#indieweb 2017-11-18

2017-11-18 UTC
eli_oat, hs0ucy, [kevinmarks], KartikPrabhu and [chrisaldrich] joined the channel
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[chrisaldrich] everyone++ for what seems like a large number of new user pages this week
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Loqi everyone has 3 karma in this channel (9 overall)
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@ChrisAldrich This looks like an interesting experiment. Curious to see how something like this might be implemented in a social feed reader. #indieweb https://twitter.com/EthanZ/status/931230918274179073?s=09 (twitter.com/_/status/931759911842865152)
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Loqi [superfeedr] "This looks like an interesting experiment. Curious to see how something like this might be implemented in a social feed reader. #indieweb https://twitter.com/EthanZ/status/931230918274179073?s=09" by Chris Aldrich on 2017-11-18 http://stream.boffosocko.com/2017/this-looks-like-an-interesting-experiment-curious-to-see-how
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[jeremycherfas] One of the good things here as opposed to micro.blog is Loqi. I can see that I do not actually need to click on the link in chrisaldrich’s post.
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@frankmeeuwsen Maak je moederschip je digitale thuishaven met POSSE en PESOS. #IndieWeb http://diggingthedigital.com/POSSE-en-PESOS/ (twitter.com/_/status/931815619464519685)
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Zegnat Good morning IndieWeb!
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[kevinmarks] Morning. Silo fail of the day https://twitter.com/kevinmarks/status/931820043599515648
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@kevinmarks Shorter @LinkedIn : "we broke our crappy website to make you install our crappy app" [the no button is offscreen and scroll is blocked] Me: "well, that's put me off ever posting anything on your silo, or reading it" https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DO59YJxX0AAk8kF.jpg (twitter.com/_/status/931820043599515648)
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Zegnat Just start POSSEing to LinkedIn, [kevinmarks] ?
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KartikPrabhu why is LinkedIn still a thing!
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Zegnat Recruitment for one.
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KartikPrabhu in indiweb-speak that's like saying "Twitter is a thing because blogging!'
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Zegnat No, Twitter is a thing because that’s where audiences are for a lot of people.
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Zegnat But I don’t think anyone has an audience on LinkedIn, except if that audience consists only of recruiters ;)
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jeremycherfas I'm told by some of my SciComm colleagues that they get the most engagement when they POSSE to LinkedIn. They don't call it POSSEing, of course, they just think they are cross-posting.
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Zegnat I’d say cross-posting is the general term. POSSE & PESOS just specify where the original post happened.
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jeremycherfas I agree; just making fun of people who are a bit indieweb without realising it.
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Zegnat what is crossposting?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "crossposting" yet. Would you like to create it?
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Zegnat what is cross-posting?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "cross-posting" yet. Would you like to create it?
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Zegnat Hmm... jeremycherfas, want to write a clear description maybe? Could be a nice resource for the people “who are a bit indieweb without realising it”
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jeremycherfas Golly. That's a bit of a chellenge, especially if you want it to include specific examples and everything.
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jeremycherfas It does seem to be something that journalists and PR people do; anything to get a bigger audience.
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jeremycherfas Cross-posting is the practice of placing the same content, possibly slightly modified, on numerous different websites. For example, an organisation will have a blog post on its own website that it copies to websites of other places with similar objectives or to silos such as [[LinkedIn]] where a larger audience may see it. This is essentially POSSE without the name, practised by people who don't know that they are being a little bit indieweb in
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jeremycherfas doing so. It is often accompanied by an apology, such as "Apologies for cross-posting".
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Loqi ok
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jeremycherfas What is cross-posting
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Loqi Cross-posting is the practice of placing the same content, possibly slightly modified, on numerous different websites https://indieweb.org/Cross-posting
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Zegnat Thanks!
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jeremycherfas Got truncated, but fixed that up.
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jeremycherfas Crossposting << cross-posting
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Loqi Sorry, I couldn't find a page named "Crossposting" or similar
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jeremycherfas Cross-posting << crossposting
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Loqi ok, I added "crossposting" to the "See Also" section of /Cross-posting
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jeremycherfas Undo
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[markmhendrickso tantek++
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[markmhendrickso sknebel++
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Loqi tantek has 228 karma in this channel (403 overall)
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Loqi sknebel has 27 karma in this channel (74 overall)
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[markmhendrickso for the debate I missed while sleeping but enjoyed reviewing before breakfast this morning ?
