#indieweb 2016-07-15

2016-07-15 UTC
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Loqi [indieweb] "Google deletes artist’s blog, a decade of his work http://fusion.net/story/325231/google-deletes-dennis-cooper-blog Articles like this are why I'm a member of the #indieweb" by Chris Aldrich http://stream.boffosocko.com/2016/google-deletes-artists-blog-a-decade-of-his-work-story325231google-deletes-dennis-cooper-blog
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@ChrisAldrich Google deletes artist’s blog, a decade of his work http://fusion.net/story/325231/google-deletes-dennis-cooper-blog/ Articles like this are why I'm a member of the #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/753744186763948032)
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[chrisaldrich] tantek: I was impressed that RSVPing to the FB event actually sent a webmention to my original Known install. Hadn't seen that before. Good Job benatwork and gang!
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[chrisaldrich] KevinMarks1: thanks for the HWC .svg files!
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@Johannes_Ernst Never, ever, put anything important on a website owned by somebody else. #ownyourcontent #indieweb https://twitter.com/davewiner/status/753740009610567680 (twitter.com/_/status/753754851448791040)
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aaronpk i think if i ever end up doing an indieweb-related startup it's going to be building a wifi-enabled SD card that uploads photos to your micropub endpoint directly, no cloud service involved
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Loqi aaronpk: tantek left you a message 1 hour, 11 minutes ago: could you post an indie event and FB POSSE copy for the next HWC in your city? https://indieweb.org/events/2016-07-27-homebrew-website-club#RSVP
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aaronpk cause nothing ever went wrong with doing a hardware startup
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aaronpk i'll put it on kickstarter that way it's guaranteed to ship 2 years late
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mblaney from a UI perspective I like seeing h-feed authors in my reader.
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mblaney I use the h-card photo next to the title when grouping posts
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aaronpk mblaney: can you share screenshots of that?
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aaronpk i can't picture it
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[benatwork] I’d like to see a PESOS box. Stick it on your router, have it suck in all your social media postings, photos etc to a built-in hard drive.
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[benatwork] #justsaying
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mblaney I couldn't use an h-entry author from the collection to do that as it makes too many assumptions.
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aaronpk [benatwork]: that sounds like what Singly was supposed to do 😞
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[benatwork] Yes. Trick may be pointing it at companies, not individuals. Imagine if you could PESOS a hashtag to a local drive and then locally process the data, for example.
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aaronpk i swear the next big trend after cloud computing is going to be local computing
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[benatwork] Yeah, the pendulum will swing back
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aaronpk look how much more power we can get when we actually distribute everything to the edges
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[benatwork] A device in everyone’s pocket, running open source software
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aaronpk my phone is already more powerful than "cloud" servers 10 years ago were
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[benatwork] Yep. And Apple is driving this hard
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[benatwork] The open source thing is likely a red herring
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[benatwork] But local software transcends internet connections
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[benatwork] And as they all enter markets with less stable networks ..
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aaronpk maybe we'll even see a resurgence of the store-and-forward model of email, back when you had to dial in with your modem to download your email, except with modern social networking interactions
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tantek benatwork, why do you say the open source thing is likely a red herring?
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mblaney sorry got called away.
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mblaney I can provide a screen shot if you want something permanent, but https://unicyclic.com/indieweb has some good examples.
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mblaney you shouldn't have to scroll far to see them.
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Loqi +1
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mblaney glad you approve Loqi
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mblaney also +1 for implied h-entry author from h-feed when no author is given for the entry, and implied author on the h-feed when it's the child of an h-card.
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mblaney those are obvious relationships so there's no reason not to use them when available.
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mblaney I'm not saying they have to be there or they must be used, but there's no reason not to use this pattern either.
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gRegorLove tantek: Not sure I'm going to do HWC on 7/27.
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Loqi gRegorLove: tantek left you a message 1 hour, 54 minutes ago: could you post an indie event and FB POSSE copy for the next HWC in your city? https://indieweb.org/events/2016-07-27-homebrew-website-club#RSVP
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tantek gRegorLove: no problem - perhaps note Bellingham is skipping that week?
