#indieweb 2017-02-23

2017-02-23 UTC
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tantek_ wow 10 is a lot, especially compared to 4 on Twitter. why 10 I wonder.
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GWG Afternoon
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tantek_ ponders how to decide how many photos to put in /multi-photo post
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tantek_ also I wonder if they all have to be the same shape
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tantek_ er, aspect ratio
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tantek_ considers 5 photos, just to put one more than what gets POSSEd to Twitter
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bear lock: lok, lukan, loka, locen (all from entymology links)
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tantek_ considers different layout for /multi-photo post
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aaronpk I limited my Multi photo posts to 4 as well
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aaronpk considering what to do with more than 4 now, especially if one is a video
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KevinMarks aaron's theme is steampunk tech though
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KartikPrabhu aaronpk: how about Cypher?
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Loqi [indieweb] "WordPress Conferences and Events | Best of 2017" by webcreate.me on 2017-02-23 http://www.webcreate.me/best-wordpress-conferences-events/
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tantek_ the "y" there is a modern twist
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KartikPrabhu posibly
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KevinMarks Phrenology
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KevinMarks Phrenology
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GWG KevinMarks: What about it? Did your head bumps change?
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tantek_ looks like IG mult-photos are required square
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tantek_ hmm
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tantek_ oh dear I just realized my Instagram Copy photo post bookmarklet likely needs updating
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tantek_ at a minimum to for multi-photo support
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tantek_ also no photo editing either in IG multi-photo posts (like rotation, trapezoid effects)
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tantek_ no person-tags either!
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tantek_ alright I'm going to just take notes on what needs to be improved in the bookmarklet rather than trying to fix it for this post
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[chrisaldrich] こんばんは Indieweb!
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GWG Hello, [chrisaldrich]
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tantek_ Guten abend!
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[chrisaldrich] Hi GWG, Tantek. I've been working on maybe doing some Japanese posts, the problem is my vocabulary is very limited.
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tantek_ very cool chrisaldrich! multi-lingual posts?
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mblaney aaronpk you could call your authorization endpoint signet?
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[chrisaldrich] With the excitement for the new Instagram multi-photo posts at hand, did anyone ever figure out a way to POSSE/PESOS their "Your story" posts? Or were those so ephemeral they weren't bothering with?
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tantek_ sounds like Cignet - healthcare provider?
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tantek_ what is a story?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "story" yet. Would you like to create it?
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tantek_ chrisaldrich looks like we need a definition of exactly what such posts are, perhaps with Silo Examples of Instagram and Snapchat
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[chrisaldrich] I suppose I know enough Spanish I could make a shot at that first, but I'm glad that I've figured out how to do hiragana and some katakana with my English language keyboard.
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tantek_ now manually person-tagging with URL, name, Twitter handle
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tantek_ since I have no cache / way to lookup anyone's FB IDs!
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tantek_ or Flickr for that matter
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tantek_ has no way of testing his site "locally" on his freshly setup laptop
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tantek_ looks good, now to check the markup
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tantek_ multi u-photo markup parses correctly with pin13
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tantek_ now to try Bridgy Publish to see what happens
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Loqi [indieweb] "Homebrew Website Club #Berlin is growing and has found a great spot: wifi, power, drinks, small bites, non-smoking(!), and a casual hipster vibe perfect for plotting #indieweb plans. #multiphoto #nofilter #indiewebcamp #hwc #hwcberlin #homebrewwebsiteclub #hoodie #hoodies #hipster #vibe #salon" on 2017-02-23 http://tantek.com/2017/053/t6/homebrew-website-club-berlin-growing
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tantek_ it worked! first multi-photo POSSE - thanks Bridgy
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tantek_ bridgy++
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Loqi bridgy has 48 karma in this channel (54 overall)
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tantek_ https://twitter.com/t/status/834576777154543617
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@t Homebrew Website Club #Berlin is growing and has found a great spot: wifi, power, drinks, small bites… http://tantek.com/2017/053/t6/homebrew-website-club-berlin-growing https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C5UDIlZUMAI3TDB.jpg (twitter.com/_/status/834576777154543617)
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tantek_ I have a feeling I'm going to start making heavy use of multi-photo posts
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[chrisaldrich] they sure brighten up the slack channel
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tantek_ wait seriously? they all showed up inline?!?
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tantek_ (or rather, how many?0
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tantek_ chrisaldrich did you see photos from my permalink or the Twitter URL?
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tantek_ (or both?)
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tantek_ what is turn off commenting
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Loqi turn off commenting is a UI option for the entirety of a blog or per post that disables and removes any commenting UI, and possibly even disables receiving comments via protocols like Webmention https://indieweb.org/turn_off_commenting
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benwerd hanging out at Homebrew Website Club
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@DreamHost DreamHost is a proud sponsor of @indiewebcamp meetups! Right out of our #PDX office, no less! #webdesign #blogging https://twitter.com/DreamHost/status/834583641942523904/photo/1 (twitter.com/_/status/834583641942523904)
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@priya_somani_ DreamHost is a proud sponsor of indiewebcamp meetups! Right out of our #PDX office, no less! #webdesign #blogging https://twitter.com/DreamHost/status/834583641942523904/photo/1 (twitter.com/_/status/834584167933427712)
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tantek_ nice!
