#microformats 2020-06-06

2020-06-06 UTC
KartikPrabhu, [chrisaldrich], [schmarty], [jeremycherfas] and [KevinMarks] joined the channel
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[KevinMarks] Should migrating the rel registry to github be part of this effort or is that orthogonal?
KartikPrabhu, [jgmac1106] and [tantek] joined the channel
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[tantek] Orthogonal
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@JamieTanna ↩️ I thought I was the only one seeing this! Fortunately I've got https://granary.io producing #Microformats feeds so I can still read Twitter from the https://indieweb.org/reader I want (https://www.jvt.me/mf2/2020/06/zkort/) (twitter.com/_/status/1269259199378272256)
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[schmarty] hey folks! doing some stream setup this morning. i realized that i haven't really set up my main dev machine (ubuntu 20.04) as an OBS streaming setup, but i have a minimal thing working.
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[schmarty] as of now i could, for example, stream what i am doing to twitch
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[schmarty] not sure about OBS output as a webcam to zoom. i don't think the OBS-VirtualCam plugin is available on linux.
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aaronpk We're gonna stream using Streamyard so you just need a webcam feed
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aaronpk ive got it all queued up already, I'll send the link over once I get to my computer
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[schmarty] so if i want to share my screen i need to figure out how to get a virtual cam out of OBS
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[schmarty] (is our plan to share screens? or just faces?)
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aaronpk Well probably share screens too at some point
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aaronpk but it can share the screen directly into the website at least with chrome
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[schmarty] oh, that's a feature of streamyard? i haven't used it.
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aaronpk The one limit of doing it the way I've set up is only one screen can be shared at a time but I think that's fine
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[schmarty] yeah i'm okay with that.
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[schmarty] ok cool, i'll quit fiddling with OBS (but am happily surprised that it seems to... work? on Ubuntu??)
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sknebel [schmarty]: OBS on linux can emulate a webcam too through v4l2loopback
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sknebel (if you happen to need that for something else later)
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[schmarty] sknebel++ ah, thanks! i remembered vaguely that it could be done but not the details.
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Loqi sknebel has 3 karma in this channel over the last year (51 in all channels)
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jacky good to go in about 15
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aaronpk Cool I'm biking over to the studio now, should be there in 25, cutting it close
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aaronpk baaack
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aaronpk gonna send you a link to join the video
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aaronpk jacky: join with your IRC nick when you get in
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GWG Where do I tune in to watch?
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[schmarty] indieweb.live (once we are live)
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aaronpk we are waiting for jacky
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jacky was having breakfast
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jacky is joining the hangout
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[schmarty] heck yeah breakfast
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jacky lol
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aaronpk we're online! https://indieweb.live
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jacky firefox choked - rejoining
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GWG Is this being recorded for posterity?
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GWG I am using Ubuntu LTS 20.04 on one system. It should work well.
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GWG Votes for Nginx.
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jacky mostly for vanity (no recording IIRC)
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[schmarty] GWG: do you already have the WP theme files from microformats.org ?
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GWG [schmarty]: No.
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GWG [schmarty]: Not yet.
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GWG I don't need to set up a one-off...I can do it on my dev site.
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GWG Theme is in /wp-content/themes/microformats
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[schmarty] aaronpk is packaging it up
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GWG Be back shortly if there are any questions...need food
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[schmarty] GWG: whenever you are back, the theme is up! https://github.com/microformats/microformats-wordpress-theme
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jacky I don't know why but firefox does _not_ like steamyard :(
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GWG I skimmed it and will fork it...I can work with this
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GWG My panini is still cooking
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jacky https://launchpad.net/~nginx/+archive/ubuntu/stable
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GWG The WordPress theme has technorati reactions. I assume we can chuck those?
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[schmarty] yeahhhh those don't exist anymore
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aaronpk edited /spread-microformats (+180) "/* T-Shirts */ replace with web.archive.org URLs" (view diff)
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GWG Back. Did I miss a WordPress problem?