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neilpdx i can't join #indiewebcamp
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aaronpk that's correct, we moved it to here
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neilpdx i see
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Loqi Just generated the first draft of this week's newsletter! https://indieweb.org/this-week/2016-07-15.html I'll generate a draft again tomorrow, so please add to it before then! https://indieweb.org/this-week#How_to
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tantek drat I forgot to take a photo at HWC SF this week
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tantek Brighton, Portland any photos? (adactio, aaronpk)
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aaronpk i forgot too, but donp took one sort of
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tantek and I thought we had more locations for the 27th
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aaronpk hm maybe missing mf2 markup?
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tantek ah on /events
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aaronpk here we go https://donp.org/i/5sFu.jpg
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tantek yep the photosrcalt template is much easier to use than either wiki or HTML markup directly
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tantek aaronpk: can you confirm a venue/location for https://indieweb.org/events/2016-07-27-homebrew-website-club#Where PDX?
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tantek !tell Jeena can you confirm a venue for HWC Göteborg on the 27th? https://indieweb.org/events/2016-07-27-homebrew-website-club#Where
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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tantek !tell adactio can you confirm a venue for HWC Brighton on the 27th? https://indieweb.org/events/2016-07-27-homebrew-website-club#Where
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell him that when I see him next
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KevinMarks The offline thing fits with my content hashing thoughts
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Loqi KevinMarks: tantek left you a message 2 hours, 53 minutes ago: could you post an indie event and FB POSSE copy for the next HWC in your city? https://indieweb.org/events/2016-07-27-homebrew-website-club#RSVP
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tantek so many photos to catch-up on posting
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KevinMarks https://twitter.com/kevinmarks/status/753810739622576133
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@SwiftOnSecurity Reporters in 2058: "Grandma, show me some of your old articles." "Sorry Samantha, my entire life's work got deleted in a CMS upgrade." (twitter.com/_/status/753810739622576133)
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tantek has that happened in an actual CMS upgrade? or just services?
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tantek wow that's quite some thread about OAuth struggles: https://twitter.com/luxagraf/status/752581965249912832
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@luxagraf @aaronpk thanks. I like @t's "dont't hate, go create", but what if you can't because all the oauth libs are outdated and suck? (twitter.com/_/status/752581965249912832)
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tantek aaronpk++ for at least trying to help resolve OAuth issues
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Loqi aaronpk has 1066 karma (9 in this channel)
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tantek hah! Loqi has >1k karma now!
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Loqi grins profusely
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[kevinmarks] Dan Gillmor lost his Mercury news archive
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tantek wat
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tantek when he upgraded his wordpress?
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tantek or when Mercury News upgraded their CMS?
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[kevinmarks] The Merc lost them
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[kevinmarks] http://mediactive.com/7-10-information-safety/
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tantek wow
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petermolnar swift
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petermolnar eh, forget to press ctrl+f
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Loqi [indieweb] "I can now post to #Twitter from my site at pvagner.tk. Let's see how I'll like this approach. #indieweb" by Peter Vágner https://pvagner.tk/2016/i-can-now-post-to-twitter-from-my-site-at
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@malcomio another reminder of the value of controlling your own content on the web, and the importance of @indiewebcamp https://twitter.com/creepytennis/status/753856209279651840 (twitter.com/_/status/753890716401754112)
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jonnybarnes well the #dev channel looks busy :P
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jonnybarnes just pushed a new update to my site to make syndication targets more verbose
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jonnybarnes i.e. my micropub client will display the `name` given by the syndication target
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jonnybarnes in my case "jonnybarnes on Twitter"
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@mothersele “His advice to other artists… maintain your own domain and back everything up.” #indieweb https://www.theguardian.com/books/2016/jul/14/dennis-cooper-google-censorship-dc-blog (twitter.com/_/status/753936822103863297)
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[phillycodehound Hi all. I'm a HUGE fan of kevinmarks and have been intrigued with the indieweb since I heard Kevin talking about on TWIT
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miklb welcome [phillycodehound
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rMdes welcome
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[chrisaldrich] phillycodehound: IndieWeb for WordPress has evolved a lot in the last 6 months. We'd appreciate your thoughts on the ease of use as you go through the process of indiewebifying your site(s).