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tantek_ waves to benwerd acoss way too many timezones
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tantek_ is not really bothering to adapt to jet lag since he's flying back in ~36 hours
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tantek_ benwerd, the past few days have had some folks here finding challenges with making likes vs reposts work in Known, e.g. using kylewm's plugin
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tantek_ perhaps you could take a look? check recent IRC logs (search) for it
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[chrisaldrich] tantek_ benwerd, I think it was dgold primarily, and I think he ultimately got sorted, but it required using 0.9.1 rather than 0.9.2 or the current version from the repo. I never heard what the ultimate problem ended up being, though I imagine he could let us know to make sure the potential problem doesn't happen again. jeremycherfas may have had a similar issue, but I'm not sure if he got sorted out yet.
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tantek_ right, something broke in most recent update
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[katiejohnsonsf] The Homebrew Website Club of subdued excitement (aka Bellingham) https://files.slack.com/files-pri/T03QR2B2T-F497GE10S/image_uploaded_from_ios.jpg?pub_secret=71235da29d&name=Image uploaded from iOS.jpg 5th time's the charm!
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tantek_ hi katiejohnsonsf and gRegorLove!!
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @benwerd: I think it's time to change my site - I have werd.io on known, but I have http://benwerd.com that I can do static (twitter.com/_/status/834593768418471937)
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KartikPrabhu wow! gRegorlove updated to 3 people from the 2 in Chicago! :)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @Johannes_Ernst: UBOS is my linux distribution - now you can set up known as a TOR hidden service (twitter.com/_/status/834594340253097984)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @Johannes_Ernst: I found that this means you can access it from behind your home firewall wihtout fiddling (twitter.com/_/status/834594459144876032)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @Johannes_Ernst: also, if you put a tor service it on raspberry pi, the address mapping works wherever you plug it in (twitter.com/_/status/834594568268107776)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @rabble: is this like sandstorm.io? (twitter.com/_/status/834594672571998208)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @Johannes_Ernst: it's more like a shared hosting environment than a container model like sandstorm (twitter.com/_/status/834594760492986368)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @Johannes_Ernst: but yu can run it in containers as well as on raspberry pis and servers (twitter.com/_/status/834594818630283268)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @Johannes_Ernst: I ended u using both Sphinx and Jekyll as one is good for docs and one for blogs (twitter.com/_/status/834594994694418433)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @benwerd: I'm goign to give the Known demo as I haven't done it in 18 months (twitter.com/_/status/834595095815024641)
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@benwerd I'm at Homebrew Website Club! #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/834595227323207681)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @benwerd: this is my website werd.io - you can see it is grabbing my instagram pics via http://ownyourgram.com (twitter.com/_/status/834595234382217216)
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Loqi [indieweb] "I'm at Homebrew Website Club! #indieweb" by Ben Werdmüller on 2017-02-23 http://werd.io/2017/im-at-homebrew-website-club-indieweb
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @benwerd: I can post to my site and syndicate out to all these social networks (twitter.com/_/status/834595319983783936)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @benwerd: here's @aaronpk in portland having a craft cocktail and reply with my bookmarklet (twitter.com/_/status/834595500833828864)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @benwerd: and it will show up on my site and also on his site (twitter.com/_/status/834595608400904193)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @benwerd: I want a personal homepage that is not just a stream of content (twitter.com/_/status/834595714135183360)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @benwerd: so I'm thinking about static homepages as well as conversational ui (twitter.com/_/status/834595838596886528)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @_MattHolland: why do you want something other than your feed? (twitter.com/_/status/834596506426548224)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @benwerd: for people who don'tk now me so I can have an introduction and more context (twitter.com/_/status/834596582658043904)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @benwerd: you don't just want to replicate twitter - you want to have a bit more than that (twitter.com/_/status/834597291398946817)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @kevinmarks: I have http://www.kevinmarks.com/ which is static, and http://known.kevinmarks.com for the dynamic updates (twitter.com/_/status/834597429353799680)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @kevinmarks: I liked @aaronpk's pinned post per tag as a way of providing context (twitter.com/_/status/834597865141968897)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @benwerd: we had this idea that we wanted everyone to own their own content, but they don't always want this (twitter.com/_/status/834598213688639490)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @ejeating: I celebrated when my parents joined facebook because it would keep me out of trouble (twitter.com/_/status/834598790438993922)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @ejeating: I have accounts on every platform everyone uses in SF, but I don't use them (twitter.com/_/status/834598893702750210)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @ejeating: everything now posts to twitter anyway, and that is the global connection (twitter.com/_/status/834599044336984064)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @benwerd: I defeinitley have very different conversations on facebook and twitter as they are different networks (twitter.com/_/status/834599201917063168)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @benwerd: even if I post things on known and they go to twitter and facebook I get different conversations in response (twitter.com/_/status/834599341016961024)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @ejeating: I've been thinking about identity from the other direction - what's the point of owning your own data? (twitter.com/_/status/834599616855343104)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @ejeating: I've been thinking about attribution and identity and tracking consistency across platforms (twitter.com/_/status/834599742403465219)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @ejeating: the post that is made up by someone on reddit that refers to the fake news on breitbart and it is accurate-ish (twitter.com/_/status/834599903556927488)
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@sdepolo If there's time I'll share my story of this session tonight at #indieWeb #sanFrancisco. It was awesome! https://twitter.com/sdepolo/status/832383709709955072 (twitter.com/_/status/834600033454485504)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @Johannes_Ernst: if you track where these things come from do they all come from the same places? (twitter.com/_/status/834600995372015616)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @benwerd: fake news comes from the indieweb - everyone making fake news starts on their own website (twitter.com/_/status/834601127228346369)
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[scottgruber] Hello world. I'm working quietly here. Setting up a new content type for my books with a collection of my highlight notes from non-DRM ePubs exported from Marvin eBook reader. What do people use to read ePub?
