#dev 2023-08-18

2023-08-18 UTC
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[snarfed] I think neither is strictly spec-compliant, but in practice both are nice user-friendly shortcuts that will generally help much more than they hurt. GWG++
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Loqi GWG has 7 karma in this channel over the last year (50 in all channels)
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aaronpk I suspect this hasn't come up much before because it only applies when sending a webmention to the same website
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GWG I know [pfefferle] and I debated self mentions a few times
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GWG But people use them
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GWG tracydurnell has a specific affinity for it
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GWG As sort of an automatic cross reference
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aaronpk and if your own code is receiving your webmentions then you can shortcut the verification step and handle relative URLs however you want
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aaronpk its only a question/problem when an external service like webmention.io is your webmention receiver
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[snarfed] right. I suspect this wasn't [Jo]'s original problem in https://chat.indieweb.org/dev/2023-08-14#t1692028187984400 though, but not sure
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Loqi [preview] [[Jo]] Does http://webmention.io do its own thing or something? Idk i tried to send a webmention with just the link and it didnt work so i ended up putting u-in-reply-to
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aaronpk It could be this:
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aaronpk if there are no microformats on the page then a plain link will be accepted. But if there are some microformats on the page and the link isn't in the parsed object I think it treats it like it isn't there at all
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aaronpk it should fall back to plain HTML parsing in that case but I think that code isn't in there right now
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[Jo] Ooh ok interesting
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[jamietanna] Snarfed is there a way to backfill webmentions from Bridgy Fed? I assume not (easily)
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[snarfed] [jamietanna] like from before you signed up? Or to retry failures?
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[jamietanna] Ah just the failures that have happened since signing up
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[snarfed] Ah. You can definitely collect them manually and resend them, but there's nothing automated yet
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[snarfed] I need to make it retry with backoff like Bridgy classic
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rubenwardy [tantek]: the spam's json is https://gist.github.com/rubenwardy/501dfa52de5ce8a8e6e87448492e9c50
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rubenwardy using webmention.io
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rubenwardy I guess the chances are good that this is pingback and not webmention
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aaronpk oh apparently i'm not exposing the source type in the api
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aaronpk i checked the DB and confirmed it was a pingback
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rubenwardy ah interesting
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[tantek] worth exposing in the API IMO so folks can track and/or opt out of pingback bridging
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aaronpk +1
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[tantek] might even be worth turning off pingback bridging by default and enabling it involves a warning that pingback can be spammy
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sknebel It is something the site author has to explicitly setup by adding the pingback Link
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aaronpk i changed the documentation already to discourage adding the pingback tag
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[tantek] 👍
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rubenwardy everything is moderated and 2 instances in a year isn't much
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rubenwardy my comment form was getting multiple spam comments a day until I added a honey pot field
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rubenwardy now it's been 1 since I added the field
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rubenwardy surprisingly effective
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rubenwardy (honeypot field = a field hidden by CSS that a bot will fill out but users won't)
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[tantek] what are local comments
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Loqi local comments are comments (sometimes called native comments) that are made directly (locally) on a post (like an article) in the UI of the site serving it, instead of posting a reply post on an indieweb site and sending a webmention https://indieweb.org/local_comments
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[tantek] rubenwardy ^ add yourself to the https://indieweb.org/local_comments#IndieWeb_Examples section there if you like! especially with a summary of your honeypot technique that you have found effective in auto-spam-blocking
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rubenwardy My September blog post will be about my experience implementing indieweb stuff and local comments
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rubenwardy so that would be good to link there
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rubenwardy how do I link to my user
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rubenwardy added something there with dodgy user formatting
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[tantek] rubenwardy++
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Loqi rubenwardy has 3 karma in this channel over the last year (4 in all channels)
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rubenwardy so much of the spam caught is just pure gibberish
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superkuh I actually implemented local comments and webmention support the same way: having nginx log certain endpoints to .log files on disk.
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superkuh So to leave a comment it's just http://mydomain.com/@say/Any sentence here. It can be multiple sentences. For some directories the comments are displayed in-line in iframes, but most just go to a general 'comment' page. Like a guestbook.
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superkuh Very few bots are made to leave comments in such a weird way.
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superkuh I don't get much spam at all.
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[tantek] whoa never heard of that technique. definitely worth adding to https://indieweb.org/local_comments#IndieWeb_Examples
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[tantek] rubenwardy, when you have a moment, if you recall when (what date) you added support for local comments, and a link to your first post that received them (presumably on that date or soon after), can you add them to your entry? I put a couple of placeholders there for now: https://indieweb.org/local_comments#rubenwardy
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rubenwardy added now
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[tantek] 👍
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rubenwardy ok, set up template for my user
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rubenwardy nice
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superkuh I wish that along with "Disallow" and "Allow" there was a "Comment" field in robots.txt where you could "send" (really have them pull) a message to web spiders's owners.
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[tantek] tried updating my profile (home page) with another rel=me u-url link (to my Threads profile) and it didn't show up on Mastodon site views of my @tantek.com@tantek.com
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[snarfed] did you click the 🔄 button on https://fed.brid.gy/web/tantek.com to update your profile?
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Loqi [preview] Tantek Çelik
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[tantek] I did !
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[tantek] clicking that button worked to activate a seeming profile update propagation in the dashboard
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[tantek] I mean just the additional link showing up at all (nevermind verified) e.g. at https://w3c.social/@tantek.com@tantek.com/
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[snarfed] ok! then yeah it's probably that it needs to be https://fed.brid.gy/r/https://tantek.com/ , sadly
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Loqi [preview] Tantek Çelik
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[snarfed] ah ok
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Loqi [preview] Tantek Çelik
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[snarfed] and yeah profile updates tend to be delayed/flaky, we still don't perfectly understand the reasons
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[tantek] well they seem to have propagated to lots of servers per https://fed.brid.gy/web/tantek.com
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Loqi [preview] Tantek Çelik
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[snarfed] yup. and looking at the AS2 Update BF sent, your https://www.threads.net/@tantek link is in there
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capjamesg Is there a reason "999+ followers" shows up?
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capjamesg Is that a limit of BF or something else?
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[snarfed] because counting is hard 🤷
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[snarfed] (it's BF)
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[snarfed] (I don't currently store the count, it currently does a table scan every time, so I limit it)
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[snarfed] [tantek] I'd be curious to look at your profile on a non-Mastodon instance that follows you to see if it shows the update
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[tantek] something like pleroma or misskey?
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[snarfed] sure!
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