#meta 2019-06-27

2019-06-27 UTC
mattl, manfred7381[m], [chrisaldrich], djmoch, [Michael_Beckwit and [tantek] joined the channel
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[tantek] [fluffy] aaronpk is bringing tea so we will at a minimum have that. I'm checking on decaf coffee. LMK if you have any other meal/drink special requests!
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[fluffy] Awesome, thanks!
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david.shanske.com edited /2019 (+94) "/* Volunteers */" (view diff)
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jamey.thesharps.us edited /User:Jamey.thesharps.us (+71) "Add my minimum-profile h-card" (view diff)
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[chrisaldrich] Maybe I'm missing it but what is the IndieWeb relevance to the not it page? Did someone put their finger up last on a bet to make it? 😁
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jamey.thesharps.us created /Template:JameySharp (+67) "Maybe this is how nicknames work?" (view diff)
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jamey.thesharps.us edited /2019/Session_proposals (+464) "Propose a session: "Taking syndication beyond news and microblogs"" (view diff)
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[Jamey_Sharp] https://indieweb.org/2019/Session_proposals says to just use `{{name}}` in session descriptions but I just had a very difficult time chasing down how to make that actually work and... I'm too grumpy now to figure out how to fix the documentation.
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[Jamey_Sharp] https://indieweb.org/sparkline#IndieWeb_Examples links to https://indieweb.org/wikifying#Setup_a_nickname_with_a_small_h-card_template but that section heading no longer exists; while https://indieweb.org/wikifying#Step_Four:_Add_a_sparkline says "Visit the template to add a sparkline" with a link right back to https://indieweb.org/sparkline#IndieWeb_Examples
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loqi.me created /manual_webmentions (+80) "prompted by [chrisaldrich] and dfn added by [chrisaldrich]" (view diff)
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boffosocko.com edited /manual_webmentions (-38) "prompted by [chrisaldrich] redirect" (view diff)
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@tw2113 Been learning about webmentions tonight. #webmentions #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/1144128085782093824)
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boffosocko.com edited /sparkline (-19) "/* IndieWeb Wiki */ redirect to proper fragment" (view diff)
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aaronpk What is a sparkline?
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Loqi A sparkline is a small, simple, data-dense graphic with typographic resolution that is shown inline and in-context with relevant text https://indieweb.org/sparkline
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aaronpk haha yeah I think a tiny photo is not really "data-dense"
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[Jamey_Sharp] Right, everything on that page uses the word "sparkline" correctly except the part about this wiki itself
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boffosocko.com edited /wikifying (+23) "/* Step Four: Add a sparkline */ link to the template for sparklines" (view diff)
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boffosocko.com edited /2019/Session_proposals (+136) "linky; alternate template for wiki" (view diff)
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@JamieTanna ↩️ I'd say this is also worth sharing on http://indieweb.org/news and http://indieweb.xyz - would you mind if I shared it there, with the wider IndieWeb community? (twitter.com/_/status/1144136125193359360)
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johanbove.info edited /User:Johanbove.info (+53) "/* Itches */" (view diff)
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@johanbove ↩️ Du hast komplett recht. Es gab in Berlin in May eine IndieWebCamp wo moderation mit webmention Vouch richtig besprochen werde: https://indieweb.org/2019/Berlin/vouch Ich möchte dir deswegen herzlich einladen das http://Indieweb.org bei zu treten und deine… https://social.johanbove.info/2019/06/27/botic-du-hast-komplett-recht-es-gab (twitter.com/_/status/1144148343360241664)
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kaja.sknebel.net edited /User:Kaja.sknebel.net/upcoming-hwcs () "(-509) update from /Events" (view diff)
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@craigburgess ↩️ @JamieTanna Does https://indieweb.xyz have an RSS feed? (twitter.com/_/status/1144176986874662913)
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infominer.id created /User:Infominer.id (+4677) "simple index to begin with" (view diff)
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[jgmac1106] [chrisaldrich] maybe we should have used an etherpad but the idea of a not-it emoji emerged in chat when discussing who would wiki garden
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@JamieTanna ↩️ @kickscondor may know better - I believe not, and instead the idea is that you use a https://indieweb.org/reader and follow through that (I fairly recently set the functionality up, and it works quite nicely) (twitter.com/_/status/1144199890706321408)
