#indieweb 2020-04-26

2020-04-26 UTC
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[tantek] alright I'm having second thoughts about using the laptop icon for things watched on the internet (netflix movies, youtube videos etc.) because the laptop icon could really mean so many other things
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[tantek] I think I'm going to switch to using that plain pay emoji ▶ for any internet movies/videos. we already use it on our IWC Schedule pages for video links so I think that makes sense
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GWG It seems to be generally accepted
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GWG [tantek]: Do you plan to iterate on your previous work?
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[tantek] yes, editing wiki now, and writing up an example post accordingly
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[tantek] GWG, updated /watch
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[tantek] WDYT of a /watch post being a reply to a /video post?
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[tantek] that is, assuming you want to notify to publishers of the video that you watched it
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[tantek] That way someone with a video post could display a facepile of people that watched it!
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[tantek] and show "number of views", which is something that video silos show
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GWG [tantek]: WordPress already supports watch under incoming webmention post type discovery
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[tantek] very cool
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GWG It's marked up using the experimental property u-watch-of though.
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GWG If something else gets traction...
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[tantek] Hmm, I'm going to prototype with u-in-reply-to
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Loqi GWG, [tantek]: it looks like this conversation is getting pretty technical, can you take it to #indieweb-dev?
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[tantek] lol yes!!!
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[chrisaldrich] Thanks again to everyone who came to the Gardens and Wikis session!
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[chrisaldrich] I've got most of the notes posted up and formatted along with the video of the session at https://indieweb.org/2020/Pop-ups/GardenAndStream
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[chrisaldrich] For those considering other pop-up sessions throughout the year, I've created a stub here https://indieweb.org/2020/Pop-ups to collect them
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[chrisaldrich] I'll write up some thoughts about the process, what we could have done a bit better, and some recommendations for the future in the next day or two.
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[chrisaldrich] If you're building or writing up something following the session, do consider adding your demo to https://indieweb.org/2020/Pop-ups/Demos.
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[chrisaldrich] One of the quirkiest UI pieces of the whole process of doing a session on Wikis was cleaning up the 8 different kinds of wiki mark up people put into the etherpad. 🙂
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lahacker i'm dying at loqi finally chiming in at tantek -- strong yes to /watch post being a reply to a /video post
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[KevinMarks] The divergence of wiki markup is an ongoing pain
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[chrisaldrich] It is becoming more difficult today as I switch between wikis....
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[chrisaldrich] Do I feel a new use case for unmung on the horizon KevinMarks? ;)
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[KevinMarks] Sounds more like a pandoc feature
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[chrisaldrich] My magic 8 ball says "chances are good".
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[chrisaldrich] What is Pandoc?
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Loqi pandoc is a format converter which supports an extreme variety of input and output formats; useful to convert from/to HTML, Markdown, XML, docx, etc https://indieweb.org/pandoc
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[chrisaldrich] petermolnar++ for that definition
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Loqi petermolnar has 5 karma in this channel over the last year (20 in all channels)
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[chrisaldrich] I think angelogladding mentioned it as his solution pathway for doing edit posts on his site to syndicate to the IWC wiki
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[tantek] I still prefer MediaWiki because it's good training to help you edit & contribute to Wikipedia
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[chrisaldrich] Through practice, MediaWiki has become second nature to me, but using Tiddlywiki on an alternating basis is definitely causing some friction.
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[chrisaldrich] I've found that a custom bookmarklets does help reduce the cognitive load a bit for some of the differences.
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[jgmac1106] I find mediawiki to hard to maintain...getting a visual editor even adding a logo takes a deep dive into horribly written documentation
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[LewisCowles] I had a few tinkers with tiddly and mediawiki. Something about the constructs seem like odd shapes to interact with. I'm not a fan of visually dense UI, so that is more than likely where it starts.
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[jgmac1106] Been enjoying the dokuwiki experience so far, but yes different wiki markup, or ways you write on wikis, is strange and hard for people
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[jgmac1106] Good to see you yesterday Lewis, sorry I did not say hi
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[tantek] ngl in general I'm not a fan of any wiki markup, for the similar reasons that I find Markdown syntax ugly and unintuitive (and objectionable on principle, its own principles)
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[tantek] but if you're going to bother to struggle with learning any wiki syntax, MediaWiki syntax is literally worth the investment most of all, purely for lowering your barrier to contributing to Wikipedia. In this day & age of massive (social) media misinfo, contributing science and cited facts is a revolutionary act.
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[jgmac1106] often i am just using HTML as I am quite often organizing stuff I wrote elsewhere to make it more logical, and 95% of the people I work with just use a visual editor
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[jgmac1106] wikipedia can be tough....I try to stay away from any subject where I have expertise, enjoy editing articles where I am less heavily invested....don't have time to waste on talk pages
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[jgmac1106] if you are up late....and not early...sun coming up on East Coast...get some sleep
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jeremycherfas Good morning IndieWeb
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[jgmac1106] Mohammed, who ran Global Open Initiative Foundation, just got hired away by wikimedia, will be moving to Berlin from Accra soon, congrats to [Sadik_Shahadu] and his teams, huge wikipedia folks
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[jgmac1106] morning Jeremy
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jeremycherfas Morning Greg
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[jgmac1106] I am going to try and rebuild my Known site today, need to delete and reinstall it
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jeremycherfas Just don't delete the DB
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[jgmac1106] I am not....already backed up that and the upload folder
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[jgmac1106] tantek I don't know why wikimedia is so hard for people to install and maintain though, just adding a logo is such a heavy lift, we had to remove any visual editors for GOIF to save on bandwidth
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[LewisCowles] np Greg
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[LewisCowles] RE: contributing science and cited facts
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[LewisCowles] They would be revolutionary if a great deal of Wikipedia was not still trivia and quotes from journalists. Has it solved dead-links yet?