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aaronpk character encoding problems now
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GWG Reading through the theme...
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GWG WordPress converted to utf a while back
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GWG Reading the code. This uses the old WordPress bookmarks system, because the menu system hadn't been invented yet
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GWG That should be easily fixable.
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GWG It hardcodes things that are now done dynamically by WordPress
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GWG So, if you deploy it to a current WP version, you may see some duplication, but if you give me access after the fact to the admin, I can deploy an updated theme and do some cleanup.
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[tantek] I'm literally in a different meeting for a bit. Hope to pop in around noon?
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aaronpk nice
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aaronpk we're making progress
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GWG I installed the theme on another site...it is going to need some work. Not too much.
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GWG But I think I can modernize it and cut out the hacks.
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aaronpk 🎉
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GWG Well, I think this predates tags on WordPress
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gRegorLove [schmarty] does mariadb have the distinction between utf8 and utf8mb4 character encoding that mysql does?
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GWG [schmarty]: I'm here for plugin talk.
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[schmarty] gRegorLove: it seems to? i'm actually using utf8mb4 now and all is good
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gRegorLove the mb4 variant being "actual UTF-8"
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gRegorLove utf8 in mysql is only 3-byte chars iirc
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[schmarty] GWG: will update the etherpad with a plugin list shortly
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gRegorLove sweet
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aaronpk mb4++
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Loqi mb4 has 1 karma over the last year
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gRegorLove woo, it's a wiki!
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jacky https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T246594 ticket about php support
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gRegorLove wp plugins updated 7 years ago? :shivers:
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gRegorLove +1 for the DisplayTitle plugin
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gRegorLove find and replease in the sql dump?
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aaronpk heh
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gRegorLove *replace, even
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[schmarty] oh yeah not a bad idea.
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gRegorLove let me take a look
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gRegorLove replacing the WP login with indielogin?
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GWG It should be easy enough if it doesn't.
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aaronpk it would be a useful plugin to exist!
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gRegorLove Is the use-case so they can comment on WP posts? I thought commenting was off currently
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aaronpk it would be the main wordpress login for everyone
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[schmarty] just updated the etherpad. we have 14 administrators and 7 authors.
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gRegorLove Ok. We'd need a way to allowlist which domains are WP authors
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[schmarty] and about 1750 "subscribers"
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aaronpk yeah that'd be set in the role in wordpress
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gRegorLove I'm leaning towards that, yeah, just wasn't sure if I was missing something
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[tantek] Proposal: preserve old comments on blog posts, and only allow new comments via Webmentions
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gRegorLove looks like pingbacks are still on for blog posts too. I think that's what's on http://microformats.org/2020/03/04/google-confirms-microformats-are-still-a-recommended-metadata-format-for-content
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gRegorLove +1 [tantek]
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GWG I spent a little time on the Microformats theme....half the function calls were deprecated in WordPress 2.8.0, so most of the job is replacing old functions with new ones, removing hard coded values with WordPress functions...
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GWG I did a few things here: https://github.com/dshanske/microformats-wordpress-theme
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gRegorLove GWG++ awesome
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Loqi GWG has 6 karma in this channel over the last year (132 in all channels)
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GWG A lot of custom code needs to be ripped out and replaced.
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GWG But it should be easily doable.
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GWG I can also steal some things from other themes
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gRegorLove oh man, I ran into something similar with WP plugins
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GWG https://wordpress.org/themes/microformats/
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GWG Someone has a theme with the same slug
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GWG How fortunate you backed up to github
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aaronpk oh dear
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GWG I suggest a name change?
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gRegorLove An entirely custom plugin we wrote with a generic name... and the WP plugin site had one with the same name.
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GWG Suggest we change it to microformatsdotorg or something
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gRegorLove Is there a way to disable the update feature within the theme?