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@khurtwilliams An Obligation to Explain the IndieWeb. https://www.zylstra.org/blog/2019/06/an-obligation-to-explain-the-indieweb/ #IndieWeb (twitter.com/_/status/1144202786705485824)
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infominer.id edited /User:Infominer.id (-138) "/* Indieweb Resources */" (view diff)
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@amoroso David Yates posted a good overview of the IndieWeb, Untangling the IndieWeb, where he concisely explains what its major protocols are supposed to do and how they work. But the most insightful part is his definition of the IndieWeb: > IndieWeb is about ... https://blog.paoloamoroso.com/2019/06/27/david-yates-posted.html (twitter.com/_/status/1144205746629988352)
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@adactio Brightonians (and visitors!) with websites: remember that this evening’s Homebrew Website Club Brighton is at the earlier time of 5pm in the @Clearleft studio. https://adactio.com/notes/15405 (twitter.com/_/status/1144234084534820864)
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tantek.com edited /2019 (-9) "no longer a stub :)" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /Organizers (+815) "Homepage Update, short term and iterating on the long term" (view diff)
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@Dkthe27 Fire to fight the dark #ThursdayMotivation #art #NowPlaying #ThursdayThoughts #music #indieweb #MusicStation #newmusic #newsong #NewMusicAlert #indieartist #Musica #unsignedartist #musicindustry #SoundCloud #musicartist https://soundcloud.com/user-532641339/do-me (twitter.com/_/status/1144270646140112896)
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@aaronpk ↩️ @justin__richer This has been a long ongoing discussion for us... so far best we've landed on is "eat what you cook" https://indieweb.org/selfdogfood#Brainstorming (twitter.com/_/status/1144272679681134593)
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jgregorymcverry.com edited /Organizers (+409) "/* Update Homepage Before Summit */ adding to description for homepage changes" (view diff)
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[tantek] aaronpk, that tweet you replied has quite the interesting hashtag regarding an identity conference going on 6/25-28: https://twitter.com/hashtag/Identiverse
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[tantek] and the account: https://twitter.com/Identiverse
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aaronpk Yeah it's a major industry event
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aaronpk I'm gonna try to go next year
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[tantek] do we have a flowchart like this for IndieAuth? https://twitter.com/JHoaglun/status/1143521192961331200
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@JHoaglun You are a security professional... you have this memorized and figured out...right? #Identiverse https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D96adkdWwAAUfqs.jpg (twitter.com/_/status/1143521192961331200)
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[tantek] aaronpk, goal for next year's conf if you go, get IndieAuth added to charts like this one: https://twitter.com/blhjelm/status/1143863393687887873
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@blhjelm ⁦@andredurand⁩ says Open ‘Anything’ will rely on standards and APIs. #Identiverse ⁦@openid⁩ ⁦@FIDOAlliance⁩ https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D9_RsT_XsAAaEgV.jpg (twitter.com/_/status/1143863393687887873)
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[tantek] so I don't actually believe these claims about OIDC (they sound greatly exaggerated based on my understanding of OIDC to date) https://twitter.com/GoneSecuring/status/1143621881410609153
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@GoneSecuring Being lectured by @_nat_en about what #OIDC actually is. Fun times at #Identiverse https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D971BcJXsAQ11qJ.jpg (twitter.com/_/status/1143621881410609153)
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[tantek] because if OIDC does all that, then IndieAuth does too. what am I missing?
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[tantek] SMS << Why SMS 2FA is a lie: in practice they make SMS a *one* (not two) factor auth by itself via SMS account recovery (e.g. AppleID, Twitter, FB, etc.) and this violates point two here: https://twitter.com/cookedj/status/1143587203047731203
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@cookedj One of the 5 things CISOs must know from @SarahKSquire at #identiverse #iammaestro https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D97WfkAXoAAg0fC.jpg (twitter.com/_/status/1143587203047731203)
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Loqi ok, I added "Why SMS 2FA is a lie: in practice they make SMS a *one* (not two) factor auth by itself via SMS account recovery (e.g. AppleID, Twitter, FB, etc.) and this violates point two here: https://twitter.com/cookedj/status/1143587203047731203" to the "See Also" section of /SMS https://indieweb.org/wiki/index.php?diff=62850&oldid=62624
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[tantek] back on the meta of this - [aaronpk] when you find out when next year's Identiverse conference is, can you add it to https://indieweb.org/Planning#Summit Adjacent Events so we can try to avoid colliding Summit 2020?