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@benwerd Homebrew Website Club: February 22. #indieweb @ Matter. https://www.instagram.com/p/BQ1qlJmludd/ (twitter.com/_/status/834601279808749568)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @Johannes_Ernst: the indieweb, unlike other places for sharing have a bit more trackability (twitter.com/_/status/834601288054738944)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @kevinmarks: places like 4chan and other meme factories have full anonymity and focus on the meme itself, not credit for it (twitter.com/_/status/834601452249214979)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @kevinmarks: there are a lot of open collaboration projects where people are trying to do for fake news what they do for spam (twitter.com/_/status/834601878688301056)
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Loqi [indieweb] "Homebrew Website Club: February 22. #indieweb" by Ben Werdmüller on 2017-02-23 http://werd.io/2017/homebrew-website-club-february-22-indieweb
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scottgruber Checking out https://indieweb.org/goodreads
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @sdepolo: Could we have a cross-silo way of expressing what is fake so we can track it between sites (twitter.com/_/status/834604235446743041)
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Loqi [indieweb] "Comment on ? Encouraging individual sovereignty and a healthy commons by Aral Balkan by This is a whole new tragedy of the commons: people don't know where the commons actually are anymore. #indieweb boffosocko.com/2017/02/22/…" by This is a whole new tragedy of the commons: people don't know where the commons actually are anymore. #indieweb boffosocko.com/2017/02/22/… on 2017-02-23 http://boffosocko.com/2017/02/22/%f0%9f%91%93-encouraging-individual-sovereignty-and-a-healthy-commons-by-aral-balkan/#comment-33926
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @benwerd: this year someone will make unified content subscription work (twitter.com/_/status/834606454074126337)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @sdepolo: are people looking for things they agree with? (twitter.com/_/status/834606733901316096)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @ejeating: yes - all my friends are looking for media they agree with (twitter.com/_/status/834606837299298307)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @ejeating: we need close reading to tell real news from fake news from satire (twitter.com/_/status/834607140081917954)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @erinjo: @benwerd most of the fake news I read comes from you (twitter.com/_/status/834607278200348672)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @Johannes_Ernst: one of the most fascinating things was the Mitrokhin archive where someone wrote the KGB archive down every day (twitter.com/_/status/834607543334924289)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @Johannes_Ernst: it is a history of soviet intelligence operations from WW II to the 1980s (twitter.com/_/status/834607629901115393)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @Johannes_Ernst: as a kid in Germany, I can remember things that mapped exactly to these KGB operations https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mitrokhin_Archive (twitter.com/_/status/834607756703330304)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @erinjo: one of the studies I read recently was getting High School students to decide if sources were credible (twitter.com/_/status/834608016485974016)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @erinjo: (twitter.com/_/status/834608020982288384)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @erinjo: (twitter.com/_/status/834608023427481600)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @erinjo: (twitter.com/_/status/834608026015395840)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @erinjo: (twitter.com/_/status/834608028137746432)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @erinjo: (twitter.com/_/status/834608034634727424)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @erinjo: (twitter.com/_/status/834608043920859136)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @erinjo: (twitter.com/_/status/834608048685588481)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @erinjo: (twitter.com/_/status/834608056470216705)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @erinjo: (twitter.com/_/status/834608058441555972)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @erinjo: they could no longer distinguish legitimate from illegitimate sources - the theory was they had grown up with the net (twitter.com/_/status/834608225790095360)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @benwerd: someone I dined with last night said that American Schools don't teach source evaluation (twitter.com/_/status/834608376499822593)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @ejeating: we never had a class on how to evaluate a source, but it was part of my high school and college curriculum (twitter.com/_/status/834608722102145024)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @ejeating: the amazing thing about the internet is that it is everything - no-one cares whether it is MIT or oxford or my brain (twitter.com/_/status/834608886787219456)
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@benwerd Appropriately enough, Homebrew Website Club at @mattervc is a discussion about fake ne ws and sources. You should come next time. #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/834608984820584448)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @ejeating: if we have some stable means of establishing identity we can compare your history of what you say (twitter.com/_/status/834609040110022656)
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@benwerd Appropriately enough, Homebrew Website Club at @mattervc is a discussion about fake news and sources. You should come next time. #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/834609109248798720)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @Johannes_Ernst: evaluating the background of the source is no longer reliable - I compare it with other things (twitter.com/_/status/834609282628911104)
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @benwerd: If anyone knows any startups that are trying to solve fake news and authority, send them my way (twitter.com/_/status/834611187723726849)
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[chrisaldrich] scottgruber, I use Spritz or spritz-like apps for reading epub, especially on smaller screens.