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gRegorLove The "No really, this is a local theme don't check wp.org" setting XD
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GWG It doesn't auto update
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GWG You have to click a button
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aaronpk it shouldn't even prompt
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GWG aaronpk: Change the slug though
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gRegorLove ^ yeah that's what I mean
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aaronpk that's such a terrible hack
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aaronpk there should be a theme setting that disables asking wp.org for updates
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gRegorLove I'm newly inspired to track this down and file a WP bug
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aaronpk do it do it
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GWG In style.css for now, change it.
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GWG You can file a bug later
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GWG We could call it Microformats2
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gRegorLove Hash "microformats2" and name it that, ha
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Zegnat CRC32 because no security needed, right? 33771a55 ;)
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GWG You people....
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[schmarty] haha
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GWG I'm going to start criticizing Processwire and Static sites.
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[schmarty] GWG++ thanks for these changes! in terms of removing the google analytics tracker - was that discussed here already?
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Loqi GWG has 7 karma in this channel over the last year (133 in all channels)
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GWG [schmarty]: If you want to add it, it shouldn't be embedded in the theme.
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GWG I have more I'll probably do.
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[schmarty] ahh, ok. there's some other way to do that now?
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GWG [schmarty]: Plugin?
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[schmarty] what's going on here? https://github.com/microformats/microformats-wordpress-theme/compare/master...dshanske:master#diff-1c1ae65fe9828eb6d3cee4edacf90018R25
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GWG [schmarty]: Someone hacked the deprecated link system to generate a menu
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GWG I had to replace it with the current menu system.
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GWG Not sure what happened with the {{{{
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[schmarty] does the menu system change require migrating any db data?
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GWG [schmarty]: It requires configuring a menu that has the right menu options in the backend.
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[schmarty] ah, so a manual migration step.
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GWG Yes
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[schmarty] are you capturing these details somewhere? they'd probably go well on the etherpad.
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GWG I'll add some.
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[schmarty] thank you!
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GWG [schmarty]: I thought I might fiddle a bit more...
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[schmarty] fiddling is good!
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GWG [schmarty]: But there is no rush...I'll document quickly.
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[schmarty] i've created a PR: https://github.com/microformats/microformats-wordpress-theme/pull/1
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Loqi [martymcguire] #1 [WIP] modernize and cleanup theme
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[schmarty] please add notes about changes that require manual steps!
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aaronpk [ [ break ] ]
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aaronpk you get some nice music on the stream now
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gRegorLove I like it!
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gRegorLove h-event p-name=break
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GWG [schmarty]: Added to etherpad
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GWG Essentially, wherever WordPress now does what is custom-coded in the theme, I'd like to rip out the custom code and replace it with the stock functions.
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GWG It makes it easier to maintain in future if you have less hand-rolled code.
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[schmarty] GWG: agreed! although tbh the content pages looked mostly identical to me
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GWG [schmarty]: They would... that's the goal
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[schmarty] GWG: i mean before any of your changes 😂
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GWG Yes
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GWG That's what I am going for
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GWG Simplification
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GWG Also, who knows how long deprecated functionality will continue to work
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[schmarty] true enough!
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GWG Even on a platform committed to backward compatibility
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gRegorLove Found an existing ticket (5 years!) and commented https://core.trac.wordpress.org/ticket/32101
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GWG And if you have the new functions, you get the filters that allow you to add functionality by plugin
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GWG So it future proofs as well
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GWG Also, I am hoping to add webmentions and for that to work, we'd need some of the hooks.
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[schmarty] GWG: good call.
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GWG [schmarty]: Not my first theme conversion
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GWG It's my 4th
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[schmarty] in the interests of having something we could put live by the end of day tomorrow
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[schmarty] can we triage this?
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GWG Yes... what I have done so far will work for now....if you configure a proper menu
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[schmarty] from your comment i am having trouble figuring out what is done vs still needs doing
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[schmarty] ah, ok, if that's the one manual step i can do that
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GWG That's the one critical manual step.