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[tantek] (should we even just list it as a possible conflict concern now even if we don't know the dates?)
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@jackyalcine ↩️ So I’m posting from my own personal website then it gets sent to Twitter. IndieWeb stuff! That’s why you see a link then. I’ve debated taking it out but makes for a good talking point. (https://v2.jacky.wtf/post/aa35bb95-e0d8-4b4a-b0c9-3d2b31434d5d) (twitter.com/_/status/1144277789723582465)
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aaronpk womp womp someone used an out of date slide https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D96adkdWwAAUfqs.jpg
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aaronpk anyway we don't do that many different OAuth flows in IndieAuth, really it's I'm just authorization code
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[tantek] aaronpk, that effect (someone used an out of date slide) speaks to the power of creating a re-usable flow charts like that! People keep posting / re-using / spreading them even after they're out of date!
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aaronpk and yes we should list it as a possible conflict right now if we know the dates
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[tantek] we have a candidate top date for Summit 2020
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aaronpk (Also my OAuth flowchart is better 😉)
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@adactio A great turnout for Homebrew Website Club Brighton in the @Clearleft studio! https://adactio.com/notes/15407 https://t.co/UhC8jH22TD (twitter.com/_/status/1144285815251656706)
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[tantek] whoa
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@ChrisAldrich While looking forward to @IndieWebSummit this weekend, I take a listen back at the past courtesy of the @ontarioextend & the @great78project at the @internetarchive. #oext374 #oextend https://boffosocko.com/2019/06/27/55756716/ (twitter.com/_/status/1144287632836440065)
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tantek.com edited /Organizers (+454) "/* Update Homepage Before Summit */ couple of responses, elevate IndieWeb as a community" (view diff)
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[tantek] [smerrill] cc: [Michael_Beckwith] (and maybe [Jamey_Sharp]) - re: lots of examples on wiki pages, Each page with such examples does have a "How to" section before the examples for exactly this reason, to provide the "how to implement the thing about which I’m reading" — if you find specific pages where that's not the case, please bring them up!
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[tantek] (there's also the category of more cutting edge things which are literally being explored by the more experimentally minded folks who don't mind trying things out that may not work, and for those we are gathering examples to actually *solve* the problem(s) being discussed)
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[tantek] (i.e. there are explorations on the wiki to which there are no solutions, and perhaps they could be better clarified as such in contrast to existing things with good specs & how to like the building blocks)
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jacky yeah like re: that game wiki
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Loqi jacky: [jgmac1106] left you a message 6 days, 14 hours ago: see the okdistribute tweet, all Oakland Dat folks
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jacky the game has a "end" or completion point so it's possible to get _deep_ into detail
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jacky the indieweb is a bit more organic so some things will seem less 'fleshed out'
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@ChrisAldrich Here's what I found in my fortune cookie: "A more open and independent web is yours for the making. #IndieWeb" @ontarioextend #oext372 #oextend #EdTech #DoOO https://boffosocko.com/2019/06/27/55756729/ (twitter.com/_/status/1144295959184183297)
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@ChrisAldrich Here's what I found in my fortune cookie: "A more open and independent web is yours for the making. #IndieWeb" @ontarioextend #oext372 #oextend #EdTech #DoOO https://boffosocko.com/2019/06/27/55756729/ (twitter.com/_/status/1144296810032353280)
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vanderven.se martijn edited /Organizers (+421) "/* Tickets */ Add comment about showing verfied badges on people who have registered and also done an [[rsvp]]" (view diff)
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[fluffy] [aaronpk] did you get a chance to take pictures of the space regarding tables/etc.? I just need to know how much I need to prepare in terms of how to keep my keyboard setup reasonably comfortable. 🙂
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[fluffy] I mean worst case I just set up my ergo keyboard for my lap so NBD either way I guess
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[aaronpk] Yes i did! The table arrangement will change but these are the tables
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[fluffy] Okay, great! Looks like I might be able to get away with just using my laptop keyboard, but I’ll still bring my keyboardio just in case (plus it looks cool)
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aaronpk Oops forgot slack uploads don't work
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aaronpk https://i.imgur.com/CfKn3cc.jpg
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aaronpk for the logs
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@cogdog ↩️ The University Dance Orchestra sang in 1925 "Happy Days Will Come" ... has it happened?? #oextend (twitter.com/_/status/1144306333304414208)
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[jgmac1106] I love the feedback we get from the community on improving the wiki. What I love more is seeing the edit notifications in #meta when community membera address a problem they have
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[jgmac1106] If you have it someone else may as well. Interesting idea id #IndieWeb examples and Other Examples get moved down in terms of our "loose" text structure
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[jgmac1106] Anyone in #meta happy to rethink pages anytime with people. Feel free to ask. If you found am issue probably four people who don't say anything did as well
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[jgmac1106] Why I love the mantra of doing over talking
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[jgmac1106] And think about how much better it makes your own posts or writing. Instead of "This is what is wrong" you can blog about "This is what I did both how and why."