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[kevinmarks] Thanks phillycodehound - do you have your own site?
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aaronpk i'm surprised flickr never did anything with alt text for images
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petermolnar as in?
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aaronpk you can't set alt text for images
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aaronpk but you can on twitter! https://dev.twitter.com/rest/reference/post/media/metadata/create
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aaronpk https://blog.twitter.com/2016/accessible-images-for-everyone
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Jeena I now have a indiewebified podcast https://jeena.net/pods marked up with microformats, etc. It will have some mistakes so if you see some please tell me :)
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Loqi Jeena: tantek left you a message 1 week, 1 day ago: HWC is only a week away! Could you add an indie event and FB POSSE copy for your city? Thanks! https://indieweb.org/events/2016-07-13-homebrew-website-club#RSVP
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Loqi Jeena: tantek left you a message 16 hours, 31 minutes ago: could you post an indie event and FB POSSE copy for the next HWC in your city? https://indieweb.org/events/2016-07-27-homebrew-website-club#RSVP
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Loqi Jeena: tantek left you a message 13 hours, 41 minutes ago: can you confirm a venue for HWC Göteborg on the 27th? https://indieweb.org/events/2016-07-27-homebrew-website-club#Where
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aaronpk Jeena: would you consider `u-audio` on the <audio> tag?
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aaronpk Monocle isn't online anymore, but when it was, it looked for an `audio` property and presented an audio player inline
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Jeena ah sure, I was looking for something in the microformats wiki
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aaronpk I think audio is there? if not, it wasn't a far leap from "photo" and "video" to "audio"
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aaronpk ah it's in there as "proposed" http://microformats.org/wiki/h-entry
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[benatwork] Site death https://blog.this.cm/tough-news-f6a5138b2ab3#.ikezifld7
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KevinMarks_ I did u-audio with unmung
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KevinMarks_ http://www.unmung.com/feed?feed=https%3A%2F%2Fjeena.net%2Fpods.rss
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gRegorLove u- u- audio
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@benborges_ Don't be evil moto, too far gone. More than Time for everyone to #selfhost & join the #indieweb #postSnowdenWorld https://twitter.com/xeni/status/753989283749298177 (twitter.com/_/status/754001120159207425)
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sknebel this looks neat: http://hubpress.io/ - a site generator for github pages that runs in the browser
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voxpelli sknebel: we're not that far away from having something similar based on indieweb tech ;)
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sknebel voxpelli: your jekyll-based setup?
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voxpelli sknebel: yes – and miklb is working on a boilerplate indieweb theme as well
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voxpelli Micropub is working now with https://github.com/voxpelli/webpage-micropub-to-github
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miklb I actually plan on working on the micropub additions for that tonight!