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GWG If I can have access, I could push further improvements later.
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GWG I did a lot of them already
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GWG HTML5 isn't critical right now.
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GWG I got rid of the errors on the page about deprecated functions
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GWG And replaced some code
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GWG So I can take time on adding mf2
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[schmarty] sounds great!
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gRegorLove Option for captcha if we don't do indielogin: > Install ConfirmEdit with ReCaptcha (NoCaptcha) support (requires MediaWiki 1.26+)
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gRegorLove https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:ConfirmEdit#ReCaptcha_(NoCaptcha)
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[schmarty] ConfirmEdit also has hCaptcha support
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gRegorLove +1, I like that
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gRegorLove schmarty's proposal of admins approving accounts
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[schmarty] thanks gRegor!
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aaronpk [tantek]: so the microformats server is actually hosting the mailing list, like it is the thing that sends and receives the emails. I would really rather not set that up on the new server especially since the mailing list is essentially read-only at this point
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aaronpk other than the microformats-admin list
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aaronpk which doesn't have public archives
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[tantek] We have closed the lists for some time
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[schmarty] microformats-admin is still active
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aaronpk one option for the alternative to the list is to set up email aliases at the web host and maintain the list of people there
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aaronpk since we're not even exposting the mailman archives for microformats-admin that's essentially all it's doing anyway
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GWG Fixed another WP deprecation error.
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[tantek] The only requirement for mailing lists are the permalinks and indexes
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aaronpk works for me, just means we lose the microformats-admin distribution list
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[tantek] Hmmm why?
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[tantek] We can recreate it as an email forwarding alias
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aaronpk yeah that's what i was suggesting
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[tantek] That’s not a loss, that’s a transition :)
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aaronpk and since there's apparently no way to look at the archives of that list anyway it's pretty much equivalent
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aaronpk (right now there are archives of the microformats-admin list on the server, just not publicly accessible)
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[tantek] Plus we want explicit addition/removal of it anyway (not self-adding/removal)
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aaronpk oh yeah i have no idea what the permissions of the current list are anyway
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[tantek] I believe myself and Rohit have admin access to it
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[tantek] So we have to manually add/remove people
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[tantek] Is there a way to make static copies of all the email permalinks and the archive index pages they link to?
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[tantek] We’ve always treated the admin list as an alias, never even looked for archives
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aaronpk the archives are already static html!
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aaronpk like all old school web apps before "static site generator" was a common term
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[tantek] Lol wow
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[tantek] Ah right, Perl, the original SSG!
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[schmarty] GWG: trying to make a working menu now. the resulting markup is not equivalent
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[schmarty] so the styles don't match
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GWG It does on mine.
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GWG Odd.
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GWG I have it on a site with different data and it looks the same.
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GWG https://wpdev.gwg.us/all/
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GWG My test site, with that theme enabled
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[schmarty] this is what i see on prod: https://media.martymcgui.re/b3/e4/b5/8a/904cc03ec9f03b46e53219948db9f148791c8562d5479f5631345396.png
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[schmarty] branch: https://media.martymcgui.re/3c/3d/62/9f/85f12e1cbbecf3c48e87d0b544ec1ad381411a370009daaff76b5bba.png
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[schmarty] there are vertical spacing differences. also, not seeing the 'blog' link marked as active.
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jacky o/
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[schmarty] \o
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gRegorLove \o/
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[schmarty] GWG: figured out the source of the issue. the generate markup is different.
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GWG [schmarty]: Generate?
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[schmarty] *generated, sorry typing and talking
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gRegorLove I think I did a pw reset on microformats wp
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GWG aaronpk: There is a Mailgun plugin for WordPress
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GWG I think you use them.