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@deesonlabs “Building Bridges” This issue collects articles on bridging that gap, including database scaling, joining the IndieWeb, and using OAuth securely. #php http://bit.ly/2ZCHL72 (twitter.com/_/status/1144316720015974400)
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@jeannieindigitl In my effort to become more involved in the IndieWed community I created http://indieweb.life and http://indieweb.social. A lot of the information out there is either out-of-date or is written so far above the head of the complete novice. A lo . . . https://jeannie.digital/62/ (twitter.com/_/status/1144319283381592065)
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@jeannieindigitl In my effort to become more involved in the IndieWed community I created https://indieweb.life and http://indieweb.social . A lot of the information out there is either out-of-date or is written so far above the head of the complete novice. A l . . . https://jeannie.digital/62/ (twitter.com/_/status/1144319655512879105)
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[schmarty] Gentle reminder to whoever it was that said they have a lightning-to-HDMI adapter for my mobile demos on Saturday morning 😅
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[schmarty] Maybe tantek or aaronpk? I have an iPhone 8. Meant to follow up on this earlier to make sure I can project my phone screen!
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aaronpk yep i'm bringing all of them
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aaronpk lightning, mini, micro, USB-C, and VGA
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[schmarty] 🎉
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GWG aaronpk, what if I need displayport?
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GWG I don't, but...
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aaronpk oh yeah I have that one too
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GWG I am just tempted to find the most obscure options...
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GWG RF? RCA? SCSI? Parallel port?
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aaronpk we have so many remote attendees registered!
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[tantek] [fluffy] confirmed decaf coffee in the morning both days
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[fluffy] awesome tantek++
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Loqi tantek has 49 karma in this channel over the last year (122 in all channels)
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[fluffy] hopefully it’s not only beneficial to the 2% that is me 🙂
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[fluffy] (I love coffee, I just can’t handle caffeine)
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[Jamey_Sharp] Is anyone bringing a TEMPEST adapter
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GWG The journey begins...
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[tmiller] If anyone is around in Portland today let me know! Just got to the hotel a bit ago and will want to grab some food
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Loqi [tmiller]: [schmarty] left you a message 3 weeks, 2 days ago: don't forget to add your date preferences for a fall IWC NYC at /Planning#NYC
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Loqi [tmiller]: [schmarty] left you a message 2 weeks, 6 days ago: please indicate your prefs for a fall 2019 IndieWebCamp NYC! /Planning#NYC
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Loqi [tmiller]: [schmarty] left you a message 2 weeks, 3 days ago: based on mifga's recc and dmitshur's preference vote, next indieweb meetup NYC will be at devoción coffee in brooklyn. RSVP: /events/2019-06-22-homebrew-website-club-nyc
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Loqi [tmiller]: [schmarty] left you a message 1 week, 5 days ago: please add your availability and interest for a fall IWC NYC! current best dates appear to be 9/21-22, 10/5-6. https://indieweb.org/Planning#NYC
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[gRegorLove] [tmiller] I'm on my way in on the Max now. Also hungry :)
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[gRegorLove] Though dinner might work better. Need to do some work work this afternoon.