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Loqi [indieweb] "Comment on ? This Week in the IndieWeb February 10 – 17, 2017 (audio edition!) by Marty McGuire" by Marty McGuire on 2017-02-20 http://boffosocko.com/2017/02/20/this-week-in-the-indieweb-february-10-17-2017/#comment-33927
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[scottgruber] chrisaldrich. Interesting. I just did a quick look at Spritz. I haven't thought of those kind of readers in a while. I think the style is called Karaoke reader with one word flashing at a time. I tried but couldn't get the hang of it. I see its an option in Marvin. Maybe I'll try it again.
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[chrisaldrich] Most of them are based on psychology studies from the 70s called Rapid Serial Visual Presentation. Spritz claims they patented the concept and have threatened litigation to clear the field. It's good for newspaper/magazine articles and fiction but is horrid for reading technical material
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[acegiak_net] There's a bug with my chatbot moodlogging plugin that responds based on the mood I enter, but at the moment it defaults to positive every time, so when I post that I am feeling despair over this trans rights in schools stuff he responds "that's nice!" Which at least made me laugh.
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[acegiak_net] Chatbot is actually a pretty nice interface for this stuff
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[chrisaldrich] Ashton, I thought about some of your mood tracking as I was reading about aaronpk's emoji site search as part of his 100daysofindieweb the other day. You might find it interesting if you haven't seen it yet.
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[chrisaldrich] https://aaronparecki.com/2017/02/20/6/day-62-emoji
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Loqi [Aaron Parecki] Day 62: Indexing Emoji Use in my Website #100DaysOfIndieWeb
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[chrisaldrich] scottgruber, there's a lot of good stuff under /read and I've got a bunch of sample posts on my site recently from exporting data from my Kindle into book reviews. Need to get back to doing more of that soon.
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Loqi [indieweb] "Comment on Buzzfeed implements the IndieWeb concept of backfeed to limit filter bubbles by Martha Villa" by Martha Villa on 2017-02-21 http://boffosocko.com/2017/02/20/buzzfeed-implements-a-form-of-the-indieweb-concept-of-backfeed-to-limit-filter-bubbles/#comment-33904
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Loqi [indieweb] "Comment on Buzzfeed implements the IndieWeb concept of backfeed to limit filter bubbles by Michael Kirk" by Michael Kirk on 2017-02-21 http://boffosocko.com/2017/02/20/buzzfeed-implements-a-form-of-the-indieweb-concept-of-backfeed-to-limit-filter-bubbles/#comment-33902
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Loqi [indieweb] "Comment on Buzzfeed implements the IndieWeb concept of backfeed to limit filter bubbles by Ryan Barrett" by Ryan Barrett on 2017-02-21 http://boffosocko.com/2017/02/20/buzzfeed-implements-a-form-of-the-indieweb-concept-of-backfeed-to-limit-filter-bubbles/#comment-33903
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[scottgruber] About to finish up here. I got the book and notes page related and exported first set of notes. Next up is an import script. But need to shut down for a bit this evening. Thx everyone. Good night!
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Loqi [indieweb] "Comment on The IndieWeb and Journalism by Daniel Goldsmith" by Daniel Goldsmith on 2017-02-21 http://boffosocko.com/2017/01/13/the-indieweb-and-journalism/#comment-33908
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jihaisse hello
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tantek_ tap tap tap
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tantek_ what is a map?
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Loqi The social web map is a metaphoric map of social web sites, from fully indieweb to silos, representing their relationships, sizes, levels of IndieMark accomplishment (or site-death) and any other axes of interesting details we can capture https://indieweb.org/map
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tantek_ Here's some inspiration for /map : http://www.theverge.com/2017/2/11/14586934/arlin-ortiz-fantasy-maps-art-illustration
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petermolnar https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/An_Atlas_of_Fantasy
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GWG Morning
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Loqi rise and shine!