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GWG The plugin just redirects email to go out the API
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[schmarty] GWG: i just pulled down your latest and all the sidebar widgets disappeared 😭
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GWG [schmarty]: Yes, they would. You have to reset them.
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GWG [schmarty]: As of a previous version, you have to name the sidebars...so I did.
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[schmarty] this is not a good experience
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aaronpk did you document this in the etherpad?
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GWG [schmarty]: I could just name them sidebar-1, sidebar-2, and sidebar-3...whcih would bring them back in the settings.
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GWG I have not yet done so.
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[schmarty] more things are breaking than are being fixed
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GWG Let me try something....
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[schmarty] so i need to create these sidebar widgets again
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[schmarty] but without the sidebar widgets i don't have the content i need to create the sidebar widgets, yaknow?
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GWG Pull again
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GWG I reverted the names
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[schmarty] they're back!
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[grantcodes] They should still be there as disabled no? You just drag them into the new sidebar anyway
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[schmarty] grantcodes: they're mostly custom text / html widgets
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[grantcodes] Usually by default when sidebars change widgets with content don't just get deleted, but moved into a disabled area. But sounds like it's under control.
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GWG [schmarty]: I also styled the active menu link. It has a different class.
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GWG Google Analytics tags shouldn't be built in the theme.
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gRegorLove The pro version has *extra* corporate tracking /s
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GWG Because it is a hard-coded number
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[schmarty] GWG: this theme is single-use and the added complexity of dipping into the WP plugin ecosystem is making me very itchy.
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aaronpk lesscode++
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Loqi lesscode has 1 karma over the last year
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aaronpk code--
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Loqi code has -1 karma over the last year
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GWG https://wordpress.org/plugins/header-footer/
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Loqi [Stefano Lissa] Description About WordPress SEO and Facebook Open Graph: I was very unpleased by Yoast invitation to remove my plugin, and it’s not the case. Read more here. Head and Footer Codes Why you have to install 10 plugins to add Google Analytics, Facebo...
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GWG There's ways to do it.
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GWG But if you want me to restore the analytics code, I will
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GWG Does anyone check the analytics?
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[schmarty] good question! i'd prefer if we didn't send analytics to google at all.
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GWG So, let's settle that issue.
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GWG Should we have analytics at all
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GWG Show of hands?
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jacky okay resetting my setup and the nginx setup works
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jacky for the blog that is
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[schmarty] jacky++ woo!
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Loqi jacky has 3 karma in this channel over the last year (87 in all channels)
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GWG In the meantime...?
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GWG I just don't want it in the theme because the theme is now on Github...if someone downloads it, with the code embedded.
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[schmarty] probably something that [tantek] should sound off about.
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GWG Even if I put a config variable, and have you add the code to the wp_config file on the CLI...
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aaronpk that'd be fine? what's wrong with that?
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GWG Which? Having it in the github repo?
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[schmarty] GWG: i'd be fine adding it back that way.
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aaronpk in the config file
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GWG Fine with me
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jacky the only thing is that since it's a subpath, it's thinking that it should be at `/var/www/blog/wiki`
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GWG Then no one will accidentally mess up the statistics if they are trying the repo out
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[schmarty] jacky: that seems backwards? 😅
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[schmarty] GWG: that sounds great! are you planning to add that to the PR?
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[KevinMarks] Analytics--
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Loqi Analytics has -1 karma over the last year
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GWG [schmarty]: I will...but waiting on the decision as to whether we should keep it.
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GWG Be safe, [schmarty]
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GWG Okay.
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GWG Will restore shortly.
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[schmarty] GWG: yep let's keep it for now to keep parity and make the decision to remove it separately
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GWG Okay... I will restore with usage comment
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[schmarty] tyvm!
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jacky [schmarty]: very much so lol
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jacky open() "/var/www/wiki/wiki" failed (2: No such file or directory),
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jacky progress lol
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[schmarty] haha
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aaronpk i think set root to just /var/www ?