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[tmiller] [gRegorLove] sounds good to me! I'm going to be working on some stuff in a bit also
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[tantek] I'm at MozPDX working on some Summit details
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tantek.com created /bock (+21) "r" (view diff)
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[tmiller] [tantek] let me know if you want to meet also, I may go explore a bit if I get some work done
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GWG I am not in till after 11, alas
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[tantek] it's already after 11
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[tantek] my clock shows 13:51
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jacky.wtf edited /2019/Session_proposals (+18) "added a hashtag for jamey's talk proposal" (view diff)
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jacky lol aaronpk turned into radioshack with all of those adapters
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tantek.com edited /discuss (+365) "quick reference at top to which channel when, add to indieweb channel description the question of whether someone who has never built a website could understand you" (view diff)
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GWG 11pm
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[jgmac1106] gwg me as well 22:52
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GWG [jgmac1106]: Share a cab to the hotel?
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[jgmac1106] red train?
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[gRegorLove] Moving dinner talk to #indieweb-chat
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GWG At 11pm they shut down
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GWG If I remember correctly
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[jgmac1106] then yes i will
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[jgmac1106] if we can verify that we should note on wiki
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[tantek] [aaronpk] can you upload last night's HWC PDX photo? I can add to https://indieweb.org/events/2019-06-26-homebrew-website-club#Photos
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[tantek] (or txt me the photo and I'll take care)
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[aaronpk] Ah yeah
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aaronparecki.com uploaded /Special:Log/upload "uploaded "[[File:20190626-hwcpdx.jpg]]" https://indieweb.org/File:20190626-hwcpdx.jpg"
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aaronpk wish there was a way to clone settings between zoom accounts
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[tantek] I'm on the wiki photo
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aaronpk 👍
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tantek.com edited /events/2019-06-26-homebrew-website-club (+189) "/* Photos */ Portland!" (view diff)
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[tantek] Portland is up. Now to get Brighton up there from Adactio's post
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[tantek] ooh big crowd in Brighton! putting them up top
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tantek.com edited /events/2019-06-26-homebrew-website-club (-22) "/* Photos */ clean up a bit" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /events/2019-06-27-homebrew-website-club (+230) "/* Photos */ Brighton photo from adactio" (view diff)
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[tantek] hah! Ana and Calum made it to both London and Brighton!
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[tantek] makes me think we need to start something similar in SF and Oakland
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aaronpk ohhh we sold out!
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@namedotcom Rolling into Portland on the train. Beer en route to @AlchemyCodeLab. @TLD is bringing domains and pizza. Local dogs report feeling the hack energy. If you’re around, sign up here: http://hack.social. #HackTheDot #IndieWeb #TrainK9 (twitter.com/_/status/1144358580969062400)
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[tantek] we need a bell or something to ring!!!
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tantek.com edited /Flask (+28) "see also" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /Flask (+13) "sa django" (view diff)
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[tantek] ok is anyone writing up a sold note? I'll draft one otherwise (likely?)
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[tantek] sold *out note
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[tantek] mentioning waitlist and pre-summit social
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@qubyte New blog post published! https://qubyte.codes/blog/cleaner-scheduled-posts-publication tweet by https://tweet-new-blog-posts.glitch.me/ #AboutThisBlog #REST #IndieWeb (twitter.com/_/status/1144362896677384197)
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[tantek] [aaronpk] should we create a Pre-summit Social ticket for folks to sign-up? or should they just show up?
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@vincentlistens ↩️ I’ve managed to build an indieweb functioning website without any client-side JS at all. For a blog the content is king and JS isn’t a penalty I should burden users with. (twitter.com/_/status/1144363797487841280)
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[aaronpk] Oh that's not a bad idea
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[tantek] Then I'll wait to post 🙂
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[aaronpk] Lemme see if I can do that from my phone
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[tantek] also https://ti.to/indiewebcamp/summit-2019 says "All day Pre-Summit Meetup" which should probably say "17:30" ?
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[aaronpk] Ok that should do it!
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[tantek] (I tried clicking join waitlist and seeing what it looked like)
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[tantek] (and if you cancel / hit the close box of the waitlist popup, then that URL is the page you see, and if you scroll down, you see 3 days of events)
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[aaronpk] Fixed time
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[tantek] also on the map on https://ti.to/indiewebcamp/summit-2019 it has a bunch of venues called out - but not Mozilla nor Pine Street !
