#dev 2023-10-04

2023-10-04 UTC
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[tantek] seems like an interesting robots.txt extension: https://www.theverge.com/2023/9/28/23894779/google-ai-extended-training-data-toggle-bard-vertex
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[tw2113] and Google will actually obey too...because they had to turn it on by default
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[tw2113] it should be robots.txt directives to opt IN to training, not opt OUT
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gRegor definitely
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gRegor Added to /robots_txt and my site
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gRegor Timely as I'm scrolling through the reader: https://vonexplaino.com/blog/posts/reply/2023/10/ai-has-bloated-my-robots.txt.html
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Loqi [preview] [Colin Morris] I had a trim robots.txt until the AIbots came Last year I started having search issues due to my host and third party DNS service got each other in a tizzy. I'm not in Google results, not in Bing. After having no success with either of their supports...
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gRegor Ooh https://www.w3.org/community/blog/2023/10/02/proposed-group-update-robots-txt-standards-community-group/
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[tantek] Yeah seems ill-conceived (as the comments make it clear). Work is already happening here: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/rfc9309/
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Soni telling ppl that a grassroots movement can't actually rely on OS vendors to do things...
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jeremycherfas Surprised they didn't manage a i
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Soni jeremycherfas: hmm?
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Soni anyway, we see "OS vendors do the thing" as the endgoal. we need ways to do the thing without the OS vendors.
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jeremycherfas Yes. PEPCAC
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jeremycherfas PEBCAC
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[schmarty] "Problem Exists Between Congress and Corporations"? 🙃
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c​apjamesg ?
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Soni we're mostly talking about #fedilinks but anyway
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[catgirlinspace] when decoding url encoded form data, should %20 be a space or a +? the url decode function im using is using + and wasn’t sure if this was right for doing form data.
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[snarfed] %20 is space
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[snarfed] often in practice + is also decoded to space, but that's a separate convention, not URL-encoding
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[snarfed] (%2B is +)
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[snarfed] https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/rfc3986.html#section-2.1
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sknebel this direction is clear, yes. %20 is space
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[tantek] in a query param (the stuff after a '?' but before a '#'), space == '+' == space
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[tantek] I believe this was so that forms with GET handlers created more readable URLs based on text inputs with spaces in them
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[tantek] because %20 is ugly
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[tantek] this%20is%20not%20friendly%20to%20read, whereas+this+is+easily+readable
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sknebel and in application/x-www-form-urlencoded form submissions also with POST
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sknebel but since the question was about decoding %20, this is all not entirely relevant
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[catgirlinspace] ah, looks like the body is sent as `space=no+wait%2Byes` for (no wait+yes). so before doing the url decoding i could just replace + with space and then the %2B still decodes to a +.
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[snarfed] python's unquote_plus is an example that handles that right: https://docs.python.org/3.11/library/urllib.parse.html#urllib.parse.unquote_plus
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sknebel right, this is not something you should have to do yourself
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[catgirlinspace] it is in my case though. decided to deal with the challenge of implementing a lot of stuff from scratch by using a runtime with very light like, utility things. is more fun this way :3
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sknebel fair :)
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sknebel (fwiw, HTML5 describes something like that as the algorithm how to do it: replace "+" with "%20", then decode as before: https://url.spec.whatwg.org/#application/x-www-form-urlencoded )
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c​apjamesg Wow haha.
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c​apjamesg “The application/x-www-form-urlencoded format is in many ways an aberrant monstrosity, the result of many years of implementation accidents and compromises leading to a set of requirements necessary for interoperability, but in no way representing good design practices”
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[tantek] lolsob. evergreen
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sknebel I did resist quoting it myself 😅
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sknebel But to be fair the web world overall does an impressive job of making the best out of these things. Are they messy? Yes. Is how to handle them nowadays properly documented? Also yes. Was old stuff broken? No.
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[KevinMarks] That's like the Python csv library
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[KevinMarks] Hm the current version is less rude than I remember. https://docs.python.org/3/library/csv.html
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[KevinMarks] Maybe it was PEP 305 I was thinking of https://peps.python.org/pep-0305/#rationale
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[schmarty] a whole PEP for CSVs! 😮
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[tantek] all this talk of FEP and PEP is tempting me to start MEEPs for #microformats engineering enhancement proposals
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[tantek] or should we have IWEEP for IndieWeb Engineering Enhancement Proposal? 😛
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[schmarty] https://i.imgur.com/KuJCh.gif
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[tantek] any MEEPs that are based purely on solving hypothetical problems will be recategorized as MEHs (microformats enhancement hypothetical)
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[schmarty] how broadly can we scope a MEEP? is "Turn the industry against Tailwind to stop the proliferation of utility classnames that interfere with mf2 parsing" too far? 😏
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[tantek] MEEPs are only for *engineering* enhancements. That sounds political
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Soni web+ap://chaos.social/@SoniEx2/111176934467289233
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Soni hmm
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Soni didn't we have link previews
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[schmarty] engineering is political 😂
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[tantek] Soni I doubt curl supports web+ap: 😛
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Soni who maintains the link previews again?
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[tantek] Soni, sounds like a question for the developers of the chat client you are using
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Soni [tantek]: yeah we doubt curl is a fully featured activitypub implementation too
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[tantek] hence better to stick with sharing https: URLs
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Soni why not add web+ap to the preview bot?
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[tantek] little to no real world uses would mean it's a low priority at best
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Soni (ideally web+* if you want compatibility with all of fedilinks)
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[tantek] especially for a volunteer-based project
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Soni we mean, it works in feditext and tokodon
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[tantek] since everything takes time. "why not add" <-- in general request for free labor are not a great thing
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Soni [tantek]: that goes for all feature requests then
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[tantek] correct, thus you can file a feature request issue (put in some labor) if you want it to be good faith considered
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Soni hmm what's the thing that does the previews again...
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[tantek] what is the thing that does link previews in chat
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "thing that does link previews in chat" yet. Would you like to create it? (Or just say "thing that does link previews in chat is ____", a sentence describing the term)
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[tantek] The thing that does link previews in chat is /Loqi
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Loqi ok
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[tantek] what is the thing that does link previews in chat
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Loqi Loqi is a friendly and useful bot/digital therapist present in the IndieWeb discussion channels https://indieweb.org/thing_that_does_link_previews_in_chat
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Soni ah okay, thanks
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Soni meh we'll try to remember to do it when the power comes back
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