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aaronpk jacky: where did this bit come from? https://gist.github.com/jalcine/43236c22b38b1f77d203601da56b3634#file-nginx-conf-L59
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jacky aaronpk: I 100% took that block from my static site
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aaronpk ah cool
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jacky it looks like it's more-or-less unnecessary tho
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GWG [schmarty]: Did the menu fix work?
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[schmarty] GWG: it did! still need to fix up a margin issue.
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GWG Okay
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jacky okay that nginx conf should work with `php7.3-fpm` installed, the blog at `/var/www/blog` and the wiki at `/var/www/wiki`
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aaronpk sweet
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[schmarty] (.menu-primary needs a margin: 0}
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[schmarty] wow i started writing a parenthetical and ended writing code.
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aaronpk lol
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GWG Working on it now.
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[schmarty] GWG: woo, thanks!
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aaronpk good stream
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[chrisaldrich] aaronpk++ schmarty++
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Loqi schmarty has 2 karma in this channel over the last year (61 in all channels)
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Loqi aaronpk has 2 karma in this channel over the last year (224 in all channels)
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[chrisaldrich] jacky++ GWG++
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Loqi GWG has 8 karma in this channel over the last year (134 in all channels)
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Loqi jacky has 4 karma in this channel over the last year (88 in all channels)
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[chrisaldrich] thanks for the exciting "paint drying" and heavy documenting while you worked.
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[tantek] What should I chime in on?
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[schmarty] tantek: there's a Pending Questions section that could use a look! https://etherpad.indieweb.org/microformats-server-migration
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[tantek] Had to restart my browser
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GWG [schmarty]: Done now.
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[schmarty] thanks, GWG!
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GWG You have to define MICROFORMATS_GOOGLE_ANALYTICS in the wp-config.php file or it won't appear
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GWG [chrisaldrich]: How often do you get to see a WordPress 2.x theme hacked to sort of work in modern times?
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[chrisaldrich] Very rarely GWG. You should write it up and do a WordCamp presentation of it and related concerns for others out there who may want to do something similar.
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[chrisaldrich] This was probably the closest thing I've seen in that area: https://wordpress.tv/2019/06/20/joseph-dickson-upgrading-kubrick-for-gutenberg/
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GWG I may continue and add in more things.
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GWG But I added post_class, so the microformats plugin might work.
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GWG And I'll probably add in some MF2
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GWG [chrisaldrich]: Did you catch my test site reformatted as the microformats site?
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aaronpk [schmarty]++ jacky++ thanks for the help today!
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Loqi [schmarty] has 3 karma in this channel over the last year (62 in all channels)
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aaronpk and you too GWG++
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Loqi GWG has 9 karma in this channel over the last year (135 in all channels)
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aaronpk jacky++
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Loqi jacky has 5 karma in this channel over the last year (89 in all channels)
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[tantek] Tried to add / answer a few things in the etherpad
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[tantek] Really hoping we can *reduce* the number of moving parts and installs in this transition (without breaking essential functionality of course)
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aaronpk me too!
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[tantek] Also hoping we don’t end up with a *longer* toolchain
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[tantek] Because long term that leads to more fragility, not less
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[tantek] restarting browser again 😂
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[tantek] Are people still around in the migration or is everyone taking a break til tomorrow? Just wondering if I completely missed today
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[tantek] alright I'm jumping in and adding to & copyediting the methodology section accordingly
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aaronpk yeah it was 9am-3pm pacific today
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aaronpk break til tomorrow!
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[tantek] Ah got it
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[tantek] Ok I’ll async check / contribute to the etherpad
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aaronpk 👍
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[tantek] I've split Methodology into Goals and Tactics
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[tantek] where we want to end up, general steps/techniques to get there
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[tantek] when do we resume tomorrow?
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aaronpk 9am again! https://events.indieweb.org/2020/06/microformats-server-migration-livestream-session-2--aBfWilFmJ2cR