#dev 2024-01-07
2024-01-07 UTC
# 
Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "custom emoji" yet. Would you like to create it? (Or just say "custom emoji is ____", a sentence describing the term)
# Loqi ok, I added "silo examples: Twitch, Slack, Discord" to a new "See Also" section of /custom_emoji https://indieweb.org/wiki/index.php?diff=92003&oldid=92002
# 
sknebel dont see one on https://codeberg.org/fediverse/fep#feps
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# 
[tantek] custom emoji << Twitter popularized custom emoji starting in 2014 <blockquote>In 2014, Twitter introduced hashflags, special hashtags that automatically generate a custom emoji next to them for a certain period of time. Hashflags may be generated by Twitter themselves or be purchased by corporations.</blockquote> — https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twitter#Posts. It's likely that Mastodon got the idea (like most of Mastodon's UI) from Twitter.
# Loqi ok, I added "Twitter popularized custom emoji starting in 2014 <blockquote>In 2014, Twitter introduced hashflags, special hashtags that automatically generate a custom emoji next to them for a certain period of time. Hashflags may be generated by Twitter themselves or be purchased by corporations.</blockquote> — https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twitter#Posts. It's likely that Mastodon got the idea (like most of Mastodon's UI) from Twitter." to the "See Also" section of /custom_emoji https://indieweb.org/wiki/index.php?diff=92017&oldid=92016
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# starrwulfe If anyone more technical than me can give this post I made a look:
# starrwulfe https://starrwulfe.xyz/b/1Scz
# starrwulfe I'm wondering if what I'd like to do is even possible... What technology stacks should I start investigating?
# starrwulfe real_devastatia[d] capjamesg[d] ⬆️ thats what I was alluding to earlier ⬆️
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# starrwulfe Ahh but there is an API:
# IWDiscord <starrwulfe#0>
# starrwulfe There are extensions known as CraftX extensions that hook in and use the api to publish straight to Ghost and Medium or bring files into Ulysses and iA Writer for example. If I can build off those to engineer in the same manner, then it may be doable.
# starrwulfe There’s also this project using Notion’s API that I’ll fork and dig into to see if I can find a way to do everything in CraftDoc as it’s doing with Notion:
# IWDiscord <starrwulfe#0>
# starrwulfe https://github.com/izuolan/notionic
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# darylsun Did something happen to IndieLogin?
# darylsun Apparently PGP is disabled now? But it can't detect my email address either???
# darylsun Never mind, I think I forgot to put my email in the header for my homepage
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# darylsun Hmmm, still not working...
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# real_devastatia starrwulfe[d]: A CMS stores the page content and metadata in a database. It's a relatively simple matter to retrieve that data to generate an RSS feed.
# real_devastatia I'm not familiar with CraftDocs or any of the other tools because I've always coded everything from scratch except when I worked on my former employer's custom CMS.
# real_devastatia Your question about sub-sites sounds like what we called sections in Web MVC (model-view-controller). There are separate Controller classes for each section of an MVC website.
# real_devastatia I don't like building hierarchies of Controllers because a controller is just a glorified switch statement.
# real_devastatia [tantek]: What app are you considering converting to/from Markdown? I don't like Markdown personally, especially when used on forums. vbCode (aka bbCode, MyCode, etc.) has been used on forums for decades, and that's what forum users are familiar with. Being forced to use Markdown instead trips me up.
# capjamesg [tantek] If you can make something simpler than markdown, with less weird hidden things you don't know apply (I recall there being something about two spaces at the end of a line doing something. I can't remember.), it's worth a think!
# real_devastatia starrwulfe[d] "These probably mean some sort of database and parsing engines would need to be running at set intervals to parse the CraftDocs..."
# real_devastatia You may have to resort to a periodic cron job, but ideally there would be hooks in the CMS that allow you to do those things when you publish the page.
# capjamesg I like markdown, but I only use a small subset of it in publishing. I use headings, italics, images, and occasionally bold text. Sometimes I use other things, but so rarely they aren't coming to mind right now.
# real_devastatia My backend parser parses pages in two different ways. It renders one version with JS clickables because they're required for the SPA site. It renders another straight HTML version for my RSS feed.
# capjamesg The fact that I can say "## title" with markdown, for example, is amazing, rather than say <h2>title</h2> as I would in HTML.
# capjamesg The more out of the way my writing markup can be, the better.
# capjamesg Oh, and I use links.
# capjamesg Out of ReST (which I don't like), markdown, and MediaWiki, markdown is my favourite for links.
# capjamesg I forget which order links go in for MediaWiki almost every time I add a link (and I have been using the software for years).
# capjamesg (is it link then text or text then link?)
# capjamesg Zegnat++
# real_devastatia capjamesg[d]: The only headline tag I use is <h1>, and that's for page titles. The page skeleton containing the <h1> tag is automatically generated when I create a new page, and the <h1> content is inserted automatically populated when I type the article title into the title field.