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jihaisse hello GWG
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GWG Hello, how is your return to active status treating you?
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GWG Had time to explore the changes?
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jeremycherfas GWG: I’ve just converted on of my WP sites to use the senpress theme. Haven’t done anything yet about the indieweb plugins. I see from the chat that there are modifications under way. Do you think it might be a good idea to wait a while before going ahead with that?
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jeremycherfas Not in any rush.
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dgold jeremycherfas: which of your sites is using Senpress?
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dgold I'd like to see it working in the hands of someone who has WP abilities
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jeremycherfas Fornacalia.com which might need to be www.fornacalia.com
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jeremycherfas But I haven’t done a whole lot of styling yet.
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jeremycherfas My playtime today was devoted to starting on Review pages in my Grav site.
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dgold looks _sharp_
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jeremycherfas Yah think?
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jeremycherfas I need to get rid of the dorky avatar, author name and all that, for a start. Maybe color code some of the H2 and H3. That kind of thing.
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jeremycherfas Oh, hang on. I’ve just noticed that I decided on ZenPress rather than Senpress in the end.
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dgold I like the minimalism thing - I've never been able to pull it off though
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jeremycherfas Thanks. Less is more.
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GWG What modifications specifically? We are always improving. I am on a program to improve all the ones I am involved in before starting anything new
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jeremycherfas I can’t be specific; just things that flitted by in the discussions. It seemed like there were quite a few changes and cleanups being contemplated. If those changes are liely to have an impact on how I manage things at my end, then I will probably hold off for a while.
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GWG Likely not that bad. It is mostly under the hood
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@t #100DoPP d35 great #indieweb chats @sknebel @slalomfahrer @jkwebtec & HWC Berlin organizers @derhess @sebastiangreger! (ttk.me t4n01) (twitter.com/_/status/834780786842812418)
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Loqi [indieweb] "#100DoPP d35 great #indieweb chats @sknebel @slalomfahrer @jkwebtec & HWC Berlin organizers @derhess @sebastiangreger!" on 2017-02-23 http://tantek.com/2017/054/t1/great-indieweb-chats-hwc-berlin
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jeremycherfas GWG: Ok, thanks.
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jihaisse GWG: « how is your return to active status treating you? » : Slowly :)
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jihaisse For now, I’m reading and thinking
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jihaisse and my thoughts was : maybe I could fix the social plugin for wordpress
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snarfed that way lie dragons :P
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jihaisse snarfed : True
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aaronpk Ghost << https://www.indiehackers.com/businesses/ghost
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Loqi ok, I added "https://www.indiehackers.com/businesses/ghost" to the "See Also" section of /Ghost
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sknebel does anyone we know have a chat widget on their page through which they can be contacted?
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aaronpk oh man i used to have that a loooong time ago
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sknebel sgreger asked about it yesterday at HWC, and my search turns up tons of services for those annoying "talk to us" popups for e-commerce sites, but not much for other use-cases
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aaronpk ah yeah i was going to say
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sknebel aaronpk: I assume you had an IRC channel as the backend?
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aaronpk of course
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jeremycherfas Has anyone here created a child theme of the ZenPress WP theme?
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bear I used (many many moons ago) had a "type something and it will be forwarded to bear" link
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aaronpk i had a form that would send me an SMS, way before smartphones
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aaronpk hah here it is http://2008.aaronparecki.com/sms/
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aaronpk i don't think it still works
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bear mine was a perl cgi script that sent my xmpp server a message
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aaronpk lol! it sends to my email now
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petermolnar aaronpk if you want an sms server, buy a cheap thinkpad t400/x200 w/ a 3g modem, add gammu-smsd on it with a stupid linux and you're done
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petermolnar indiesms
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aaronpk i wonder how the cost of that compares to using twilio
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petermolnar 5gbp per month -> unlimited sms within network, 500(?) outside
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aaronpk we don't have plans like that in the US :)
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petermolnar I'm doing that because I sometimes misconfigure alerts and they send _a lot_ of false things
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petermolnar and I don't want to destroy my wallet with an external service
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sgreger sknebel, thanks for following up on the chat question. it'S rather low priority at this point, i was mainly curious are those "annoying pop-up services" really the only way to do such thing.
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petermolnar (btw this is pre-paid)
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petermolnar 5 GBP (as british pounds)
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aaronpk hm there is someone that will give me unlimited SMS for $6/mo
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sknebel sgreger: I went through a few of my bookmarks, most of the things seem pretty dead :/
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Loqi [indieweb] "@sdepolo and I hanging out by the Post-Its at Homebrew Website Club. #indieweb" by Ben Werdmüller on 2017-02-23 http://werd.io/2017/sdepolo-and-i-hanging-out-by-the-post-its-at-homebrew
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sgreger aaronpk: i have been playing around with distributed indieauth (trying to write a little piece that authenticates me to log in to the wiki based on me being logged in to my wordpress site) - i'm running in one issue though
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sknebel found this, which is bound to telegram and I don't like the UI, both on the web and telegram side, but at least its recent and open-source: https://github.com/idoco/intergram
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sgreger without touching my code, sometimes it works and i get authenticated, other times i get an error page
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sgreger is the authentication through indieauth.com throttled? like only three logins per hour or so?
