content on websites; some CMSs are used for IndieWeb sites, see the tables on this page for current usage https://indieweb.org/CMS
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[aciccarello]
I guess I don't see what the intention of the projects page is currently
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[aciccarello]
Maybe there isn't a unified one right now which is part of the problem πŸ˜‚
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aaronpk
i think that is in fact the problem
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aaronpk
apparently it is my fault, i created the page 10 years ago haha
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[aciccarello]
If I'm looking for a project, I'm probably going to look at the page of what I want the project to do (i.e. CMS or webmentions, etc)
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[tantek]
it was simpler when there were fewer projects πŸ™‚
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[tantek]
aciccarello, agreed re: projects page not skimmable
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[tantek]
I think once we are done filtering/pruning the projects page of dead branches (so to speak) it will be a lot better
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[tantek]
I like the split between:
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[tantek]
projects = audience is people looking for a project to *use* (both users and developers, e.g. a library that just "handles something" for them that they can build on)
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[tantek]
open source = OSS that supports IndieWeb at any/all levels that is welcoming / open to contributors / contributions (perhaps clustered by how easy it is to get involved / make a difference/contribution, how much of a community there is)
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[tantek]
agreed on broadening /contribute to include developers looking to contribute to some OSS
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[tantek]
capjamesg[d]++ for helping with the very painful task of pruning / moving projects to /former_projects
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Loqi
capjamesg[d] has 21 karma in this channel over the last year (60 in all channels)
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[aciccarello]
Is there any way to narrow down the scope of projects? Right now it feels like "any software that would be remotely helpful for an indieweb project"
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[tantek]
I like the broad scope, *and* as you hinted in another comment, I think the /projects page can lean on other page for more comprehensive lists, e.g. /SSG and /CMS
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[tantek]
other pages*
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capjamesg[d]
Happy to help πŸ™Œ
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[aciccarello]
capjamesg[d]++ Yeah nice work keeping the wiki helpful
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[tantek]
aciccarello, note the TOC is deliberately organized by use-cases / clusters of what people may be looking for when they get to the page. that's very deliberate.
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Loqi
capjamesg[d] has 22 karma in this channel over the last year (61 in all channels)
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aaronpk
i just moved a couple of my old things from /projects to /former_projects
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aaronpk
there's some really ancient stuff on there heh
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capjamesg[d]
Can Loqi send a reminder when an old page with a lot of content might need a review?
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capjamesg[d]
actually, there is a uk government slack bot that does just that.
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aaronpk
i'm sure there's a mediawiki report for that
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aaronpk
lots of stuff to find things that need work here https://indieweb.org/Special:SpecialPages
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[tantek]
there's a MediaWiki Special Pages I think for least recent edited pages
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[tantek]
that's more actually #indieweb-meta so I'll fork that thread there
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[tw2113_Slack_]
it’s been an afternoon of ES6 JS for me today
fel joined the channel
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[tantek]
8.5 days until the 4th anniversary of the WebSub Recommendation! https://indieweb.org/timeline#January
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Loqi
I added a countdown scheduled for 2022-01-23 3:08am PST (#6913)