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[markmhendrickso fwiw I agree that we shouldn't be trying to replace anything (aka fb, twitter) even if we incorporate a lot of existing UX, and i also think really good UX is important for this space (insofar as saying design quality should aspire to reach the level of existing, popular products or – gasp! – even exceed them)
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[markmhendrickso i also agree with tantek's urge to criticism armchair quarterbacks here that seem to criticism more than they build from the "ground" (plain text is one representation of that) up, and i agree with sknebel at the same time that we should let people generally find and build for the ways the want to participate in the indieweb, without imposing our own notions of how to do that right
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[markmhendrickso *i suppose by "agree" with urge = I mean "empathize" ?
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[markmhendrickso also, I've been meaning to add proper info about Neotoma to the indieweb website...thanks for inquiring into it sknebel
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[markmhendrickso kevinmarks – that makes me sad LinkedIn is punting Android visitors since their site is built on Ember, my web framework of choice =(
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sknebel [markmhendrickso: do you have a list somewhere what data sources neotoma supports? I skimmed github, but couldn't find a clear one
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sknebel I think sgreger did POSSE to LinkedIn for a while - in some fields, it seems to be actually used for content other than resumes
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Zegnat I seem to remember he demod POSSE to LinkedIn at an event?
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sknebel Brighton
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Zegnat Aah, yep, can confirm https://indieweb.org/2016/Brighton/Demos#Sebastian_Greger
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Zegnat I totally forgot I wrote that demos page...
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Zegnat is currently working on the Berlin demos page
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[markmhendrickso sknebel – I'm currently focused on Foursquare with Facebook, Twitter and Instagram up next, but I'm building it so that support can be added theoretically for any RESTFUL and OAuth 2.0 API without any additional code changes. LinkedIn may plug in easily enough; I just haven't tested it yet.
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[markmhendrickso See https://github.com/neotoma/documentation/blob/master/sources.md
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[markmhendrickso But also note that Neotoma is strictly PESOS and doesn't help with POSSE, at least for now.
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sknebel yeah. question was unrelated to the linkedIn talk, just something I remembered from yesterday
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[markmhendrickso Cool. Out of curiosity, what kinds of data would you like to PESOS, or are you interested in POSSE generally?
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sknebel only thing I've been recently considering are reddit bookmarks, but I'll probably solve that through making it easier to bookmark things to my site directly
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sknebel and maybe twitter stuff
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sknebel most of it isn't really worth keeping IMHO, but maybe a private archive might be worthwhile still
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[markmhendrickso Most of your online data in silos, you mean?
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[markmhendrickso Or just from Reddit and Twitter
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[markmhendrickso I see Reddit has an apparently robust API, although I haven't dug into it yet
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sknebel I mainly use these two silos, so both ;)
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[markmhendrickso Got it ?
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[eddie] One interesting thing about the Slack mobile app big where it has bee melding people’s conversations is I’ve started using the chat.indieweb.org logs and they are actually very pleasant. Could use a *little* more white space but that’s all about personal preference. Works pretty good to scan when on a phone
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[eddie] Bug* not big lol
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@carapacing indieweb is a good concept/movement and i want to support it but it's still in its infancy and thus is aimed at people who are programmers by trade. i am not one. it's a huge jargon hurdle for me (twitter.com/_/status/931976499489538051)
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@carapacing #indieweb is a good concept/movement and i want to support it but it's still in its infancy and thus is aimed at people who are programmers by trade. i am not one. it's a huge jargon hurdle for me and others (twitter.com/_/status/931976683871260673)
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@carapacing indieweb needs everyman how-tos. stripped-down simple stuff anyone can grasp. indieweb participants seem to understand the importance of spreading this idea but without realising it won't spread past tech junkies (said with fondness!) without simplified help for regular users (twitter.com/_/status/931978027193511936)
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Loqi [superfeedr] "A post on Twitter byThe Bug Whispeter indieweb needs everyman how-tos. stripped-down simple stuff anyone can grasp. indieweb participants seem to understand the importance of spreading this idea but without realising it won't spread past tech junkies (said with fondness!) without simplified help for regular users&#8212; The Bug Whispeter (@carapacing) November 18, 2017 A lot [&#8230;]" by Michael Bishop on 2017-11-18 https://miklb.com/2017/11/2763/
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@miklb @carapacing A lot of us are working on making the UX better, especially in the WordPress arena for IndieWeb newcomers. But I agree more documentation would be great. (twitter.com/_/status/931979727677607937)
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aaronpk [miklb] feel free to point them at https://indieweb.org/generations for an explanation
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[miklb] cool, if there is any follow up I will
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aaronpk the "without realising" comment makes me want to point out that page, because it's definitely not the case that we don't realize it
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@martijnvdven @carapacing As you might guess from us suddenly showing up, we subscribe to IndieWeb tweets ? No apologies necessary. Even if you are gen 4, I think the concepts should still be accessible. So if we can make it easier, we should. But for that we need fresh eyes too. (twitter.com/_/status/931981050137456641)
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Zegnat Ugh, I hate multi-tweets. By the time I finish writing my reply to someone’s tweet, they have themselves also replied with more text.