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[aaronpk] That's just google maps doing its thing
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[jgmac1106] wonders if anyone finds maps embedded on website useful anymore, are they still needed. Wonder what heat map research says
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[aaronpk] I think I fixed the maps
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[aaronpk] Google is still gonna highlight random venues, also based on your own google account info, but at least there are pins on moz and pine st too
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@Geek_Centric ↩️ I'm slowly porting my site over to laravel jigsaw! It will require some moving parts, at least to generate markdown as I use some indieweb stuff (twitter.com/_/status/1144367633132851203)
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[tantek] both fixes verified
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[tantek] drafting note
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[tantek] and something broke with my Twitter auth. uh-oh, right before Summit. of course
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[tantek] account still seems ok
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[tantek] oh n.m. this was the half-broken state that's been true for a while. ok I have some auth-debt to take care of (eventually)
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[jgmac1106] I had to log into dev.twitter.com and youbget warning of read access only... Nobody tells you, no email
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[tantek] please review: https://tantek.com/2019/178/t1/indieweb-summit-sold-out
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Loqi [Tantek Çelik] 🏔 #IndieWeb Summit has sold out! Did you mean to sign-up and forgot? You can: 🤞🏽 Join the waitlist! 🎟  Get a pre-Summit Social ticket (free!) for Friday night! https://2019.indieweb.org/summit#register #IndieWebSummit
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[jgmac1106] tantek++
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Loqi tantek has 50 karma in this channel over the last year (123 in all channels)
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[tantek] if no objections / suggestions, posting 15:35
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[tantek] and got distracted
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[tantek] what no one pointed out the double-whitespace after the ticket emoji?!? 🙂
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[tantek] posted / tweeted
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[tantek] waits for Loqi twitter streaming search to notice
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[tantek] gives Loqi a nudge
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Loqi gives back the nudge
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[tantek] 😂
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mblaney hi tmiller, gRegorLove not sure what plans you made in chat but happy to join for dinner.
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[schmarty] mblaney: i think the current plan is meeting somewhere around 8pm. no location chosen afaik.
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[tantek] if only we had some sort of mapping-based tool to see where people were in realtime
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mblaney hi schmarty ok cool if someone wants to mention a location here rather than chat that would help with checking later.
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[schmarty] good call. as far as i know tmiller, gRegorLove, tantek, you, and me have expressed interest so far. if folks already on the ground there want to pick a place i will do my best to be there by 8pm!
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[tantek] Y U NO SHOW MY POSSE TWEETS LOQI?
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[tantek] !rt https://twitter.com/t/status/1144375521125363712
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Loqi Thanks! We need one more person to confirm the retweet!
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[jgmac1106] !rt https://twitter.com/t/status/1144375521125363712
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Loqi Thanks [jgmac1106] and [tantek]! https://twitter.com/indiewebcamp/status/1144383383734116352
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loqi.me created /Marauders_Map (+360) "prompted by [tantek] and dfn added by [tantek]" (view diff)
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dougbeal.com edited /2019/Organizers (+15) "/* Remote Participation */" (view diff)
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loqi.me edited /Marauders_Map (+196) "[tantek] added "was written by an incoming Facebook summer intern (who was also a computer science major at Harvard, ironically) https://mashable.com/2015/05/29/marauders-map-facebook-stalker/" to "See Also"" (view diff)
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[tmiller] @mblaney dont think we've decided on a place just yet
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[tantek] If no one suggests anything I'm going to suggest a default of Prasad
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[tantek] and if that's too "healthy" sounding, then I'll suggest the Mexican place across the street Los Gorditos, where folks can get burritos to go, and likely sit with folks at the tables outside Prasad
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gRegorLove I like Prasad and Gorditos. Cafe Yumm looks good too and sounds familiar; think we ate there one time?
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tantek.com edited /Organizers (+1540) "Summit Planning Improvements - first for reasons" (view diff)
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[tantek] I'm also thinking of likely seating capacity for 5-8 people which is my rough guess from having read various chats
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tantek.com created /2020/Planning (+108) "stub" (view diff)
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tantek.com created /2020/Organizers (+183) "stub" (view diff)