# real_devastatia [edit] capjamesg[d]: The only headline tag I use is <h1>, and that's for page titles. The page skeleton containing the <h1> tag is automatically generated when I create a new page, and the <h1> content is automatically populated when I type the article title into the title field.
# real_devastatia Oh, and the volume headers on my front page are <h3>, but I only have to add one of those once a year.
# real_devastatia Here's some fun. Have a text input for the title and a textarea for the content. Have an empty <h1> tagset in the content field. Watch the title in the content magically fill itself in as you type in the page title.
# real_devastatia function initTitleField()
# real_devastatia function keyup()
# IWDiscord <real_devastatia#0>
# real_devastatia {
# real_devastatia {
# real_devastatia var bodyField = document.getElementById('edit-content-field');
# real_devastatia var titleField = document.getElementById('edit-title-field');
# real_devastatia bodyField.value = bodyField.value.replace(/<h1>.*<\/h1>/i, '<h1>' + titleField.value + '</h1>');
# IWDiscord <real_devastatia#0>
# real_devastatia with (document.getElementById('edit-title-field')) {
# real_devastatia removeEventListener('keyup', keyup);
# real_devastatia addEventListener('keyup', keyup);
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# 
[KevinMarks] Markdown still can't nest lists reliably
# capjamesg Almost every time I want to make a table, for example, I use HTML.
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# capjamesg > doesn't really pretend to be plain-text readable (it isn't IMO)
# capjamesg Yeah, but it is difficult to author.
# IWDiscord <capjamesg#0>
# capjamesg (links in particular)
# capjamesg Irrespective of that, I don't think a lot of people authoring markdown are publishing it raw.
# [KevinMarks] Tables without colspan aren't too bad, but interpreting tab separated on paste is the main win
# capjamesg Rather, they write markdown knowing it is going to be presented.
# capjamesg I love how a "markdown guide" admits "Creating tables with hyphens and pipes can be tedious." 😄
# capjamesg That is maybe a problem for another day, though. Tables are _hard_.
# [KevinMarks] There's a lot of duelling markdown in fediverse as some tools do it (correctly imo) on input text, and some on posted text. AP is defined as html, but treating is as markdown is a thing some clients do
# [KevinMarks] They're useful in github issues etc
# capjamesg Yes. I haven't used most of the features in that guide. I didn't even know a lot of them existed.
# [KevinMarks] I tend to move tables through Google sheets before emailing them via Gmail, as they have wrangled the outlook interop
# real_devastatia [tantek]: Typing HTML for tables is tedious.
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# [KevinMarks] It isn't if you type html rather than xhtml - <td> is self closing as is <tr>
# real_devastatia I don't self-close tagsets that have closing tags.
# [KevinMarks] Sure, but replacing \n with <tr><td> and \t with <td> gets you most of the way
# capjamesg [tantek] Was your timeline graph that you showed at HWC a table?
# capjamesg I think about that graph a lot.
# capjamesg It is one of my favourite pieces of HTML.
# capjamesg Yeah. I think there should be some kind of generator for it.
# real_devastatia I found a flexbox widget that creates an org chart from nested lists. The problem I keep having with flexbox-based widgets though is that they break when used in a flexbox page layout.
# [KevinMarks] Tables with svg in some elements can be good
# capjamesg I thought "web component!" to help make authoring easier, but then you'd need JS and you miss part of the magic.
# [KevinMarks] This is where I go mad in nunjucks or jinja2
# capjamesg jinja2++
# capjamesg I like templating languages but I have seen them used poorly.
# real_devastatia Google "mark turanksy better javascript templates". It uses pure JS like ASP, not a template language.
# capjamesg When it is hard to know if main app logic or templating logic is controlling something, you have a problem.
# [KevinMarks] I know what you mean, but trying to do iteration without explicit declarative tooling I'd hard
# capjamesg oneproblematatime++
# [KevinMarks] Mavo is the closest I've seen to making it html native, and the separation of templating macros ends up being tjeb lesser evil a lot of the time
# [KevinMarks] I'm not sure. I think it did fall between the server and client models
# real_devastatia http://blog.markturansky.com/BetterJavascriptTemplates.html
# [KevinMarks] My pov is that if Lea, who knows much more about the domain than I do, and is a star at api and design can't square that circle, it may be too hard
# real_devastatia Turansky says you have to put the templates in textareas, but I ship disallowed stuff in JSON by base64 encoding it on the server and decoding it in the client.