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voxpelli I'm looking at making it more configurable right now as well :)
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kbs that's a neat idea :)
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miklb there is prose.io which allows you write your markdown in the browser and publish to your gh-pages. I've not used it though
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Jeena site deaths http://fusion.net/story/325231/google-deletes-dennis-cooper-blog/
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kbs voxpelli: out of curiosity, did you pick the github api rather than the git protocol for simplicity? (maybe irrelevant in the big picture since afaict only github provides an easy git -> web-page path anyway)
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voxpelli kbs: yeah, to get things started, it's built as a self-contained module so one could swap it out for a git-based one later on
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kbs ah, nice
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voxpelli https://github.com/voxpelli/node-github-publish/
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voxpelli felt better to focus the effort on the micropub part than on the git one :)
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kbs wise choice :)
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sknebel kbs: gitlab has pages as well, and there is a service for bitbucket as well
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kbs sknebel: ah, didn't know that - thanks for the pointers
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voxpelli one can also trigger a build on the commits to the repo and have the result of that build be pushed anywhere
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voxpelli I believe miklb is building his jekyll himself rather than having GitHub do it for him
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miklb I use TravisCI with mine and push to my own VPS
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miklb so my site is on GitHub but Travis does a build/deploy on each new commit
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voxpelli one could also push to eg. Amazon S3 or https://surge.sh/ or such if one wants
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kbs no end of creative ways to do this, I'm coming to realize :)
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miklb the main advantage to using the branch/CI/deploy is it allows you to run any plugin you want for jekyll
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miklb you can actually deploy the compiled HTML back to GitHub
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sknebel yeah, GitLab has examples for many site generators, because they have their own CI offering integrated and use that
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voxpelli and I'm doing it directly on GitHub to ensure that everything works without any extra plugins :)
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miklb and the theme I built doesn't require any plugins
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miklb missing piece right now is sending webmentions, but we are zeroing in on solving that I think :-)
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voxpelli progressively enhanced static site generation – you heard it here first! :)
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cweiske miklb, did you get my note about stapibas?
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cweiske https://chat.indieweb.org/2016-07-09#t1468059309083000
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miklb cweiske I did. I could see building a front end for something like that
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miklb voxpelli++
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Loqi voxpelli has 83 karma (4 in this channel)
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KevinMarks So can we get hubpress to add mf2 markup at least?
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KevinMarks Hm. Webmention sending should be doable as a commit hook.
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voxpelli KevinMarks: not commit hook, but "page has built" web hook. Problem is to know what's new though, hence the feed-based approaches (added bonus is that one can just rely on already existing pubsubhubbub ping)
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voxpelli the delay between commit and build makes the static site a bit hard to work with :/
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KevinMarks Ah. I was thinking github pages, maybe I misunderstood
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voxpelli KevinMarks: GitHub Pages has such a hook: https://developer.github.com/changes/2014-03-12-page-build-event-for-webhooks/ :) I use it to ping my PuSH hub
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KevinMarks Is there a lag between committing and the pages being live?
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miklb there can be. I think that's why the page-build-event hook
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miklb for my self hosted jekyll, I have to wait to run my rake task until after build and deploy so the URL is live
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miklb rake task for sending webmentions
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KevinMarks That page build event doesn't give the url of the page?
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KevinMarks That is a bit weird
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sknebel KevinMarks: I think it is for "rebuild of the entire website", not "individual page finished building"
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KevinMarks So you would hook the commit to know which pages changed, then wait for page build to run the webmention sending?
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voxpelli KevinMarks: I think I would just fetch the main feed and look for any posts that has been changed in there
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voxpelli look at the updated timestamp
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voxpelli would solve enough cases, the rest could be handled manually if needed
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KevinMarks Well, that assumes you have a feed. This is the page/post distinction
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miklb might need to distinguish between jekyll sites on gh-pages and like plain HTML hosted on GitHub
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KevinMarks WordPress has that too - some things are posts and in a a time stamped feed, some our pages
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KevinMarks s/our/are
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Loqi KevinMarks meant to say: WordPress has that too - some things are posts and in a a time stamped feed, some are pages
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voxpelli miklb: distinguish how? in what hook they would use?
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miklb I misunderstood what KevinMarks meant about "assumes you have a feed"
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KevinMarks No, that fits too
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sknebel miklb: still a valid use case
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voxpelli KevinMarks: most webmentions are made from posts though I'm thinking and mostly there it's of much use to have them automatically pinged. One could always manually trigger a page to be pinged
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sknebel for pure HTML, parsing the commit for changed files would make sense
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voxpelli s/mostly there it's/it's mostly there/
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Loqi voxpelli meant to say: KevinMarks: most webmentions are made from posts though I'm thinking and it's mostly there of much use to have them automatically pinged. One could always manually trigger a page to be pinged
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voxpelli sknebel: or rather: doing a diff between the new branch head and the last known branch head and looking at the files that has changed inbetween ;)
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voxpelli (and that's why I avoided real git integration in my Micropub endpoint for now :P)
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sknebel voxpelli: right, github probably doesn't trigger commit-by-commit
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voxpelli sknebel: hopefully not, or else you would get a mild DoS if someone were to add eg. the Linux repo as a subtree ;)
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sknebel why would you need that for the micropub-endpoint?