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@miklb @carapacing We have a concept of generations https://indieweb.org/generations and are still solidly in gen 2 IMO but working hard towards 3. (twitter.com/_/status/931981302584266757)
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@miklb @carapacing I’m not familiar with neocities so I can’t speak to that. Should join us in chat and discuss more! https://indieweb.org/discuss (twitter.com/_/status/931982616445808641)
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dgold can anyone explain to me huffduffer & youtube?
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dgold I heard mention of this feature on a microcast, but cannot find any documentation
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aaronpk huffduffer lets you create podcast RSS feeds by adding any audio files to your account. http://huffduff-video.snarfed.org lets you get an audio URL from any youtube video. so you can use that to turn youtube videos into podcasts.
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goodmode (Testing! It's been a long time since I joined a chat from a web client...) I'm the g4 wannabe-supporter from Twitter who didn't think before hashtagging. :'^) Sorry to aaronpk and y'all else, it's all too easy to use loaded language when you think only only your close pals are listening. No excuse, but sincere apologies! You're working hard and for a good cause
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goodmode also I have to manually refresh it seems, so I'll be slow. I was wondering what differentiates a silo from a 3rd-party personal domain? I use Neocities for casual personal-site mayhem like in days of yore when people used Geocities for glitter gifs, but I want to learn more about how to take the web back
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dgold thank you aaronpk
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Zegnat How are you chatting that you have to manually refresh, goodmode?
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sknebel hi goodmode!
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sknebel what do you mean by 3rd-party personal domain? something like username.neocities.org?
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Zegnat A domain that you own (even hosted at a third party) still lets you move to different places but keep control over where links point to
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Zegnat If you had goodmodeart.com you could point it at neocities now, and have something at goodmodeart.com/about. If you decide you need more than neocities (maybe you want to run some PHP) and move to a different server you point goodmodeart.com to the new hosting, but you can still have goodmodeart.com/about the same. So all links on the web keep work
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Zegnat ing.
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goodmode yes, so I'm aware all my files are hosted on neocities' servers and obviously I have no control over whether they go down. The IW wiki says a silo requires you to make an account, and allows interaction with only accounts on that site. For web hosting is this different in that they'll allow you to code comment systems or aggregation lists that don't just include in-site content?
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goodmode also I'm using the in-browser chat linked from the /discuss page on the wiki
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Zegnat Aah, aaronpk’s webchat. I haven’t looked at that recently, honestly didn’t know it still worked.
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aaronpk oh no that's still supposed to work
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goodmode Ah I just got your response Zegnat, that does explain it :^) Thank you
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Zegnat But yeah, neocities is more a hosting provider than a silo :) So your understanding is right
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Zegnat It is just a hosting provider with certain limitations.
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[miklb] @goodmode more like if the comment system was only built to be used by other neocities users, that would make it more like a silo
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goodmode I see! That's cleared a lot up for me, thank you. And again sorry for the curmudgeonly tweets I'm aware the movement is still on the up-and-up I'm just... hm. an impatient young upstart haha. Thank you for your patience with me :^)
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Loqi goodmode: lol
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[miklb] no need to apologize ?
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Zegnat To be fair, with some more impatient people, maybe balls get to roll faster? :P
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[jeremycherfas] @Dgold the tool from @snarfed will also grab audio file from other difficult sources in addition to YT. I often try it on a page where there is an audio player but I can’t huffduff the audio. Soundcloud usually works that way.
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[dgold] Thanks jeremy
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[miklb] what’s the easiest way to syndicate a bookmark/like to indienews
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GWG [miklb]: For you? Try pfefferle's plugin?
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[miklb] how does it work? I don’t see any UI for it
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GWG I'm not sure. Haven't tried it
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[miklb] if I add a syndication link, that gets marked up with u-syndication with the syndication-link plugin right?
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GWG Yes, it should
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GWG You can use the UI box
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@schmarty Your &lt; 10min update on the #IndieWeb community! This Week in the IndieWeb audio edition for November 11th - 17th, 2017. https://martymcgui.re/2017/11/18/185046/ (twitter.com/_/status/932034203595739136)
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[miklb] If I’m reading the page correctly, I can just add https://news.indieweb.org/en as a syndication link. But will that send a webmention or does it need to be in the note? ?