# capjamesg I admire the work Lea did on Mavo.
# 
rubenwardy missed the conversation a bit but... I switched from Markdown to ASCIIDoc for writing my book as Markdown just doesn't have the features I need. Like admonitions
# rubenwardy my blog still uses Markdown though
# [KevinMarks] Conditionals and iterating are the tricky parts of templating
# capjamesg GitHub has them.
# capjamesg But they aren’t standard.
# capjamesg And they are poorly documented.
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# real_devastatia [KevinMarks]: Scroll up and click? lol
# rubenwardy TIP, WARNING, IMPORTANT
# capjamesg [tantek] it is basically a callout box.
# capjamesg Yeah. I forget the syntax all the time.
# capjamesg Agreed.
# real_devastatia I feel like I'm shadow banned in here. See you folks later! lol
# capjamesg real_devastatia[d] Nooo! 😅
# [tantek] http://chat.indieweb.org/dev for this channel
# rubenwardy anyway, Markdown isn't a standard in itself, the introducing document isn't an exact specification. There's so many different implementations. I recommend CommonMark or GitHub Flavoured Markdown (GFM)
# capjamesg The syntax reminds me of Ruby real_devastatia[d].
# capjamesg Wait…
# capjamesg What is it called. ERB?
# rubenwardy <+[tantek]> Lol [!note] is better than <note> how?
# rubenwardy It can't be confused with HTML, for one
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# [tantek] That being said, I do like the inline admonition syntax in https://docs.asciidoctor.org/asciidoc/latest/blocks/admonitions/ because it is literally "just" text with the use of ALLCAPS to communicate the admonition! I bet that solve like 90% of use-cases
# rubenwardy you can't include markdown inside html blocks (unless it's inline)
# rubenwardy yeah. ASCIIDoc is just more flexible (at the cost of being a bit finicky
# rubenwardy )
# rubenwardy can have plugins as well I believe
# rubenwardy in my Markdown version, I used liquid for callouts
# rubenwardy
{% include warning.html note=warnings.thing %}geskeca joined the channel
# rubenwardy Latin
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# rubenwardy It's very useful when writing a book as it gives you more customisation over how it's formatted
# rubenwardy For my blog, I've used "extensions" (well, custom liquid tags and includes) to have:
# rubenwardy - figures and galleries
# rubenwardy - embed cards (links that show the OpenGraph title and image)
# rubenwardy - youtube embed
# rubenwardy my figure extension automatically generates optimised thumbnails
# Loqi Liquid is an open source templating language developed by Shopify https://indieweb.org/Liquid
# rubenwardy it's a markdown file though
# rubenwardy just with `
{% figure "./image.png", "An image" %}` sprinkled around# rubenwardy there is a way I could extend the markdown parser to turn automatically turn images on their own into figures, but I wanted the ability to have different alts to captions
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# rubenwardy I could make it so `\nCaption` works
# rubenwardy but that requires messing with the markdown parser
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# [Paul_Robert_Ll] I use this plugin for markdown it (there are others that do similar): https://www.npmjs.com/package/markdown-it-image-figures
# [Paul_Robert_Ll] Personally, I think Markdown (or CommonMark) could do with redefining the syntax for images with titles to be images with figure captions.
# rubenwardy [Paul_Robert_Ll]: I saw that, but doesn't support separate caption to alt
# [Paul_Robert_Ll] It does: ``
# rubenwardy hmm
# rubenwardy I suppose there's probably hooks to insert my thumbnail system as well
# [Paul_Robert_Ll] FWIW, I’m storing my markdown files in a separate repo, and took the time to document that particular conventions I’m using in my documents. https://github.com/paulrobertlloyd/paulrobertlloyd-content
# starrwulfe https://www.tablesgenerator.com/
# starrwulfe Saw the earlier convo about Markdown/HTML/BBCode and tables... Thought I'd leave this tool here that saves me all the time:
# IWDiscord <starrwulfe#0>
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# starrwulfe One of the more mindnumbing parts of my job is that I have to make some of our data tables into ASCII sometimes for presenting in notes that need to show up in TTY/terminal screens and plain text messages where the only thing I'm guaranteed is monospaced font.
# starrwulfe So this has helped me tremendously.
# capjamesg aaronpk You may find https://github.com/swyxio/domainblocklist interesting (maybe start from the bottom of the README, after the list)
# capjamesg [edit] aaronpk You may find https://github.com/swyxio/domainblocklist interesting (maybe start from the bottom of the README, after the list)
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# [tantek] create << useful for making ASCII tables (suitable for monospace displays like inside pre tags) https://www.tablesgenerator.com/
# Loqi ok, I added "useful for making ASCII tables (suitable for monospace displays like inside pre tags) https://www.tablesgenerator.com/" to the "See Also" section of /create https://indieweb.org/wiki/index.php?diff=92024&oldid=91302
# starrwulfe 🤠 much obliged!
# starrwulfe You'll also find it does MediaWiki, LaTex and all that too.
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# capjamesg [KevinMarks] I saw that.
# capjamesg Impressive engineering.
# capjamesg Seriously impressive engineering.