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voxpelli sknebel: I wouldn't need diffing exactly, but I would need to handle fetching, pushing etc on a repo that someone could do all kinds of crazy things with (unless I were to do a fresh clone on each and every interaction, and that wouldn't be very performant)
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sknebel ah, yeah
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cweiske "git fetch && git reset --hard origin/master" is enough for the crazy things you can do with git repos
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cweiske be it local stale files or force pushes that changed all history
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voxpelli yeah, one can get pretty far with that
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voxpelli (if one can use the CLI tools that is)
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KevinMarks1 I'm thinking that I could make a hook receiver in mention-tech to send wm's, and archive the pages to internet archive etc.
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aaronpk whoa, archive.org passes back the headers of the original page when you request to archive it
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aaronpk ah that's what I was looking for, it does pass back a header of the archive.org URL that it creates
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aaronpk in the "Content-Location" header
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KevinMarks1 does it return the rewritten page?
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Loqi Just generated this week's newsletter! You still have a few minutes to make changes, and I'll re-generate it 10 minutes before it gets sent out at 2pm Pacific time. https://indieweb.org/this-week/2016-07-15.html
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KevinMarks1 I made a thing to relativise the URLs in a spiderpig archive
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aaronpk KevinMarks1: i added an example here https://indieweb.org/archive.org
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KevinMarks1 Do I have to ping the https version of news.indieweb now?
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snarfed KevinMarks: yeah, and s/indiewebcamp.com/indieweb.org/
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KevinMarks1 so my webmention failed. got it
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snarfed docs and error msgs haven't been updated; feel free to subscribe to https://github.com/aaronpk/IndieNews/issues/26
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aaronpk oops yes thanks
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Loqi [indienews] New post: "Homebrew Website Club 2016-07-13" http://www.kevinmarks.com/hwc2016-07-13.html
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KevinMarks1 there we go
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Loqi Generated the final version of the newsletter! This will be sent out at 2pm Pacific time. https://indieweb.org/this-week/2016-07-15.html
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aaronpk that's such a terrible picture of me lol
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aaronpk man the Quill editor with media endpoint support is so great
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aaronpk \o/ new logo finally made it into the email
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KevinMarks1 oh, I heard a good p3k name if you make an image cache: calotype
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KevinMarks1 from http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b07j699g
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aaronpk hah nice https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Calotype
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@indiewebcamp This week in the #indieweb https://indieweb.org/this-week/2016-07-15.html https://twitter.com/indiewebcamp/status/754061742213169156/photo/1 (twitter.com/_/status/754061742213169156)
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KevinMarks1 put my webmentions into the sidebar on desktop: http://www.kevinmarks.com/svgsparklines.html
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Loqi SVG Sparklines 2016-04-18
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KevinMarks1 (does that work for other people?, I only tested on chrome)
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KevinMarks1 hm, oldest first is a bit odd on the homepage
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bear chrome and firefox works
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gRegorLove Looks good in Firefox
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KevinMarks1 OK, good.
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bear even looks good in safari
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sknebel hm, images don't show up for me.
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sknebel oh, wait, they are loaded directly from twitter, that's my scriptblocker then
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sknebel nvm
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KevinMarks1 I put the webkit-flex prefixes in, though I think safari doesn't need those any more
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KevinMarks1 voxpelli++ for sort=desc already being there
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Loqi voxpelli has 84 karma (5 in this channel)
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KevinMarks1 I'm sure designers will not like the grid violation on the homepage
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[shaners] http://boingboing.net/2016/07/15/google-deletes-artists-b.html
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