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[LewisCowles] Morning jeremycherfas
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[LewisCowles] RE: Wikipedia RE: cited facts. Sadly there has never been a replacement for universities, academia, editorial published content; only tiers in-between that confuse the two.
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jeremycherfas Morning [LewisCowles]
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[jgmac1106] yeah Lewis I try to edit a few articles in educational psychology, I gave up on digital ltieracies...someone there just dead set on their definition, still maintain the situated cognition page and a few other geeky cogsci places
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jeremycherfas Re ^^^ Citation needed
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[jgmac1106] I hear that from a number of academics, not worth the headache of trying to edit pages in your subject expertise,
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[jgmac1106] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Digital_literacy
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jeremycherfas In general, open wikis have the problem of over-zealous guardians.
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[jgmac1106] jeremycherfas your citation
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jeremycherfas You ionterposed yourself between me and [LewisCowles]
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[jgmac1106] ahh okay
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jeremycherfas Although, of course, over-zealous guardians are better than no guardians at all.
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Zegnat !tell tantek re: view posts for YouTube, I looked into that, but then YouTube removed the history endpoint from their API. Sad because you can still see your watch history on the site if logged in :(
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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[LewisCowles] I disagree
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[LewisCowles] and maths backs me
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[LewisCowles] find a proof that using sub-sets you can construct an accurate verifiable super-set
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[jgmac1106] Zegnat wonder if Google Takeout provides youtube history
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jeremycherfas What are you disagreeing with, [LewisCowles]
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[LewisCowles] over-zealous moderation > no moderation
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[LewisCowles] moderation creates sub-sets
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jeremycherfas Fair enough.
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[jgmac1106] [LewisCowles] see the wikidata effort for dead links issue...big push to get all the data in one place across all platforms
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[jgmac1106] agree I like wikis like ours with more a lazy consensus, no wasted on talk pages
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Zegnat And good morning IndieWeb :) Just catching up on conversations.
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Zegnat [jgmac1106] I don’t know if it is in there, maybe, but I do not think you can automate running Google Takeout? Might be worth pursuing though.
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[LewisCowles] jgmac1106, they could solve it if they kept a cached copy
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[jgmac1106] no you can not zegnat
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jeremycherfas Gotta slip out for a moment to record some audio. BRB.
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[LewisCowles] then they have a link, with some need for a mechanism to fallback to their hash.
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[jgmac1106] funny I actually use YoutTube more to "listen" than watch
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Zegnat I think there is an Internet Archive bot active on Wikipedia these days, so if dead links in the citation section are found they get auto-updated to IA?
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Zegnat [jgmac1106]: I am probably around 50/50 on watching and listening
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[jgmac1106] correct Zegnat
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indier hello
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indier A question about the online homebrew web site clubs. Anyone tried MIT 'unhangouts' web conference?
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[LewisCowles] no, got a link?
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indier https://unhangout.media.mit.edu/
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indier It uses a combination of jitsi, etherpad/ethercalc and a chat function (XMPP? Not sure...) to deliver a "remote lecture"
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[LewisCowles] I guess nice for them
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[LewisCowles] there is a point lingering?
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[jgmac1106] I have used unhangouts before yes
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indier Sorry, tried to join a homebrew recently. The organiser used zoom, but personally, not prepared to download their software.
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[jgmac1106] we fooled around with some unconferences
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indier So, unhangouts a viable alternative is the "point lingering" :)
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[jgmac1106] you can also try video.etherpad.org I made a Pro Google Meet
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aaronpk this topic is definitely better for the meta channel
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[jgmac1106] good point aaronpkl
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aaronpk but generally which platform is used for a homebrew website club is up to the organizer of that particular meetup
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[jgmac1106] oops
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jeremycherfas Are there similar disavantages to using Zoom from a browser?
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indier Sorry. Took a guess from the web site: https://indieweb.org/discuss
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indier Is there a guide to describe what channel is for what topics?
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aaronpk yes, on that page under here https://indieweb.org/discuss#Chat_Channels_Purposes
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indier Understood; never scrolled farther down...!
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indier Just realised why gave up using irc: incompatible with anonymous proxy. The other chat channels not available via web browser?
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aaronpk everything except #indieweb-chat is available in the sidebar
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indier Errr, sidebar?
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aaronpk it's on the left side. if you're on a small screen then you have to tap the little icon in the corner to expand it
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indier Sorry, see only the indiewebcamp logo top left
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aaronpk here's the direct link: https://chat.indieweb.org/meta/today also linked from that /discuss page at the top
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indier Mmm, "log" was interpreted as "archive"... lost in translation!
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aaronpk it is both, but good feedback
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indier > jgmac1106: that etherpad link failed. First it was blank (due to images disabled by default!). Then a circle of green pencils, then nothing
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[jgmac1106] indier, yep bummer confirmed, I click on new Pad and tried to name my pad but it did not work
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[jgmac1106] nope loaded just a bit slowly: https://video.etherpad.com/p/testpad
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[jgmac1106] too slow to use
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[jgmac1106] oops thought we were in meta
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jacky https://100daystooffload.com/
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Loqi 100 Days To Offload #100DaysToOffload Just. Write.
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