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sgreger (more likely the error is in my code, but just thought to check)
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sgreger "There was a problem. Something went horribly wrong!" ;)
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aaronpk that's odd, let me look at some logs
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sgreger that would be great. i just tried a moment ago (after 2h break) and received that error again. debugging is a bit tricky, as it seems to be an issue with the final step (indieauth.com verifying the code from my endpoint, the POST request...)
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aaronpk aha, it's getting a 301 redirect on the post
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sgreger sknebel: thanks, i'll have a look at it
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sgreger aaronpk: my site returns a 301?
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aaronpk your authorization_endpoint on your home page is https://sebastiangreger.net/indieauth but that is actually just a redirect to https://sebastiangreger.net/indieauth/
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aaronpk so the POST fails
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sgreger argh
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aaronpk we were just talking about this yesterday :)
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sgreger thank you! that piece of information (the 301) was the missing piece. i was literally ripping my hair out earlier. i could just not figure it out...
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gRegorLove Good morning, indieweb
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aaronpk cool! should be an easy fix
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sgreger now it works. with repeat success. i can authorize myself simply based on the fact that i am logged in to my site
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aaronpk woo
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Zegnat Alright, I made good on my itch for yesterday’s HWC (https://licit.li/58af1f9599091). No I have time to start on bloggercode, petermolnar ;)
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sgreger yes, it was as easy as adding the slash to the <link rel="authorization_endpoint" href
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sgreger aaronpk++
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Loqi aaronpk has 472 karma in this channel (1225 overall)
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sgreger "An authorization endpoint must be able to both generate authorization codes as well as verify authorization codes." -> so this means, my little hack is not really a proper endpoint, because it does not allow verifying codes from other sites?
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aaronpk ?
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aaronpk the wiki had to verify your code at your authorization endpoint
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aaronpk that's the verification it's talking about
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aaronpk (or rather, indieauth.com did on behalf of the wiki)
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[chrisaldrich] jeremycherfas, I had a child theme of sempress a while back which was probably pretty close. I didn't realize how nice senpress was until I got lost in the rabbit hole of content on fornicalia
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voxpelli sknebel: sgreger: about the chat thing, not very indie:ish, but Intercom seems to be a very powerful and good such service
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jeremycherfas I’ve asked Mathias about this on github, but wondering about the structure. As he has it, zenpress is inside ZenPress, and like that, WP won’t see the parent style. if I take zenpress out of ZenPress, everything is fine. But I no longer have the SASS.
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jeremycherfas I don’t know enough to know whether that will break down the line.
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sgreger above guote is from https://indieweb.org/authorization-endpoint > the way i read it, my enpoint should also be capable of what indieauth.com does?
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sgreger ...the "verify" part
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aaronpk oh, no not at all
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aaronpk refresh. is that clearer?
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sgreger :) yes!
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[chrisaldrich] jeremycherfas, usually child themes are more important when building on top of themes from the repository that will update in the future (so you won't overwrite your changes/work). SenPress (the child) is pretty solid and unlikely to change as much as SemPress (the parent), so you probably won't go too wrong in just hacking directly on top of the child theme.
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jeremycherfas True, but I also want to keep my changes fairly discreet. All working well locally, but I’ll wait to hear before I publish.
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[chrisaldrich] I don't think SenPress is in the main WP repository, so you're unlikely to see an autoupdate message and accidentally overwrite your work there, but be aware that it could happen.
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[chrisaldrich] (and make sure you keep a back up just in case)
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[chrisaldrich] I saw your question to GWG earlier. Like him, I think that a lot of the WordPress Indieweb plugins are pretty mature, so you're unlikely to have any major issues down the road if you start using them now. Most changes will just add small bits of functionality that you might not even notice since they're in the background.
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[chrisaldrich] It's not like the situation a year or two ago where there were some major changes which might have kept you on your toes (but which honestly weren't hard to overcome with help on Github or here in chat).
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jeremycherfas Chrisaldrich: Thanks. Yes, that’s next on the list for that site,, then the other sites. But first I want to tweak how it looks just a bit.
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[chrisaldrich] I like that it's a much prettier visual experience over the prior incarnation which was either 2015 or 2012 if I remember?
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[chrisaldrich] Though for a semantically marked up site about bread, one would expect you might have "breadcrumbs"? https://wordpress.org/plugins/breadcrumb-navxt/
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[chrisaldrich] Apparently not even Loqi would laugh at that one. ?
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[chrisaldrich] jeremycherfas, I've been thinking more about an indieweb podcast; last night for HWC quiet writing hour I started outlining some potential interviews along with lists of evergreen questions
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jeremycherfas That’s very cool. I’d love to collaborate.
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jeremycherfas I spent this morning looking through the chat logs and thinking I’d been safely tucked up and fast asleep.
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[chrisaldrich] You have far more experience and expertise on the technical side so that would be a grand help.
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[chrisaldrich] Don't let me keep you from dreaming about bread...
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sgreger voxpelli: thanks for the hint. but indeed, not the "indie" solution i was daydreaming of.
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aaronpk now i want to make a chat widget for my site again
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jeremycherfas Maybe we could find a time to chat one to one about how to proceed?
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[chrisaldrich] I try to be careful of reading through chat logs too often. Causes too many itches I don't have time to scratch.
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jeremycherfas I’m horribly completist like that.
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[chrisaldrich] With the time difference (from Los Angeles to Rome?) what might work well for you?
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sgreger my idea was that it could be some very simple and sleek ui, which then talks to some "bridge" connecting with my preferred chat ui
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[chrisaldrich] I'm typically a night owl, but I'm often up early on Tuesdays and Thursdays for occasional conference calls to the UK/France.
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jeremycherfas Chrisaldrich: I’m an early bird, so if you are up late and I am up early, that works.
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[chrisaldrich] choose your favorite day anytime after Monday next week, and I shall appear with bells on.
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jeremycherfas 8am for me is 11 pm for you. Would that work?
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jeremycherfas Done tinkering. Better go prepare food.
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[chrisaldrich] sure 11pm is more than fine, I can go as late as 2ish if necessary
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snarfed *massive* outside-looking-in discussion of indieweb and more: http://llllllll.co/t/building-the-world-you-want-to-live-in/6599
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aaronpk wow
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bear reads
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snarfed tough but fair imho
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aaronpk it's actually a great discussion and everyone is being very civil :)
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[chrisaldrich] There are one or two deviations of civility, one sadly pointed at Tantek
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Zegnat There are definitely things in that discussion worth addressing. It also shows that people (with the best intentions) visiting indieweb.org have a hard time figuring out what it is about.
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gRegorLove Yeah, I think people are looking for a more discrete, monoculture-ish definition of indieweb. "Oh, it's software that does x, y, z"
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[chrisaldrich] With things like webmention and micropub as far along as they are, we're getting closer and closer to Generations 2 and 3. A few larger scale projects like Manton's or what I suspect DreamHost wants to do with it in relation to WordPress may help be tipping points to scaling these functionalities to a larger audience.
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[chrisaldrich] The real question is "how would you sell this to your mom?" We're really trying to sell a nebulously defined abstract construct rather than a concrete end-product.
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gRegorLove snarfed: You should add "spit-and-baling-wire to the short Bridgy description. Haha
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Loqi hehe
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Zegnat That makes it sound like we are an incubator for the standards of tomorrow
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snarfed lol
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[chrisaldrich] Facebook, Twitter, and others cornered the market before the necessary standards to overcome the hurdle of "Web 2.0" were created, so it's a bigger uphill battle trying to regain that ground. The nice part is that many people, as evinced in that link, know we could do better. The best part about IndieWeb is that it's actually starting to physically happen here. How do we underline this point on the front page?
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@seometadaten DreamHost is a proud sponsor of @indiewebcamp meetups! Right out of our #PDX office, no less! #webdesign #blogging https://twitter.com/DreamHost/status/834583641942523904/photo/1 (twitter.com/_/status/834842918825267200)
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aaronpk ?
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aaronpk oh I didn't see that tweet yesterday! https://twitter.com/DreamHost/status/834583641942523904
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@DreamHost DreamHost is a proud sponsor of @indiewebcamp meetups! Right out of our #PDX office, no less! #webdesign #blogging https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C5UJZgzXUAA7S3r.jpg (twitter.com/_/status/834583641942523904)
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[chrisaldrich] Mention DreamHost and see what you get?
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@100daysindieweb Day 65: Implementation Report Template for Micropub Clients #100DaysOfIndieWeb: https://aaronparecki.com/2017/02/23/6/day-65-micropub-implementation-reports (twitter.com/_/status/834845148454514690)
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KartikPrabhu that thread (though largely civil) is a good example of why forums don't work for fruitful discussions
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KartikPrabhu "explain indieweb in 2/3 sentences..." <explanation> "but that is not enough <rant> "
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voxpelli One of the great things in IndieWeb is that we can support both experimental dev work and mature products at once – unlike Twitter that closed down their API when they needed to polish their UX
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[chrisaldrich] aaronpk++ for underlining the point of incremental change with his #100daysofIndieweb post just now
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Loqi aaronpk has 473 karma in this channel (1226 overall)
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voxpelli So there can be some IndieWeb endeavors that are at the very polished state and at the same time be some others that are very rough – silos can't do that because they often need to fit it all into one product
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voxpelli aaronpk: "as soon as possible" would be neat to have somewhat more specific – upcoming days? weeks? months?
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aaronpk ideally I'd love to have 1-2 more by Monday
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voxpelli :/ You don't have one from me, right? I don't have time to sit down with IndieWeb stuff this weekend so can't do Monday :(
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aaronpk it should take about 5-10 minutes to complete
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aaronpk and I don't have any except for my own yet because I just made it :)
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[chrisaldrich] That's a great point voxpelli. In fact, when was the last time a social platform made a large transformative change in it's own functionality. It seems like the market is relatively saturated. Take yesterday: Instagram unveils multi-photo which seems like something they should have had years ago, but only seems to expand on their own "stories" functionality and making it more permanent, while underneath it all isn't it just geared toward try
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[chrisaldrich] Snapchat's lunch?
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[chrisaldrich] Often we see major corporations simply supporting the masses and not attempting to push the boundaries. I love that indieweb seems to be pushing on the boundaries. Reminds me of some interesting philosophy in Marco Arment's podcast recently: http://boffosocko.com/2017/02/02/%F0%9F%8E%A7-under-the-radar-65-getting-sherlocked-under-the-radar/
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Loqi [Chris Aldrich] ? Under the Radar 65: Getting Sherlocked | Under the Radar http://1.gravatar.com/avatar/d5fb4e498fe609cc29b04e5b7ad688c4?s=42&d=mm&r=pg
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voxpelli Yeah, I think some are so set on the silos mindset that they think that as a project matures it has to inherently stop developing itself, and that should certainly not be the case with IndieWeb
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[chrisaldrich] What is sherlocked?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "sherlocked" yet. Would you like to create it?
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[chrisaldrich] Sherlocked is when an individual developer's project is knocked off by a much larger corporation, typically subsuming a large, but not complete portion of the functionality.
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Loqi ok
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[chrisaldrich] Sherlocked << https://overcast.fm/+FgnZDbtyM
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Loqi ok, I added "https://overcast.fm/+FgnZDbtyM" to the "See Also" section of /Sherlocked
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[chrisaldrich] Building on voxpelli's thought, I'd submit that Indieweb is building something which inherently can't be sherlocked because of continual growth and development.
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dgold "something like "modernised NTTP running over zeromq."
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dgold eh...
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dgold presuming they meant NNTP, I don't think they've been using 0mq much - it is wonderful for consistent connections, but really poor at maintaining unused links
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gRegorLove what is NNTP?
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Loqi https://indieweb.org/nntp
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aaronpk indieweb.camp is expiring today, we didn't do anything with it last year, and it is now up to $40/yr to renew. i'm kind of tempted to let it drop.
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bear +1 - i've been letting a lot of domains just fall away myself
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KevinMarks Oh, I thought you used that for the registration
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KevinMarks I am shedding a lot of domains too. Partly because Google made them annoying to renew
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aaronpk we used 2016.indieweb.org last year
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sknebel thought about grabbing hwc.berlin, but at 50 € vs 5 € for a "boring" .de...
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sknebel Risks of centralized internet services 101: https://bugs.chromium.org/p/project-zero/issues/detail?id=1139 ( OUCH! )
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sknebel (well, maybe that's worded a bit unfairly, it could have hit the same number of sites through a widely used product instead)
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cweiske ouch
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sknebel (but the fact that it mixes sites (which it seems to do) is only possible because it is centralized like that)
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sknebel cloudflare statement: https://blog.cloudflare.com/incident-report-on-memory-leak-caused-by-cloudflare-parser-bug/
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voxpelli thinks about the bearer token arguments and why it's enough to rely on https alone and not so any OAuth 1 style signing of things
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[chrisaldrich] Is it just me, or is the wiki not working with /fragmentions at the moment? https://indieweb.org/fragmention##this+wiki
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aaronpk ohh i bet i never put that in the new theme
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aaronpk yeah that problem was definitely made worse because of how many customers they have
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aaronpk cross-customer leakage is way worse than if you happened to be using a buggy webserver yourself
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Loqi [indieweb] "Read posts nearly perfected!" by Chris Aldrich on 2017-02-23 http://boffosocko.com/2017/02/23/read-posts-nearly-perfected/
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sknebel yeah, that's what I missed at first
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Loqi [indieweb] "Comment on PressForward as an IndieWeb WordPress-based RSS Feed Reader & Pocket/Instapaper Replacement by I've moved a big step closer to perfecting my "Read" posts!" by I've moved a big step closer to perfecting my "Read" posts! on 2017-02-23 http://boffosocko.com/2016/12/31/pressforward-as-an-indieweb-wordpress-based-rss-feed-reader-pocketinstapaper-replacement/#comment-33930
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@ChrisAldrich I've moved a big step closer to perfecting my "Read" posts! #IndieWeb http://boffosocko.com/2017/02/23/read-posts-nearly-perfected/ (twitter.com/_/status/834910718797434880)
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